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Brian Burke-President of Hockey Operations for the Calgary Flames

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Old
09-05-2013, 02:27 PM
  #176
guymez
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
They don't have a single elite forward. The flames have a top line and then a bottom 9 with virtually zero centers.
You think the Oilers are deep at centre? Why is it that you are so intent on pointing fingers instead of scrutinizing the holes on your team?


In terms of elite talent I would be concerned about the Flames next draft pick if I were you.
Also, as MV pointed out below, Bärtschi is very talented and has the potential to be an Eberle equivalent IMO.

That said...since when are you in a position as an Oilers fan to point fingers at other organizations and their lack of success?

That seems to be your only role on this board. Does this make you feel better because the Oilers suck so bad?

I would rather the Oilers improve and start actually competing for something other than the lottery.


Last edited by guymez: 09-05-2013 at 02:33 PM.
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09-05-2013, 02:27 PM
  #177
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Good points...completely agree especially on the MacT/Burke part.
All I want is to see the BOA mean something again...have it be at least a semblance of what I grew up with as a kid.

If Burke can spice things up a bit and keep pressure on the Oilers to not be complacent, I have no problem with that.

Burke vs. MacT instead of Feaster vs. Tambellini? Winner winner chicken dinner.

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09-05-2013, 02:29 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by Digger12 View Post
All I want is to see the BOA mean something again...have it be at least a semblance of what I grew up with as a kid.

If Burke can spice things up a bit and keep pressure on the Oilers to not be complacent, I have no problem with that.

Burke vs. MacT instead of Feaster vs. Tambellini? Winner winner chicken dinner.


Winner winner chicken dinner indeed.

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09-05-2013, 02:29 PM
  #179
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Just no talent. I'll take the talent.
Sven Bärtschi is stupid talented.

This just in: Top 3 picks aren't a prerequisite for elite talent.

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09-05-2013, 02:31 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
By most accounts the goal was to be a playoff team last year opposed to being a borderline lottery club.
On the merit of the natural progression of a young, talented team - not because they stepped up in free agency or the trade market and plugged the holes.

It doesn't take a genius hockey mind to throw money at players like Hudler and Wideman and pretend they're the solution.

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Sidenote: Sorry, this Burke hiring has made me super cynical. I'm not convinced that he's a great hockey mind but based on the kinds of players that he covets and loves my gut tells me that the Flames are going to be pushing the Oilers around... regardless of their lack of "skill." I'm still having nightmares about that last game between the Oilers and Flames from last season. Their ECHL players bullied our guys.
He blusters about truculence, but have you watched the Leafs? Soft as we are.

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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
Sven Bärtschi is stupid talented.

This just in: Top 3 picks aren't a prerequisite for elite talent.
They're just a near assurance of it.

I'll reiterate an earlier point: Based on what you would consider trackable progression and league history, it would not be reasonable to suggest Baertschi WILL be an elite player.

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09-05-2013, 02:34 PM
  #181
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I think its a virtual guarantee that the Flames will have better balance than the Oilers. Their top 3 lines will not have the lack of grit and toughness the Oilers top 3 has.
And whether Oilers fans agree with this philosophy or not, if the Flames struggle out of the gate and Burke isn't happy with the balance on the roster or the team's compete level then he and Feaster will make some moves. That's a definitely a guarantee. He's not going to sit around and watch the Flames limp to a last place finish. Even if they're destined to finish low in the standings they're still going to fight and claw and battle their way through the schedule.

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09-05-2013, 02:34 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
The lock out shortened season only masked how bad this team was.

In a full season this team would have been done by December.
A full training camp would've given the team a chance to implement systems better. Smith touched base on it yesterday said a lot of the coaching was done via video.

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09-05-2013, 02:36 PM
  #183
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A full training camp would've given the team a chance to implement systems better. Smith touched base on it yesterday said a lot of the coaching was done via video.
The only problem with that line of thought is that the Oilers had the same shortened training camp as every other team.

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09-05-2013, 02:38 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
And whether Oilers fans agree with this philosophy or not, if the Flames struggle out of the gate and Burke isn't happy with the balance on the roster or the team's compete level then he and Feaster will make some moves. That's a definitely a guarantee. He's not going to sit around and watch the Flames limp to a last place finish. Even if they're destined to finish low in the standings they're still going to fight and claw and battle their way through the schedule.
Good. If they can keep spinning their wheels trying to compete instead of accepting the painful short term need to rebuild, more the better.

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09-05-2013, 02:40 PM
  #185
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On the merit of the natural progression of a young, talented team - not because they stepped up in free agency or the trade market and plugged the holes.

It doesn't take a genius hockey mind to throw money at players like Hudler and Wideman and pretend they're the solution.
Hey, I hope you're right. If the Oilers struggle out of the gate I hope that MacTavish doesn't sit on his hands and "evaluate" like Tambellini did.

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He blusters about truculence, but have you watched the Leafs? Soft as we are.
And yet they still pushed the Oilers around the ice during the 11/12 season.

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They're just a near assurance of it.

I'll reiterate an earlier point: Based on what you would consider trackable progression and league history, it would not be reasonable to suggest Baertschi WILL be an elite player.
I'll start placing value on top 3 talent when the wins start coming.

Based on what I saw during the 2012 WHL final Bärtschi is going to be a star and a pain in the ass for us for many years. He was by far the most impressive player that I saw during those playoffs.

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09-05-2013, 02:40 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
And whether Oilers fans agree with this philosophy or not, if the Flames struggle out of the gate and Burke isn't happy with the balance on the roster or the team's compete level then he and Feaster will make some moves. That's a definitely a guarantee. He's not going to sit around and watch the Flames limp to a last place finish. Even if they're destined to finish low in the standings they're still going to fight and claw and battle their way through the schedule.
Completely agree and thats one of the main points of frustration I have had with this team.
This inability to improve the team under the guise of being patient was an insult to hockey fans that expected competent management.
Doing nothing rarely works to solve any problem.

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09-05-2013, 02:42 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
I'll start placing value on top 3 talent when the wins start coming.

Based on what I saw during the 2012 WHL final Bärtschi is going to be a star and a pain in the ass for us for many years. He was by far the most impressive player that I saw during those playoffs.
So top three talent needs to win at the NHL level, but you can predict Bärtschi's going to be elite because of his strong junior performance? WUT?

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09-05-2013, 02:44 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
The only problem with that line of thought is that the Oilers had the same shortened training camp as every other team.
Sure, but how many teams had a new coach with as many young players playing the positions we did?

Smith talked to Quennville and talked about how it didn't matter in CHI because they had 2 or 3 guys that needed to learn the system, everyone else knew it.

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09-05-2013, 02:49 PM
  #189
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So top three talent needs to win at the NHL level, but you can predict Bärtschi's going to be elite because of his strong junior performance? WUT?
Top three talent shouldn't win at the NHL level? WUT? Four years of historic ineptitude and counting.

And yeah, I feel pretty ******* confident about Bärtschi's potential. He played at a 40 point place last year despite the fact that the Flames jerked him around and grossly misused him early on.

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09-05-2013, 02:50 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Sure, but how many teams had a new coach with as many young players playing the positions we did?

Smith talked to Quennville and talked about how it didn't matter in CHI because they had 2 or 3 guys that needed to learn the system, everyone else knew it.
Thats one reason why handing the reigns over to Kruger was a bad idea.

Oiler management knew there was going to be a lockout and they had to realize that it was going to be very difficult to have a rookie coach implement a new system in a shortened season.


Last edited by guymez: 09-05-2013 at 02:56 PM.
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09-05-2013, 02:55 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
Top three talent shouldn't win at the NHL level? WUT? Four years of historic ineptitude and counting.

And yeah, I feel pretty ******* confident about Bärtschi's potential. He played at a 40 point place last year despite the fact that the Flames jerked him around and grossly misused him early on.
Yeah, if Bärtschi reaches his potential he might be as good as the fourth best Oiler under 25.

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09-05-2013, 02:56 PM
  #192
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The bullseye on Feaster's back is as big as his head. Only a matter of time before Burke takes over the GM role too.

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09-05-2013, 02:59 PM
  #193
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The bullseye on Feaster's back is as big as his head. Only a matter of time before Burke takes over the GM role too.
Yup...its very similar to the situation with Tambo when MacT came on board.

I'm betting Digger is a happy man at the end of this season.

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09-05-2013, 03:00 PM
  #194
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Yeah, if Bärtschi reaches his potential he might be as good as the fourth best Oiler under 25.
I'm a die hard Oilers fan, I dislike the flames as much as the next guy. But, Bärtschi is going to be very good. I would put him in the same potential level as Eberle.

Even if a player plays for a rival team, you have to recognize and respect talent when you see it. He oozes it. I would love to have him on the Oilers.

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09-05-2013, 03:04 PM
  #195
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Thats one reason why handing the reigns over to Kruger was a bad idea.

Oiler management knew there was going to be a lockout and they had to realize that it was going to be very difficult to have a rookie coach implement a new system in a shortened season.
I said from day one if the plan was to get rid of Renney at season end and Kreuger was thought of as an option that they should've given him the reigns during the year. Why waste time with a system that the players 100% won't be playing the next year? Same reason why I think Reed should be gone now.

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09-05-2013, 03:05 PM
  #196
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
You think the Oilers are deep at centre? Why is it that you are so intent on pointing fingers instead of scrutinizing the holes on your team?


In terms of elite talent I would be concerned about the Flames next draft pick if I were you.
Also, as MV pointed out below, Bärtschi is very talented and has the potential to be an Eberle equivalent IMO.

That said...since when are you in a position as an Oilers fan to point fingers at other organizations and their lack of success?

That seems to be your only role on this board. Does this make you feel better because the Oilers suck so bad?

I would rather the Oilers improve and start actually competing for something other than the lottery.
I'm not sure where I said the oilers are deep at center. I will say however that our top center is a lot better than Matt Stajan whether it be Gagner or RNH.

I would argue that your role here is to praise everything that goes on in calgary while decrying anything that happens here.

The situation in calgary is so remarkably similar to ours a few years ago. Is Baertschi talented? Absolutely. Will he be an elite forward? Perhaps. His last season wasn't much to write home about though since it was shortened due to injury. We will see what this season holds. Nothing is set in stone for this franchise but I think it's safe to say this is a lottery year for the flames.

I am hardly the only person on this board that mocks the flames. I don't approve of everything the oilers do either but I am pleased with what MacT has done this offseason. I also praised Feaster for doing what should be done this offseason: minor tweaking.


That doesn't change the fact that the flames are still a weak hockey club with many pundits predicting them to finish very low in the standings. Not does it change the fact that they should have torn down the team at least two years ago.

The fact we got a better return for Penner than they did for Iginla should say enough.

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09-05-2013, 03:08 PM
  #197
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I'm a die hard Oilers fan, I dislike the flames as much as the next guy. But, Bärtschi is going to be very good. I would put him in the same potential level as Eberle.

Even if a player plays for a rival team, you have to recognize and respect talent when you see it. He oozes it. I would love to have him on the Oilers.
My comment was less on Bärtschi 's potential and more on the fact the Oilers have at least three, if not four players who I (and I'd wager any sane person) would rate higher.

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09-05-2013, 03:11 PM
  #198
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Didn't Burke and Lowe patch up their differences? I thought they had.

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09-05-2013, 03:16 PM
  #199
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Anyone else waiting for Reed to announce Rottier starting Friday?

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09-05-2013, 03:23 PM
  #200
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I'm not sure where I said the oilers are deep at center. I will say however that our top center is a lot better than Matt Stajan whether it be Gagner or RNH.
Matt Stajan and Backlund (in terms of the game they bring) would both be a better fit on this Oilers team that Sam Gagner. With Monahan likely making the team there is a lack of veteran presence there but Stajan and Backlund are gritty secondary scorers and Monahan has size and a strong 2 way game as well. All 3 players offer something that no Oiler centre (except possibly RNH) can offer at this time.

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I would argue that your role here is to praise everything that goes on in calgary while decrying anything that happens here.
The difference between me and you is that I am not scared to admit that there are strengths in the Flames org and shed light on the incompetence with the Oilers Management.

All you seem to want to do is overlook the issues with this management (as based on your endless defending of Tambo) by diverting attention to another team usually the Flames.

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The situation in calgary is so remarkably similar to ours a few years ago. Is Baertschi talented? Absolutely. Will he be an elite forward? Perhaps. His last season wasn't much to write home about though since it was shortened due to injury. We will see what this season holds. Nothing is set in stone for this franchise but I think it's safe to say this is a lottery year for the flames.
On this we completely agree.

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I am hardly the only person on this board that mocks the flames. I don't approve of everything the oilers do either but I am pleased with what MacT has done this offseason. I also praised Feaster for doing what should be done this offseason: minor tweaking.
You defended Tambo (and to a lesser extent Lowe) ad nausium over the past couple of years.
You had an excuse for everything the Management group did or didnt do.

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That doesn't change the fact that the flames are still a weak hockey club with many pundits predicting them to finish very low in the standings. Not does it change the fact that they should have torn down the team at least two years ago.
The Flames are likely to be a lottery team as you stated above. They probably did wait to long as well.

Now we see how good an addition Burke will be because its clear what the direction of the team is now.

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The fact we got a better return for Penner than they did for Iginla should say enough.
Cherry picking doesnt really accomplish much...how have the Oilers done replacing Glencross?

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