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Old
09-03-2013, 07:49 PM
  #76
Mr Forever
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I'm disappointed MacT didn't make the bottom six better, but replacing Horcoff and Whitney with Gordon and Ference was great.

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09-04-2013, 04:44 AM
  #77
Steve BachIntyre
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i think the single act of buying out belanger made the bottom 6 better. even if they were to bring lonny bohonos back from europe to replace him with. still better.

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09-04-2013, 07:19 AM
  #78
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Way too early for this thread. Post it again in 2 years.

So far, so good for MacT but it's a long way to go when your top line is aged 23-20-21 y.o. The peak for a player is usually considered to be 27 y.o.

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09-04-2013, 07:59 AM
  #79
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Anybody know if the MacT/Hemsky presser is going to be streamed on the Oilers webpage today ?

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09-04-2013, 09:11 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by MrOiler View Post
Way too early for this thread. Post it again in 2 years.

So far, so good for MacT but it's a long way to go when your top line is aged 23-20-21 y.o. The peak for a player is usually considered to be 27 y.o.
Well, MacT had nothing to do with acquiring any of the players on the top line, so why would anyone give him credit for it - now, or 2 years from now?

Going into the season with proven liabilities like Smyth, and gambling on AHLers like Acton and Hamilton are the moves he should be judged on, and there is no reason to wait 2 years to make that assessment.

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09-04-2013, 09:16 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Red Deer Rebel View Post
Well, MacT had nothing to do with acquiring any of the players on the top line, so why would anyone give him credit for it - now, or 2 years from now?

Going into the season with proven liabilities like Smyth, and gambling on AHLers like Acton and Hamilton are the moves he should be judged on, and there is no reason to wait 2 years to make that assessment.
He did acquire a top-6 forward for potential, so there's that.

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09-04-2013, 09:42 AM
  #82
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I vote for Tambi. He got more for Penner than Calgary got for Iginla - much more. The fact that he got anything for him is remarkable, the fact that he got a first round, a former first round, and an asset. WOW. Cleared out Moreau and his contract at a time when Ethan was a shell of himself. Got something for Steve Staois when Staois had lost a couple steps.

I like MacT, but to say he did something substantially more than Tambi ... I dunno. Tambi didn't make a bunch of unfulfilled promises like MacT did. Although, Tambi didn't speak.

In the cycle of things, Tambi was there to gut out KLowe's mistakes and stockpile assests. I'm glad he wasn't trigger happy. MacT's role now is different, his role is to start to harvest the crops and make some trades. There were no crops for Tambi to harvest.
You listed the three good moves (aside from 1st overalls) in the entire time Tambellini was here. MacTavish trading Horcoff and getting Perron are more significant than all but the Penner deal.

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09-04-2013, 09:45 AM
  #83
Moose Coleman
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Originally Posted by Red Deer Rebel View Post
Well, MacT had nothing to do with acquiring any of the players on the top line, so why would anyone give him credit for it - now, or 2 years from now?

Going into the season with proven liabilities like Smyth, and gambling on AHLers like Acton and Hamilton are the moves he should be judged on, and there is no reason to wait 2 years to make that assessment.
True, but you could also wait until the season, uh, starts.

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09-04-2013, 09:48 AM
  #84
ManofSteel55
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Originally Posted by Red Deer Rebel View Post
Well, MacT had nothing to do with acquiring any of the players on the top line, so why would anyone give him credit for it - now, or 2 years from now?

Going into the season with proven liabilities like Smyth, and gambling on AHLers like Acton and Hamilton are the moves he should be judged on, and there is no reason to wait 2 years to make that assessment.
Guys like Smyth, Acton and Hamilton aren't much different than guys we had when Tambo was here. Like Smyth, Belanger, Eager, etc.

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09-04-2013, 10:08 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by ManofSteel55 View Post
Guys like Smyth, Acton and Hamilton aren't much different than guys we had when Tambo was here. Like Smyth, Belanger, Eager, etc.
How so? Smyth is what he is, Done, but I don't see how Acton and Hamilton are anything like Belanger and Eager, save for the role they'll be put in.

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09-04-2013, 10:30 AM
  #86
Tad Mikowsky
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True, but you could also wait until the season, uh, starts.
No man, we have to jump to conclusions!

Your post makes too much sense.

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09-04-2013, 11:05 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by ManofSteel55 View Post
Guys like Smyth, Acton and Hamilton aren't much different than guys we had when Tambo was here. Like Smyth, Belanger, Eager, etc.
I would argue they are likely to be worse. Smyth was so bad at center last year Kreuger had to bring up Vande Velde to replace him.

MacTavish has done little to improve our organizational depth chart at center. We dropped Horcoff and Belanger, and brought in Gordon and a question mark.

Other than Gordon, our bottom 6 is full of question marks or players who have already proven they can't play - and Craig MacTavish is the person who has produced this state of affairs.

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09-04-2013, 11:27 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Red Deer Rebel View Post
I would argue they are likely to be worse. Smyth was so bad at center last year Kreuger had to bring up Vande Velde to replace him.

MacTavish has done little to improve our organizational depth chart at center. We dropped Horcoff and Belanger, and brought in Gordon and a question mark.

Other than Gordon, our bottom 6 is full of question marks or players who have already proven they can't play - and Craig MacTavish is the person who has produced this state of affairs.
Belanger is addition by subtraction. Not sure how you miss this.

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09-04-2013, 01:07 PM
  #89
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Seems like this team has to purge every year. Would be nice if our pro scouts could make a decent evaluation from time to time.

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09-04-2013, 01:23 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
Belanger is addition by subtraction. Not sure how you miss this.
There are far worse centers in our organization than Eric Belanger.

In fact, Lander is the only viable replacement, and even he would have to take a step forward to be an upgrade.

Having said this, I would much rather have Lander than Belanger, but I would also much rather have Belanger than any of the plugs MacTavish brought in, or Ryan Smyth, who, as I stated, couldn't even outplay Chris Vande Velde last year.

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09-04-2013, 01:35 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Red Deer Rebel View Post
I would argue they are likely to be worse. Smyth was so bad at center last year Kreuger had to bring up Vande Velde to replace him.

MacTavish has done little to improve our organizational depth chart at center. We dropped Horcoff and Belanger, and brought in Gordon and a question mark.

Other than Gordon, our bottom 6 is full of question marks or players who have already proven they can't play - and Craig MacTavish is the person who has produced this state of affairs.
Third line is Jones-Gordon-Hemsky. Not a fan of Jones and it remains to be seen if he can bounce back after last season, but he's serviceable enough.

So really we're talking about the fourth line and who cares about a line that we'll (hopefully) see for maybe eight minutes a night at most?

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09-04-2013, 01:37 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
Third line is Jones-Gordon-Hemsky. Not a fan of Jones and it remains to be seen if he can bounce back after last season, but he's serviceable enough.

So really we're talking about the fourth line and who cares about a line that we'll (hopefully) see for maybe eight minutes a night at most?
^^ ***.

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09-04-2013, 01:56 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
Third line is Jones-Gordon-Hemsky. Not a fan of Jones and it remains to be seen if he can bounce back after last season, but he's serviceable enough.

So really we're talking about the fourth line and who cares about a line that we'll (hopefully) see for maybe eight minutes a night at most?
Hemsky is a top 6 winger who gave an interview a couple of seasons ago expressing his disdain about being "turned into a checker".

But, I do agree that he will easily be our best defensive winger in the bottom 6 after he gets demoted ...

... which should tell us all how bad the rest of the bottom 6 wingers are.

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09-04-2013, 03:29 PM
  #94
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Gordon - elite defensively

Joensuu - solid defensively... better than most give him credit for

Jones - decent defensively... not a defensive liability

Hemsky - average defensively... not a liability

Brown - decent defensively... for a guy who's a #13 forward he's perfectly adequate defensively

Smyth - decent defensively but obviously has slowed down a lot

Lander - still unproven defensively imo. Obviously he's young and still developing so this is a year that he'll hopefully show he can be a solid #4C given some linemates who hopefully can at least be average in their own end.

Omark - awful defensively and hopefully he's improved in that area


Overall the defensive abilities of most of the bottom line forwards is adequate. I actually worry more about scoring in the bottom 6 than anything else. More grit and physicality as well would obviously help take the pressure off the top 2 lines but if most of those players above play up to their abilities (a big IF) then I think the bottom 6 won't bleed as many goals against as some think.

Darkhorses like Eager or Ryan Hamilton could potentially surprise us with strong camps and really create some good competition on the roster.

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09-04-2013, 05:35 PM
  #95
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sorry, did not read thread..

but comparing a GM who could build a solid case to why he should be considered one of the worst GM's of all time to a guy who's had the job for 5 months makes no sense

carry on if you think this convo is relevant or entertaining

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09-04-2013, 06:24 PM
  #96
Kyle McMahon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
Third line is Jones-Gordon-Hemsky. Not a fan of Jones and it remains to be seen if he can bounce back after last season, but he's serviceable enough.

So really we're talking about the fourth line and who cares about a line that we'll (hopefully) see for maybe eight minutes a night at most?
You're right, 4th lines are of no importance and have no impact on their teams' fortunes.

Sincerely,

Kruger-Bolland-Frolik

Paille-Campbell-Thornton


Gee, two of those guys were available for draft picks as salary dumps at the draft. Couldn't have used them, could we MacT?

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09-04-2013, 06:37 PM
  #97
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I'm disappointed MacT didn't make the bottom six better, but replacing Horcoff and Whitney with Gordon and Ference was great.
MacT did say a lot of deals fell apart and was disappointed. He's done the best he could and he's done a lot. Can't change everything in one offseason. I just love that he flat out admitted the weakenesses of the team and is trying to address them.

What I really like about MacT though is that he is 100% honest and does his best to explain everything to the public. Most importantly, he doesn't sugarcoat things. He's very intellectual and says the right things.

The guy is at least trying. Hell, look what he did today? He had a mini press conference with Hemsky to clear the air because he felt it might become a distraction. Smart.

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09-04-2013, 06:41 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Kyle McMahon View Post
You're right, 4th lines are of no importance and have no impact on their teams' fortunes.

Sincerely,

Kruger-Bolland-Frolik

Paille-Campbell-Thornton


Gee, two of those guys were available for draft picks as salary dumps at the draft. Couldn't have used them, could we MacT?
Yeah, remember how good Versteeg was when he left Chicago?

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09-04-2013, 07:21 PM
  #99
Kyle McMahon
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Yeah, remember how good Versteeg was when he left Chicago?
Yeah, he followed up those years of 53 and 44 points in Chicago with years of 54 and 46 points in Tor/Phi and Florida. What a bum.

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09-04-2013, 07:58 PM
  #100
GreatKeith
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Yeah, he followed up those years of 53 and 44 points in Chicago with years of 54 and 46 points in Tor/Phi and Florida. What a bum.
And then a whopping 4 points last year.

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