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Are you guys fed up w/ Samsonov yet?

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Old
11-25-2006, 08:38 AM
  #26
goalchenyuk
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Originally Posted by NRG87 View Post
I've been bashing Samsonov all year, but let's be fair to him: he played a very good game yesterday. I think we should try him out with the man who can, Saku Koivu, before we move forward with the crucifixion.
yes and no ; well yes , but geez ! you saw the number of giveaways he did ?

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Old
11-25-2006, 09:20 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
He's playing better on offense of late anyway, even if it still isn't resulting in big numbers. For now, he's not a major headache, most teams have a player or two in the lineup who can generate scoring chances but is a defensive liability. The biggest problem of all about Samsonov is what his $3.5M contract is going to do to us in the summer when we have to try to sign as many of Markov, Rivet, Souray, Bonk, and Johnson as possible... and probably only end up with 2 or 3 of them returning.
Money isn't really that big of a problem and the lenght is acceptable. (No one in their right mind would try to re-sign Bonk but that's another debate) Sammy will have his UFA year next year so he may pull a Bonk and then everyone will also try to have him re-sign.

The real shame in all this , is in hindsight it would have created more room for Lats and Perez (Higgins also) to "grow" and gain valuable experience without hurting our production. I've said that Perez would outscore Sammy this year and it just might happen.

Altough on a positive note, he does add good depth and may just prove to be useful down the stretch in case of injuries. Gainey was very wise in saying that it cold take "months" to evaluate what Samsonov can bring to the team. Let's be patient , he may just pull a Bonk and be our hero before we know it.

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11-25-2006, 09:43 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by sXe View Post
Money isn't really that big of a problem and the length is acceptable. (No one in their right mind would try to re-sign Bonk but that's another debate) Sammy will have his UFA year next year so he may pull a Bonk and then everyone will also try to have him re-sign.
Bonk has arguably been our best center this year - so lets not even think about re-signing him. Do you think he is playing well because he will be a UFA or because the coaching staff has recognized where he will be effective and have been able to unlock some of the effort that had been lacking.

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11-25-2006, 10:14 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by briste View Post
Bonk has arguably been our best center this year - so lets not even think about re-signing him. Do you think he is playing well because he will be a UFA or because the coaching staff has recognized where he will be effective and have been able to unlock some of the effort that had been lacking.
Do you really need me to answer that?

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11-25-2006, 10:38 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by hab View Post
the guy has the wrong linemates all together, three pretty players on one line is just plain stupid.... throw him on a line with a goal scoring bulldozer like latendresse and see what happens.
seriously... he is only playing with danglers...not gonna help!

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Old
11-25-2006, 10:44 AM
  #31
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I wasn't crazy about the signing. I remember when he was just a rumoured possibility writing something to the effect that he skates around a lot without really doing anything.

Overall though, I'm not too disappointed. My expectations weren't that high to begin with, and it's clear that he has a specific role. The good thing about this team is that it has real depth for the first time in many years, so Carbonneau can hide him when he has to.

My only real concern is that the contract runs for next year.

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Old
11-25-2006, 10:44 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by #ZAMBONI# View Post
Would you trade him for Calder ?
I'd trade him for a 7th round draft pick right now. Would clear up enough salary to help sign one of Souray/Markov. Plus when Higgins comes back he'll be even more useless than he is now.

Try Perezhogin or Kostitsyn on the 2nd line instead of him, they both looked beter.

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11-25-2006, 10:50 AM
  #33
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I'm not going to complain, because for better or worse he's here for the season.
As much as it's hard to get on board with him, we really do need someone who will shoot on that line. Samsonov is quite good at drawing defenders down low on the left, we just need to give him more outlets. Plekanec's always behind the net on the play, and Kovalev is always cross-ice. Putting the puck behind the net again negates what Samsonov did (drawing defenders out of the play. putting the puck behind the net gives them time to get back in it), and Kovalev isn't always in a position to be passed to, since there are usually two or three players between.

When Markov is at the blueline, that's an outlet, but when it's Streit or Souray they aren't as good at getting the puck cross-ice as quickly. I think it's a matter of drawing up plays to work with what we have, than forcing Samsonov into a system where he can't use what he's good at.

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Old
11-25-2006, 10:54 AM
  #34
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I suspect the same people who at one time disliked Bonk, Aebischer, even Kovalev when they first arrived now dislike Samsonov...

He's starting to click with Kovalev. They had a few nifty plays last night against the Sabres. As a duo, it was one of their better games.

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:03 AM
  #35
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Samsonov will be fine, just wait til we put the Samsonov - Koivu - Kovalev line together. If Higgins keeps it up when he returns, there's no reason why he can't centre Lats and Ryder.

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:09 AM
  #36
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Samsonov is miserable and isn't even worth a bag of pucks right now.

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:09 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by P1x44r View Post
Samsonov is miserable and isn't even worth a bag of pucks right now.
ahahahahaha
some of our fans are so incredibly stupid it s too funny


I havent thrown the towel yet, at least he s working hard and trying
No he s not worth his 3.5 M YET, but saying he s miserable is pure stupidity

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:11 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Sthabs View Post
ahahahahaha
some of our fans are so incredibly stupid it s too funny
Quoted For Truth. There's a difference between being a fan, and being a fanatic. Fans can see things a little more objectively, fanatics can't.

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:16 AM
  #39
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Carbo is gotta try separating Sammy and Kovy.I would try Samsonov with Koivu and move Ryder down.Ryder will not look to pass the puck to Kovalev all the time cause the guy shots more then he passes.Im sure things will get better

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:28 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by RedScull View Post
Quoted For Truth. There's a difference between being a fan, and being a fanatic. Fans can see things a little more objectively, fanatics can't.
Sorry, I could only see in numbers. Was born with this vision defect.

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:32 AM
  #41
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well i think that sami played well latly...skating fast...passes...creates chances....i can't say i'm fed up with him....hi's a good player and we will put numbers too...be patient...there are human beings...we are winning for god sakes

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11-25-2006, 11:38 AM
  #42
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What's San Jose Cap room right now????? Mark Bell has been pretty bad thus far, I wouldn't mind trading up one problem for another.....

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Old
11-25-2006, 11:49 AM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sXe View Post
Money isn't really that big of a problem and the lenght is acceptable.
I guess it depends on how much you value Rivet/Souray/Markov and Johnson as well. If you think they're not important, then I can see how you might say the money isn't really that big of a problem. Otherwise, well, you're wrong.
Quote:
(No one in their right mind would try to re-sign Bonk but that's another debate)
Bonk has been extremely valuable to the Habs this year, anybody who watches the team would admit it, even those of us who historically have not been his biggest fans. If we had the money, it would be great to be able to re-sign him. Alas, Samsonov's contract makes it impossible to even think of it. And Bonk is a much more valuable player to the team than Samsonov.

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11-25-2006, 12:16 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I guess it depends on how much you value Rivet/Souray/Markov and Johnson as well. If you think they're not important, then I can see how you might say the money isn't really that big of a problem. Otherwise, well, you're wrong.
Bonk has been extremely valuable to the Habs this year, anybody who watches the team would admit it, even those of us who historically have not been his biggest fans. If we had the money, it would be great to be able to re-sign him. Alas, Samsonov's contract makes it impossible to even think of it. And Bonk is a much more valuable player to the team than Samsonov.

Paying a top 6 forward over 3M$ seems more reasonnable than paying our 3rd line center 3M$. I value Johnson for what he is but he shouldn't be over 2M$ for a 3rd liner unless you consider him top 6, than someone else has to go.

Our 3rd line is pretty good but it's also pretty expansive.

Ryder will probably look at 3M$ or close next year also? Why not blame him for us being unable to sign anyone? Why not blame Abby's contract, 2M$ for a backup is a lot also. I'll tell you why, because Samsonov is the new Bonk and everyone will probably do a complete turnaround on him at some point and forget about all those silly posts, like you seem to be forgetting about Bonk's past season.

I dislike Samsonov but not because of his salary. His contract is very reasonnable and anyone filling a top 6 role with his experience would fetch a similar price.

You could have had Mike Grier for cheaper than Bonk and get 10 times the results + grit + effort. Bonk is nothing special, he's effective in his role but overpaid. But of course you would give him a UFA contract and *newsflash* UFAs don't take paycuts so you would pay your 3rd line center close to 3M$ and than blame someone else for losing Markov or whoever? You just choose to look at one person.

Finally, my whole point was that I took objection to you saying Sammy is the cause of our future projected cap problems that may or may not even happen. Watch Sammy turn it up in his UFA year (next year) and then I'll have to be the voice of reason again and convince you not to re-sign him.

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Old
11-25-2006, 12:20 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by RedScull View Post
Quoted For Truth. There's a difference between being a fan, and being a fanatic. Fans can see things a little more objectively, fanatics can't.
too bad that that the word "Fan" and "Fanatic" are the SAME word (just a shortened version for the prior)

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Old
11-25-2006, 12:30 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by The n00b King © View Post
too bad that that the word "Fan" and "Fanatic" are the SAME word (just a shortened version for the prior)
Yeah but when used in conversation, there's a marked difference between the two's use.

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Old
11-25-2006, 01:40 PM
  #47
goalchenyuk
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
What's San Jose Cap room right now????? Mark Bell has been pretty bad thus far, I wouldn't mind trading up one problem for another.....
Excellent idea from you !

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Old
11-25-2006, 01:54 PM
  #48
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While the whole team get run over by the Sabres, Samsonov (although he didn't score) is the among the few Habs that create chances with his speed. He brings a dimension that most other players in our team don't have on the table.
Who know which team we'll play against in playoff? We need Samsonov!

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Old
11-25-2006, 01:59 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sXe View Post
Paying a top 6 forward over 3M$ seems more reasonnable than paying our 3rd line center 3M$. I value Johnson for what he is but he shouldn't be over 2M$ for a 3rd liner unless you consider him top 6, than someone else has to go.

Our 3rd line is pretty good but it's also pretty expansive.

Ryder will probably look at 3M$ or close next year also? Why not blame him for us being unable to sign anyone? Why not blame Abby's contract, 2M$ for a backup is a lot also. I'll tell you why, because Samsonov is the new Bonk and everyone will probably do a complete turnaround on him at some point and forget about all those silly posts, like you seem to be forgetting about Bonk's past season.

I dislike Samsonov but not because of his salary. His contract is very reasonnable and anyone filling a top 6 role with his experience would fetch a similar price.

You could have had Mike Grier for cheaper than Bonk and get 10 times the results + grit + effort. Bonk is nothing special, he's effective in his role but overpaid. But of course you would give him a UFA contract and *newsflash* UFAs don't take paycuts so you would pay your 3rd line center close to 3M$ and than blame someone else for losing Markov or whoever? You just choose to look at one person.

Finally, my whole point was that I took objection to you saying Sammy is the cause of our future projected cap problems that may or may not even happen. Watch Sammy turn it up in his UFA year (next year) and then I'll have to be the voice of reason again and convince you not to re-sign him.
I don't agree at all with the Grier comparison. 10 times more? Nevermind that Grier is a winger, if Grier would have brought 10 times the results that Bonk has brought to the Habs this year, he would essentially be Jarome Iginla.

Anyway, I'd probably deal Samsonov for either Bell or Calder straight up. Not because I hate Samsonov and have given up on him producing, but more because Calder and Bell can bring comparable production (and intangibles that make up for any deficit) for about the same price. I think they're both UFA, and I'd rather take my chances with a struggling Bell or Calder this year and have more room to re-sign players next year, more than having Samsonov next year and less room to re-sign Markov, Souray...all the way down to Bonk and Johnson.

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Old
11-25-2006, 02:05 PM
  #50
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He needs to be the main attraction of his line, I think he might do good with Latantress-Plekanek. All and all he's frusterating most of the time but at least he would produce.

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