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Habs Cuts (28th: Dumont clears waivers)

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Old
09-19-2013, 10:20 AM
  #401
lamp9post
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Originally Posted by Dirty Danglez View Post
Yah because Gallagher and Galchenyuk didn't make the team due to their training camp/pre season
Not solely. Galchenyuk was ripping up the OHL at the time (nothing to learn by staying there) and Gallagher had several impressive training camps before he made the team.

Also last year there were actually spots available. This year the roster is pretty much set barring injuries.

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09-19-2013, 10:21 AM
  #402
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Originally Posted by Grant McCagg View Post
LOL. Nothing like getting dumped multiple times. I'd compare it more to the gf saying "get your feces coagulated or I'll dump you."

Lots of folks on here don't understand what sending a message means.....not overly complicated.
It's not because we disagree that we don't understand what sensig a message is.
Should we start DD on the 4th line this year due to his poor last season? That would be dumb right.
Well sending a message this early, when the kid shows improvement and motivation, is pretty freaking stupid.
Let me ask you, if LL was still here say over Blunden, would you be asking yourself why? Would you be saying he needed to be cut?

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09-19-2013, 10:26 AM
  #403
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It's not because we disagree that we don't understand what sensig a message is.
Should we start DD on the 4th line this year due to his poor last season? That would be dumb right.
Well sending a message this early, when the kid shows improvement and motivation, is pretty freaking stupid.
Let me ask you, if LL was still here say over Blunden, would you be asking yourself why? Would you be saying he needed to be cut?
Do you understand that the gm and coach don't like this kid. And stop saying he showed improvement cause he didn't. He won't ever play on the top 6, that is set in stone and they don't want another soft stumbling forward to play in bottom 6...end of story. Stop looking for reasons he's just not in the plans for team and don't be surprised if he gets traded if Bergevin gets a chance.

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09-19-2013, 10:36 AM
  #404
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Reason 4: it's not because he already played in the NHL under a different system and team, that its all good, he doesn't need it. That's absurd.

I'm going by the reason YOU gave. You said to give him some time in the NHL. Well, he had it so it's not a valid reason to keep him around.

Reason 3: how would you know? According to LL and his gf, he did everything they asked him to do.

How would I know? I don't listen to his gf. I listen to management And for your info, Louis has said nothing.

Reason 2: one or two more exhibition games means 4-5 extra days here. You work with him, and why exactly do you think the reason he was sent down was because he couldn't keep up anymore and he would be having a hard time moving forward in camp? So many assumptions based off your own speculations.

I'm not the one speculating. You are. Louis was sent down. Obviously management see something not quite right. You're the one assuming that he deserves more time in training camp.

Reason 1: So what you are saying is that you have no clue why he was sent down. Maybe this, maybe that, or maybe this too. Great.

I have as much of a clue as you do as to why he should stay up here. As I said up to now Bergevin & his staff have done a decent job. When they start to screw up, I'll speak up.



MB has already done bonehead moves, I wouldn't call this one another one but I don't have blind faith, so whatever I feel is strange, I'll question.
So in other words an internet poster who hasn't played one game of pro hockey, hasn't spent one minute with the player we're talking about knows more about the situation than Bergevin, Dudley, Lapointe, Mellanby, and Therrein. Who exactly is going on blind faith?

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09-19-2013, 11:00 AM
  #405
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Originally Posted by onice View Post
So in other words an internet poster who hasn't played one game of pro hockey, hasn't spent one minute with the player we're talking about knows more about the situation than Bergevin, Dudley, Lapointe, Mellanby, and Therrein. Who exactly is going on blind faith?
What are you talking about? If you can't argue points properly don't resort to trying to discredit an internet poster.
You want to discuss a matter, let's do it, you don't want to, keep your petty insults to yourself.

I never pretended to know anything more than anybody. I'm saying the timing of the cut doesn't make sense. It's been explained why. It's not the end of the world. Just like when people were saying PK was holding out last year for Doughty money made no sense. Sometimes it's okay to use your brain you know?
I would have preferred for him to stay here longer so he can work with the big club more and find it odd a club would send any prospect they really want to succeed down early (unless it has to do with Juniors or really being too far in terms of development to really work with), but hey, I guess that's just too much to say and it has to turn into ''me pretending to know more than the old organization''. Damn I hate this site sometimes.

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09-19-2013, 11:03 AM
  #406
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Originally Posted by Adriatic View Post
Do you understand that the gm and coach don't like this kid. And stop saying he showed improvement cause he didn't. He won't ever play on the top 6, that is set in stone and they don't want another soft stumbling forward to play in bottom 6...end of story. Stop looking for reasons he's just not in the plans for team and don't be surprised if he gets traded if Bergevin gets a chance.
Well if that's the case then management keeps losing points.

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09-19-2013, 11:17 AM
  #407
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It's not because we disagree that we don't understand what sensig a message is.
Should we start DD on the 4th line this year due to his poor last season? That would be dumb right.
Well sending a message this early, when the kid shows improvement and motivation, is pretty freaking stupid.
Let me ask you, if LL was still here say over Blunden, would you be asking yourself why? Would you be saying he needed to be cut?
No, we should trade DD because he sucks. But that isn't how it works because there seems to be an unwritten law that DD must always get top wingers and PP time despite being useless.

I agree with the handling of LL. DD, not so much.

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09-19-2013, 11:47 AM
  #408
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Renaud Lavoie ‏@LavoieRenaud 7m
G Robert Mayers on waivers. #canadiens

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09-19-2013, 11:50 AM
  #409
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Renaud Lavoie ‏@LavoieRenaud 7m
G Robert Mayers on waivers. #canadiens
Would not mind to see him claimed. Know it won't happen, though.
I liked him enough to give him a contract back when he was leaving the QMJHL.
He has not developed as one would hope so I am not sure why they are continuing ties with him.

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09-19-2013, 11:58 AM
  #410
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Renaud Lavoie ‏@LavoieRenaud 7m
G Robert Mayers on waivers. #canadiens
To be expected. Easily the odd man out, needs a team willing to sign him to a multi-year deal as a project, and it just gets worse for him on a multi-year once Fucale's included into the pro fold. Habs would be killing his value (?) holding onto him without any foreseeable opportunity to develop/showcase him the further you go into the future. Wonder if he'll get picked up, bounce down to the ECHL, or head to Europe for more playing time and likely more money.

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09-19-2013, 12:11 PM
  #411
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It's not because we disagree that we don't understand what sensig a message is.
Should we start DD on the 4th line this year due to his poor last season? That would be dumb right.
No, but he should start the season on what I'd call a 3rd line (with Bourque and Prust) instead what would probably be considered the 1st line (with Pac and Briere).

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09-19-2013, 12:14 PM
  #412
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Damn I hate this site sometimes.
Don't worry, you're not alone. Therrien should get media assurances because what he says is all bull ****. Using Colberg as an example made me understand that LL, like DD, has his place penciled in for this year regardless of what happens in Pre-season. I'm glad we didn't give anyone a PTO because it would be unfair the way this organization evaluates talent. I thought LL played well against Boston and thought with some better line mates he could handle tougher minutes. Also Therien bringing up last year... Really? What does last year have to do with this year? I hope LL can find his fire to compete and push his way into this lineup.

Did anyone see a good reason to cut him? Like him not competeting, not playing well, being strides behind the play, looking out of place? I would of prefered a better excuse on Therien side, he left me needing a real explanation.

In my opinion, I think a team that makes its young players and rookies compete against the veterans for roster spots really helps the team compete at the beginning of the season. With more than 3/4 of the roster penciled in, I fear a slow start to the season.

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09-19-2013, 12:16 PM
  #413
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To be expected. Easily the odd man out, needs a team willing to sign him to a multi-year deal as a project, and it just gets worse for him on a multi-year once Fucale's included into the pro fold. Habs would be killing his value (?) holding onto him without any foreseeable opportunity to develop/showcase him the further you go into the future. Wonder if he'll get picked up, bounce down to the ECHL, or head to Europe for more playing time and likely more money.
Is Fucale guaranteed to go to the AHL? I didn't pay much attention to that situation after he signed his ELC but I assumed he'd go back to the Q and Mayer and Tokarski would battle it out in Hamilton.

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Did anyone see a good reason to cut him? Like him not competeting, not playing well, being strides behind the play, looking out of place? I would of prefered a better excuse on Therien side, he left me needing a real explanation.
Just because you don't like the reason doesn't mean it wasn't a perfectly valid one.

As usual, Habs fans fishing for stories where there are none to be found.

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09-19-2013, 12:19 PM
  #414
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Is Fucale guaranteed to go to the AHL? I didn't pay much attention to that situation after he signed his ELC but I assumed he'd go back to the Q and Mayer and Tokarski would battle it out in Hamilton.
Fucale isn't old enough to go to the AHL yet. I'm talking after this year, and I wouldn't have expected Mayer to jump on a one year contract as a backup getting little exposure or development. Pretty sure it'll be Condon and Tokarski in Hamilton, btw. We do still have Condon, right? I didn't miss something (other than Delmas, lol)?

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09-19-2013, 12:19 PM
  #415
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Fucale is back in Halifax with the Moose...

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09-19-2013, 12:24 PM
  #416
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What was the official reason given for the LL cut? And what was the real reason according to Wozniak?

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09-19-2013, 12:29 PM
  #417
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Fucale isn't old enough to go to the AHL yet. I'm talking after this year, and I wouldn't have expected Mayer to jump on a one year contract as a backup getting little exposure or development. Pretty sure it'll be Condon and Tokarski in Hamilton, btw. We do still have Condon, right? I didn't miss something (other than Delmas, lol)?
Got it. Thought I missed something there with Fucale.

I don't know about Condon. Did he outplay Mayer? The Habs seem to keep investing time and money in Mayer, they must feel he's serviceable enough for the Dogs.

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What was the official reason given for the LL cut? And what was the real reason according to Wozniak?
Wozniak never said (she just said that the reason was B.S.). Therrien later said it was because they already know Leblanc and where he's at and want to see more of the guys they didn't get to see up close every day (Collberg, Thomas, Nystrom).

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09-19-2013, 01:18 PM
  #418
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It took a long time to read every post on this thread. A few made good points. (I'm sure most of you feel that yours was one of the few.) In general, though, the myriad conjectures about why Louis Leblanc was cut remind me of the fable about the blind men who describe the entirety of an elephant after touching a small area of its body.

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09-19-2013, 01:22 PM
  #419
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Is Fucale guaranteed to go to the AHL? I didn't pay much attention to that situation after he signed his ELC but I assumed he'd go back to the Q and Mayer and Tokarski would battle it out in Hamilton.



Just because you don't like the reason doesn't mean it wasn't a perfectly valid one.

As usual, Habs fans fishing for stories where there are none to be found.
Oh ya because saying we know he had a bad season last year so let's cut him so he can't prove himself at the NHL level. Get a grip...

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09-19-2013, 01:26 PM
  #420
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Just because you don't like the reason doesn't mean it wasn't a perfectly valid one.

As usual, Habs fans fishing for stories where there are none to be found.
And it also doesn't mean it was a valid one.

Nobody is fishing for a story. Some just don't like the way a prospect is being handled. Just like some didn't like the way PK was handled.

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Wozniak never said (she just said that the reason was B.S.). Therrien later said it was because they already know Leblanc and where he's at and want to see more of the guys they didn't get to see up close every day (Collberg, Thomas, Nystrom).
Doesn't that seem odd a bit to you? Why is Blunden still here? Do they not already know him? How does retaining Leblanc prevent them from seeing guys like Collberg, Thomas, Nystrom, Big Mac..?
Furthermore, shouldn't you want to keep the players you think are closest to the NHL with the team the longest? Isn't that why guys like Bournival and Thomas are still here?

To me it appears like we're wasting away a prospect, not giving him what he needs, and flipping a coin as to whether or not he works out. Send him down now, if he bounces back, great we have another good prospect, if he doesn't well we were right in cutting him. I would have preferred to see them work with LL, try him on different line combination. He certainly didn't look out of place next to Moen and White, so why not give him a shot with better wingers?


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09-19-2013, 01:34 PM
  #421
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Doesn't that seem odd a bit to you? Why is Blunden still here?
I have to assume it's because Blunden would have to pass through waivers to go to Hamilton and they figure there's a possibility they may lose him by doing so. Ditto for St-Pierre. LL could go through one last time without exposing him.

I'm taking management's word for why they're proceeding the way they are, even though I didn't see the need to send him down so early... In this case I trust they just know more than I do about the situation. Knowing more doesn't always mean you make the right decision in retrospect but it does increase the odds thereof.

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09-19-2013, 01:42 PM
  #422
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Doesn't that seem odd a bit to you? Why is Blunden still here? Do they not already know him? How does retaining Leblanc prevent them from seeing guys like Collberg, Thomas, Nystrom, Big Mac..?
Furthermore, shouldn't you want to keep the players you think are closest to the NHL with the team the longest? Isn't that why guys like Bournival and Thomas are still here?

To me it appears like we're wasting away a prospect, not giving him what he needs, and flipping a coin as to whether or not he works out. Send him down now, if he bounces back, great we have another good prospect, if he doesn't well we were right in cutting him. I would have preferred to see them work with LL, try him on different line combination. He certainly didn't look out of place next to Moen and White, so why not give him a shot with better wingers?
I think you make some good points. It also makes sense that Therrien wouldn't be completely upfront though. If he said, "Louis played a good game, but his performance last season weighs more heavily, at this point he is still too far down the depth chart to merit another preseason game," that kind of honesty might be considered unnecessarily damaging to the prospect's confidence. It seems like a lot of what the organization says to the media is what they think sounds best, rather than the actual reasons behind decision making. A grain of salt to be taken with everything.

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09-19-2013, 02:10 PM
  #423
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Oh ya because saying we know he had a bad season last year so let's cut him so he can't prove himself at the NHL level. Get a grip...
You're the one digging fervently to find a story where there is none and I'm the one that needs to get a grip? No, it can't be because Leblanc had a terrible year last year and our coaching staff wasn't as short-sighted as the almighty HFBoards to be blown away by a couple of camp scrimmages and 1 pre-season game.

They know what he is and where's he at, and they know he isn't ready for the NHL. What is so hard to believe about that?

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And it also doesn't mean it was a valid one.

Nobody is fishing for a story. Some just don't like the way a prospect is being handled. Just like some didn't like the way PK was handled.
Some didn't like PK handled right up until he won the Norris, so, with apologies to the experts, the Canadiens have won that round.

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Doesn't that seem odd a bit to you? Why is Blunden still here? Do they not already know him? How does retaining Leblanc prevent them from seeing guys like Collberg, Thomas, Nystrom, Big Mac..?
Blunden is still here because, if Gionta can't start the season, he's likely going to be the 4th line option with Prust moving up to the 2nd. Which is in line with your "closest to the NHL" argument that follows below - Blunden is closest to staying with the team, so he stays. Not complicated.

Quote:
Furthermore, shouldn't you want to keep the players you think are closest to the NHL with the team the longest? Isn't that why guys like Bournival and Thomas are still here?
Your false assumption here is that Leblanc is close to the NHL. He's not. At least, not any more close than the names you've mentioned so far.

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To me it appears like we're wasting away a prospect, not giving him what he needs, and flipping a coin as to whether or not he works out. Send him down now, if he bounces back, great we have another good prospect, if he doesn't well we were right in cutting him. I would have preferred to see them work with LL, try him on different line combination. He certainly didn't look out of place next to Moen and White, so why not give him a shot with better wingers?
Please, "wasting away a prospect" because we sent him down on day 6 of camp instead of day 13 or whatever is just an absurd argument.

What you, and what most people parroting these arguments are forgetting, is that Leblanc was bad last year. And you're suggesting that the organization should wipe all that away and coddle Leblanc (or worse, reward him) because he played well in a couple of meaningless games. Leblanc has a long way to go, and it doesn't start by suddenly being given an express pass to the NHL. When he puts in the work and produces the results consistently in the NHL level, he'll be back. And at least that time it'll be based on merit over an extended period of time, not "he looked good next to White in a game!".

The greatest irony in all of this, of course, is that many members here ripped the Habs for "reaching" for the hometown kid at the draft, taking him purely because of his nationality and giving him an undeserved chance with us when other teams wouldn't have touched him until the 2nd round. Now all we're hearing about is how unfair the Habs are being to this gem of a prospect whose pro potential is crumbling before our very eyes. Even Wozniak wasn't this crazy.

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09-19-2013, 02:38 PM
  #424
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I always lived by the policy that if I couldn't have them, nobody could.
So if we go into your basement we'll find all your girlfriends chained to the wall.

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09-19-2013, 02:48 PM
  #425
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EVERYONE knows/knew that Leblanc was not going to make the Habs roster. Even the people complaining about "timing" admit to that.

Lets say that everyone knows that your hot girlfriend is about to cut you. Dump you and send you packing.

Would it really matter if she dumped you on Monday or let you have a mercy date on Friday and then dump you on Saturday? The end result is the same.
Well if there is a rash of injuries to forwards (3-4) then there is a chance he makes it. But regardless if we're cutting everyone who has no chance of making it why are Collberg, MacCarron, Tarnasky, etc... still with the team. Everyone knows they are not going to make the Habs roster.

As for your analogy, the difference between Monday and Friday is that it actually gives you a chance to change her mind. If you win the lottery on Wednesday, she'll probably not dump you. Not too mention if you go out on Friday with a hot girl, it will raise your value in the eyes of other women who see you on a date with a hot girl, so when you do breakup you'll be sought after. Not too mention you're more likely to get breakup sex on a Friday night then on a Monday

In the end it's not even about Leblanc it's about giving everyone a fair chance. Leblanc didn't get a fair chance. And honestly it seems a bit systematic with some players getting preferential treatment compared to others.

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