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Old
08-27-2013, 09:11 PM
  #26
Spawn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
And those two got exposed for the majority of the series.
Meh. They are world class defenders. Andrew Ference is a borderline top 4 d-man who is aging and has trouble staying healthy. I think he is going to be a lot closer to Nick Schultz than people are willing to accept.

I think you are way off if you think he is going to noticeably improve the defense of this team.

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Old
08-27-2013, 09:22 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
Meh. They are world class defenders. Andrew Ference is a borderline top 4 d-man who is aging and has trouble staying healthy. I think he is going to be a lot closer to Nick Schultz than people are willing to accept.

I think you are way off if you think he is going to noticeably improve the defense of this team.
I haven't seen allot of Ference's play, but he is quite a bit better than Nick Schultz from what I've seen.

As asfar as the Tambo vs MacT thing, I think MacT is going to be a MUCH better GM than Tambo was. He's intelligent and is a true NHL insider with connections.

It might be hard to fairly compare the two though. As Tambo was the key to the rebuild, MacT is key to bringing this team to a different level.

Two very different styles of management.

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08-27-2013, 10:28 PM
  #28
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I vote for Tambi. He got more for Penner than Calgary got for Iginla - much more. The fact that he got anything for him is remarkable, the fact that he got a first round, a former first round, and an asset. WOW. Cleared out Moreau and his contract at a time when Ethan was a shell of himself. Got something for Steve Staois when Staois had lost a couple steps.

I like MacT, but to say he did something substantially more than Tambi ... I dunno. Tambi didn't make a bunch of unfulfilled promises like MacT did. Although, Tambi didn't speak.

In the cycle of things, Tambi was there to gut out KLowe's mistakes and stockpile assests. I'm glad he wasn't trigger happy. MacT's role now is different, his role is to start to harvest the crops and make some trades. There were no crops for Tambi to harvest.

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Old
08-27-2013, 11:11 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Trizent View Post
I vote for Tambi. He got more for Penner than Calgary got for Iginla - much more. The fact that he got anything for him is remarkable, the fact that he got a first round, a former first round, and an asset. WOW. Cleared out Moreau and his contract at a time when Ethan was a shell of himself. Got something for Steve Staois when Staois had lost a couple steps.

I like MacT, but to say he did something substantially more than Tambi ... I dunno. Tambi didn't make a bunch of unfulfilled promises like MacT did. Although, Tambi didn't speak.

In the cycle of things, Tambi was there to gut out KLowe's mistakes and stockpile assests. I'm glad he wasn't trigger happy. MacT's role now is different, his role is to start to harvest the crops and make some trades. There were no crops for Tambi to harvest.
Agreed to a certain extent... if we give MacT props for moving Horcoff, Tambi needs props for dumping some of the guys he did, and I completely agree that Tambi was there to stockpile assets, and it wasn't time to make a "Bold" move while he was GM since we weren't ready for it

Tambi did some things well
1) pulled the trigger on coaches who didn't fit
2) stockpiled some nice D prospects (not sure how much is him and how much is the scouts)
3) moved some players that needed to be moved like mentioned above
4) Didn't do anything "Bold" and give us more of a chance last year to make the playoffs (and save his job) but in the long run hurt us in the future.

Didn't do well on others
1) Hired poor coaches
2) Missed on most Forward prospects that weren't drafted round 1, they have not lived up to expectations (again not sure how much is him)
3) kept guys like Horcoff and Hemsky (Hemsky especially) when he could have moved them at trade deadlines... I often wonder if we could have gotten Forseberg for Hemsky, since Washington gave him up for Erat
4) Poor signings (though he may not have had as open of a pocketbook to work with as MacT either)

MacT so far
1) New coach (?) I'm not a huge fan of the hiring but I know a lot of others are, we'll see how it pans out.
2) Draft (?) I love Nurse, but I think we'll all regret passing on Nichuskin very soon (Imagine him on our 3rd line this year) and I think they said that they didn't know who they were going with when they were up, if you're picking #7, you should have a list of 7 guys who you'd want, heck when I do fantasy football and I'm picking 7, I know my first 7 picks... that unpreparedness or "winging" it mentality worries me a bit, but I also really like what he did in the later rounds; but no way to evaluate this for at least two years
3) Trading Horcoff (+) (like moving Moreau), but keeping Hemsky (-)... we'll see what happens the rest of the year
4) Made a "Bold" move getting Perron and signing Ference, will it work out? Likely is the time for us to make a "Bold" move, I'm glad Tambi didn't last year since we weren't ready and selling future parts for the present wouldn't have been a good plan
5) Signings? Will any of them pan out? how many years does Ference have left? In 2-3 years will he even be in our top 6 defense? Will Gordon be the guy we need or the next Belanger (where we really like the signing but it backfires horribly)? Joensuu, Hamilton, Acton, Jones resigned, Grebs, Belov... will any of them be useful signings for us?

-Really hard to compare the 2 right now. Tambi did some things well and others not so well.... we'll not be able to evaluate MacT for a year or 2 since all moves he's made really have ? attached to them.

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Old
08-27-2013, 11:34 PM
  #30
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Well said skorf.

The Belanger, Hordichuk, and Eager signings were generally applauded at the time.

Perron scored one more goal than PRV last year and PRV was stuck with Belanger a decent chunk and had no PP time like Perron. It is the type of trade we need to do (present in exchange for future), but when I see Setoguchi get traded for a 2nd round only, it makes me think we overpaid.

Don't like the process of MacT giving Ralph a vote of confidence then 2 weeks later or whatever killing him off. I mean, do you have a plan or what?

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Old
08-28-2013, 12:10 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skorf View Post
Agreed to a certain extent... if we give MacT props for moving Horcoff, Tambi needs props for dumping some of the guys he did, and I completely agree that Tambi was there to stockpile assets, and it wasn't time to make a "Bold" move while he was GM since we weren't ready for it

Tambi did some things well
1) pulled the trigger on coaches who didn't fit
2) stockpiled some nice D prospects (not sure how much is him and how much is the scouts)
3) moved some players that needed to be moved like mentioned above
4) Didn't do anything "Bold" and give us more of a chance last year to make the playoffs (and save his job) but in the long run hurt us in the future.

Didn't do well on others
1) Hired poor coaches
2) Missed on most Forward prospects that weren't drafted round 1, they have not lived up to expectations (again not sure how much is him)
3) kept guys like Horcoff and Hemsky (Hemsky especially) when he could have moved them at trade deadlines... I often wonder if we could have gotten Forseberg for Hemsky, since Washington gave him up for Erat
4) Poor signings (though he may not have had as open of a pocketbook to work with as MacT either)

MacT so far
1) New coach (?) I'm not a huge fan of the hiring but I know a lot of others are, we'll see how it pans out.
2) Draft (?) I love Nurse, but I think we'll all regret passing on Nichuskin very soon (Imagine him on our 3rd line this year) and I think they said that they didn't know who they were going with when they were up, if you're picking #7, you should have a list of 7 guys who you'd want, heck when I do fantasy football and I'm picking 7, I know my first 7 picks... that unpreparedness or "winging" it mentality worries me a bit, but I also really like what he did in the later rounds; but no way to evaluate this for at least two years
3) Trading Horcoff (+) (like moving Moreau), but keeping Hemsky (-)... we'll see what happens the rest of the year
4) Made a "Bold" move getting Perron and signing Ference, will it work out? Likely is the time for us to make a "Bold" move, I'm glad Tambi didn't last year since we weren't ready and selling future parts for the present wouldn't have been a good plan
5) Signings? Will any of them pan out? how many years does Ference have left? In 2-3 years will he even be in our top 6 defense? Will Gordon be the guy we need or the next Belanger (where we really like the signing but it backfires horribly)? Joensuu, Hamilton, Acton, Jones resigned, Grebs, Belov... will any of them be useful signings for us?

-Really hard to compare the 2 right now. Tambi did some things well and others not so well.... we'll not be able to evaluate MacT for a year or 2 since all moves he's made really have ? attached to them.
I actually disagree hard that this was a positive. I advocated that Tambo should be somewhat active on deadline day, trading Whitney/Khabby/maybe even Jones and acquiring a player using one of our 2nd round picks to try and make the playoffs but also grab some assets using useless players.

If I were Tambo on deadline day, I would have dealt Whitney and Khabby, and traded for Torres for ANA's 2nd rounder. Torres would have been a great fit down the stretch and also would have been on our 3rd line possibly today.

Instead, we gambled and lost on Bishop (probably a good thing but Tambo did try to get him), and we grabbed Smithson and tailed it in the standings.

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Old
08-28-2013, 12:29 AM
  #32
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Whitney's value at trade deadline is evident right now with him being a UFA still. No one wants for cheap without giving up an asset.

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Old
08-28-2013, 12:44 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trizent View Post
Whitney's value at trade deadline is evident right now with him being a UFA still. No one wants for cheap without giving up an asset.
Brenden Morrow got Joe Morrow and a high-ish draft pick and he's still unsigned. Whitney could have grabbed a 3rd from a desperate team.

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Old
08-28-2013, 02:48 AM
  #34
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Tamby was the dumbest man in hockey. At no time from the day he was hired did I ever think he was capable of running an NHL franchise.
MacT is a giant step up from that. I'm cautiously optimistic that he can handle the job.

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Old
08-28-2013, 03:35 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trizent View Post
I vote for Tambi. He got more for Penner than Calgary got for Iginla - much more.
If you don't understand the cost difference between a 3 month trade deadline rental and acquiring a player with another year left on his current term then I'm not sure if we can reliably trust your assessment of a GMs ability.

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08-28-2013, 04:12 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by The Human Torch View Post
If you don't understand the cost difference between a 3 month trade deadline rental and acquiring a player with another year left on his current term then I'm not sure if we can reliably trust your assessment of a GMs ability.
3 month period of time - Oilers give up 1st for Dwayne Roloson

3 month period of time - Oilers get a 1st, and two former firsts for Ryan Smyth.

Maybe I'm just burying Feaster and what he got for Iginla.

I guess my point is that Tambi got more for Penner than what most hockey media figured.

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Old
08-28-2013, 05:04 AM
  #37
Steve BachIntyre
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tambo was a scapegoat puppet with the who me? grin to guide the tank.
he was a plug gm who signed plug players. macts hair grows directly out of his brain completely bypassing his scalp.

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08-28-2013, 07:51 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by MeestaDeteta View Post
Granted, MacT hasn't been in the GM role that long yet, but from what we've seen so far, what are the biggest differences between MacT's style, approach, etc. compared to Tambellini's?
Tambo said nothing and did nothing of significance. MacT shot his mouth off and did nothing of significance.

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Old
08-28-2013, 07:53 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Usual_Suspect View Post
Omark has a preference.

@dohfOs
Reason why Omark decided to come back to the #Oilers is simple. It's spelled MacTavish.

@dohfOs
@Alex_Thomas14 Omark always liked Edmonton. He never really liked Tambo and Renney though. He'll give his all to make the #Oilers .
Oh boy, that has to be the major difference right there. Omark.



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08-28-2013, 07:55 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Spawn View Post
Meh, I still see the same problems now that I did at the end of last season.

Soft bottom 6 with too many borderline NHLers/inexperienced players.
Awful center depth with no room for injury (as demonstrated with the Oilers likely starting the year with Gagner and Gordon as the top 2 centers).
Bad defensive core that does not have a true top pairing d-man and only has one legitimate puck mover in the group.

Not only has MacT failed to address the holes on the team, he wasn't even able to address what he preceived as issues.
A) He swung out on acquiring Clarkson (thank God) or a similar big top 6 forward. Instead he traded for another smaller skilled guy.
B) He swung out on acquiring a goaltender. Apparently he was in on Bernier and Schneider (thank God considering what the rumoured asking price was). Didn't land either.
C) Struck out on a deal for Coburn. He added Ference, but he at best is a #4 guy, and ideally wouldn't even be there.

What I see with MacT is a guy who talked a big game but wasn't actually able to accomplish really any of the things he set out to do to start the off-season. Sure I'm willing to give him more time. But he hasn't blown me away with anything. If anything, we're lucky that he didn't succeed in some of the things he shot for.

This ^^^

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08-28-2013, 07:57 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
Ference was more than a #4 on the Stanley Cup finalists...
Not sure what you were watching. Chara and Seidenberg were the top pairing. Next were Ference and Boychuk, and Johnny was definitely #3 on the depth chart.

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Old
08-28-2013, 08:10 AM
  #42
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So we are comparing 3 or 4 years of Tambo versus 3 months of MacT?
Gotcha.

Please somebody drop a puck somewhere.

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Old
08-28-2013, 08:15 AM
  #43
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Tambo got us Hall, RNH and Yakupov. Mac T hasn't even got us anyone close to that level in the 3 months he's been GM,

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08-28-2013, 09:29 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Conkanen View Post
So we are comparing 3 or 4 years of Tambo versus 3 months of MacT?
Gotcha.

Please somebody drop a puck somewhere.
Exactly, give MacT 4 years to not accomplish much and see how everyone around here feels.

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Old
08-28-2013, 09:46 AM
  #45
Trizent
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Originally Posted by Stoneman89 View Post
Tambo said nothing and did nothing of significance. MacT shot his mouth off and did nothing of significance.
Perfect summary.

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Old
08-28-2013, 09:52 AM
  #46
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Perfect summary.
Other than the whole MacT actually making significant moves thing

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Old
08-28-2013, 10:07 AM
  #47
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Other than the whole MacT actually making significant moves thing
Well if you ignore those, then all he did was sign Omark and waive Rajala

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Old
08-28-2013, 10:09 AM
  #48
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It's impossible to say.

What did he have to trade?

What state was our team in a year ago and if it was in the same state now wouldn't it be less likely that we'd be able to attract free agents?

Tambo did his job and it's too soon to say whether Mac-T is doing his.

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Old
08-28-2013, 10:22 AM
  #49
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Justin Schultz is the most significant asset acquired during the Tambi era. There was some luck involved, granted. Tambi's era is tainted because no one believes he was allowed to do anything except run errands for KLowe.

We better hope that MacT is better than the both of them over the next 5 years or we are in for a lot of hurt.

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08-28-2013, 10:40 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Trizent View Post
Justin Schultz is the most significant asset acquired during the Tambi era. There was some luck involved, granted. Tambi's era is tainted because no one believes he was allowed to do anything except run errands for KLowe.
We better hope that MacT is better than the both of them over the next 5 years or we are in for a lot of hurt.
Yes, the fans thinking that this was the case, does hamper your ability to see that Tambo dithered SO much.

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