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Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Dan Girardi

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Old
08-11-2013, 11:13 AM
  #76
bernmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BPD View Post
Right, Siemens could fail, and Girardi and DZ don't fail. Do you see the difference there? We're dealing with known pieces. We know that Girardi is an all-star caliber defender. We know that Del Zotto is a talented young defender. We know NOTHING about Duncan Siemens aside from that his name sounds like Dunk In Semen.

It's not a crapshoot, it's a proven quantity for an unknown quantity. It's only a crapshoot in your head because you've got an endless case of "shiny new toy" syndrome.
Selective quotes. Siemens could also be better.
Plus we already got usage out of Girardi. Wear and tear factor down the road.

Prefer something different?
More value to NYR?
Fine.
But the premise is sound.

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Old
08-11-2013, 11:18 AM
  #77
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by The Folignorant One View Post
Get off NHL13 eh. No team would trade proven players like Girardi and MDZ for Siemens, Barrie and a 1st, especially teams like the Rangers who are in win-now mode. If the Avs received those 2 players, that pick won't even be a good one, sure as hell would be outside of the top 15, I'd say.
Feel free to tweak or suggest counter offer.
bernmeister supports competition of ideas to determine best value.

However, 'win now' scenarios usually = fail.
Again, I point to the Clowe trade as an example.
Even if he was not injured, he was not likely to single handedly carry us through and dominate in playoffs.

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Old
08-11-2013, 11:31 AM
  #78
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
Siemens was drafted #11 overall. Just like these guys:

Samuel Morin
Filip Forsberg
Jack Campbell
Ryan Ellis
Kyle Beach
Brandon Sutter
Jon Bernier
Anze Kopitar
Lauri Tukonen
Jeff Carter
Keith Ballard
Fast Freddie Sjostrom
Pavel Vorobiev
Oleg Sapryken
Jeff Heerema
Jason Ward
Dan Focht
Jarome Iginla
Jeff Friesen
Brenden Witt


That's 20 years worth of 11th overalls. Out of those 20 guys, there are TWO I would rather have over either of Girardi or Del Zotto. One more is debatable. The other 17 are laughable. Being selected 11th overall does not make a guy likely to be something special. Frankly, based on the last 20 years, it gives him a 10 percent chance of doing that, and those aren't good odds.

I swear, Bern, someone needs to make a drinking game out of your posting habits. With a Coke for Pepsi chaser.

These are 2 different standards.

I said
Quote:
But such a high pick, and the expectation is not that he turns into the second coming of Bobby Orr or Brad Park, but that he is a really solid stay at home, clear the crease, take the body, shutdown D

such a valued asset is NOT LIKELY to fail.
That is different level of value and satisfaction than the historical record you present.

You even admit that with:
Quote:
Being selected 11th overall does not make a guy likely to be something special. Frankly, based on the last 20 years, it gives him a 10 percent chance of doing that, and those aren't good odds.
The target is great value by retaining production as reduced cost as a vet salary is replaced by a younger counterpart. IF a guy turns into the second coming of Brad Park, that's a bonus.


----------

Also, you said
Quote:
Out of those 20 guys, there are TWO I would rather have over either of Girardi or Del Zotto. One more is debatable. The other 17 are laughable.
From the list of:
Samuel Morin
Filip Forsberg
Jack Campbell
Ryan Ellis
Kyle Beach
Brandon Sutter
Jon Bernier
Anze Kopitar
Lauri Tukonen
Jeff Carter
Keith Ballard
Fast Freddie Sjostrom
Pavel Vorobiev
Oleg Sapryken
Jeff Heerema
Jason Ward
Dan Focht
Jarome Iginla
Jeff Friesen
Brenden Witt

The underlined are clear cut, but more are productive in at least some capacity. It's not like the complete list is all deadwood.

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Old
08-11-2013, 02:23 PM
  #79
CM Lundqvist
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Another Ranger that is criminally underrated. Gotta love these threads.

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Old
08-19-2013, 12:17 PM
  #80
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Girardi is one of the best defensive defenseman in the game and he can chip in a little offensively as well. That being said, I agree they need to move him when they have to sign Hank and Stepan.


Deal I would propose would be as follows and would have to be a sign and trade. Girardi must be willing to sign with the team he is traded to.

Ducks
Girardi


Rangers
Etem
2013-2014 1st round pick

I don't care what anybody says. The Ducks defenseman are awful. I think Fowler is clueless in his own zone. Etem has upside but I don't expect him to be an impact forward. I believe he will be a 20 goal third liner, at best a fringe second line forward. If Girardi will sign, he will help the Ducks defense for the next 7 to 8 years.

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Old
08-19-2013, 12:39 PM
  #81
tempest2i
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I'd be pleased as punch to get Girardi on the Oilers. Considering the Oilers are unlikely to trade any of their NHL playing youngsters for him, it's not likely that he would be available. :/

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Old
08-19-2013, 12:44 PM
  #82
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Has anyone taken a look at the Rangers cap situation for next year even if the cap doesn't go up?.. The Rangers might have to sign Cally, Hank and Girardi, but they have a TON of money coming off the books it will not be a problem. The Rangers do not have to trade Girardi, and it would take a considerable payment for them to move him.

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Old
08-19-2013, 12:54 PM
  #83
tempest2i
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Has anyone taken a look at the Rangers cap situation for next year even if the cap doesn't go up?.. The Rangers might have to sign Cally, Hank and Girardi, but they have a TON of money coming off the books it will not be a problem. The Rangers do not have to trade Girardi, and it would take a considerable payment for them to move him.
I just took a peek, there's a ton of players on the roster that will be in contract years this year. That should make from an interesting season just from that factor alone.

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Old
08-19-2013, 01:37 PM
  #84
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Yeah, we have a ton coming off the books. The problem is, we have to either sign those players or replace them with somebody else. It's not just opening an account filled with money to us. The best scenario is that our young players can fill a permanent spot or 2.

Next season is going to be interesting for sure. Lots of UFA's and RFA's to sign. Our bottom 6 is sure to look different.

We have 3 guys signed passed 2015. 1 will be bought out. That's should make a fun summer.

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Old
08-19-2013, 01:51 PM
  #85
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Eberle + Petry + 3rd

for

Callahan + Girardi + Powe

Hall-RNH-Yakupov
Perron-Gagner-Callahan
Smyth-Gordon-Hemsky
Powe-Lander-Jones
Joensuu R. Hamilton

Smid-Girardi
Ference-J. Schultz
N. Schultz-Belov
Grebeshkov

Hagelin-Richards-Nash
Kreider-Stepan-Eberle
Pouliot-Brassard-Zuccarello
Pyatt-Boyle-Dorsett
Moore Asham

Staal-MDZ
McDonagh-Petry
Moore-Stralman
Falk

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Old
08-19-2013, 01:58 PM
  #86
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by tempest2i View Post
I'd be pleased as punch to get Girardi on the Oilers. Considering the Oilers are unlikely to trade any of their NHL playing youngsters for him, it's not likely that he would be available. :/
And therein is the rub. Gotta give to get.
Rangers could do the Howson coveted MDZ, AND Girardi.

But Oilers will not do the premium we need the other way: Yakupov OR J. Schultz.

Consistently, if the target is Eberle, the counter is Gagner; if Gagner, the counter is the undesired Hemsky.

Lowball is rule, not the exception.

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Old
08-19-2013, 02:23 PM
  #87
Bullseyes
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Originally Posted by CM Lundqvist View Post
Another Ranger that is criminally underrated. Gotta love these threads.
Agreed.

I love to bag on Girardi, but he's a player that once he's gone, everyone will miss.

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Old
08-19-2013, 03:16 PM
  #88
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JVR+Phaneuf for Girardi,miller,boyle and 1st

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Old
08-19-2013, 03:32 PM
  #89
smoneil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SchultzSquared View Post
Eberle + Petry + 3rd

for

Callahan + Girardi + Powe

Hall-RNH-Yakupov
Perron-Gagner-Callahan
Smyth-Gordon-Hemsky
Powe-Lander-Jones
Joensuu R. Hamilton

Smid-Girardi
Ference-J. Schultz
N. Schultz-Belov
Grebeshkov

Hagelin-Richards-Nash
Kreider-Stepan-Eberle
Pouliot-Brassard-Zuccarello
Pyatt-Boyle-Dorsett
Moore Asham

Staal-MDZ
McDonagh-Petry
Moore-Stralman
Falk
I love Cally, but I would do this deal easily from a Rangers PoV. Eberle is a clear upgrade over Cally and Girardi is a clear upgrade over Petry. Frankly, a 3rd is overpayment for Powe.

I think for the Rangers it would depend on whether they think either Staal or McDonagh can switch to the right side. That would let them pair Staal and McDonagh, and then play MDZ and Petry on the 2nd pair.

Great proposal.

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Old
08-19-2013, 03:37 PM
  #90
smoneil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingnashty61 View Post
JVR+Phaneuf for Girardi,miller,boyle and 1st
Too much money coming in. I'm also not really sold on JVR, and with Staal, McDonagh and MDZ, the last thing we need is another LH shooting D. Plus, Miller is going to be needed when Richards gets bought out. I honestly think Richards was kept this year at least partially because the team doesn't see Boyle as a 3C and doesn't think Miller is close to ready.

From a Toronto perspective, they have a lot invested in JVR, and I can't see them wanting to give up him and Phaneuf in exchange for Girardi and some pieces they could get elsewhere.

I doubt either team considers this.

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Old
08-19-2013, 03:45 PM
  #91
tempest2i
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
And therein is the rub. Gotta give to get.
Rangers could do the Howson coveted MDZ, AND Girardi.

But Oilers will not do the premium we need the other way: Yakupov OR J. Schultz.

Consistently, if the target is Eberle, the counter is Gagner; if Gagner, the counter is the undesired Hemsky.

Lowball is rule, not the exception.
That's why I didn't even propose a trade.

I think Girardi re-signs with the Rangers. Unless his asking price is crazy. If that's the case he'll probably hit free agency and get paid handsomely.

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Old
08-19-2013, 03:59 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by avsfansince95 View Post
o'reilly at the deadline with elliot or a pick
Would love the ROR + Elliot package

I think Elliot will be very good one day.

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Old
08-19-2013, 05:01 PM
  #93
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by tempest2i View Post
That's why I didn't even propose a trade.

I think Girardi re-signs with the Rangers. Unless his asking price is crazy. If that's the case he'll probably hit free agency and get paid handsomely.


my complaint on the lowballing was not directed at you.

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