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Bo Horvat vs the World (Nichushkin mostly)

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09-16-2013, 06:17 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by NuxFan09 View Post
Success in the playoffs there is a much better indicator than success in the playoffs in the OHL, something lots of people are basing their praise for Horvat on.
I am not sure what you are basing this on, but ok. Not that I care, I was just answering a question. One thing I am sure of, none of you watched a second of the KHL playoffs.

I really do think we should get Bulis back and maybe Deron Quint. Both of those guys proved to be valuable in the KHL playoffs. It's a league where Patrick Thoreson & Nik Zherdev are top 10 scorers. While it may be the 2nd best league, it surely is nothing like the NHL and the playoffs.

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09-16-2013, 06:19 PM
  #127
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Is playoff success predetermined by nationality?
I do not care if it is or isn't. Any idea of who the most productive players have been in the SC Finals?

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09-16-2013, 06:22 PM
  #128
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This is classic Gillis snake-oil.
I bet if you dropped the Gillis bashing every time you spoke people would take things a little bit more seriously. It gets old.

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09-16-2013, 06:28 PM
  #129
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So much bickering over something that really just comes down to personal opinion.

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09-16-2013, 06:30 PM
  #130
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So much bickering over something that really just comes down to personal opinion.
Message boards in a nut shell.

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09-16-2013, 06:31 PM
  #131
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Finally we can make threads calling out other posters? Hell yeah, a lot of your days are coming.


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09-16-2013, 06:31 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Please Let Us Win View Post
I do not care if it is or isn't. Any idea of who the most productive players have been in the SC Finals?

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09-16-2013, 06:38 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Please Let Us Win View Post
I really do think we should get Bulis back and maybe Deron Quint. Both of those guys proved to be valuable in the KHL playoffs. It's a league where Patrick Thoreson & Nik Zherdev are top 10 scorers. While it may be the 2nd best league, it surely is nothing like the NHL and the playoffs.
Maybe we should also bring Kyle Wellwood back? He owned the OHL too, that same league that Bo was voted the Playoff MVP of.

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09-16-2013, 06:52 PM
  #134
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Maybe we should also bring Kyle Wellwood back? He owned the OHL too, that same league that Bo was voted the Playoff MVP of.
And if Kyle Wellwood had a better commitment to fitness he might have been a very good player in the NHL.

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09-16-2013, 07:12 PM
  #135
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Finally we can make threads calling out other posters? Hell yeah, a lot of your days are coming.
Yeah, they're petty and lame. Was the "victim" of one recently by a particularly delightful gentleman (and I use that term very loosely). I kinda think the mods should shut these sort of threads down.

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09-16-2013, 07:18 PM
  #136
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Finally we can make threads calling out other posters? Hell yeah, a lot of your days are coming.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamonddog01 View Post
Yeah, they're petty and lame. Was the "victim" of one recently by a particularly delightful gentleman (and I use that term very loosely). I kinda think the mods should shut these sort of threads down.
Just an unfortunate place to split the thread, that's all. They're just posts from the Bo Horvat thread that were moved into their own thread. Since that was the first post, it ended up being the OP of this thread.

(Took me this long to figure out what you were talking about... )

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09-16-2013, 07:24 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
And there you have it, indisputable proof that Russians are the key to the Stanley Cup. Especially ones that stay in NA.

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09-16-2013, 07:33 PM
  #138
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And there you have it, indisputable proof that Russians are the key to the Stanley Cup. Especially ones that stay in NA.
Seriously?

You make an entirely unfounded statement about European players being unable to produce in the playoffs, and when I provide a dramatic counterexample, you make up a straw man argument like that?

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09-16-2013, 07:38 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Seriously?

You make an entirely unfounded statement about European players being unable to produce in the playoffs, and when I provide a dramatic counterexample, you make up a straw man argument like that?

I'm guessing that by the exception not proving the rule, PLUW doesn't put much of any stock into your opinion... Just a guess.


Last edited by Bleach Clean: 09-16-2013 at 07:43 PM.
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09-16-2013, 07:41 PM
  #140
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Can't believe so much energy is being wasted arguing about which player will be a better pro player when they haven't even started their pro career's yet.

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09-16-2013, 07:42 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Seriously?

You make an entirely unfounded statement about European players being unable to produce in the playoffs, and when I provide a dramatic counterexample, you make up a straw man argument like that?
I made no such comment. If you believe you've proved something then that is nice. Anecdotes Anonymous is calling.

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09-16-2013, 07:51 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Please Let Us Win View Post
I made no such comment. If you believe you've proved something then that is nice. Anecdotes Anonymous is calling.
Please explain this then:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Please Let Us Win View Post
You really don't know where the idea of some of our recent Euro stars disappearing has come from? More importantly, who cares about the KHL playoffs.
You spout some blanket nonsense about how European players disappearing in the playoffs will result in concerns for Nichushkin in the playoffs as well. There are plenty of European players that produce well in the playoffs, and to think that simply being European somehow makes you less of a playoff performer is disgusting.

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09-16-2013, 07:59 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Please explain this then:



You spout some blanket nonsense about how European players disappearing in the playoffs will result in concerns for Nichushkin in the playoffs as well. There are plenty of European players that produce well in the playoffs, and to think that simply being European somehow makes you less of a playoff performer is disgusting.
I tend to agree on the European vs North American thing. I think it's really more of a style thing than a North American vs European thing. As a very general statement I would say that the big physical guys tend to do better in the playoffs (eg Lucic and Bickell as well as Malkin) than they might in the season and some of the smaller skilled guys get shutdown with the closer physical play and the relaxed reffing. Even at that it's a gross over generalization as Patrick Kane does well in the playoffs.
I also think there is some confirmation bias. People call out Semin or Ovechkin if they play poorly in the playoffs but gloss over the fact that Toews played poorly in the last two playoffs

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09-16-2013, 07:59 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Please explain this then:



You spout some blanket nonsense about how European players disappearing in the playoffs will result in concerns for Nichushkin in the playoffs as well. There are plenty of European players that produce well in the playoffs, and to think that simply being European somehow makes you less of a playoff performer is disgusting.
Again, I did not make the statement.

You are always so desperate to prove something here. Then you are desperate to try and prove what you believe you've proven. It's not healthy. Posting a photo of Malkin doesn't mean anything. We all know he won the CS. I am not sure why you'd think that was useful.

Prove to me that Russians, plural, are as effective as Canadians in the playoffs. I don't care either way, but I know it'll keep you busy. Again, I didn't make a statement either way.


Edit: I really need you to re-read my post that you quoted and then REALLY think about it. REALLY, REALLY think.

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09-16-2013, 08:03 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Please Let Us Win View Post
Again, I did not make the statement.

You are always so desperate to prove something here. Then you are desperate to try and prove what you believe you've proven. It's not healthy. Posting a photo of Malkin doesn't mean anything. We all know he won the CS. I am not sure why you'd think that was useful.

Prove to me that Russians, plural, are as effective as Canadians in the playoffs. I don't care either way, but I know it'll keep you busy. Again, I didn't make a statement either way.

Not getting in the middle, but this made me chuckle.

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Old
09-16-2013, 08:03 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Please Let Us Win View Post
Again, I did not make the statement.

You are always so desperate to prove something here. Then you are desperate to try and prove what you believe you've proven. It's not healthy. Posting a photo of Malkin doesn't mean anything. We all know he won the CS. I am not sure why you'd think that was useful.

Prove to me that Russians, plural, are as effective as Canadians in the playoffs. I don't care either way, but I know it'll keep you busy. Again, I didn't make a statement either way.
Malkin with the CS does not "prove" anything, it's simply to make a point. You implied that somehow being European makes a player less likely to be effective in the playoffs. I'm not going to embark on trying to prove statistically whether or not one nationality is better than another, because the very premise is borderline racist.

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09-16-2013, 08:04 PM
  #147
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Sweet. So can we compare Horvat to the 90 or so Canadian conn smythe winners then? Horvat = Gretzky.

Wow. So informative.

and considering I was bored. I finally decided to look for that post you made admitting you didnt know much about Nichushkin.

so here it is:

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...&postcount=530

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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I already said I haven't seen enough of him live. I watched him at the world juniors, and a few highlight clips, but am relying a lot on what I read from scouting reports.

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Old
09-16-2013, 08:06 PM
  #148
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Sweet. So can we compare Horvat to the 90 or so Canadian conn smythe winners then? Horvat = Gretzky.

Wow. So informative.



LS, post more man.

In any event, the blanket statement, if one was made, rarely works. Which is kind of ironic here. But also, the exception does not prove the rule either... Guess it's a circular argument again?

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09-16-2013, 08:12 PM
  #149
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Sweet. So can we compare Horvat to the 90 or so Canadian conn smythe winners then? Horvat = Gretzky.

Wow. So informative.
Without getting the middle of this ***t on VKW-fest that you've all fit going in here, a bit of common sense would suggest that the number of Conn Smythe winners by nationality is likely to be roughly in line with the proportion of players by those same nationalities over the years.

Of course this whole Horvat- Nichushkin "thing" departed the realm of common sense a long time ago ...

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09-16-2013, 08:14 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Malkin with the CS does not "prove" anything, it's simply to make a point. You implied that somehow being European makes a player less likely to be effective in the playoffs. I'm not going to embark on trying to prove statistically whether or not one nationality is better than another, because the very premise is borderline racist.
For the last time, I did not say European players produce less or more. Reading my posts will PROVE that.

You didn't make a point with the Malkin picture. We all already know he won. One player would not speak to whether or not a nationality is effective any more than if it was done in a negative light. It's a garbage, waste of time anecdote. Almost borderline racist.

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