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Is this PHX proposal even close?

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Old
12-01-2006, 11:40 PM
  #26
in the hall
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had no idea nagy was an upcoming UFA.. so that completely changes it imo

I don't give up Prucha in the deal

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12-01-2006, 11:54 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by MisterUnspoken View Post
It has more to do with the 3.9 million over X amt of years (which is overpaid). And saying he'd be the best defenseman on this team isn't saying much. Actually I think it's inaccurate as Tyutin is the best defenseman on this team and I would take him over Morris. (Call me a homer if you want).

UFAs to be usually fetch a nice prospect and a pick so if Nagy were coming to NY that's the return you'd probably get.
3.9 Mil is overpaying for a 1-2 Defenseman? Are you kidding me? Were you asleep this summer? And okay, have it your way. Ill take Montoya and your 1st to go please. Can I get a bag with that?

This is a deal a playoff bound Rangers team makes. Nevermind the fact you dump Kaspar... is he even back in the NHL yet? And Malik!

I throw in Comrie, you throw in Montoya?

I really dont know what we would do with Kaspar and Malik, were crammed for space on defense as it is...

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12-02-2006, 12:15 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
3.9 Mil is overpaying for a 1-2 Defenseman? Are you kidding me? Were you asleep this summer? And okay, have it your way. Ill take Montoya and your 1st to go please. Can I get a bag with that?

This is a deal a playoff bound Rangers team makes. Nevermind the fact you dump Kaspar... is he even back in the NHL yet? And Malik!

I throw in Comrie, you throw in Montoya?

I really dont know what we would do with Kaspar and Malik, were crammed for space on defense as it is...
Montoya wouldn't be dealt because that leaves us with NO GOALIE PROSPECTS. I'm sure you already knew that though, since you seem to know all about our "playoff bound" team after 20 something games.

Further Morris is a #1 or #2 defenseman? More like a #3-4 paid 3.9 million a year, kind of like Kaspar was when we signed him. Is he overpaid now? Sure is. Keep Morris if he's so good. He's not worth moving Prucha when we could attempt to fill that hole via FA or other more favorable trading options.

We dump Malik? He's been playing much better and we aren't in a rush to "dump him". We certainly would in the right deal.

Kaspar is sitting in the press box costing us cap space so yes I'd like to move him but not in a deal for Prucha. We may be able to pawn him off on a non playoff team in a deadline deal. I'd take my chances as GM.

This deal SUCKS for the Rangers and if you knew half as much as you think you do about the Rangers you wouldn't make this deal either.

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12-02-2006, 03:23 AM
  #29
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Soo.... Does Nagy play C ever? Because that would be a reason why I would want him. I love Cullen but with Shanahan and Prucha on the same line and minimal production, I have no reason to believe that cullen and any two other guys would be a good second line. I've never heard of nagy as anything but lw (and injury prone but that's another story). Am I wrong?

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12-02-2006, 04:56 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
3.9 Mil is overpaying for a 1-2 Defenseman? Are you kidding me? Were you asleep this summer? And okay, have it your way. Ill take Montoya and your 1st to go please. Can I get a bag with that?

This is a deal a playoff bound Rangers team makes. Nevermind the fact you dump Kaspar... is he even back in the NHL yet? And Malik!

I throw in Comrie, you throw in Montoya?

I really dont know what we would do with Kaspar and Malik, were crammed for space on defense as it is...
Derek Morris isn't a 1-2 defenseman worth nearly $4 million per signed for another two seasons after this season

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12-02-2006, 08:20 AM
  #31
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Derek Morris isn't a 1-2 defenseman worth nearly $4 million per signed for another two seasons after this season
I disagree.

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12-02-2006, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by RegalRangers View Post
Soo.... Does Nagy play C ever?
No, he's a LW. He's a good playmaker, though.

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12-02-2006, 08:22 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by MisterUnspoken View Post
Nagy is also a UFA so trading Prucha for him is dumb.
Just more expensive. He's an upgrade, but you'll have to pay him alot more.

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12-02-2006, 01:14 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Cynical TyranT View Post

I'd say pull Spiller, we pull Artem and Prucha...
You the GM for PHX, never would have thought you would be on HF talking to some fans about deals.

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12-02-2006, 01:26 PM
  #35
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Even though Pruchas in the deal... I'll take it! For the most part, addition by subtraction w/ Malik and Kaspar, and I always liked Morris and Nagy (Is he Czech or Slovak?)

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12-02-2006, 02:24 PM
  #36
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is this deal fair value wise? absolutely.

is it one I would make? no.

Right now I'm just not prepaired to move that many young assets in a deal unless i'm getting a major player. I know we've got a competetive team here, but I'm not ready to move a 24 year old 30 goal scorer, a second and a good prospect just for a now upgrade.

what I would be interested in doing is breaking this deal up, it's too big for my taste. What would you want just for Nagy? how about just Morris?

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12-02-2006, 02:56 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by xander View Post
is this deal fair value wise? absolutely.

is it one I would make? no.

Right now I'm just not prepaired to move that many young assets in a deal unless i'm getting a major player. I know we've got a competetive team here, but I'm not ready to move a 24 year old 30 goal scorer, a second and a good prospect just for a now upgrade.

what I would be interested in doing is breaking this deal up, it's too big for my taste. What would you want just for Nagy? how about just Morris?
For Nagy, I'd want Prucha. Malik would need to be added to even up the salary. You can give Spiller a shot, too, if you'd like. That's not the answer you were looking for was it? If I deal Nagy I want someone coming back with major offensive upside. The Rangers don't appear to have any prospects like that in their system. The reason I made the deal so big is so that I could add Morris (who IMO, fills a very significant need for you guys, very well). Last season, we got two second rounders and a quality young enforcer for Denis Gauthier. Morris is twice the defenseman Gauthier is. I figured Anisimov and a 2nd was fair value, but only in conjuction with the Nagy deal. To be honest, I don't even really want to deal Morris. He's a fine defenseman. This deal is just such a good fit for us, that I was willing to part with him. Without Prucha involved, I'd probably look elsewhere if I were going to deal Morris.

The bottom line is that Prucha was the primary target, and without him, there probably isn't a realistic deal that I would go for. I understand that Prucha has alot of potential, and is only 24. Nagy, himself, is only 27. While he is a potential UFA, 4 mil. per year and a shot to play with Jagr should be enough to retain him. Nagy is a wonderfiul talent. As I said earlier, he has 128 points in his last 129 games. Morris is young top pairing defenseman who is becoming increasingly underrated. I'm offering quality players, here. I need a quality return.

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Old
12-02-2006, 03:09 PM
  #38
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That proposal is really bad from a Phoenix stand point. Kasper is over priced and sucks bad.

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12-02-2006, 03:17 PM
  #39
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For Nagy, I'd want Prucha. Malik would need to be added to even up the salary. You can give Spiller a shot, too, if you'd like. That's not the answer you were looking for was it? If I deal Nagy I want someone coming back with major offensive upside. The Rangers don't appear to have any prospects like that in their system. The reason I made the deal so big is so that I could add Morris (who IMO, fills a very significant need for you guys, very well). Last season, we got two second rounders and a quality young enforcer for Denis Gauthier. Morris is twice the defenseman Gauthier is. I figured Anisimov and a 2nd was fair value, but only in conjuction with the Nagy deal. To be honest, I don't even really want to deal Morris. He's a fine defenseman. This deal is just such a good fit for us, that I was willing to part with him. Without Prucha involved, I'd probably look elsewhere if I were going to deal Morris.

The bottom line is that Prucha was the primary target, and without him, there probably isn't a realistic deal that I would go for. I understand that Prucha has alot of potential, and is only 24. Nagy, himself, is only 27. While he is a potential UFA, 4 mil. per year and a shot to play with Jagr should be enough to retain him. Nagy is a wonderfiul talent. As I said earlier, he has 128 points in his last 129 games. Morris is young top pairing defenseman who is becoming increasingly underrated. I'm offering quality players, here. I need a quality return.
thats fair enough, but nagy isnt enough of an upgrade over prucha to justify the money that the rangers would have to pay him. I'd rather just keep prucha, who is cheap and will be so for 3 more years.

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12-02-2006, 03:24 PM
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That proposal is really bad from a Phoenix stand point. Kasper is over priced and sucks bad.
Prucha is a good return for Nagy. Anisimov and a 2nd is a good return for Morris. The two Rangers defenseman are in the deal soley for salary purposes. Malik would be dealt as soon as anyone would take his salary(maybe in a deal that includes the dirt cheap Perreault) and Kaspar would be sent to San Antonio. I would accept any other salary dumps in their place. These two just seemed the most likely.

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12-02-2006, 03:26 PM
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thats fair enough, but nagy isnt enough of an upgrade over prucha to justify the money that the rangers would have to pay him.
You do get Morris at a discount (return wise). Maybe that's not enough.

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I'd rather just keep prucha, who is cheap and will be so for 3 more years.
3 years? Really? How's that?

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12-02-2006, 03:29 PM
  #42
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You do get Morris at a discount (return wise). Maybe that's not enough.



3 years? Really? How's that?
well he's 24 and won't hit ufa until he's 27.

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12-02-2006, 03:37 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Prucha25Graves988 View Post
You the GM for PHX, never would have thought you would be on HF talking to some fans about deals.
Huh?

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12-02-2006, 03:41 PM
  #44
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well he's 24 and won't hit ufa until he's 27.
Okay, but he'll certainly be RFA before then, right? He'll be due quite a raise regardless, I would think.

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12-02-2006, 03:44 PM
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Okay, but he'll certainly be RFA before then, right? He'll be due quite a raise regardless, I would think.
of course he'll get a raise, but he will still be cheaper than what nagy would cost.

you know how it is with the cap, you've got to hold onto these guys before they hit ufa and get the most out of them while they're cheap. if this wasn't the case then you wouldn't be looking to deal nagy in the first place.

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12-02-2006, 03:50 PM
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of course he'll get a raise, but he will still be cheaper than what nagy would cost.

you know how it is with the cap, you've got to hold onto these guys before they hit ufa and get the most out of them while they're cheap. if this wasn't the case then you wouldn't be looking to deal nagy in the first place.
True enough, but I'd wager that he'd outproduce Prucha by a decent margin for those three years. My reasons for wanting to deal Nagy are complicated.

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12-02-2006, 03:52 PM
  #47
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care to elaborate?

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12-02-2006, 04:27 PM
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Okay, but he'll certainly be RFA before then, right? He'll be due quite a raise regardless, I would think.
the problem is that Nagy right now is a rental.. you do NOT trade a young goal scorer in his second year for a rental

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12-02-2006, 04:35 PM
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care to elaborate?
Sure. First of all, Phoenix is not built to compete now, nor are we built to compete in the near future. Our best players are either very young (Ballard, Michalek, LeNevue, Sjostrom, Mueller, Hanzal, ect.), or in their late twenties/early thirties (Nagy, Doan, Jovonovski, Morris, Comrie, Boynton, ect.). I'd like the team to get younger. So when the Ballards, Michaleks, and Muellers are all grown up, they have a supporting cast around them that can contend.

Also, with Doan, Comrie, Nagy, and Ballard all due significant raises, and with Jovo's bloated contract, plus the one that Bertuzzi will surely recieve, there will be some difficult decisions to be made. The odd man out, in my mind, is Nagy. I like Doan better, and Nagy should bring a better return than Comrie.

Plus, I'd love to see what Nagy is capable of doing on a team that doesn't suck. I think he'd be unbelievable on a roster in which he's not the best player. If he were to have talent around him, I think he'd explode, and I'd love the opportunity to rub it in the face of his many detractors.

Nagy is a very very talented hockey player. He's the most talented player to ever play for the Phoenix Coyotes that wasn't all washed up. I don't think he's the one who will deliver us from Suckville, however. He's not the type of guy who can put a whole team on his shoulders and still dominate under the deadweight. No doubt on a better team, he'd be recieving tons of recognition. Unfortunately Phoenix won't be a good team for a long time, if ever.

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12-02-2006, 04:36 PM
  #50
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the problem is that Nagy right now is a rental.. you do NOT trade a young goal scorer in his second year for a rental
I'm sure that in order to do this deal the Rangers would have to be planning on re-signing Nagy.

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