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Sat., Oct. 12 2013|Flyers 2 at Red Wings 5

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10-13-2013, 11:23 AM
  #151
Curufinwe
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Simmonds+ for Eberle is what I'd try. Take advantage of their need for toughness and D to get a young sniper to play with G.


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10-13-2013, 11:24 AM
  #152
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McGinn looked like pre-injury McGinn last night, not just a perimeter player. A lot of his poor play in the AHL could have been attributed to having zero confidence after coming up to the NHL, playing well, and then being sent back right away. He may have thought that he no longer had a future withe Flyers considering eight of the top nine spots are locked up long term.

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10-13-2013, 11:25 AM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Is it safe to assume Talbot was still on the 3rd line and still sucked?

I was good with his signing when I thought he was going to be a really good 4th liner and PKer, but if he's gonna be used in a 3rd line role that's terrible. He's just not useful there.
When Lecavalier/Hartnell come back, I'm hoping McGinn or Raffl stay up and bump Talbot to the 4th line. It was understandable why he was on the 3rd line last night, as it was either he or Newbury. Talbot's the least of the Flyers problems, in my opinion.

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10-13-2013, 11:29 AM
  #154
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Simmonds+ for Eberle is what I'd try.
I mentioned something similar to the experts over on the Trade Forums, but no one replied to it. It depends on how big of a plus, but I'd probably do it in a heartbeat. I want Eberle, dammit!

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10-13-2013, 11:32 AM
  #155
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I think a lot of that is hindsight bias. With having never won it recently there's always mistakes to look at that looked correctable, but if you go back there were a good portion of us supporting these so-called obvious mistakes. Sometimes other options were unavailable or seem more appealing after the fact.

Many people thought Lavi deserved another year after a lockout-shortened season, and some of the same people now think that was a mistake. It's hard to see what will and what won't pan out, I wouldn't get down on the organization as a whole just yet. We're still a team that needs players and chemistry to develop; we're still well off our prime.

With trading Richards and Carter we opted for a rebuild, and with so many guys still developing, we'll probably have to wait til Morin and Hagg can come in and influence games before we're real contenders. At the tail end of Streit and Vinny's contracts we might start to get there. Maybe in 3-4 years we get another Lavi-style motivational coach after Chief runs his course and we can start making legitimate runs for the cup.

These things are cyclical and right now we still have an awesome young core, don't let their recent uninspired play make you doubt that. We've seen what they can do. We're still a few pieces away but have guys that may step up into those roles. Mason looks good (albeit small sample) and fits in perfectly with the rest of the core, for instance.

It's still October and I like the changes we're seeing since Chief took over. Now if they would just get the special teams back to where they were..
Except most, if not all, of the examples I highlighted were obvious and egregious mistakes. I'm talking about stuff like the Leighton signing, giving Laviolette three games for what might as well have been no reason whatsoever, delaying an inevitable Holmgren firing, etc.

Most mistakes are just that, mistakes. I'm talking about the stuff that people already know is stupid or pointless at the time of it happening.

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10-13-2013, 11:45 AM
  #156
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i ALWAYS THOUGHT SIMMER PLUS A 2ND FOR YAKUPOV WOULD BE FAIR.

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10-13-2013, 11:54 AM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
Except most, if not all, of the examples I highlighted were obvious and egregious mistakes. I'm talking about stuff like the Leighton signing, giving Laviolette three games for what might as well have been no reason whatsoever, delaying an inevitable Holmgren firing, etc.

Most mistakes are just that, mistakes. I'm talking about the stuff that people already know is stupid or pointless at the time of it happening.
It's really hard to call it hindsight bias when large chunks of the posters in this very forum called those moves mistakes when they went down. It took zero hindsight to recognize the Shelley signing was bad and the Leighton signing a disaster that would demolish any Cup chances.

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10-13-2013, 11:57 AM
  #158
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i ALWAYS THOUGHT SIMMER PLUS A 2ND FOR YAKUPOV WOULD BE FAIR.
Why are you yelling?


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10-13-2013, 11:57 AM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
It's really hard to call it hindsight bias when large chunks of the posters in this very forum called those moves mistakes when they went down. It took zero hindsight to recognize the Shelley signing was bad and the Leighton signing a disaster that would demolish any Cup chances.
Beef gets it.

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10-13-2013, 12:57 PM
  #160
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Making a move on Yak could be interesting, he'd be a perfect fit for Giroux once he develops a little bit more. Edmonton is down on him this season too, although I doubt it affects his value.

So obviously has to start with Coburn, but what else? Talbot won't get it done, Mes we need another d coming back and still won't get it done. Maybe Simmonds or Hartnell if they send back a d to replace Coburn? Getting rid of Voracek would be dumb at this point, Couturier's defense is invaluable to the team, and Schenn is starting to look like he's ready for a big year. It'd be hard to get rid of any of those 3. Maybe Read or Laughton even though they've been playing well.
I would think it starts at Coburn Laughton and a pick.

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10-13-2013, 01:03 PM
  #161
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Over payments for yak. Think seguin trade. He wouldn't demand what people are saying. Just less actually then the seguin trade, he is not as proven.

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10-13-2013, 01:10 PM
  #162
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But really what are the realistic chances that any of this happens? I want a real sniper for Gs wing so much it's ridiculous but the problem is who, for what, and does Homer think we need one. Trading for someone right now would be perfect because it could spark the offense and give them time to turn the season around before it's too late.

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10-13-2013, 01:22 PM
  #163
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Let's get these two 22nd overall picks together.

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10-13-2013, 01:51 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
It's really hard to call it hindsight bias when large chunks of the posters in this very forum called those moves mistakes when they went down. It took zero hindsight to recognize the Shelley signing was bad and the Leighton signing a disaster that would demolish any Cup chances.
I think every trade or move that goes down there will be people falling on either side of it, I'm just saying a lot of the moves that are considered obvious mistakes weren't as obvious when they happened. Leighton was a joke, but he never really cost us anything huge after the SCF (but we didn't have much choice then with what happened to Emery). Bob was mismanaged by Laviolette and then the entire goalie situation got blown up by Snider after we got swept by Boston. There were mistakes, but I think its easy to see where the Flyers were coming from, especially with limited alternatives.

Shelley was stupid but inconsequential, Bob was a travesty but couldn't be helped after Bryz fell flat. People call the Pronger trade bad because we should have known he'd get injured, but that's a tricky line to toe when you're trading for the best defenseman in the game. And he took us to the finals. All I'm saying is there's context to every move that gets forgotten and makes it look worse the farther away it is and after seeing how it played out.

Overall I'm happy that we have management that is willing to go out and try to fix its deficiencies instead of being too afraid to make any moves. I just want to get away from the Bullies mentality, but it seems like so much of our front office is stuck in it..

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10-13-2013, 01:52 PM
  #165
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But I like the idea of a deal around Hartnell+ or Simmonds+ for Eberle/Yak. One of them would be perfect for G's wing and having both Hartnell and Simmonds is redundant.

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10-13-2013, 02:14 PM
  #166
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But I like the idea of a deal around Hartnell+ or Simmonds+ for Eberle/Yak. One of them would be perfect for G's wing and having both Hartnell and Simmonds is redundant.
I'm a big Hartnell fan but I'd be more willing to part with him as compared to Simmer.

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10-13-2013, 02:18 PM
  #167
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I'm a big Hartnell fan but I'd be more willing to part with him as compared to Simmer.
Indeed. What would we need to add to Hartnell to get Eberle/Yak?

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10-13-2013, 02:25 PM
  #168
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Indeed. What would we need to add to Hartnell to get Eberle/Yak?
A lot. Coburn at least I would say.

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10-13-2013, 02:50 PM
  #169
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A lot. Coburn at least I would say.
Or Hartnell + Mez + Talbot instead of Cuburn?

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10-13-2013, 02:55 PM
  #170
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Or Hartnell + Mez + Talbot instead of Cuburn?
Edmonton isn't close enough to competing for that to make sense for them, in my option.

Simmonds + Coburn for Eberle + defensive prospect is probably about as good as we could hope for. I'm not sold, but I understand the appeal.

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10-13-2013, 02:58 PM
  #171
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Edmonton isn't close enough to competing for that to make sense for them, in my option.

Simmonds + Coburn for Eberle + defensive prospect is probably about as good as we could hope for. I'm not sold, but I understand the appeal.
I don't know if I would do that one, I'd certainly like to try to keep Simmonds over Hartnell if at all possible. I'd rather add Hartnell + a pick to keep Simmonds.

But what the hell do I know? I'm not a GM. I just really want sniper on Gs wing so badly.

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10-13-2013, 03:02 PM
  #172
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I don't know if I would do that one, I'd certainly like to try to keep Simmonds over Hartnell if at all possible. I'd rather add Hartnell + a pick to keep Simmonds.

But what the hell do I know? I'm not a GM. I just really want sniper on Gs wing so badly.
I just don't think you can get a player like Eberle (or even Yakupov) for a package that has Hartnell as its best piece. In fact, I think its pretty brutal for Edmonton.

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10-13-2013, 03:04 PM
  #173
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What's wrong with the offense? Simple, you miss 100% of the shots you don't take. We have been playing hot potato with the puck for a long time. I think Berube is part of the problem not part of the solution. He has been running the power play for a while and during that tenure we have taken less and less shots. Scoring is not rocket science, when you have a shot you take it. We play Pass, Pass, Pass until it gets tipped away or we miss the pass.

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10-13-2013, 03:11 PM
  #174
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Or Hartnell + Mez + Talbot instead of Cuburn?


I don't think so. Mez is an overpaid 3rd pairing d-man and a pending UFA at that. Talbot is a 4th liner and pk specialist. Compare that to a minute eater top 4 like Coburn only getting .5 mil more then Mez and is signed for another two yrs.

Harebell, Coburn plus to even get them thinking about it IMO. I really don't think it's worth it though.

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10-13-2013, 03:12 PM
  #175
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What's wrong with the offense? Simple, you miss 100% of the shots you don't take. We have been playing hot potato with the puck for a long time. I think Berube is part of the problem not part of the solution. He has been running the power play for a while and during that tenure we have taken less and less shots. Scoring is not rocket science, when you have a shot you take it. We play Pass, Pass, Pass until it gets tipped away or we miss the pass.


Chief ran the pk not the pp. Since he's taken over all the team has done is improve in all areas. It's a process, we just need to be patient. This a full length season, there's still time to turn things around. Considering they have already started I think I'll reserve judgment for the time being.

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