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10/5/13 - Anaheim @ Minnesota - FSN/PRIME - 7:00 PM CDT

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Old
10-06-2013, 02:53 PM
  #451
Puhis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J22 View Post
Falk? yeah, no. Falk was actually better with Prosser which cant be good for your argument.

Please let me know if I made a any grammatical errors. It would be hard to sleep tonight if I knew I made another typo. Thanks for all the hard work.
See the bold parts.

Also, you can talk as much BS as you want, the truth is that Falk wasn't better with Prosser. He was really good with Spurgeon when Falk was being good Falk. Everyone knows that, much like Scandella and most of the young defensemen, Justin Falk was really inconsistent. We saw "Good Falk" and we saw "Bad Falk". Good Falk was physical, used his shot and didn't panic. He used his limited talent really well, and had the size to back it up. Bad Falk was much like Marco Scandella yesterday. The difference is that Scandella's ceiling is still that of a top-4 D-man. Now, we're supposed to be patient with defensemen, but he has got to show some improvement and more importantly some consistency as well. He hasn't really taken any steps forward during the last two years and he is still too unpredictable.

Jared Spurgeon is a different breed. He has shown that he belongs from the moment he stepped on the NHL ice. He has been one of the more reliable defensemen in this team, lead the D in points during 2011-12 season and showed to be durable as well. He has shown his ability in even strength, on the PK but most importantly on the PP where he belongs. Now, finding a suitable partner for him has been a bit of an issue, but to be honest, we haven't had much choice. Marco Scandella, Justin Falk, Clayton Stoner and a few games with Suter after no training camp. Disregarding the last one due to reasons already mentioned (no training camp, lack of chemistry/experience together, tough minutes), are you honestly trying to tell me that the reason Spurgeon's pairing hasn't worked yet is down to him, and not the lack of talent in his side? Now, you're calling me delusional but I'm only stating the facts. The reason I referred to the comments from the experts is that they know a bit more about hockey than you or me. They were really positive about Spurgeon's effort in the LA game, and that to me is enough to prove you wrong.

No, Jared Spurgeon is not the next big thing. No, he probably never reaches a star status in this league. He is just really good in what he does. And no, signing him to an extension was not a mistake.

I'd like to see Spurgeon paired with Ballard. They are both highly mobile, both have good hockey IQ and defensive awareness, and both can move the puck efficiently. If Spurgeon struggles with him, then I might start to worry. But now? Nah.

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10-06-2013, 03:50 PM
  #452
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Originally Posted by Puhis View Post
See the bold parts.

Also, you can talk as much BS as you want, the truth is that Falk wasn't better with Prosser. He was really good with Spurgeon when Falk was being good Falk. Everyone knows that, much like Scandella and most of the young defensemen, Justin Falk was really inconsistent. We saw "Good Falk" and we saw "Bad Falk". Good Falk was physical, used his shot and didn't panic. He used his limited talent really well, and had the size to back it up. Bad Falk was much like Marco Scandella yesterday. The difference is that Scandella's ceiling is still that of a top-4 D-man. Now, we're supposed to be patient with defensemen, but he has got to show some improvement and more importantly some consistency as well. He hasn't really taken any steps forward during the last two years and he is still too unpredictable.

Jared Spurgeon is a different breed. He has shown that he belongs from the moment he stepped on the NHL ice. He has been one of the more reliable defensemen in this team, lead the D in points during 2011-12 season and showed to be durable as well. He has shown his ability in even strength, on the PK but most importantly on the PP where he belongs. Now, finding a suitable partner for him has been a bit of an issue, but to be honest, we haven't had much choice. Marco Scandella, Justin Falk, Clayton Stoner and a few games with Suter after no training camp. Disregarding the last one due to reasons already mentioned (no training camp, lack of chemistry/experience together, tough minutes), are you honestly trying to tell me that the reason Spurgeon's pairing hasn't worked yet is down to him, and not the lack of talent in his side? Now, you're calling me delusional but I'm only stating the facts. The reason I referred to the comments from the experts is that they know a bit more about hockey than you or me. They were really positive about Spurgeon's effort in the LA game, and that to me is enough to prove you wrong.

No, Jared Spurgeon is not the next big thing. No, he probably never reaches a star status in this league. He is just really good in what he does. And no, signing him to an extension was not a mistake.

I'd like to see Spurgeon paired with Ballard. They are both highly mobile, both have good hockey IQ and defensive awareness, and both can move the puck efficiently. If Spurgeon struggles with him, then I might start to worry. But now? Nah.
Actually Falk played best with Prosser. All those games when no goals were scored against Prosser were games he was paired with Falk. Some of my closer friends are good friends with Falk I'll get a direct answer from him on what he thinks of Spurgeon, instead of some fanboys opinion.

Saying Spurgeon has proved himself on the pk and pp is just hilarious. We have had an average to below average pp and pk since he joined our team. Special teams went from an area of strength to an area of weakness since Spurgeon joined the Wild and that is an undisputable fact.

Saying he just hasn't found the right partner going into his forth year with the Wild should tell you something. I don't think anybody disputes the fact that Spurgeon has some good elements to his game but when everyone who is paired with him instantly becomes the worst defenseman on our team you should ask yourself why might this be the case. Trying to find a d partner for Spurgeon is like trying to find linemates for Clutterbuck, maybe we will find a Tavaras who made Clutterbuck look great for Spurgeon, but chances are we won't.

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10-06-2013, 04:04 PM
  #453
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Originally Posted by Puhis View Post
I'd like to see Spurgeon paired with Ballard. They are both highly mobile, both have good hockey IQ and defensive awareness, and both can move the puck efficiently. If Spurgeon struggles with him, then I might start to worry. But now? Nah.
I think I'd interested in this, eventually, if Scandella doesn't figure his **** out.

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10-06-2013, 04:18 PM
  #454
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I was impressed with Dumba's skating ability/agility. Whether or not he will develop the judgement to along with it is another thing, but he could be a "Super Spurgeon", which wouldn't be a bad thing. Granlund looked better than last year, but still looks overmatched, to me.

As i've been saying for a year and a half now, Heatley is done. Put him on the PP only.

Brodziak looks better than last year. Cooke looks good. Too bad he couldn't handle the puck right in front of Ducks net on pass he intercepted. He as ALL alone.

Good to see the first line click.

If Coyle is seriously injured it will be a MAJOR bummer. He was starting to look like this year's Brodin.

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10-06-2013, 04:32 PM
  #455
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GetCluttered22 View Post
Actually Falk played best with Prosser. All those games when no goals were scored against Prosser were games he was paired with Falk. Some of my closer friends are good friends with Falk I'll get a direct answer from him on what he thinks of Spurgeon, instead of some fanboys opinion.

Saying Spurgeon has proved himself on the pk and pp is just hilarious. We have had an average to below average pp and pk since he joined our team. Special teams went from an area of strength to an area of weakness since Spurgeon joined the Wild and that is an undisputable fact.

Saying he just hasn't found the right partner going into his forth year with the Wild should tell you something. I don't think anybody disputes the fact that Spurgeon has some good elements to his game but when everyone who is paired with him instantly becomes the worst defenseman on our team you should ask yourself why might this be the case. Trying to find a d partner for Spurgeon is like trying to find linemates for Clutterbuck, maybe we will find a Tavaras who made Clutterbuck look great for Spurgeon, but chances are we won't.
Do you even read my posts? It's like hitting my head against a wall when I'm trying to be reasonable. Or are you just trying to get me banned by being annoying and ignorant?

And seriously, what you're saying is that Spurgeon single-handedly destroyed our PP and PK. That's the biggest load of crap I've heard since that guy claimed that Parise and Koivu are just glorified grinders.

I don't know the reasons why our PP has been a disaster in last couple of years, but I KNOW that Spurgeon is not a part of it. Yeah, he used to have trouble keeping the zone. That was 2 years ago. Get over it. 2 years ago Heatley was still a serviceable player, 2 years ago our 1st pairing was Zanon-Zidlicky and 2 years ago our 1st line was Heatley-Brodziak-Johnson. Players grow. Why don't you?

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10-06-2013, 06:32 PM
  #456
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Originally Posted by Puhis View Post
Do you even read my posts? It's like hitting my head against a wall when I'm trying to be reasonable. Or are you just trying to get me banned by being annoying and ignorant?

And seriously, what you're saying is that Spurgeon single-handedly destroyed our PP and PK. That's the biggest load of crap I've heard since that guy claimed that Parise and Koivu are just glorified grinders.

I don't know the reasons why our PP has been a disaster in last couple of years, but I KNOW that Spurgeon is not a part of it. Yeah, he used to have trouble keeping the zone. That was 2 years ago. Get over it. 2 years ago Heatley was still a serviceable player, 2 years ago our 1st pairing was Zanon-Zidlicky and 2 years ago our 1st line was Heatley-Brodziak-Johnson. Players grow. Why don't you?
You being reasonable? Please. You're the one who is resorting to name calling.

I simply point out my opinion along with some facts. If that bothers you maybe you shouldn't go on the internet. I don't care if you don't agree with me and I don't expect you to. But to get so angry and aggressive is uncalled for.

I want to see the Wild win as much as any of us here, and IMO we would be a far better team with Spurgeon NOT playing top 4 minutes. To say Spurgeon has not been a part of our PP problems the last few years is unjustified. He has played top 3 pp minutes for our defence each of the last 3 years. I'm not saying he single-handedly destroys our pp, but I think we have so many better options.

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10-06-2013, 07:15 PM
  #457
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Sorry but Spurgeon is garbage. Would be a 6th defenseman on a good team with defensive depth. Unfortunately we don't have depth.

Just look at chicago, LA, new york, st. louis. He wouldn't even be dressing on those teams.

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10-06-2013, 07:24 PM
  #458
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Originally Posted by Randy BoBandy View Post
Sorry but Spurgeon is garbage. Would be a 6th defenseman on a good team with defensive depth. Unfortunately we don't have depth.

Just look at chicago, LA, new york, st. louis. He wouldn't even be dressing on those teams.
Wouldn't go as far as calling him garbage. But pretty much agree with this. I hope we're able to improve our defense next off season, or maybe from a trade during the season.

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10-06-2013, 07:28 PM
  #459
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Wouldn't go as far as calling him garbage. But pretty much agree with this. I hope we're able to improve our defense next off season, or maybe from a trade during the season.
Agreed with this post. We definitely need an upgrade on D.

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10-06-2013, 07:33 PM
  #460
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Wild fans are starting to sound like Nuck fans.

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10-06-2013, 07:40 PM
  #461
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FTR- I dont think Spurgeon is garbage, and I cant see how anyone can argue that he isnt one of the teams top 6 dmen.

The problem I see with Spurgeon, he's a #6 dman that needs a partner with size, speed, and good puck handling. Not many teams in the NHL have the luxury of playing a guy like that on the bottom pair.

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10-06-2013, 07:53 PM
  #462
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Originally Posted by GetCluttered22 View Post
I'm not saying he single-handedly destroys our pp, but I think we have so many better options.
Up until this year, we really didn't. Guys who could play the point up until last season included Zidlicky, Gilbert, Spurgeon, Cullen, Burns, Havlat, and Schultz. Look at those guys and give me four better options for the point than Spurgeon. Zidlicky, Cullen, and Burns are all decent options, although I liked Cullen down on the forward lines better than at the point.

Last year brought us guys like Suter, Brodin, and Pominville. Spurgeon is still in the top-4 there on the powerplay. This season, we finally have good depth at playing the point. Suter, Brodin, Pominville, Spurgeon, Dumba, Ballard, and potentially a guy like Scandella if he pulls his head out of his butt.

Up until this year, there were not better options. Plain and simple.

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Originally Posted by Randy BoBandy View Post
Sorry but Spurgeon is garbage. Would be a 6th defenseman on a good team with defensive depth. Unfortunately we don't have depth.

Just look at chicago, LA, new york, st. louis. He wouldn't even be dressing on those teams.
Highly disagree. Spurgeon, while overplayed for the Wild and in situations he isn't quite as useful in, but he would play on those teams.

St Louis? He'd play over Leopold, who has been playing like hot garbage, easily enough. He'd be the #6 guy there, but that's because they have tremendous depth with a great #1(Piet), two good #2s(Bouwmeester and Shattenkirk), along with some solid depth options in Polak and Cole and Jackman. They're a anomaly with how teams are built.

Chicago? He'd be the #5 or #6. Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson, and Oduya are better. He'd be right there with guys like Brookbank, Leddy, Kostka, and Rozsival.

Los Angeles, same thing. Likely a #5 or #6 behind Doughty, Voynov, Regehr, and Mitchell. Again, they have extraordinary defensive depth. New York has Staal, McDonagh, Del Zotto, and Girardi above him. Yet again, he'd be right there in contention for the #5 or #6 spot. Really disagree when people say the only reason he gets playing time is because he is on the Wild. He's not a top-pairing guy, but he is certainly usable.

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Originally Posted by MNWILDFAN001 View Post
Wouldn't go as far as calling him garbage. But pretty much agree with this. I hope we're able to improve our defense next off season, or maybe from a trade during the season.
Yup. Ideally he'd be a third pairing guy or at least a second pairing guy not expected to anchor his line, but we don't have that depth. Yet. Maybe Dumba takes that step. Or maybe Gunnarsson explodes. Perhaps we get a big guy like Phaneuf in free agency. Or pick up a lower level guy like Boyle, Orpik, or Klesla.

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10-06-2013, 08:02 PM
  #463
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Originally Posted by tyratoku View Post
Up until this year, we really didn't. Guys who could play the point up until last season included Zidlicky, Gilbert, Spurgeon, Cullen, Burns, Havlat, and Schultz. Look at those guys and give me four better options for the point than Spurgeon. Zidlicky, Cullen, and Burns are all decent options, although I liked Cullen down on the forward lines better than at the point.

Last year brought us guys like Suter, Brodin, and Pominville. Spurgeon is still in the top-4 there on the powerplay. This season, we finally have good depth at playing the point. Suter, Brodin, Pominville, Spurgeon, Dumba, Ballard, and potentially a guy like Scandella if he pulls his head out of his butt.

Up until this year, there were not better options. Plain and simple.



Highly disagree. Spurgeon, while overplayed for the Wild and in situations he isn't quite as useful in, but he would play on those teams.

St Louis? He'd play over Leopold, who has been playing like hot garbage, easily enough. He'd be the #6 guy there, but that's because they have tremendous depth with a great #1(Piet), two good #2s(Bouwmeester and Shattenkirk), along with some solid depth options in Polak and Cole and Jackman. They're a anomaly with how teams are built.

Chicago? He'd be the #5 or #6. Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson, and Oduya are better. He'd be right there with guys like Brookbank, Leddy, Kostka, and Rozsival.

Los Angeles, same thing. Likely a #5 or #6 behind Doughty, Voynov, Regehr, and Mitchell. Again, they have extraordinary defensive depth. New York has Staal, McDonagh, Del Zotto, and Girardi above him. Yet again, he'd be right there in contention for the #5 or #6 spot. Really disagree when people say the only reason he gets playing time is because he is on the Wild. He's not a top-pairing guy, but he is certainly usable.



Yup. Ideally he'd be a third pairing guy or at least a second pairing guy not expected to anchor his line, but we don't have that depth. Yet. Maybe Dumba takes that step. Or maybe Gunnarsson explodes. Perhaps we get a big guy like Phaneuf in free agency. Or pick up a lower level guy like Boyle, Orpik, or Klesla.
while I agree with everything you said about the Wild PP, I think you overrate where Spurgeon would fit with other teams. There is zero chance Spurgeon makes the roster for St. Louis, LA, or Chicago.

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10-06-2013, 08:15 PM
  #464
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while I agree with everything you said about the Wild PP, I think you overrate where Spurgeon would fit with other teams. There is zero chance Spurgeon makes the roster for St. Louis, LA, or Chicago.
For Chicago, I reckon they'd rather have Spurgeon than Leddy. Only clear advantage Leddy has over Spurgeon is his speed. Spurgeon is much better defensively, has better hockey IQ and would probably fit there quite nicely.

It's hard to compare Spurgeon to most players, since Spurgeon is forced to play in roles he isn't best suited for. Ideally, I'd like to see him in 2nd or 3rd pairing with a lot of PP time, but he has to play PK and a lot of difficult minutes and D-zone starts.

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10-06-2013, 08:25 PM
  #465
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Originally Posted by Puhis View Post
For Chicago, I reckon they'd rather have Spurgeon than Leddy. Only clear advantage Leddy has over Spurgeon is his speed. Spurgeon is much better defensively, has better hockey IQ and would probably fit there quite nicely.

It's hard to compare Spurgeon to most players, since Spurgeon is forced to play in roles he isn't best suited for. Ideally, I'd like to see him in 2nd or 3rd pairing with a lot of PP time, but he has to play PK and a lot of difficult minutes and D-zone starts.
I would've agreed with you that Spurgeon was better than Leddy up until about the midpoint of last season. But arguing Spurgeon/Leddy is pretty much pointless after seeing how much Chicago trusted Leddy last year in the Playoffs.

Spurgeon isnt even an option for 2nd pair or the PP on the kind of team that the Wild are hoping to become. Spurgeon cant QB a PP and his shot/one timer is not NHL quality. There was a reason that Spurge was constantly left wide open at the top of the left circle.

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10-06-2013, 08:31 PM
  #466
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Originally Posted by J22 View Post
I would've agreed with you that Spurgeon was better than Leddy up until about the midpoint of last season. But arguing Spurgeon/Leddy is pretty much pointless after seeing how much Chicago trusted Leddy last year in the Playoffs.

Spurgeon isnt even an option for 2nd pair or the PP on the kind of team that the Wild are hoping to become. Spurgeon cant QB a PP and his shot/one timer is not NHL quality. There was a reason that Spurge was constantly left wide open at the top of the left circle.


I'd say that was an NHL quality shot. He CAN rip it, and it's pretty accurate, too. I agree that he doesn't have a great shot, but it's definitely NHL quality.

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10-06-2013, 10:30 PM
  #467
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More than anything I think Spurgeon's shot suffers from his short reach. Very rarely does he get anything in his wheelhouse.

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10-07-2013, 01:02 AM
  #468
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Would make my day if someone made a gif of Heatley whiffing on that one timer then falling over.

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10-07-2013, 09:37 AM
  #469
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Would make my day if someone made a gif of Heatley whiffing on that one timer then falling over.
that was an epic whiff, i've been a heatley fan but dang he looks slow. yes i too would like to see a reply of that.

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10-07-2013, 09:44 AM
  #470
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No, I have no idea where Spurgeon was aiming. What I do know, and figured a genius like yourself would know, is where a NHL player would want to be aiming on that shot in that situation.
Shots against the grain oftentimes catch the goalies by surprise. I thought it was nicely placed.

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10-07-2013, 11:27 AM
  #471
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If I were coaching I would be absolutely fuming, more than anything else, about everyone packing it in ten seconds too early. Getting beat on a good chance in OT is disappointing, but getting beat in OT because you just kind of stopped playing is absolutely bush league.
Worst part of the night. Team fights back to tie the game and then lets the Ducks walk right into the zone and score. Initially, I tried faulting Backstrom a little, if only for the fact that any one-on-one move turns him into a statue, but the team essentially letting it get to that point was ridiculous.

Quote:
Backs actually looked mostly good. Had a couple big saves on shots I really wouldn't have faulted him for giving up. First goal (Saku's deflection) was a little soft and it would've been nice to set the tone differently, but I still can't blame him on this one. And absolutely can't fault him for the OT goal, that's 100% on the D. Would still like to see Hards get a start soon, to protect Backstrom's health, to keep Harding sharp, and to create some competition.
Harding should be getting the start in Nashville. I know the team likes to ride Backs but Harding starting every third game or so sounds about right.

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10-07-2013, 11:46 AM
  #472
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Harding should be getting the start in Nashville. I know the team likes to ride Backs but Harding starting every third game or so sounds about right.
I agree. Let's give him a shot in Nashville. He needs to get in.

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