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09-16-2013, 01:19 PM
  #201
MasterDecoy
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Defense wins championships.

Offense makes for great highlight YouTube videos.

Montreal has the offensive firepower if you look at last season. We lost in the playoffs because our defense was over-matched. Price needs help.
you say defense wins you championships, but you hated jacques martin and his defensive style. i demand answers!

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Originally Posted by SmurfsFTW View Post
I so agree with this. Sick and tired of soft players. I want a talented, hard working, tough line up.
not me bro, i want an impotent, lazy, soft lineup.

like, seriously

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09-16-2013, 01:24 PM
  #202
SouthernHab
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Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
you say defense wins you championships, but you hated jacques martin and his defensive style. i demand answers!



not me bro, i want an impotent, lazy, soft lineup.

like, seriously
You are confusing defense and effective defense.

The Habs under Martin were not aggressive at all on defense. We were a passive team that did nothing but sag back to the net.

That defense was successful a couple of decades ago but now teams are able to easily defeat that style of defense.

Martin being a defensive hockey wizard was a myth that became a meme.

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:27 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
Getting in the goalies grill and getting pucks on net from the point. Our forwards are not good enough to be solely depended on for our offence.
Only Gallagher does this. Max does it sometimes but that's about it.

For the life of me I can't understand why the coach doesn't just nail Rene Bourque's ass to the front of the net. Make him go there and threaten to bench him if he doesn't. He's got all the tools but just no head. If he'd just sit in front of the net it would help us so much.

As for our end, we'd better pray that Tinordi is ready and that 29 other teams were wrong to pass on Murray.

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09-16-2013, 01:29 PM
  #204
SouthernHab
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
No doubt our D needs big time help. But I find folks underrate offense. You can't win if you can't score. Problem is that in the playoffs you score by getting in the opposing goalie's grill. We don't do this and other teams do. That's what kills us. And yeah, Price is completely left on his own and it sucks.

And I don't see it being much different this year either. We're still not built for the postseason.
I agree regarding offense.

In the context of this discussion regarding Diaz, this team did not miss Diaz whatsoever when he was out with his injury.

Diaz throws in a few assists but has no impact on the team's success. That's why I would rather see Tinordi taking his place on the ice.

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:31 PM
  #205
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I want Ryan Mcdonaugh for our #2 spot.
Subban-Mcdonaugh

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:31 PM
  #206
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This is what I want to see...

Present
Markov-Subban <--- Big minutes Offensive Pairing
Gorges-(Two-way #2 defenceman) <--- Big minutes Shutdown Pairing
Murray/Emelin-Diaz <--- Multi-purpose, energy pairing

Future
Beaulieu-Subban <--- Offensive Pairing
Tinordi-(Two-way #2 defenceman) <--- Shutdown Pairing
XXX-XXX <--- Multi-purpose, energy pairing

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:32 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Only Gallagher does this. Max does it sometimes but that's about it.

For the life of me I can't understand why the coach doesn't just nail Rene Bourque's ass to the front of the net. Make him go there and threaten to bench him if he doesn't. He's got all the tools but just no head. If he'd just sit in front of the net it would help us so much.
.
That's tough to teach that to soft players even though they have the size, it's gotta be in you. Gallagher is the perfect example, doesn't care what happens to him he's going to net..love that kid. The more I watch Pacioretty the more he looks like a perimeter player, you could tell he doesn't really wanna go to the front of the net.

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:35 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by Adriatic View Post
That's tough to teach that to soft players even though they have the size, it's gotta be in you. Gallagher is the perfect example, doesn't care what happens to him he's going to net..love that kid. The more I watch Pacioretty the more he looks like a perimeter player, you could tell he doesn't really wanna go to the front of the net.
Meh, fine with me if he keeps putting up 60 points

He used to go to the net but he hasn't exactly had the best luck with injuries. I remember when Wiz sent him to the hospital in ambulance with a slap shot standing in front of the net. He found a way to be a first line winger without going to the net.
He said he wants to work on that this year again though so we'll see. (crashing the net)

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:40 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by Adriatic View Post
That's tough to teach that to soft players even though they have the size, it's gotta be in you. Gallagher is the perfect example, doesn't care what happens to him he's going to net..love that kid. The more I watch Pacioretty the more he looks like a perimeter player, you could tell he doesn't really wanna go to the front of the net.
Sometimes the coach has to step in. "You stand in front of the net or I bench you."

He'll stand in front of the net.
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Originally Posted by Dagistitsyn View Post
Meh, fine with me if he keeps putting up 60 points

He used to go to the net but he hasn't exactly had the best luck with injuries. I remember when Wiz sent him to the hospital in ambulance with a slap shot standing in front of the net. He found a way to be a first line winger without going to the net.
He said he wants to work on that this year again though so we'll see. (crashing the net)
Max is a different story. I'd like him to go to the net more than he does but he gets dirty sometimes. And he's effective.

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:42 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
Subban-Mcdonaugh
That one is gonna hurt for next 10 years

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:43 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by Adriatic View Post
The PK show starts tonight I guess. After watching the game last night, Drewiski sucks, Diaz sucks, Tinordi is slower than a turtle, Markov we know is made out of glass...all I can say is I hope PK is ready for the season cause he'll be playing about 35 min per game.
Tinordi isn't slow. and he's going to help tremendously.
PK is PK.
Markov is at least a #4, maybe #3... just shouldn't get as many minutes as before.
Gorges is a stable #4.
Then Bouillon/Tinordi/Pateryn would be a fine 3rd pairing by me...

I voluntarily left out Murray and Diaz, so yeah, I think defense is set.

Is it a great D corps? Of course not. But it's fine for now, and with all the youngsters coming in we should be fine.

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:46 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by MasterD View Post
Tinordi isn't slow. and he's going to help tremendously.
PK is PK.
Markov is at least a #4, maybe #3... just shouldn't get as many minutes as before.
Gorges is a stable #4.
Then Bouillon/Tinordi/Pateryn would be a fine 3rd pairing by me...

I voluntarily left out Murray and Diaz, so yeah, I think defense is set.

Is it a great D corps? Of course not. But it's fine for now, and with all the youngsters coming in we should be fine.
We're rolling the dice with our D. And we're really going to be relying on a rookie a lot more than we should. I really hope that Murray can do some heavy lifting here because I've lost a lot of faith in Gorges. Everything could go right... Tinordi could be awesome but man, we're rolling the dice.

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09-16-2013, 01:46 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by Adriatic View Post
That one is gonna hurt for next 10 years
With McDonagh there is a good chance we wouldn't have had Galchenyuk. That trade was so bad that some good may have come of it.

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:47 PM
  #214
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No idea how anyone can call Tinordi slow as a turtle...find me one other guy in the league his size with his mobility.

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09-16-2013, 01:47 PM
  #215
MasterDecoy
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
You are confusing defense and effective defense.

The Habs under Martin were not aggressive at all on defense. We were a passive team that did nothing but sag back to the net.

That defense was successful a couple of decades ago but now teams are able to easily defeat that style of defense.

Martin being a defensive hockey wizard was a myth that became a meme.
confusing defense and effective defense? defense is defense dude: are you limiting chances against, are you minimizing and boxing out shots, cutting passing lanes et cetera. if you don't do any of them then you're not playing defense at all; you're just running around like phaneuf in his own end.

say what you want about martin but look at the team's record - seasons and playoffs - then looks at the roster he had to play with + injuries. argue he was boring, yeah, but the results were there

and we never under martin "sagged back to the net", or at least nowhere near as much as were doing it now. martin would always have two forwards pressuring the blueline for quick counter-attacks. therrien has everyone and their pets collapsing back to the net - which i find completely retarded but what do you know...

besides, what they hell is defensive hockey if that isn't it?

under martin: passive? yes. not aggressive on the forecheck? yes. sitting on leads just 'cause? yes () but what in the chinese hell (it's a place where you eat mooncakes all year long i heard) is an aggressive defense? like, grimacing a lot? fighting? chasing guys out of position to hit them? blueline pressure? inquiring minds wants to know

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:49 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
No idea how anyone can call Tinordi slow as a turtle...find me one other guy in the league his size with his mobility.
myers?

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Old
09-16-2013, 01:50 PM
  #217
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
No idea how anyone can call Tinordi slow as a turtle...find me one other guy in the league his size with his mobility.
There's quite a few 6'5 (or bigger ) defenders who can skate as well as him. He isn't slow though, I don't get why that was said. He's not fast but he's fine for his size.

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09-16-2013, 01:52 PM
  #218
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
We're rolling the dice with our D. And we're really going to be relying on a rookie a lot more than we should. I really hope that Murray can do some heavy lifting here because I've lost a lot of faith in Gorges. Everything could go right... Tinordi could be awesome but man, we're rolling the dice.
Murray is the wild card. If can still play he's gonna be a huge help in front of Price for Habs. I just haven't seen him play enough the last couple of years so I don't know what to expect. I know when I watched him in the playoffs a few years ago with San Jose he was incredible. True he was paired with Boyle but he was a force in front of the net and along the boards. If he's anything close to that he will be a big help.

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09-16-2013, 01:53 PM
  #219
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
You are confusing defense and effective defense.

The Habs under Martin were not aggressive at all on defense. We were a passive team that did nothing but sag back to the net.

That defense was successful a couple of decades ago but now teams are able to easily defeat that style of defense.

Martin being a defensive hockey wizard was a myth that became a meme.
He had to regulary play guys like Paul Mara, Hal Gill, Harmlik, Brent Sopel, Spacek, Bergeron, O'Byrne, Picard, Campoli and Kaberle, while some of theses guys weren't bad and had roles he had to played many of them together at the same time, give the guy a break !

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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
No idea how anyone can call Tinordi slow as a turtle...find me one other guy in the league his size with his mobility.
Myers, Hedman, Lauridsen, Byfuglien, Cowen, Brent Burns while Tinordi has good mobility it's becoming more and more the norm for big defensemans.

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09-16-2013, 01:53 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
This is what I want to see...

Present
Markov-Subban <--- Big minutes Offensive Pairing
Gorges-(Two-way #2 defenceman) <--- Big minutes Shutdown Pairing
Murray/Emelin-Diaz <--- Multi-purpose, energy pairing

Future
Beaulieu-Subban <--- Offensive Pairing
Tinordi-(Two-way #2 defenceman) <--- Shutdown Pairing
XXX-XXX <--- Multi-purpose, energy pairing
I very much disagree with this strategy.
I like the idea of one offensive guy who can breakout the puck and one guy who sits back as the shutdown.

Too much D on one pairing hurts it because you can't break out of the zone and you get hemmed up in there. Too much offence and you can get in big trouble defensively.

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09-16-2013, 01:55 PM
  #221
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Originally Posted by Adriatic View Post
Murray is the wild card. If can still play he's gonna be a huge help in front of Price for Habs. I just haven't seen him play enough the last couple of years so I don't know what to expect. I know when I watched him in the playoffs a few years ago with San Jose he was incredible. True he was paired with Boyle but he was a force in front of the net and along the boards. If he's anything close to that he will be a big help.
A couple of posters have spoken highly of him. I haven't seen enough to have a solid opinion. I just hope that those who've praised him are right. 'Cause we need some serious help on that front. Our PK sucked last season.

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09-16-2013, 01:56 PM
  #222
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Where can I watch this online?

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Old
09-16-2013, 02:07 PM
  #223
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Our PK sucked last season.
i think it's more related to therrien deciding to change the whole strategy than it has to do with personel

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Old
09-16-2013, 02:13 PM
  #224
donghabs98
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i think it's more related to therrien deciding to change the whole strategy than it has to do with personel
The PK was so frustrating to watch. I hated the way they set up and would leave a player wide open. Hopefully there is some changes

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09-16-2013, 02:13 PM
  #225
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Agreed about Murray and the defense.

Everything fell apart last year when Emelin went down. I'm hoping Murray is able to bring back that stability and make opponents keep their heads up. When a guy like Emelin is on the ice, you know he's out there. Makes opponents think that extra second. Not to mention he was getting pretty solid with the puck too. I'm hoping Murray brings some of that back to the D. Maybe I'm hoping for too much, don't really know him that well. Anyway, curious to see what he looks like tonight. I'll be watching him pretty closely.

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