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2013-2014 Hartford Wolf Pack/Greenville Road Warriors Thread

View Poll Results: How much do you follow our minor league teams?
I regularly go to games and/or subscribe to AHL Live 12 9.16%
I go to a couple of games a year 9 6.87%
I follow the Wolf Pack by regularly reading about it 57 43.51%
I occasionally check stats, but don't follow Hartford regularly 46 35.11%
What's a Wolf Pack? Are they zoo animals? Why would I follow the minors? 7 5.34%
Voters: 131. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-07-2013, 02:08 PM
  #526
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
I don't want to come off as cheerleading the guy but your comments on Lindberg seem unnecessarily harsh considering it's literally two games into the season for a guy trying to adjust to a different style game and different size ice
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...most of the offense on the team has been created by Kreider, Miller and Kristo
Time will tell. NA bias IMO

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10-07-2013, 02:16 PM
  #527
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Time will tell. NA bias IMO
BBKers c'mon. Leslie has no bias and she is doing a great job of getting us the info that she sees by spending her time watching these kids play. No need for any of this.

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10-07-2013, 02:20 PM
  #528
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Lindberg took the shot that set up Kreider's goal yesterday. He is definitely still adjusting to the NA ice and I'm gonna give him more than 2 games before I start dismissing him as a legitimate NHL prospect.

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10-07-2013, 02:24 PM
  #529
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BBKers c'mon. Leslie has no bias and she is doing a great job of getting us the info that she sees by spending her time watching these kids play. No need for any of this.
I usually have a very high opinion of Leslies work. Seriously. Watched both Pack games myself. Cannot see how she comes to these conclusions. This is seriously what I think about her opinion this time. Like it or not. I see no other explanation for her praise for Kristo and harshness or Lindberg here...blah blah blah

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10-07-2013, 02:30 PM
  #530
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I usually have a very high opinion of Leslies work. Seriously. Watched both Pack games myself. Cannot see how she comes to these conclusions. This is seriously what I think about her opinion this time. Like it or not. I see no other explanation for her praise for Kristo and harshness or Lindberg here...blah blah blah
Or maybe she saw something different than you did? Why do you have to go directly to NA bias? What rationale do you have to back that up? Was she anti-Anisimov? Erixon? Fast last year? Hrivik last year?

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10-07-2013, 02:52 PM
  #531
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I am still 99% sure the assist credited to Miller was actually Lindberg.

Regardless Lindberg to me did have some dangerous shifts (in a good way). He's a very subtle player though...never really knocked you over the head but a few times I found myself thinking "damn that was a smart play" and it was OL.

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10-07-2013, 02:59 PM
  #532
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Or maybe she saw something different than you did? Why do you have to go directly to NA bias? What rationale do you have to back that up? Was she anti-Anisimov? Erixon? Fast last year? Hrivik last year?
I think that this is quite the spread opinion here on the boards and hardly objectively commented when going the other way. He (Fast) played in €urope last year btw so how could Leslie comment on his play on the Pack (only one game if I remember correctly)? Do not really remember remarks on Erixon. Anisimov was usually appreciated, you are right there. OK, sorry, I am having an awful day...

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10-07-2013, 03:11 PM
  #533
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
I think that this is quite the spread opinion here on the boards and hardly objectively commented when going the other way. He (Fast) played in €urope last year btw so how could Leslie comment on his play on the Pack (only one game if I remember correctly)? Do not really remember remarks on Erixon. Anisimov was usually appreciated, you are right there. OK, sorry, I am having an awful day...
No worries, just seemed like a rather large leap

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10-07-2013, 03:22 PM
  #534
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
I usually have a very high opinion of Leslies work. Seriously. Watched both Pack games myself. Cannot see how she comes to these conclusions. This is seriously what I think about her opinion this time. Like it or not. I see no other explanation for her praise for Kristo and harshness or Lindberg here...blah blah blah
i dont have a na bias..and i thought lindberg was mediocre at best during the preseason...i havent seen any pack games though to be fair.

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10-07-2013, 04:07 PM
  #535
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
I am still 99% sure the assist credited to Miller was actually Lindberg.

Regardless Lindberg to me did have some dangerous shifts (in a good way). He's a very subtle player though...never really knocked you over the head but a few times I found myself thinking "damn that was a smart play" and it was OL.
Hey - you must have been watching the game at the same time I was! This was exactly what I came to post.

1) It was Lindberg that took the excellent shot that led to Kreider's goal. It was incorrectly assigned to Miller. If you watch the replay, you can see it's 16, not 10 and then it's clearly his face when the players celebrate the goal.

2) He did not dominate in the way that Kreider or Miller did, but he did make his share of subtle little plays. In particular, nearly every time there was a pass that made it through a couple of defenders or came out of a crowd to land on a HFD stick, I would look back and see it was Lindberg. Happened at least 3 or 4 times.

I do think he has a subtler game and there is no question he is getting used to the smaller ice, but I am very confident he will start to become more and more noticeable over the next month or so. I thought I saw improvement in this respect already from game one to game two.

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10-07-2013, 04:19 PM
  #536
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Other than my post above about Lindberg, I pretty much agreed with Leslie's writeup - other than where she said Bourque was the fastest player on the ice. I think she meant to say "fastest player playing with 5 gears. Kreider clearly has 6 or 7, so I'm not counting him."

Also, she mentioned one thing that I'd like to point out:

Quote:
The up-tempo and high skill-based game that Hartford won this afternoon (by a score of 4-3), however, was much more of what this team will need to be to succeed this season. And more importantly, it is what the Rangers’ prospects need to develop properly. When you look up and down the lineup, this is no longer a lunch pail crew. However, I believe that there will be differences of opinion here, as Wolf Pack head coach Kenny Gernander said this afternoon that he preferred the way his team played in game one and not in the game this afternoon.
BARF.

Torts isn't here anymore, G! No more stone age hockey!

I have said it for years and comments like this only back it up - he was a AAAA hardworking forward himself and so he views lunchpail hockey as the "right" way to play and it's what he's trying to teach all our forwards. He is ill-equipped to help offensively oriented prospects. God help MSC if he ever takes a regular shift in HFD...

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10-07-2013, 04:32 PM
  #537
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Great to hear nothing but good things for our big time prospects in Hartford.

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10-07-2013, 05:47 PM
  #538
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That is what the AHL is for.

Yogan being sent to the ECHL is alot different than sending MSC, a guy that has averaged 90 points a season for three straight years in Juniors.

regardless of role that Powe is playing, he's got no future value to the Rangers organization and instead of giving a spot to some fringe player at both teh NHL and AHL levels, they should be teaching MSC how to eat/workout so that he gets stronger physically and as that happens, naturally he will learn how to play against men.
What makes you think that they aren't? You think that just because he got sent to the ECHL, they stopped talking to him, stopped advising him? That's ridiculous.

Powe can't be sent to the ECHL, so I have no idea what point you are trying to make by bringing him up. If MSC is going to be a good player, some time in the ECHL isn't going to change that. Girardi spent some time in the ECHL too, and he turned out all right.

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10-07-2013, 06:04 PM
  #539
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I have NO FAITH in this organizations ability to identify talent and LESS FAITH in their ability to develope and mold that talent into productive NHL'ers.
That's a rather silly viewpoint considering what the Rangers have brought to the NHL level in recent history. Lundqvist, McDonagh, Stepan, Girardi, Staal, Sauer, Hagelin, Dubinsky, Callahan, Anisimov, etc. And without the use of a single top 10 pick.

Quote:
There is NO ORGANIZATIONAL FUTURE for Darrol friggin Powe on the NHL Roster. Why on earth does he get a spot over MSC. The AHL is a DEVELOPMENTAL LEAGUE meant to house those that are not quite good enough for the NHL but to old for Junior Hockey.
Powe has no long-term future with the Rangers. There's little doubting that. That being said, if there was a gun to my head and I was forced to choose whether Powe or St. Croix has a more notable Rangers career then I'm picking Powe. I say that as a believer in St. Croix. Reality is that odds are against St. Croix, like any prospect of his ilk. If a Rangers forward suffers an injury and they need someone to fill in on the 4th line or as a 13th forward for 1 or 2 games you don't want to call up a Kreider or Lindberg or similar prospect for that and take them away from the AHL when you could just have Powe fit in seamlessly in a niche role. And even if Powe never gets called up you still need veterans in the minors. There's a reason the Wolfpack captains are Johnson, Powe, and Haley. You want some older voices who know the ropes of the NHL and can influence the younger guys. Look how much Hagelin thrived by playing with John Mitchell. We hear all the time about veteran influences in the NHL locker room. Now imagine a locker room with a bunch of 20-23 year olds. You need a few mature voices.

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MSC should not be wasting his time or effort in the ECHL. Yes he has warts in his game. that is the reason he is in the minors. To be developed by the guys at the AHL level.
The ECHL is not a sunday league. It's still competitive, professional hockey. And over 500 guys from the ECHL have went on to play in the NHL. One of the "downsides" of having so many talented forward prospects is that there's a roster crunch. St. Croix was the odd man out, unfortunately. If he produces with Greenville I'm sure it won't take long for him to find his way back to Hartford.

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The Rangers have been greatly aided by guys that didn't need much developmeent or tutoring. They are piss poor at taking a player that needs work, such as an MSC and bringing him along and teaching him. The ECHL is a garbage league and tearing up that league means jack ****.
Don't know where this comes from exactly. Michael Sauer, Dan Girardi, Artem Anisimov, and Michael Del Zotto are all evidence against this. It's not like there are tons of teams out there churning out NHLers with project picks.

Quote:

He's an offensive player, work with him with that understanding and teach him to be a somewhat responsible player defensively while allowing the offensive aspect of his game to blossom.
Is hockey in the ECHL played on a basketball court or something? Why can't he learn those things there? Again, him being there isn't a permanent thing. He's not being punished. If he is so deserving of being in the AHL, as you say, then that means he should **** on his competition in the ECHL. And if he does then he'll get promoted.

Quote:

He should not have been sent to the ECHL, seems like the easy way out of a teaching situation.
The Rangers spent all sorts of time, energy, and resources to draft St. Croix and then follow his progress the next two seasons before handing him a contract this past summer. Do you really think he's in the ECHL because Ken Gernander doesn't have the motivation to teach him?


Last edited by TheRightWay: 10-07-2013 at 06:23 PM.
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Old
10-07-2013, 06:55 PM
  #540
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Kenny Gernander said this afternoon that he preferred the way his team played in game one and not in the game this afternoon
Yeah, great. The offensively gifted prospects are scoring and making plays, I don't like that either.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post

BARF.

Torts isn't here anymore, G! No more stone age hockey!

I have said it for years and comments like this only back it up - he was a AAAA hardworking forward himself and so he views lunchpail hockey as the "right" way to play and it's what he's trying to teach all our forwards. He is ill-equipped to help offensively oriented prospects. God help MSC if he ever takes a regular shift in HFD...
How about it?

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10-07-2013, 07:17 PM
  #541
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Yeah, great. The offensively gifted prospects are scoring and making plays, I don't like that either.



How about it?
Not sure if you're agreeing or not - I was commenting on the same quote from Gernander where you expressed disbelief.

The point is - they did well and showed offensive flair in the second game. And wonder of wonders, they won! What does Gernander have to say about it? That he'd prefer they played the way they had the previous night - in other words, play a game where there was lots of grinding, fighting and, wonder, of wonders the team had great difficulty scoring (and eventually lost). So, the obvious inference is that he's going to coach them to play that way.

Like I said, BARF.

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10-07-2013, 07:31 PM
  #542
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Not sure if you're agreeing or not - I was commenting on the same quote from Gernander where you expressed disbelief.

The point is - they did well and showed offensive flair in the second game. And wonder of wonders, they won! What does Gernander have to say about it? That he'd prefer they played the way they had the previous night - in other words, play a game where there was lots of grinding, fighting and, wonder, of wonders the team had great difficulty scoring (and eventually lost). So, the obvious inference is that he's going to coach them to play that way.

Like I said, BARF.
To be fair, the Wolfpack did outshoot Norfolk 37-28 while getting outshot 26-22 by Albany. Obviously, the Albany game was more fun for us as fans because of the results (i.e. who scored), but as the coach of an entire team, I don't think Gernander is off base by saying they played better in the first game.

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10-07-2013, 07:59 PM
  #543
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To be fair, the Wolfpack did outshoot Norfolk 37-28 while getting outshot 26-22 by Albany. Obviously, the Albany game was more fun for us as fans because of the results (i.e. who scored), but as the coach of an entire team, I don't think Gernander is off base by saying they played better in the first game.
I watched both in their entirety and I vehemently disagree.

The Pack may have had more shots in the first game, but they were mostly ugly, bad angle attempts that would look very familiar to anyone who watched the Rangers play last week / in the preseason. It was very frustrating. Conversely, in the second game, they were much more dangerous - and scored more as a direct result. They had many more shots from prime scoring areas. They consistently beat the Devils' (who play the same style as the parent club) defense with their offense.

They will be the more offensively talented team than almost any other team they go up against in the AHL. And so they're going to play grind-it-out, punch-it-up hockey? Shoot ugly, wide angle shots? That'd be like the Penguins trying to play the 6-goalie '11-'12 Rangers system. Not playing to their strengths.

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10-07-2013, 08:28 PM
  #544
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To be clear, I'm certainly not accusing Leslie of anything with my comment, it was entirely just expressing my impression that she came off a little harsh on a player who has played exactly two real professional games in north america (preseason doesn't count). Of course he needs to create chances and be involved if he wants to be a top six player, but it came across as a comment you'd make after watching a guy struggle to make an impact over an entire season, and I'm not sure I've really seen anyone say that Lindberg is a star in the making. Most people figure he could be a good third liner with an outside shot at being a top six forward. Maybe people in the Rangers org called him a rising star? I don't know

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10-07-2013, 09:01 PM
  #545
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Not sure if you're agreeing or not - I was commenting on the same quote from Gernander where you expressed disbelief.

The point is - they did well and showed offensive flair in the second game. And wonder of wonders, they won! What does Gernander have to say about it? That he'd prefer they played the way they had the previous night - in other words, play a game where there was lots of grinding, fighting and, wonder, of wonders the team had great difficulty scoring (and eventually lost). So, the obvious inference is that he's going to coach them to play that way.

Like I said, BARF.
Definitely agreeing.

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10-07-2013, 10:43 PM
  #546
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First of all, please know that I have no North American bias. I love European prospects and am very excited about Fast and Lindberg playing in North America.

That said, I have not been happy with what I have seen out of Lindberg, either in the two games in Hartford this weekend or in his pre-season games with the Rangers. I do know that the Rangers were absolutely in love with him after the tournament in Traverse City and camp in New York (ie, a rising star). Lindberg was offensively a dynamo, which everyone knew was an extension of what he did last season in Sweden.

So, with his early work, Lindberg had basically had made the team, all he had to do was just continue to perform. But as soon as he got to the pre-season, he stopped doing what he just had done days before. And he has not restarted.

As for the assist, I saw it live (have not seen the video) and am not sure who should have gotten it. If its Lindberg, great, but frankly, the Rangers want Lindberg to stand out, be noticable, make things happen on a regular basis. Time will tell whether he can do this, but I think the idea within the organization that he is a defensive forward is long gone.

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10-08-2013, 09:36 AM
  #547
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bit of a rant here so bear with me.

I have no issues with guys not making the NHL team because he didn't do enough to warrant a spot. Kreider as much as I pump him up, dodn't earn a spot on the NHL roster and as such was sent down.

Kreider is a big part of the Rangers future and they want him to develope properly.

I have NO FAITH in this organizations ability to identify talent and LESS FAITH in their ability to develope and mold that talent into productive NHL'ers.

There is NO ORGANIZATIONAL FUTURE for Darrol friggin Powe on the NHL Roster. Why on earth does he get a spot over MSC. The AHL is a DEVELOPMENTAL LEAGUE meant to house those that are not quite good enough for the NHL but to old for Junior Hockey.

MSC should not be wasting his time or effort in the ECHL. Yes he has warts in his game. that is the reason he is in the minors. To be developed by the guys at the AHL level.

The Rangers have been greatly aided by guys that didn't need much developmeent or tutoring. They are piss poor at taking a player that needs work, such as an MSC and bringing him along and teaching him. The ECHL is a garbage league and tearing up that league means jack ****.

He's an offensive player, work with him with that understanding and teach him to be a somewhat responsible player defensively while allowing the offensive aspect of his game to blossom.

He should not have been sent to the ECHL, seems like the easy way out of a teaching situation.
I think freaking out that MSC went to ECHL is a silly over-reaction, its a common step for young first-year pros - Dan Girardi started out in the E.

However, i do share a concern that NYR's AHL affiliate has not delivered a pipeline of NHL regulars. McD and Hagelin's 1/2 seasons don't really apply here, that was more orientation out of college game to playing against men and the pro schedule.

Help me out if i am missing others, but it seems the only NHL regulars we developed in the last ~5 years with a couple seasons in AHL were Sauer and Anisimov, who were both 2d round picks.

Gernander is a nice and hard-working guy.

Many folks believe the Rangers have an exceptional group of promising prospects in Hartford this year.
Will this staff be able to lead them to their potential?

Which circles me back to St Croix.
Some quotes and articles I've read speak highly of Coach Stork in Greenville.
Hopefully he will help build the readiness of St Croix, Nicholls and Noreau to be effective pros and eventual NHL'ers.

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10-08-2013, 09:40 AM
  #548
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I don't particularly care that MSC is in Greenville, as I don't think he's that good. Time will tell, but I've never been impressed with his prospects of succeeding as a pro.

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10-08-2013, 10:21 AM
  #549
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However, i do share a concern that NYR's AHL affiliate has not delivered a pipeline of NHL regulars. McD and Hagelin's 1/2 seasons don't really apply here, that was more orientation out of college game to playing against men and the pro schedule.

Help me out if i am missing others, but it seems the only NHL regulars we developed in the last ~5 years with a couple seasons in AHL were Sauer and Anisimov, who were both 2d round picks.
Completely agree. The lack of ability to develop legit NHL players out of the AHL is concerning. I can't think of anyone else in addition to Sauer and Anisimov who benefited from long stints with Connecticut/Hartford.

I can think of 6 guys down with Hartford who I feel have a legitimate shot about contributing to the Rangers. Kreider, Miller, Talbot, McIlrath, Lindberg, and Hrivik. It makes you nervous, because you don't want to see this many players' NHL hopes die out playing for Gernander.

I've always hoped Gernander wasn't the head coach. The guy played like 950 AHL games to 50 NHL games. The AHL is a Developmental league and he doesn't know jack about making the jump for the AHL to the NHL.

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10-08-2013, 10:23 AM
  #550
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Completely agree. The lack of ability to develop legit NHL players out of the AHL is concerning. I can't think of anyone else in addition to Sauer and Anisimov who benefited from long stints with Connecticut/Hartford.

I can think of 6 guys down with Hartford who I feel have a legitimate shot about contributing to the Rangers. Kreider, Miller, Talbot, McIlrath, Lindberg, and Hrivik. It makes you nervous, because you don't want to see this many players' NHL hopes die out playing for Gernander.

I've always hoped Gernander wasn't the head coach. The guy played like 950 AHL games to 50 NHL games. The AHL is a Developmental league and he doesn't know jack about making the jump for the AHL to the NHL.
Dubinsky? Dawes? Callahan? Korpikoski? McDonagh and Hagelin played there. Erixon in Columbus. Weise now in Vancouver.

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