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Old
10-02-2013, 04:05 PM
  #76
Andy
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Originally Posted by Kirk Muller View Post
In general its not the individual parts that are the issue in Montreal. Diaz as a players is a regular NHL defensemen however it makes no sense to pair him with Markov.

The problem in Montreal is the size and makeup of their defenseman and usage.

Montreal has a star defenseman in Subban

A #4 aging PP specialist in Markov. Sorry folks he isnt capable of 24 minutes a night anymore.

A # 4 defensive Dman in Gorges

A # 5 PP specialist in Diaz

A # 6 defenseman in Boullion

And a potential #2 complimentary top pairing in Tinordi however in terms of development is currently a #5.

Realistically Montreal is missing a #2 and #3 quality of defenseman which is causing guys past usage, roles and abilities.
I agree with this 100%. The only thing I'd say is that Gorges is more of a complimentary top 4 d-man. He can't drive a pairing by himself. The bolded part is the most important. Gorges, Markov and Diaz are all playing outside of their roles. Diaz is being asked to play as a top 4, Gorges is being asked to fill in the role a first pairing defensive D man, and Markov being asked to play as a number 3 or number 2.

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10-02-2013, 04:08 PM
  #77
Kirk Muller
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I agree with this 100%. The only thing I'd say is that Gorges is more of a complimentary top 4 d-man. He can't drive a pairing by himself. The bolded part is the most important. Gorges, Markov and Diaz are all playing outside of their roles. Diaz is being asked to play as a top 4, Gorges is being asked to fill in the role a first pairing defensive D man, and Markov being asked to play as a number 3 or number 2.
i agree with you in regards to Gorges. He isnt a prototypical shut down number 4 defenseman say like someone like Willie Mitchell or the likes who drive your second pairing. Gorges will always need someone of higher calibre to make the pairing work

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10-02-2013, 05:02 PM
  #78
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My have times changed. Just last year there was all this talk about how great Gorges was. I guess reality has sunk in.

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10-02-2013, 05:06 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
My have times changed. Just last year there was all this talk about how great Gorges was. I guess reality has sunk in.
Gorges is a good defenseman playing out of his role. He's be even better if he wouldn't be asked to be on the first pairing. I've seen very little people suggesting he's a first pairing D man. He's a great complimentary top 4 dman. If the Canadiens had a guy like Mitchell or Seidenberg to pair up with Subban, I wouldn't have any problem with Gorges being partnered with Markov or Emelin. Asking Gorges to handle a first pairing is too much.

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10-02-2013, 05:39 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Gorges is a good defenseman playing out of his role. He's be even better if he wouldn't be asked to be on the first pairing. I've seen very little people suggesting he's a first pairing D man. He's a great complimentary top 4 dman. If the Canadiens had a guy like Mitchell or Seidenberg to pair up with Subban, I wouldn't have any problem with Gorges being partnered with Markov or Emelin. Asking Gorges to handle a first pairing is too much.
Agreed.

Honestly can't wait until two seasons from now. Our team should be much better. Lots of dead weight coming off of the books by then, hopefully a new coach, some added size and offense through trades/free agency to supplement Eller Gallagher Galchenyuk, along with a seasoned Tinordi and Beaulieu on the back end, and maybe even a new defenseman through trade/free agency. We're honestly not too far away from being a good team. In 2-3 years I'm hoping that the new era will begin. Too many remnants of the old regime still on this team to think that we've turned the page just yet.

Really looking forward to having a good defensive core, because this one just hasn't been up to it. Too many guys being overused and played out of their roles.

This is only year 2 of the rebuild and I'm not expecting much. Future is bright though.

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10-02-2013, 05:40 PM
  #81
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Wouldn't keep him on the team past this year

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10-02-2013, 05:56 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Gorges is a good defenseman playing out of his role. He's be even better if he wouldn't be asked to be on the first pairing. I've seen very little people suggesting he's a first pairing D man. He's a great complimentary top 4 dman. If the Canadiens had a guy like Mitchell or Seidenberg to pair up with Subban, I wouldn't have any problem with Gorges being partnered with Markov or Emelin. Asking Gorges to handle a first pairing is too much.
I agree. He's a bottom pairing dman who can play 2nd pairing in a pinch. Can play on the PK as well.

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10-02-2013, 06:37 PM
  #83
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I don't see how everyone thinks Diaz is so soft/bad defensively? He's great with his stick and has high hockey iq in all three zones. He doesn't throw hits (it would be stupid for him to go around looking for hits anyways) but doesn't shy away from hits and blocks a lot of shots so I don't get how he's that soft either.
This.

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10-02-2013, 06:41 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Evgeny Oliker View Post
To me its the pairing of Markov and Diaz that just doesnt make sense. Both are not great defensively, although Diaz may actually be better yes.

I think pairings should be more like this;
Subban - Gorges
Diaz - Tinordi
Markov - Bouillon (replace with Emelin when he returns!)
Those pairings make a lot of sense. Only problem is that it would allow Tinordi to play his natural side. Therrien would never allow such a thing.

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10-11-2013, 12:18 PM
  #85
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Diaz is so underrated around here it's becoming pathetic. After each game, we all see the same pattern: "Desharnais, Bouillon and Diaz out!!!". It's the new trend. Is there anybody who watches the game anymore? Diaz is playing great, hasn't put the team in trouble and is able to make a pass to get the puck out of the zone.

People talk like he's expendable. Guess what guys, Tinordi and Beaulieu aren't ready yet to play 20 minutes a game. Diaz isn't going anywhere and rightfully so.

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10-11-2013, 12:23 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by dgeezus View Post
Diaz is so underrated around here it's becoming pathetic. After each game, we all see the same pattern: "Desharnais, Bouillon and Diaz out!!!". It's the new trend. Is there anybody who watches the game anymore? Diaz is playing great, hasn't put the team in trouble and is able to make a pass to get the puck out of the zone.

People talk like he's expendable. Guess what guys, Tinordi and Beaulieu aren't ready yet to play 20 minutes a game. Diaz isn't going anywhere and rightfully so.
I really like Diaz and I agree with you. He does need to round out his game a little and play more aggressively but, I don't think people realize that he's much more of a positive than a negative. Gorges-Diaz should be a pretty sweet pairing, hope the positives from each rub off on each other and create good chemistry.

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10-11-2013, 12:48 PM
  #87
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Diaz plays scared against physical teams, not edmonton thats for sure. We will never win anything with players like this.

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10-11-2013, 01:00 PM
  #88
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Diaz face looks like a snake face don't trust him

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Old
10-11-2013, 01:41 PM
  #89
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I'm sure players love playing against this guy. I'd dump the puck in his corner every single time. He won't take the body. And for a guy that is supposed to be a PMD, I'd be curious to see how many times he misses a pass or has trouble controlling the puck.

I want this guy out as soon as possible.

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10-11-2013, 01:42 PM
  #90
Andy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgeezus View Post
Diaz is so underrated around here it's becoming pathetic. After each game, we all see the same pattern: "Desharnais, Bouillon and Diaz out!!!". It's the new trend. Is there anybody who watches the game anymore? Diaz is playing great, hasn't put the team in trouble and is able to make a pass to get the puck out of the zone.

People talk like he's expendable. Guess what guys, Tinordi and Beaulieu aren't ready yet to play 20 minutes a game. Diaz isn't going anywhere and rightfully so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Draft View Post
I really like Diaz and I agree with you. He does need to round out his game a little and play more aggressively but, I don't think people realize that he's much more of a positive than a negative. Gorges-Diaz should be a pretty sweet pairing, hope the positives from each rub off on each other and create good chemistry.
I agree with both of these. He's been solid and outside of not playing physical, there is very little I have to complain about him so far. He's made no more mistakes than Subban, Boullion, Markov, Tinordi or Gorges so far this season. I still think he's playing outside of his role - he's a really a bottom pairing D - but he's been solid defensively.

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10-11-2013, 04:05 PM
  #91
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Diaz on the 3rd pairing with a physical stay at home partner is not a bad deal. That way, you can mask a lot if his shortcomings.

On a healthy Habs team, he is a 3rd pairing guy with 2nd unit pp time. That being said, I wouldn't shed a tear if he is not given another contract, but you will have to look outside the organization for a replacement as beaulieu or dietz are the most likely candidates to take that role away from him, but they probably won't be ready by then, especially dietz

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10-11-2013, 05:14 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Hackett View Post
Diaz on the 3rd pairing with a physical stay at home partner is not a bad deal. That way, you can mask a lot if his shortcomings.

On a healthy Habs team, he is a 3rd pairing guy with 2nd unit pp time. That being said, I wouldn't shed a tear if he is not given another contract, but you will have to look outside the organization for a replacement as beaulieu or dietz are the most likely candidates to take that role away from him, but they probably won't be ready by then, especially dietz
Beaulieu should be ready next season. I can accept Tinordi and Beaulieu making rookie mistakes with their upside and unique skill sets. I can't accept it from Diaz and Bouillon.

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