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Oilers sign Ryan Nugent-Hopkins to extension [7 years/$6 million AAV] ‎

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:11 PM
  #101
topchowda
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Originally Posted by SephF View Post
What a dbag, shut up Nazem.

These kids are first overall picks.
Not to mention he didnt make the NHL till 22 and was pretty bad up until then and was not well liked be his NHL GM or coaches and was publicly called out multiple times

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:12 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
I don't know if you missed that whole "Kadri Is An Evil Greedy Moneysucker" PR campaign that Dreger launched during his contract negotiation??

I'm obviously paraphrasing here, but it was pretty blatant. He might be a little resentful of the fact that he just tried to negotiate his way past a bridge contract and essentially had the biggest media player in Canada sicked on him.
Even still, he isn't comparing himself to any player. I don't know why fans are getting up in arms about it as if he went out of his way to tell the world that RNH is a pathetic player or something. I mean, I get wanting to defend your team's players, but at some point the witch hunt is completely superficial, isn't it?

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09-20-2013, 02:12 PM
  #103
Joey Moss
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Originally Posted by Gardner McKay View Post
Id take Kadri over "The Nuge" any day of the week when factoring in contracts, production and health.
Good thing you're not a GM.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:14 PM
  #104
SmoggyTwinkles
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Just heard the Kadri quote on the radio.

Sounds a lot different when you hear the rest of it, and the fact that he's laughing about it.

It's just typical Kadri joking around with a little honesty to it. I like that about him actually.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:16 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
Cool, if Kadri breaks out the ~$4m you saved with a bridge contract will be more than covered by the large contract he'll get at the end of the bridge deal.

For the Oilers, it makes a lot of sense to spend a little more right now (when they're not contenders) to save more in the future (when they hope to be contenders).
first off i'm a Devils fan, secondly I am very far from a leafs fan. You are basing your opinion on the fact that you think RNH is going to develop into a top 15 player in the league. There is significant risk for a guy who's very slight by NHL standards and has experienced problems with his shoulder. But that's not what I was saying before, i'm saying Kadri was the second best player on a playoff team and nearly hit ppg last year, which is more than RNH has done so far in his career

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09-20-2013, 02:17 PM
  #106
theranfordflop
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The Oilers have a long term plan, and in that plan RNH is a core player, along with Hall, Eberle, Yak (probably), and Schultz. Nurse is probably in there too. Why is that the plan? Because it HAS TO BE. These are the guys they HAVE to commit to, because they’ve made a huge sacrifice to get them.

So say you’re managing a team, and you can potentially have all 6 of those guys for a window of 6-7 years at a maximum of 36 million in any given year. That’s a maximum of 54% cap utilization, knowing the cap simply will not be decreasing any time soon. Again, that’s a maximum, it’s more likely to drop to around 48-50% of cap utilization at the point that all those contracts are actually in place (and there’s no guarantee Nurse, Schultz, or Yakupov will be close to 6 per).

How does that compare to other teams? Specifically teams that contend? Well:

Hawks used 50% of their cap on Kane, Toews, Sharp, Hossa, Seabrook, and Keith last year. This season, with the lower cap it will be 55%.

Bruins used 39% of their cap on Lucic, Bergeron, Krejci, Marchand, Chara, and Rask (These are the guys I would consider their core, correct me if I’m wrong) last year. This year it will be 54%.

Remember, the Oilers don’t plan on this kind of utilization for at least another 3-4 years. In 2 years, with RNH’s contract, they’re set to use a maximum of 43% of their cap on these core players. In 3 years it will be a maximum of 50%.

I can see how people might say, “well he hasn’t put up the points to be worth that”.

But is cost certainty for the next decade worth it? From a business standpoint is it worth it? I think so. If you’re planning to be a contender, then this is how you plan it, in my opinion. No guarantee that it works of course, but that doesn't mean you don't try.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:23 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gardner McKay View Post
Id take Kadri over "The Nuge" any day of the week when factoring in contracts, production and health.
so if you're the Oiler GM...would you trade RNH for Kadri?

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:27 PM
  #108
Petro Points
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Originally Posted by SmoggyTwinkles View Post
Just heard the Kadri quote on the radio.

Sounds a lot different when you hear the rest of it, and the fact that he's laughing about it.

It's just typical Kadri joking around with a little honesty to it. I like that about him actually.
Nothing wrong with what Kadri said.. people are taking things out of context...
A lot is wrong with the Kadri > RNH group here. No need for Oiler fans to argue with this group.. Time will shut these fans up.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:30 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
Even still, he isn't comparing himself to any player. I don't know why fans are getting up in arms about it as if he went out of his way to tell the world that RNH is a pathetic player or something. I mean, I get wanting to defend your team's players, but at some point the witch hunt is completely superficial, isn't it?
Kadri is commenting on other teams and the way they do business. Not only that, he's doing so immediately after the team he works for strong arms him into a small contract because they either a) don't trust that he's not a flash in the pan or b) have managed their cap like a garbage fire.

Not only does he have no horse in this race, he's wading into a topic where he has no credibility.

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09-20-2013, 02:35 PM
  #110
Petro Points
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Originally Posted by Zubrus Coffee Maker View Post
first off i'm a Devils fan, secondly I am very far from a leafs fan. You are basing your opinion on the fact that you think RNH is going to develop into a top 15 player in the league. There is significant risk for a guy who's very slight by NHL standards and has experienced problems with his shoulder. But that's not what I was saying before, i'm saying Kadri was the second best player on a playoff team and nearly hit ppg last year, which is more than RNH has done so far in his career
now factor in the fact that Kadri was nothing but **** in the NHL til his 4th year after drafted. Compare that to Nuge's first 2 yrs since draft and shake your head.

Not sure why a NJ fan is here to bash this deal after what that team forked out to Zajac and a 20 pt season.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:37 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by tempest2i View Post
Kadri is commenting on other teams and the way they do business. Not only that, he's doing so immediately after the team he works for strong arms him into a small contract because they either a) don't trust that he's not a flash in the pan or b) have managed their cap like a garbage fire.

Not only does he have no horse in this race, he's wading into a topic where he has no credibility.
I have not heard the audio but I am sure he didnt make the comment just like that... He must have been asked to comment on the deal by someone..
The kid said nothing wrong and was probably trying to be funny. Oil fans should not find it offensive.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:37 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tempest2i View Post
Kadri is commenting on other teams and the way they do business. Not only that, he's doing so immediately after the team he works for strong arms him into a small contract because they either a) don't trust that he's not a flash in the pan or b) have managed their cap like a garbage fire.

Not only does he have no horse in this race, he's wading into a topic where he has no credibility.
That's fine, but I guess I just don't see the purpose of getting worked up about it. It seems like some people are taking the opinions of a few on here (i.e. Kadri is better than RNH right now) and projecting their vehement disagreement with that opinion onto Kadri when, for all intents and purposes, the kid just made a tongue-in-cheek remark.

But I guess none of that is on topic anyway so my apologies for getting off track.

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09-20-2013, 02:38 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
now factor in the fact that Kadri was nothing but **** in the NHL til his 4th year after drafted. Compare that to Nuge's first 2 yrs since draft and shake your head.

Not sure why a NJ fan is here to bash this deal after what that team forked out to Zajac and a 20 pt season.
Kadri was given the chance to develop in the AHL, which is not relevant at all to whether he is better than RNH right now. But, my opinion should be completely discredited because my favourite team gave out a contract I don't agree with. k.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:39 PM
  #114
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Nobody is demeaning RNH or trashing him.

Kadri was asked a question, he answered. Have some thick skin, or learn from us, we'll teach you.


Last edited by ThirdManIn: 09-20-2013 at 02:42 PM. Reason: no need in that generalization
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Old
09-20-2013, 02:40 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoggyTwinkles View Post
Just heard the Kadri quote on the radio.

Sounds a lot different when you hear the rest of it, and the fact that he's laughing about it.

It's just typical Kadri joking around with a little honesty to it. I like that about him actually.
Or being a thoughtless putz, that probably covers it more closely.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:40 PM
  #116
Steve BachIntyre
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Your line of thinking is that unless the Oilers get a 4th line face puncher to play 20 games at 6 mininutes a nigh, none of their players will be able to succeed and score ppg season.

ouff
Wow a mind reader. You should put up a shingle in your window. Just read my words don't try and guess what im thinking please. The kids are getting tossed around out there regularely. they are missing games and getting injured, and having liberties taken at them. What would you suggest? Steroids?

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:41 PM
  #117
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I have not followed RNH's injury history but from what I read he hasn't played a full season without injuring that same shoulder he injured in junior. That's much more of a problem than flukey injuries such as lupuls
Jeez. People should research these things. He had an injury in junior. He never had it repaired, just rehabbed. He has had the same injury both seasons. Never had it repaired, just rehabbed. He has now had it repaired, not just rehabbed. The exact same surgery that Taylor Hall had. This surgery actually fixes the problem, its not just a temporary tape job until the next time he gets hurt.

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09-20-2013, 02:41 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Pi View Post
Nobody is demeaning RNH or trashing him.Kadri was asked a question, he answered. Have some thick skin, or learn from us, we'll teach you.


Of course, never. Geez.


Last edited by ThirdManIn: 09-20-2013 at 02:43 PM. Reason: quote
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Old
09-20-2013, 02:41 PM
  #119
5RingsAndABeer
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Originally Posted by Zubrus Coffee Maker View Post
first off i'm a Devils fan, secondly I am very far from a leafs fan. You are basing your opinion on the fact that you think RNH is going to develop into a top 15 player in the league. There is significant risk for a guy who's very slight by NHL standards and has experienced problems with his shoulder. But that's not what I was saying before, i'm saying Kadri was the second best player on a playoff team and nearly hit ppg last year, which is more than RNH has done so far in his career
$6m won't be close to a top 15 player for the vast majority of RNH's contract. It's not even top 15 right now.

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09-20-2013, 02:41 PM
  #120
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For all of the "injury prone" people: suppose your broke your leg, didn't get a cast, and it healed badly. If, due to the improper healing, the leg causes you problems throughout your life are you injury prone? Alternatively, suppose you broke your leg and walked home on it. Is every step you take a new injury, or is it just one injury that keeps hurting? I suppose some might say "yes", but that answer doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

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09-20-2013, 02:42 PM
  #121
Pi
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Originally Posted by theranfordflop View Post
The Oilers have a long term plan, and in that plan RNH is a core player, along with Hall, Eberle, Yak (probably), and Schultz. Nurse is probably in there too. Why is that the plan? Because it HAS TO BE. These are the guys they HAVE to commit to, because they’ve made a huge sacrifice to get them.

So say you’re managing a team, and you can potentially have all 6 of those guys for a window of 6-7 years at a maximum of 36 million in any given year. That’s a maximum of 54% cap utilization, knowing the cap simply will not be decreasing any time soon. Again, that’s a maximum, it’s more likely to drop to around 48-50% of cap utilization at the point that all those contracts are actually in place (and there’s no guarantee Nurse, Schultz, or Yakupov will be close to 6 per).

How does that compare to other teams? Specifically teams that contend? Well:

Hawks used 50% of their cap on Kane, Toews, Sharp, Hossa, Seabrook, and Keith last year. This season, with the lower cap it will be 55%.

Bruins used 39% of their cap on Lucic, Bergeron, Krejci, Marchand, Chara, and Rask (These are the guys I would consider their core, correct me if I’m wrong) last year. This year it will be 54%.

Remember, the Oilers don’t plan on this kind of utilization for at least another 3-4 years. In 2 years, with RNH’s contract, they’re set to use a maximum of 43% of their cap on these core players. In 3 years it will be a maximum of 50%.

I can see how people might say, “well he hasn’t put up the points to be worth that”.

But is cost certainty for the next decade worth it? From a business standpoint is it worth it? I think so. If you’re planning to be a contender, then this is how you plan it, in my opinion. No guarantee that it works of course, but that doesn't mean you don't try.
There is 99% guarantee that Yakupov WILL make 6M unless he crashes completely.. There is no ifs and buts about it. No matter what Yakupov does...if he's in the same ballpark ~0.70 PPG or so, he will get 6M.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:44 PM
  #122
ThirdManIn
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Originally Posted by scliff View Post
For all of the "injury prone" people: suppose your broke your leg, didn't get a cast, and it healed badly. If, due to the improper healing, the leg causes you problems throughout your life are you injury prone? Alternatively, suppose you broke your leg and walked home on it. Is every step you take a new injury, or is it just one injury that keeps hurting? I suppose some might say "yes", but that answer doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
It doesn't make you injury prone, but if you have an improperly healed break in your leg you definitely have a disadvantage for the rest of your life.

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09-20-2013, 02:46 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
$6m won't be close to a top 15 player for the vast majority of RNH's contract. It's not even top 15 right now.
I probably should have put before, that your theme was that the 6 mil will be a good deal for him in the future, so I was basing what I said off of the assumption that he would be well better than a 6 million dollar player, and closer to a 7-8 million dollar player. sorry about that, I'm just always worried about giving players overvalued contracts for potential and see them blow up in the teams face if he doesn't improve enough

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:46 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Zubrus Coffee Maker View Post
Kadri was given the chance to develop in the AHL, which is not relevant at all to whether he is better than RNH right now. But, my opinion should be completely discredited because my favourite team gave out a contract I don't agree with. k.
well RNH was good enough to crack the NHL and score loads of points in his rookie season as a 18yo. Kadri was actually given a chance to crack the NHL but failed each time. Kardi may be better than RNH at this time considering the age but that does not mean RNH will not be well worth the money a couple yrs from now.

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Old
09-20-2013, 02:48 PM
  #125
Tad Mikowsky
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Originally Posted by Pi View Post
Nobody is demeaning RNH or trashing him.

Kadri was asked a question, he answered. Have some thick skin, or learn from us, we'll teach you.
Tell that to the people who used Steve Begin as a comparison for Nuge.

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