HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > Hockey Talk by Country > Sweden
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2

What Jokerit joing the KHL means for Sweden.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-09-2013, 12:09 PM
  #151
Jussi
No strings on me
 
Jussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Finland
Posts: 45,165
vCash: 500
Because in a Champion's league it would be a "special, limited occasion", while playing for the biggest trophy in Europe where there's a bigger chance of an upset than in league play.

Jussi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2013, 01:19 PM
  #152
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
First you need biggest trophy in Europe and Champions League. None in there and I guess will not be.

If you want Champions League, you need clubs from various countries, which are comparable to each other (by budget, quality, players) not to have blowouts. It is not possible in hockey, because SHL/SM-Liiga clubs can not be comparable with KHL´s, especially top KHL´s. Maybe NLA clubs and one or two DEL clubs would be able to skate solid roster if such CL, becasue they have money. Or to have CL without KHL, which is not real at all.

When your clubs have budget at least at 15M euro, we can talk about CL.


Last edited by vorky: 08-09-2013 at 01:28 PM.
vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2013, 01:44 PM
  #153
Jussi
No strings on me
 
Jussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Finland
Posts: 45,165
vCash: 500
Zürich Lions proved KHL clubs are very beatable in Champion's league or cup type competitions.

Jussi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2013, 02:11 PM
  #154
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
Zürich Lions proved nothing. Btw, read what I said about NLA. Plus, you can not compare 2008 year with 2013.

vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2013, 04:00 PM
  #155
Latgale_fan
Registered User
 
Latgale_fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Riga
Country: Latvia
Posts: 964
vCash: 500
Dare I say- nothing?

I honestly don't see any connection. Their joining KHL means that KHL gets another club with cool jersey and logo... and more exposure in Finland. But I don't see it having any impact on Sweden.

Then again Elitserien is now called SHL..... Could it be that it's a secret plan to change ''S'' from ''Sweden'' to ''Scandinavian'' later and create a Pan-European league with KHL??

Latgale_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2013, 06:21 PM
  #156
Jussi
No strings on me
 
Jussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Finland
Posts: 45,165
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latgale_fan View Post
Dare I say- nothing?

I honestly don't see any connection. Their joining KHL means that KHL gets another club with cool jersey and logo... and more exposure in Finland. But I don't see it having any impact on Sweden.

Then again Elitserien is now called SHL..... Could it be that it's a secret plan to change ''S'' from ''Sweden'' to ''Scandinavian'' later and create a Pan-European league with KHL??
Well the Finnish league announced today they're changing their name from SM-Liiga to 1üga.


Jussi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2013, 03:47 AM
  #157
icing
Registered User
 
icing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 841
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
Well the Finnish league announced today they're changing their name from SM-Liiga to 1üga.

1:st üga

I read it like Lüga.

icing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2013, 03:52 AM
  #158
icing
Registered User
 
icing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 841
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latgale_fan View Post
Dare I say- nothing?

I honestly don't see any connection. Their joining KHL means that KHL gets another club with cool jersey and logo... and more exposure in Finland. But I don't see it having any impact on Sweden.

Then again Elitserien is now called SHL..... Could it be that it's a secret plan to change ''S'' from ''Sweden'' to ''Scandinavian'' later and create a Pan-European league with KHL??
I dont think so, no. Finland is not part of Scandinavia and I don't think the Swedish teams will reach outside it's own borders not including Finland. A Nordic league would automatically include more countries than just Sweden, Denmark and Norway. But we already have a NHL.


Last edited by icing: 08-10-2013 at 03:58 AM.
icing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2013, 09:25 AM
  #159
Jonimaus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Lund
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by icing View Post
I dont think so, no. Finland is not part of Scandinavia and I don't think the Swedish teams will reach outside it's own borders not including Finland. A Nordic league would automatically include more countries than just Sweden, Denmark and Norway. But we already have a NHL.
You mean like Iceland, Greenland and Faroe Islands?

Jonimaus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-11-2013, 07:28 AM
  #160
icing
Registered User
 
icing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 841
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonimaus View Post
You mean like Iceland, Greenland and Faroe Islands?
Hmm. I guess so. We can learn the "Islanders" to skate can't we?

icing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-26-2013, 04:04 AM
  #161
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
Alexander Medvedev, 25.8.2013

Quote:
- Хочу напомнить, что более 80 процентов акционеров королевского клуба АЕК, среди которых сотни тысяч простых болельщиков, проголосовали за участие клуба в КХЛ. Но шведская федерация это заблокировала. Однако я надеюсь, что все-таки мы дождемся того времени, когда АЕК будет выступать в КХЛ. Также хочется видеть у нас немецкие и швейцарские клубы.
http://www.sovsport.ru/news/text-item/636478

Quote:
I want to remind you that more than 80% of AIK shareholders, among them are pure fans, voted for joining KHL. However swedish federation blocked it. I believe that there will be time when AIK plays KHL. We would like to see germans a suiss clubs in the league as well.

vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-26-2013, 12:14 PM
  #162
icing
Registered User
 
icing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 841
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vorky View Post
Alexander Medvedev, 25.8.2013


http://www.sovsport.ru/news/text-item/636478
80% of 198 votes said yes to continue the work with the application of joining the KHL. Yup, only 198 people attended and voted. There's about 16 000 members. They decided to have another vote about the definite joining if the swedish federation said yes. About 50% also wanted to wait and see if AIK would be promoted to the SHL (former SEL) - have in mind AIK was playing 2nd tier hockey at the moment and the club economy was dreadful.


Last edited by icing: 08-26-2013 at 12:25 PM.
icing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-26-2013, 12:36 PM
  #163
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
mistake, wrong thread.


Last edited by vorky: 08-26-2013 at 01:10 PM.
vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-26-2013, 12:56 PM
  #164
icing
Registered User
 
icing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 841
vCash: 500
...
The content in the post i responded to was deleted and edited. A mod can delete this.
...


Last edited by icing: 08-27-2013 at 05:49 AM.
icing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-26-2013, 01:02 PM
  #165
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
mistake, wrong thread.


Last edited by vorky: 08-26-2013 at 01:28 PM.
vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-26-2013, 01:07 PM
  #166
icing
Registered User
 
icing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 841
vCash: 500
...
The content in the post i responded to was deleted and edited. A mod can delete this.
...


Last edited by icing: 08-27-2013 at 05:49 AM.
icing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 08:48 AM
  #167
hz
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Country: Sweden
Posts: 103
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vorky View Post
First you need biggest trophy in Europe and Champions League. None in there and I guess will not be.

If you want Champions League, you need clubs from various countries, which are comparable to each other (by budget, quality, players) not to have blowouts. It is not possible in hockey, because SHL/SM-Liiga clubs can not be comparable with KHL´s, especially top KHL´s. Maybe NLA clubs and one or two DEL clubs would be able to skate solid roster if such CL, because they have money. Or to have CL without KHL, which is not real at all.

When your clubs have budget at least at 15M euro, we can talk about CL.
Do you really think the KHL clubs would blowout the european teams? Really? Budget is not everything. Sure Russia has money, but Sweden is a much more attractive country for foreigners, so is Germany, Switzerland, Finland and rest of Europe. Many teams in Sweden also play with cheaper young talented players, which is quite rare in KHL. All in all, my point is that in Sweden be dont need as much money as the russians club to be able to compete. Top teams in Sweden would certainly be able to compete with every team in KHL. So would teams in Finland, Switzerland, Germany, Czech Republic and even Austria.

Btw if money would be everything, how come Dortmund is the second best team in the world and not Manchester City?

hz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 08:54 AM
  #168
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hz View Post
Do you really think the KHL clubs would blowout the european teams? Really? Budget is not everything. Sure Russia has money, but Sweden is a much more attractive country for foreigners, so is Germany, Switzerland, Finland and rest of Europe. Many teams in Sweden also play with cheaper young talented players, which is quite rare in KHL. All in all, my point is that in Sweden be dont need as much money as the russians club to be able to compete. Top teams in Sweden would certainly be able to compete with every team in KHL. So would teams in Finland, Switzerland, Germany, Czech Republic and even Austria.

Btw if money would be everything, how come Dortmund is the second best team in the world and not Manchester City?
I would like to ask you if you really think that "Top teams in Sweden would certainly be able to compete with every team in KHL. So would teams in Finland, Switzerland, Germany, Czech Republic and even Austria." Thx

Yes, money are not everything but you need money to have good competition. That is a reason why swedish soccer team does not play stage group of UEFA Champions League every year. Sweden is just as example of soccer country, which is not on par with the best euro leagues. I could name Finland, Slovakia, Latvia if I wanted.

vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 09:03 AM
  #169
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
You named Manchester City but you omitted Chelsea, MU and other top english clubs. The same with Real, FCB, Bayern.

If you want Champions league style of competition you need at least 3-4 domestic leagues which TOP clubs are on pair in budgets. I can not see that in hockey. Yes, there are such leagues - SHL, SML, DEL but they are not even close to KHL. I am speaking about top clubs of the leagues. That is one of reasons why I dont believe "Champions league style of competition" = ET. I am sure that a few top swedish clubs would have no problem to compete in KHL, because they would be forced to increase budget. The same Jokerit or Lev Praha.

vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 09:09 AM
  #170
Huffman
Registered User
 
Huffman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,591
vCash: 500
The KHL will never be MUCH better than the SHL or FEL as long as their league consists of close to 30 teams mainly filled with guys from the former Soviet countries and rejected NHL players. Pay them all you want, the difference in quality will still not be huge.

Huffman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 09:14 AM
  #171
hz
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Country: Sweden
Posts: 103
vCash: 500
The difference beetween Allsvenskan and teams Barcelona and Bayern is much bigger both in quality and economy than beetween SHL and top KHL-teams. But if say Malmö made it to the groupstage there would for sure not be blowouts against either of those team. Malmö could maybe pull of a upset against teams like Milan, Juventus or PSG. My team, IFK Göteborg has for the record beaten both Bayern and Barca in CL, despite the huge differences in economy.

I look at the KHL roosters and i cannot see what's so great about them? Even on paper the KHL is not much better. Like Thoresen i know is one of the biggest stars year after year. That guy was nothing special in SHL, he could not make the NHL. What makes you think players like that would make so much of a difference? Is he better then for instance Holloway? I dont think so. For the KHL teams to be able to beat the european teams ten times in ten they would have to have 6 Kovalchuk and 6 Radulov. Look at Slovan now, they lost to Vienna and will probably not make it to Berlin.

hz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 09:28 AM
  #172
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
Slovan does not want to make it to Berlin, ET is not attractive for club.

Look at pre-games of SKA this offseason. Then we can talk.

We can talk weeks about rosters but it is not important. If you want attractive league, pan euro league, you need money. If you want Champions League you need 3 or 4 similar leagues, which top clubs are on pair budget talks. That is a reason why FCB plays CL and not clubs from Albania.


Last edited by vorky: 08-30-2013 at 09:33 AM.
vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 09:29 AM
  #173
hz
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Country: Sweden
Posts: 103
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huffman View Post
The KHL will never be MUCH better than the SHL or FEL as long as their league consists of close to 30 teams mainly filled with guys from the former Soviet countries and rejected NHL players. Pay them all you want, the difference in quality will still not be huge.
Yeah, i agree.

SHL is filled with players who couldn't make the NHL+ a few youngsters that maybe could.
KHL is filled with players who couldn't make the NHL+ Some russians who have moved home and often underperformes.

The quality of the players who couldn't make the NHL are basically the same, they don't magically become better because they receive more money. The russian NHL-calibre guys are to few to make a real kind of difference.

Holloway, Joakim Lindtström, Oscar Möller, Pierre-Edouard Bellemare, Jimmie Ericsson + and bunch av hardworking talented youngsters. To say that this team is much worse then SKA is stupid. They could beat them any day of the week.

It so easy to make excuses when you dont "want" to win. I have yet to met the hockeyplayer that don't want to win every game.

hz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 09:35 AM
  #174
vorky
@vorkywh24
 
vorky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,041
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hz View Post
Yeah, i agree.

SHL is filled with players who couldn't make the NHL+ a few youngsters that maybe could.
KHL is filled with players who couldn't make the NHL+ Some russians who have moved home and often underperformes.

The quality of the players who couldn't make the NHL are basically the same, they don't magically become better because they receive more money. The russian NHL-calibre guys are to few to make a real kind of difference.

Holloway, Joakim Lindtström, Oscar Möller, Pierre-Edouard Bellemare, Jimmie Ericsson + and bunch av hardworking talented youngsters. To say that this team is much worse then SKA is stupid. They could beat them any day of the week.

It so easy to make excuses when you dont "want" to win. I have yet to met the hockeyplayer that don't want to win every game.
bold is not true. I can name you guys who would play NHL if no KHL. Would be nice, if you made a research before writing.

vorky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2013, 09:37 AM
  #175
hz
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Country: Sweden
Posts: 103
vCash: 500
They blew out the two worst teams in SM-liiga. Doesn't say that much really. Then they played two close games against two middle teams. That's the team that would blow out the top teams in Sweden... I think these games spoke to my advantage really.

hz is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:48 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.