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Old
09-23-2013, 10:08 AM
  #851
overlords
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For comparison's sake, Cammy got suspended 1 game, IIRC for a real vicious slash on Nino where nobody was really going after him. Kessel slashes twice, but he had mother****ing john scott coming at him.

Top it off with him being the best player on the leaf's roster.... yeah..

2 games max

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09-23-2013, 10:13 AM
  #852
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
For comparison's sake, Cammy got suspended 1 game, IIRC for a real vicious slash on Nino where nobody was really going after him. Kessel slashes twice, but he had mother****ing john scott coming at him.

Top it off with him being the best player on the leaf's roster.... yeah..

2 games max
I don't think anybody is expecting more than that. Although I wouldn't miss him

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09-23-2013, 10:14 AM
  #853
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I don't think anybody was expecting more than that. Although I wouldn't miss him
Haven't read the main boards, eh?

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09-23-2013, 10:14 AM
  #854
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
He was trying to make himself look useful and failed. His team just lost a fight, was losing the game and he tried to 'send a message' by hurting a star player on the other team. I think it's obvious.
Not sure if he really did failed.

And please with the speculation of hurting a star player. You guys are way over-exagerating by implying Scott could have hurt Kessel in 1 second (time that it took for Kessel's teammates to jump in). Kessel had plenty of time to skate away or defend himself.

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09-23-2013, 10:18 AM
  #855
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Originally Posted by HiggsBozon View Post
The first two-handers I might have understood. But he came back and gave another one, as well as the spear at the end. That's 2 times where he unnecessarily hit another guy with his stick. And remember, that's a guy who gave a very similar slash to Luke Schenn in the same preseason. So it's not like it's the first time he pulls **** like this.

As for your opinion on more Habs players being willing to do that... it's quite pathetic if you actually think that. Hitting another guy with a weapon, as unconventional as it can be, has no place anywhere.
The spear at the end, now that was stupid. If he deserves a suspension, it's for that. What I don't blame him for is the initial slashes. Scott is twice his size, and that's the only reason he went after him to begin with. You play with fire, you get burned.

And yes, I do think hockey's honour code is ridiculous. It's okay to punch guys in the head, you hear fans and even players long for the "glory days" when men were men and you could get away with Scott Stevens style hits designed to take people down at all costs, but slashing is crossing the line?

Kessel slashes all the time actually, usually it's just a distraction mor than anything else. The one Hab who regularly does that is Plekanec. To me it's as much a part of the game as borderline hits and face punching. I don't want to see players regularly swinging their sticks at each other's heads (though sword fight style duels replacing fist fights could be an improvement ), but yes, when you deal with bigger and stronger players trying to force smaller players into a fight, then there is a place for stick work. Would you really be upset if Chara got slashed around more?

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09-23-2013, 10:20 AM
  #856
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Originally Posted by Rosso Scuderia View Post
Not sure if he really did failed.

And please with the speculation of hurting a star player. You guys are way over-exagerating by implying Scott could have hurt Kessel in 1 second (time that it took for Kessel's teammates to jump in). Kessel had plenty of time to skate away or defend himself.
Can't hurt someone who isn't suspecting it in 1 second?




Maybe you've never been a fight in your life, but he had ample time to do damage. You really think he wasn't going to hurt him? Do you think he was bringing him fresh baked cookies? Hugs? Early valentines presents?

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09-23-2013, 10:25 AM
  #857
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I'm assuming Scott just wanted to give him a gift certificate to Wendy's. That's all.

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09-23-2013, 10:26 AM
  #858
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Originally Posted by Dr Gonzo View Post
I'm assuming Scott just wanted to give him a gift certificate to Wendy's. That's all.
What an animal.

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09-23-2013, 10:28 AM
  #859
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Clarkson must be feeling silly right now though. He did nothing during the brawl, and cost his team his services for 10 games and some cap issues.

Weak, all around. I get that he 'defended his teammates', but he didn't really do anything on the ice, other than give the ref a "oh crap, I'm in trouble" look as soon as he realized his team was taking care of business without him.

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09-23-2013, 10:28 AM
  #860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
For comparison's sake, Cammy got suspended 1 game, IIRC for a real vicious slash on Nino where nobody was really going after him. Kessel slashes twice, but he had mother****ing john scott coming at him.

Top it off with him being the best player on the leaf's roster.... yeah..

2 games max
Hall got away with this doozy scot-free. Not even a penalty on the play.



So based on that alone, Kessel could easily get nothing.

Of course, with the NHL's disciplinary consistency, he could also get 15 games. Who the hell knows.

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09-23-2013, 10:29 AM
  #861
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Hall got away with this doozy scot-free. Not even a penalty on the play.



So based on that alone, Kessel could easily get nothing.

Of course, with the NHL's disciplinary consistency, he could also get 15 games. Who the hell knows.
Eastern bias

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09-23-2013, 10:31 AM
  #862
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Hall got away with this doozy scot-free. Not even a penalty on the play.
Yeah, but he received a phone call, and promised to be 'a really good boy' on the ice. Lesson learned, the hard way!

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09-23-2013, 10:32 AM
  #863
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Originally Posted by Dr Gonzo View Post
Clarkson must be feeling silly right now though. He did nothing during the brawl, and cost his team his services for 10 games and some cap issues.

Weak, all around. I get that he 'defended his teammates', but he didn't really do anything on the ice, other than give the ref a "oh crap, I'm in trouble" look as soon as he realized his team was taking care of business without him.
Yeah my thinking as well. If you're going to leave the bench and take the 10 games, at least make it count

No one ever accused Clarkson of being the sharpest tool in the shed, though.

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09-23-2013, 10:33 AM
  #864
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Originally Posted by Dr Gonzo View Post
Yeah, but he received a phone call, and promised to be 'a really good boy' on the ice. Lesson learned, the hard way!
I know you were joking but the sad thing is, he didn't even get a phone call

And people say stars don't get preferential treatment...

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09-23-2013, 10:33 AM
  #865
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
Can't hurt someone who isn't suspecting it in 1 second?




Maybe you've never been a fight in your life, but he had ample time to do damage. You really think he wasn't going to hurt him? Do you think he was bringing him fresh baked cookies? Hugs? Early valentines presents?
To hurt Kessel within 1 sec, he had to sucker punch him.

Watch the replay, where do you see Scott having the chance to hurt Kessel?

Right after the first scuffle/contact, they were seperate. The only way for Scott to hurt Kessel was to do what Kessel did, which is with a slash because they were too far away.

You think Kessel can't outskate Scott for 1 sec, the time his teammates jump in? Scott did not even throw a SINGLE punch in all the incident and you guys make it seems like Kessel was in great danger. From the moment Scott went after Kessel, there was no physical contact between them, except the 2 slashes and 1 "spear".

After their first contact, tell me where Kessel was in "danger", and by danger, i mean being all by himself, face to face, against Scott, with no refs and Leafs around.

I didn't know yersterday was the day Kessel almost died and had to use legitimate self-defense in order to save his life.

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09-23-2013, 10:35 AM
  #866
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I'm not kidding me and I don't expect any punishment from the NHL towards Kessel. I'm not expecting logic anymore from Shanahan. But what Kessel did, IMO, goes against all principles and all honor codes of any sport. If Scott actually wanted to get a hold of Kessel on that shift, he would've killed him easily.

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09-23-2013, 10:35 AM
  #867
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
I know you were joking but the sad thing is, he didn't even get a phone call

And people say stars don't get preferential treatment...
He didn't? Not even a "Hey, it's Shanny....lol....how you doing?" type call?

Well, that's...something.

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09-23-2013, 10:43 AM
  #868
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Hall got away with this doozy scot-free. Not even a penalty on the play.



So based on that alone, Kessel could easily get nothing.

Of course, with the NHL's disciplinary consistency, he could also get 15 games. Who the hell knows.
Except that Kessel did not do it once, but twice. So there's no accident there. He can't play the victim/self-defense card either since the 2nd slash, he did it as a 3rd man(in this case 4th man cuz Scott was tied with TWO Leafs) on a vulnerable player.

If you don't see the difference between the two incidents, I have nothing more to say.

I agree with you last sentence though. I have no idea how Shanny will handle this. He will either say Kessel did in self defense and gets nothing... or say he can't slash a player with two hands while that player is tied up in another fight and gets 2 games. Also the fact that Scott doesn't seem to be injure on those slash might affect the decision too.

On your gif, I guess the Coyotes player wasn't injured so Hall did not get a suspension. Ohlund got 4 games for the same kind of slash but it broke Koivu's foot so yeah...

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09-23-2013, 10:43 AM
  #869
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Kessel will probably get a 1 game (pre-season) ban.

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09-23-2013, 10:53 AM
  #870
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Originally Posted by Rosso Scuderia View Post
Except that Kessel did not do it once, but twice. So there's no accident there. He can't play the victim/self-defense card either since the 2nd slash, he did it as a 3rd man(in this case 4th man cuz Scott was tied with TWO Leafs) on a vulnerable player.

If you don't see the difference between the two incidents, I have nothing more to say.
I'm not defending the slash or saying "Hall got nothing for this so Kessel should get nothing for his". I'm just posting another example of an exceedingly egregious slash that was a clear intent to injure (like Kessel's was), but which received no discipline. Just to say that if it happened before, it can happen again.

I'm not expecting a harsh penalty for Kessel, honestly. Maybe 1 regular season game, but I doubt it. Scott shouldn't get anything though. I have no respect for what he did but nothing he did was a suspendable offense.

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09-23-2013, 11:00 AM
  #871
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09-23-2013, 11:07 AM
  #872
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Well, I'm surprised to see some caveman pyschology from you out of all people on this board.
I'm old school and would be incredibly disappointed if fighting was ever taken out of the game. If they're going to make it harder for enforcers to enforce, though (between instigator penalties, removal of helmets, mandatory visors, misconducts for fights in the last 5 minutes, etc), they have to keep the same code that has existed forever where guys at a noticeable size/strength disadvantage are allowed to get away with a bit of stick work to protect themselves or as part of (like I referred to it before) the "small dog with a big bark/bite" routine.

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09-23-2013, 11:10 AM
  #873
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
kessel.gif
The O'Byrne is strong with that one.

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09-23-2013, 11:15 AM
  #874
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Have you ever been speared by a hockey stick? It really doesn't need to be that hard for it to hurt. Especially in that area.
No, but it does have to be with the toe of the stick, otherwise it's not a spear. Anything else is a slash or nothing. And as you watch the bottom of Kessel's stick blade barely wipe across Scott's pants (among the best protected of areas, so I don't know what you're talking about with "especially in that area") with no wind up, you have to conclude that it was nothing, and are relegated to the murky waters of discerning some kind of intent, or whatever.

Kessel shouldn't even have gone back over there unless it was to drop the gloves and stand in front of him, though. Shouldn't expect much more from a guy who just seconds before took another swat at the guy after teammates stepped in and let him get away.

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09-23-2013, 11:16 AM
  #875
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When you have head hunter goons like Scott in the league whose only purpose is to injure the other team's much smaller star player, then there is a problem with the league itself. Teams have to arm themselves with less skillfull apes just to be able to play in the league. In turn it just changes the game to roller derby on ice.

There is also a flaw in the rules that has developed in that unlike the past where players could jump off the bench, and protect the smaller players. Now, if there is a smaller line against a goon line, the goon line can just chase the smaller guys down and cause injury. Even though it might seem that the bench jumping penalty stops brawls and injuries, it also creates the scenario where smaller players can get headhunted and injured. Maybe time to relook at the rule.

In this case, the biggest suspension should go to Scott for headhunting Kessel and when it is so apparent that he even tells Kessel beforehand that he was going to jump him, the league has to act on that and penalize it heavily if it attempts to retain any credibility for player safety.

As well, since it was premeditated by Scott, the league should also heavily fine the coach and GM of the Sabres for allowing a premeditated attempt to injure to even take place. Even if they say they didn't know Scott was going to do that, it is still their responsibility to ensure it doesn't happen.

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