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NHL Draft - Prospects Discuss hockey prospects from all over the world and the NHL Draft.

RW Evgeny Kuznetsov (2010, 26th overall, Washington)

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Old
09-06-2013, 11:52 AM
  #801
Tiranis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SimplySensational View Post
Guess who only had 10 points in 26 games in 2005-06 in the KHL and then went on to have 73 in 77 games in the NHL?
Semin? Who is not even in the same tier as Malkin... So...

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09-06-2013, 02:41 PM
  #802
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
At 21, with 4 full years of KHL experience, you can't be comparing him to Malkin when he can't crack PPG or score at even .5PPG in the playoffs. I don't care what he looks like, the results are simply not even in the same tier as Malkin.
The results are there. If you compare Kuznetsov and Malkin's 18, 19, and 20 year old seasons in the KHL you see they are very similar.

Malkin

18 years old- 34 games played, 12 points
19 years old- 52 games played, 32 points
20 years old- 46 games played, 47 points


Kuznetsov

18 years old- 35 games played, 8 points
19 years old- 44 games played, 32 points
20 years old- 49 games played, 41 points

Malkin left as a 21 year old and had an excellent rookie year in the NHL. Kuznetsov has stayed longer but what's to say he won't have a similar impact when he comes to the NHL? I do think Malkin was a better prospect than Kuz but I still think Kuz has elite potential.

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09-06-2013, 02:42 PM
  #803
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drw02 View Post
The results are there. If you compare Kuznetsov and Malkin's 18, 19, and 20 year old seasons in the KHL you see they are very similar.

Malkin

18 years old- 34 games played, 12 points
19 years old- 52 games played, 32 points
20 years old- 46 games played, 47 points


Kuznetsov

18 years old- 35 games played, 8 points
19 years old- 44 games played, 32 points
20 years old- 49 games played, 41 points

Malkin left as a 21 year old and had an excellent rookie year in the NHL. Kuznetsov has stayed longer but what's to say he won't have a similar impact when he comes to the NHL?
KHL competition level has also drastically improved since Malkin's departure. I'm not saying Kuznetsov will be next Malkin but he'll be annual 60+ point getter.

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09-06-2013, 09:05 PM
  #804
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Semin? Who is not even in the same tier as Malkin... So...
Okay...

Ovechkin 26 in 37 games in KHL. 104 in 82, Calder trophy winner.

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10-14-2013, 01:31 PM
  #805
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Evgeny kuznetsov

How good is this kid!? I know he's out injured at the moment but why hasn't washington got him playing yet? The few times a i watched the KHL last year he was the main reason traktor did as good as they did. Also when he comes overseas what type of player do you see him becoming.

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10-14-2013, 01:33 PM
  #806
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensfaninToronto View Post
How good is this kid!? I know he's out injured at the moment but why hasn't washington got him playing yet? The few times a i watched the KHL last year he was the main reason traktor did as good as they did. Also when he comes overseas what type of player do you see him becoming.
I think he stayed there to help guarantee a spot for Sochi.
He's coming over next year
I see him putting up Semin like numbers when does make it over. 30-40

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10-14-2013, 01:36 PM
  #807
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Him starting with Garbo(if he stays) on the second line would be eye candy

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10-14-2013, 01:56 PM
  #808
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Well he is friends with Orlov. Orlov was scratched during the playoffs for a turnover during the last game of the season, while Schultz stayed in the lineup while turning the puck over every damn shift.

Kuznetsov also watches the Capitals himself, so he saw what was happening and said he didn't want to get stuck in the AHL and miss the playoffs.

Capitals will have to wait for the playoffs to sign him due to the salary cap.

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10-14-2013, 11:06 PM
  #809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensfaninToronto View Post
Him starting with Garbo(if he stays) on the second line would be eye candy
Yes, yes it would be. I can't wait

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Old
10-15-2013, 10:02 AM
  #810
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Radulov > Kuznetsov (HF poll confirmed)

Radulov's best NHL season:
58 points (28 goals)

I'm not saying Kuznetsov will top out at less than 58 points, but this hype train needs to put on the breaks. The same thing happened with Granlund, Schultz, Baertschi, Silfverberg... these are all going to be good players but the fact that some poeple here EXPECT Kuznetsov to put up a point per game at some point (Kessel-territory) is ridiculous.

He's a shiny new toy that's doing well in another league and when he comes over people will be like, why doesn't he have 10 points in 8 games yet? He was dominating the KHL... lol

PS: I like the guy and think he will be a good 2nd line NHL player.

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Old
10-15-2013, 10:17 AM
  #811
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
Radulov > Kuznetsov (HF poll confirmed)

Radulov's best NHL season:
58 points (28 goals)

I'm not saying Kuznetsov will top out at less than 58 points, but this hype train needs to put on the breaks. The same thing happened with Granlund, Schultz, Baertschi, Silfverberg... these are all going to be good players but the fact that some poeple here EXPECT Kuznetsov to put up a point per game at some point (Kessel-territory) is ridiculous.

He's a shiny new toy that's doing well in another league and when he comes over people will be like, why doesn't he have 10 points in 8 games yet? He was dominating the KHL... lol

PS: I like the guy and think he will be a good 2nd line NHL player.
If Radulov didn't have attitude issues, 29/30 teams would be after him and he get paid over 4mil easily. Radulov could have a similar production to Semin in the NHL imo.

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10-15-2013, 10:23 AM
  #812
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
Radulov > Kuznetsov (HF poll confirmed)

Radulov's best NHL season:
58 points (28 goals)


I'm not saying Kuznetsov will top out at less than 58 points, but this hype train needs to put on the breaks. The same thing happened with Granlund, Schultz, Baertschi, Silfverberg... these are all going to be good players but the fact that some poeple here EXPECT Kuznetsov to put up a point per game at some point (Kessel-territory) is ridiculous.

He's a shiny new toy that's doing well in another league and when he comes over people will be like, why doesn't he have 10 points in 8 games yet? He was dominating the KHL... lol

PS: I like the guy and think he will be a good 2nd line NHL player.
You mean 22-year old Radulov 5+ years ago? Or are you sure that 58 points would be best for Radulov in his prime?

And it takes time. Tarasenko has started to look like a good player. Belov looks like a solid top4 defenseman so far for Oilers, where it's very hard to look like a solid defenseman at all. And ask Montreal fans what do they think of Emelin. Best KHL players aren't that bad.


Last edited by Kshahdoo: 10-15-2013 at 10:34 AM.
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Old
10-15-2013, 10:25 AM
  #813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
Radulov > Kuznetsov (HF poll confirmed)
Radulov's best NHL season:
58 points (28 goals)
Yeah, this is a strong point, especially considering that Radulov left the NHL at 21 and Kuzbetsov will debut at 22.

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Old
10-15-2013, 10:27 AM
  #814
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well if Radulov > Kuznetsov per HF Poll then its definitely true. Cause HF is right about everything!! Nobody knows how good he will actually be. Its a different game, maybe he will start hot out of the gate, or maybe it will take a little bit of time for him to adapt to the different style of play and not to mention different cultural atmosphere,

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Old
10-15-2013, 10:36 AM
  #815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
Radulov > Kuznetsov (HF poll confirmed)

Radulov's best NHL season:
58 points (28 goals)

I'm not saying Kuznetsov will top out at less than 58 points, but this hype train needs to put on the breaks. The same thing happened with Granlund, Schultz, Baertschi, Silfverberg... these are all going to be good players but the fact that some poeple here EXPECT Kuznetsov to put up a point per game at some point (Kessel-territory) is ridiculous.

He's a shiny new toy that's doing well in another league and when he comes over people will be like, why doesn't he have 10 points in 8 games yet? He was dominating the KHL... lol

PS: I like the guy and think he will be a good 2nd line NHL player.
58 points with 26 goals on the Predators in his sophomore season at the age of 21. He would likely be better than that had he stayed in the NHL - not that unheard of for 21 year olds in their 2nd NHL season to improve.

If Kuz comes in at 22/23 and puts up 58 points the hype train was more than warranted.

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10-15-2013, 01:47 PM
  #816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
Radulov > Kuznetsov (HF poll confirmed)
.. but the fact that some poeple here EXPECT Kuznetsov to put up a point per game at some point (Kessel-territory) is ridiculous.
so what you're saying is that there is no chance Kuznetsov will ever have a PPG NHL season?

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10-15-2013, 01:57 PM
  #817
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Quote:
Originally Posted by helicecopter View Post
so what you're saying is that there is no chance Kuznetsov will ever have a PPG NHL season?
No, what he's saying is that the expectations are unrealistic given the comparables available. Maybe he'll be a PPG forward one day but there's nothing to back up those projections right now.

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10-15-2013, 03:42 PM
  #818
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
No, what he's saying is that the expectations are unrealistic given the comparables available. Maybe he'll be a PPG forward one day but there's nothing to back up those projections right now.
so in your opinion he didn't mean what he wrote, ok.

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10-15-2013, 04:09 PM
  #819
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Originally Posted by helicecopter View Post
so in your opinion he didn't mean what he wrote, ok.
...the guy said that to EXPECT Kuznetsov to put up a PPG is ridiculous. Meaning peoples expectations are way too high. You can't expect someone who has never played in the NHL to put up a PPG.

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10-15-2013, 04:19 PM
  #820
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
Radulov > Kuznetsov (HF poll confirmed)

Radulov's best NHL season:
58 points (28 goals)

I'm not saying Kuznetsov will top out at less than 58 points, but this hype train needs to put on the breaks. The same thing happened with Granlund, Schultz, Baertschi, Silfverberg... these are all going to be good players but the fact that some poeple here EXPECT Kuznetsov to put up a point per game at some point (Kessel-territory) is ridiculous.

He's a shiny new toy that's doing well in another league and when he comes over people will be like, why doesn't he have 10 points in 8 games yet? He was dominating the KHL... lol

PS: I like the guy and think he will be a good 2nd line NHL player.
Glad we have moderators to remind us excitement and high expectations are passe.

In seriousness though, I'd love to hear your analysis on Kuznetsov's game. What about him makes an expectation to peak at a point-per-game, in your words, ridiculous?

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10-15-2013, 07:00 PM
  #821
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I think people's reactions kind of solidified my point.
It shouldn't be a bad thing to say a prospect may not be as good as Phil Kessel... arguably a top 5 winger in the NHL...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayKing View Post
If Radulov didn't have attitude issues, 29/30 teams would be after him and he get paid over 4mil easily. Radulov could have a similar production to Semin in the NHL imo.
I don't disagree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kshahdoo View Post
You mean 22-year old Radulov 5+ years ago? Or are you sure that 58 points would be best for Radulov in his prime?

And it takes time. Tarasenko has started to look like a good player. Belov looks like a solid top4 defenseman so far for Oilers, where it's very hard to look like a solid defenseman at all. And ask Montreal fans what do they think of Emelin. Best KHL players aren't that bad.
I think Radulov would have hit 70 points but not 80.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Acallabeth View Post
Yeah, this is a strong point, especially considering that Radulov left the NHL at 21 and Kuzbetsov will debut at 22.
And Damian Brunner is how old? How about Cory Conacher?
It doesn't matter all that much.. once you're NHL ready you're NHL ready. Some players take longer than others but Radulov wasn't one of those players so your point it moot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by end2endrush View Post
well if Radulov > Kuznetsov per HF Poll then its definitely true. Cause HF is right about everything!! Nobody knows how good he will actually be. Its a different game, maybe he will start hot out of the gate, or maybe it will take a little bit of time for him to adapt to the different style of play and not to mention different cultural atmosphere,
Says the guy on HF...

No one knows what level of success anyone will have right away. I won't be on here saying "I told you so" if he goes 10 games without a point next year... that's not what my comment was about. I was simply saying his expectations are in fact, ridiculous.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
58 points with 26 goals on the Predators in his sophomore season at the age of 21. He would likely be better than that had he stayed in the NHL - not that unheard of for 21 year olds in their 2nd NHL season to improve.

If Kuz comes in at 22/23 and puts up 58 points the hype train was more than warranted.
Well maybe your expectations are reasonable... because most people would be very disappointed if the kid came in and only ever put up Teddy Purcell and Martin Erat type numbers. In fact, me just "comparing" him to them will infuriate people, which is stupid because Purcell has had a 65pt campaign and is actually a good player. He's just not a name brand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by helicecopter View Post
so what you're saying is that there is no chance Kuznetsov will ever have a PPG NHL season?
No, I'm not saying that.

Go look at "Your team in 5 years" posts on HF, from years ago.
90% of the prospects everyone expected to be amazing, never even panned out. Pretty much every 1st round pick in in the top 6 for everyone haha.
I'm not saying Kuznetsov isn't going to pan out, but if anyone has them slotted in along side the NHL elite and he doesn;t reach that status, it sure as hell wouldn;t be the first time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by helicecopter View Post
so in your opinion he didn't mean what he wrote, ok.
It's exactly what I wrote.. lol
Read it again without being bias this time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StrappingYoungChad View Post
Glad we have moderators to remind us excitement and high expectations are passe.

In seriousness though, I'd love to hear your analysis on Kuznetsov's game. What about him makes an expectation to peak at a point-per-game, in your words, ridiculous?
Oh I'm sorry.. I thought this was a hockey message board in which people have debates, post information and talk about their opinions

As for Kuznetsov.. the guy has yet to play in the NHL and it's blasphemy that I say he may not hit 80 points? lol

The guy has all the talent in the world, but so do a lot of other guys who actually don't even make an impact in the NHL. If I'm the weird one for not slotting him next to Zetterberg and Kessel, then so be it.

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10-15-2013, 07:52 PM
  #822
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I would certainly not be dissapointed if Kuznetsov puts up 58 points in 2013-2014.

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10-15-2013, 07:57 PM
  #823
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58 points for most prospects in year one is a heck of a season.

To say otherwise is just foolish.

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10-15-2013, 08:25 PM
  #824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin8se7en View Post
I think people's reactions kind of solidified my point.
It shouldn't be a bad thing to say a prospect may not be as good as Phil Kessel... arguably a top 5 winger in the NHL...



I don't disagree.



I think Radulov would have hit 70 points but not 80.



And Damian Brunner is how old? How about Cory Conacher?
It doesn't matter all that much.. once you're NHL ready you're NHL ready. Some players take longer than others but Radulov wasn't one of those players so your point it moot.



Says the guy on HF...

No one knows what level of success anyone will have right away. I won't be on here saying "I told you so" if he goes 10 games without a point next year... that's not what my comment was about. I was simply saying his expectations are in fact, ridiculous.



Well maybe your expectations are reasonable... because most people would be very disappointed if the kid came in and only ever put up Teddy Purcell and Martin Erat type numbers. In fact, me just "comparing" him to them will infuriate people, which is stupid because Purcell has had a 65pt campaign and is actually a good player. He's just not a name brand.



No, I'm not saying that.

Go look at "Your team in 5 years" posts on HF, from years ago.
90% of the prospects everyone expected to be amazing, never even panned out. Pretty much every 1st round pick in in the top 6 for everyone haha.
I'm not saying Kuznetsov isn't going to pan out, but if anyone has them slotted in along side the NHL elite and he doesn;t reach that status, it sure as hell wouldn;t be the first time.



It's exactly what I wrote.. lol
Read it again without being bias this time.



Oh I'm sorry.. I thought this was a hockey message board in which people have debates, post information and talk about their opinions

As for Kuznetsov.. the guy has yet to play in the NHL and it's blasphemy that I say he may not hit 80 points? lol

The guy has all the talent in the world, but so do a lot of other guys who actually don't even make an impact in the NHL. If I'm the weird one for not slotting him next to Zetterberg and Kessel, then so be it.



What of his game, though, makes you think he won't reach that point per game total?

I never said anything about blasphemy or whatever, I was just hoping for an analysis. Don't put words in my mouth.

I'm looking for specifics, like "he doesn't have a wide stride so I see him getting knocked around easily on smaller ice", or "I don't agree with the analysis of him being a great playmaker because whenever I watch him, he turns the puck over". Actual analysis is what I was hoping for.

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10-15-2013, 09:51 PM
  #825
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NHL prospects don't fail to pan out due to random chance, they fail to pan out because of flaws in their game... For those who don't think he'll be successful, why not?

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