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Eklund: Rangers Coach "Quietly" Pushing for a Big Trade to Change Culture?

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Old
09-04-2013, 02:32 PM
  #76
HoosierDaddy
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
I agree with GAG, not sure what basis AV would have to change the culture when he barely knows the players. He has yet to see how they interact as a team, whether in the locker room or on the ice. And it's not like the team has any Avery, Kotalik, Wolski, etc., types that need to be weeded out.
How much do you need to know? This was the group that got the last coach fired, deservedly so, IMO.

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09-04-2013, 02:39 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by HoosierDaddy View Post
How much do you need to know? This was the group that got the last coach fired, deservedly so, IMO.
not sure what you're saying.

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09-04-2013, 02:50 PM
  #78
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Barely>none
It's a stretch to say that Dom Moore with one year off is worse than Boyle by any substantial margin. In fact, if you want to be technical Moore only missed half a year of hockey considering it was a short season. Not like he isn't a professional athlete and doesn't know how to stay in shape, he's really fit. His timing might take a month or two to get back but once that happens he's clearly a better player. I like Boyle though too, that comment was mostly in jest.

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09-04-2013, 02:52 PM
  #79
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I agree with someone above who said the culture change is AV.

Anytime you bring in a new coach, you're bringing in a new culture. Also, not a shock that a new coach wants to instill his culture in his new team.

How AV moulds his team via system or trade is on him, and I wouldn't be surprised if there was a player or two he wants to move.

But the timing does seem odd to say the least.

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09-04-2013, 02:54 PM
  #80
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since this whole thing is purely unfounded unlikely speculation, these are my Cap-compatible daydreams

Richards for Stastny or Phaneuf and I'm cool with that.

Staal to 'Canes if Justin Faulk comes back, i'm cool with that too.

Del Zotto for Nugent-Hopkins, i'm cool with that


If Ottawa wanted Boyle in a package for Gryba and Obrien (or Stone), that might work.

otherwise, let it be
Glad you are. EDM would laugh hard.

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09-04-2013, 02:57 PM
  #81
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HFNYR was actually pretty sane for the last week. Now we're back.

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09-04-2013, 03:08 PM
  #82
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HFNYR was actually pretty sane for the last week. Now we're back.
HF is only sane when it's down for maintenance.

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Old
09-04-2013, 03:15 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Not to add to the credibility of the off-season publicity lies spewed by Eklund, but if AV came in and his first real move is trading away Callahan, the heart of soul of this organization, he would be hated by fans before he even gets a chance to stand behind the bench.

Shape the team how you want, dumping our captain and a guy that this team has been molded after would be dispicable, especially if you're trying to "change the culture." You don't trade away the guy who is the hardest worker, year in year out.
No matter who gets traded, if the team wins, no one except the ones who bought a jersey of the player would care all that much.

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09-04-2013, 04:00 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by JCrusty View Post
not sure what you're saying.
Our illustious leader for life had no intentions of making a coaching change until after the exit interviews with the players. I choose to read that based on those discussions a decision was made to $hit-can the coach.

But I could as well be all wet. Just my interpretation of how things played out. Feel free to disagree.

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09-04-2013, 04:00 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by cwede View Post

Rangers Coach "Quietly" Pushing for a Big Trade to Change Culture?
You'd think he would want to see the team skate once or twice. That said.

Who is not an AV kind of guy? If anything , all homerism aside, I think the Rangers roster is pretty solid with character and skill. Could it be better ? Yea, but is it the culture?

Based on his lame play last year Brad Richards could go, but maybe he was just off his game due to the lockout and injuries. I wouldn't classify him as a bad apple in the locker room.

Nash? Everyone loves Nash - He just can't do it alone?

Cally? Heart and soul

Staal...Girardi....Mc D...Steps...Hags THE KING!


I dont see where the "culture" is dragging us down.

Even the new guys like Brassard and Dorsett appear to be solid players with a will to play hard.

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09-04-2013, 04:02 PM
  #86
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No matter who gets traded, if the team wins, no one except the ones who bought a jersey of the player would care all that much.
That's the reason I do not stich names or numbers on my, now, 4 sweaters. I root for the logo on the front, doing away with the customizing I don't grow a big attachment to the players.

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09-04-2013, 04:05 PM
  #87
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But I could as well be all wet.
Glad you cleared that up for Crusty.

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09-04-2013, 04:14 PM
  #88
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What exactly is wrong with the culture in New York?

The squad they ice is competitive and a legit playoff contender, they just had their offense neutered by Torts despite the fact they possess players like Richards and Nash.

I wouldn't read into this at all, has anybody mentioned the fact that it's a little too late in the summer to move numerous players and just hope they all gel within a month?

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09-04-2013, 04:16 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Robert Theodorson View Post
What exactly is wrong with the culture in New York?
Pretty weak season for Broadway. Tickets to Betrayed are seriously expensive.

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Old
09-04-2013, 04:26 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by HoosierDaddy View Post
Our illustious leader for life had no intentions of making a coaching change until after the exit interviews with the players. I choose to read that based on those discussions a decision was made to $hit-can the coach.

But I could as well be all wet. Just my interpretation of how things played out. Feel free to disagree.
The day Glen Sather says "Okay.... okay.... so you want the coach gone?" instead of smacking a player out of his office with his half chewed moist cigar is the day when Glen Sather is no longer the GM of the New York Rangers. People are blaming the players putting the fault on them for the firing of the coach through bad mouthing TOrts. Glen doesn't roll that way which is one reason why he's been the long time GM of this Dolan owned team. Glen saw what he saw. Perhaps the players showed how they feel for Glen to pick up on and didn't put the former coach on a pedestal but what are people expecting?

Disgruntled players are supposed to make the coach sound great? Is Glen suppose to ignore the lack of faith the players had in his dump-in system? Are the players suppose to hide their discontent and lack of faith in moving forward with the way he handles the defense, offense, and players? Is Brad Richards suppose to walk into the room and say "Torts was great"? Sure, the guy didn't have a good year but is there a way to keep both Richards and Torts? It's not even about keeping one or the other, it's about the fact that these decisions exist. Is Henrik suppose to walk in there and say nothing about what he feels?

I mean, we have our opinions as fans on whether Torts should have been fired or not and so do the players. If the principle has an interview with students to talk about a teacher and the students are afraid to speak out against the teacher explicitly but insinuates that they are not happy with the teacher's teaching abilities, manners, methods of discipline and effectiveness and makes them uncomfortable and unwilling to perform their duties as students, is the principle suppose to ignore that?

There was no anonymous vote and a ballot. The point of these exit interviews is exactly that: to assess various aspects of the team through the perspectives of the players. When you do in fact pick up on so many problems expressed by players, you do something.

Had Glen not done nothing, it would have been negligent. In the world of managing coach-player relationship, it would be 2nd degree murder of the team.

I just think the players fired Torts line is more about getting traffic on articles.

P.S routing back to thread, the culture that AV wants to change (if that is in fact the case), might be more to do with making this team his as opposed to Torts's. More than half of our team was molded by Torts. As a new coach coming in, I'd want to do something to put my mark on a season before it starts.

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Old
09-04-2013, 04:39 PM
  #91
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vigneault needs more offensive players for his purely offensive system, might as well sell off all the defensive players since its gonna be all offense this season.

someones not going to see the sarcasm here

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Old
09-04-2013, 06:37 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by JCrusty View Post
The day Glen Sather says "Okay.... okay.... so you want the coach gone?" instead of smacking a player out of his office with his half chewed moist cigar is the day when Glen Sather is no longer the GM of the New York Rangers. People are blaming the players putting the fault on them for the firing of the coach through bad mouthing TOrts. Glen doesn't roll that way which is one reason why he's been the long time GM of this Dolan owned team. Glen saw what he saw. Perhaps the players showed how they feel for Glen to pick up on and didn't put the former coach on a pedestal but what are people expecting?

Disgruntled players are supposed to make the coach sound great? Is Glen suppose to ignore the lack of faith the players had in his dump-in system? Are the players suppose to hide their discontent and lack of faith in moving forward with the way he handles the defense, offense, and players? Is Brad Richards suppose to walk into the room and say "Torts was great"? Sure, the guy didn't have a good year but is there a way to keep both Richards and Torts? It's not even about keeping one or the other, it's about the fact that these decisions exist. Is Henrik suppose to walk in there and say nothing about what he feels?

I mean, we have our opinions as fans on whether Torts should have been fired or not and so do the players. If the principle has an interview with students to talk about a teacher and the students are afraid to speak out against the teacher explicitly but insinuates that they are not happy with the teacher's teaching abilities, manners, methods of discipline and effectiveness and makes them uncomfortable and unwilling to perform their duties as students, is the principle suppose to ignore that?

There was no anonymous vote and a ballot. The point of these exit interviews is exactly that: to assess various aspects of the team through the perspectives of the players. When you do in fact pick up on so many problems expressed by players, you do something.

Had Glen not done nothing, it would have been negligent. In the world of managing coach-player relationship, it would be 2nd degree murder of the team.

I just think the players fired Torts line is more about getting traffic on articles.

P.S routing back to thread, the culture that AV wants to change (if that is in fact the case), might be more to do with making this team his as opposed to Torts's. More than half of our team was molded by Torts. As a new coach coming in, I'd want to do something to put my mark on a season before it starts.
I dont know why its so hard to envision that a couple of player sob stories didnt sway the decision which, in a sane world, is a much tougher decision than you lead on.

Your caricature of Sather playing the role of Gordon Gekko is a wild tale -- if it were ever true, it'd have been back when Wall Street came out.

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Old
09-04-2013, 06:39 PM
  #93
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See Dubinsky? Dubinsky was a player who's play and production never really improved. He never developed the consistent offensive game that he showed flashes of having. Dubsinsky became overpaid. He didn't get dealt becasue he didn't "sign quietly"

Assuming this "rumor" is true, I hardly see it being a ploy to get Stepan to sign.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts. Dubinsky's production rate went up consistently every season but two (his second full season, where they moved him away from Jagr, and his last season here, where he clearly just had a down year).

Excepting those two, his production has steadily gone up (including last year, where he put up the highest production rate of his career).

People here didn't like him because he held out and because they expected him to be a goalscorer (which he never was). The team traded him because Columbus demanded him and they wanted Nash. That's all there is to it.

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09-04-2013, 06:52 PM
  #94
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You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts. Dubinsky's production rate went up consistently every season but two (his second full season, where they moved him away from Jagr, and his last season here, where he clearly just had a down year).

Excepting those two, his production has steadily gone up (including last year, where he put up the highest production rate of his career).

People here didn't like him because he held out and because they expected him to be a goalscorer (which he never was). The team traded him because Columbus demanded him and they wanted Nash. That's all there is to it.
I didn't say it didn't improve. I said it never really improved. If you want o laude the jump from 41 pound to 44 fewer games fine. But you can't chalk up going from 54 points in 77 games in 10-11 to 34 points in 77 games in 11-12 as simply a down year.

I didn't really care that he led out. And I didnt really care that he want a goal scorer. What I did care about and what I didn't like was his awful hockey IQ.

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09-04-2013, 06:56 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I didn't say it didn't improve. I said it never really improved. If you want o laude the jump from 41 pound to 44 fewer games fine. But you can't chalk up going from 54 points in 77 games in 10-11 to 34 points in 77 games in 11-12 as simply a down year.

I didn't really care that he led out. And I didnt really care that he want a goal scorer. What I did care about and what I didn't like was his awful hockey IQ.
You said that his play and production never really improved. I pointed out the consistent increase in production, and now your beef is the tired "awful hockey IQ" nonsense (ie- the go to thing people list when they don't like a player for non-hockey reasons)? Yeah. Sure you don't care that he held out.

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09-04-2013, 07:08 PM
  #96
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You said that his play and production never really improved. I pointed out the consistent increase in production, and now your beef is the tired "awful hockey IQ" nonsense (ie- the go to thing people list when they don't like a player for non-hockey reasons)? Yeah. Sure you don't care that he held out.
No, it's something people say when stats don't tell the full story.

A one point increase to a 3 point increase to a 10 increase is indeed an increase by definition. But it's not the trajectory I had hoped for him (especially with a two point decrease the following season). Especially for someone carrying a 4.2M cap hit. Do to me his play and production never really improved. The numbers may have improved marginally. His play didn't improve.

I was here or his contract negotiation. Feel free to look back at my posting history and show me where I killed him for holding out.

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09-04-2013, 07:38 PM
  #97
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No, it's something people say when stats don't tell the full story.

A one point increase to a 3 point increase to a 10 increase is indeed an increase by definition. But it's not the trajectory I had hoped for him (especially with a two point decrease the following season). Especially for someone carrying a 4.2M cap hit. Do to me his play and production never really improved. The numbers may have improved marginally. His play didn't improve.

I was here or his contract negotiation. Feel free to look back at my posting history and show me where I killed him for holding out.
Good luck explaining that around these parts.

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Old
09-04-2013, 08:01 PM
  #98
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Why would the Rangers move quality depth for a broken down, aging Morrow? I'd rather have either of Boyle/Zuccarello on their own than Morrow, let alone moving both of them to accomodate space for him. It's not even that I think those two are more valuable as players (which I do), I think they're important to the locker room culture. Both are well liked and excellent teammates.
I'm not advocating moving anyone. The team is down two top nine forwards at the start of the season and he can help bridge that gap. I'd like to have Morrow then and later in the year we will need him as an injury/playoff reinforcement. He's a leader and plays with genuine toughness. 55-60 regular season games and playoffs. LTIR will create enough room.

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09-04-2013, 08:41 PM
  #99
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Maybe they are referring to the renovations and physically changing the shape of the locker room.


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09-04-2013, 08:45 PM
  #100
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What exactly is wrong with the culture in New York?
I don't know. I, like Alain Vigneault, have not been inside the dressing room.

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