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Holmgren Deserves to get Fired

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Old
10-09-2013, 03:46 PM
  #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood Couturier View Post
Take this with a grain of salt but I was talking to someone who knows a couple of the higher ups in the Flyers organization and knows all of the announcers but Laviolette was fired on the team plane after the Carolina game and Holmgren was supposed to be fired Monday morning and for whatever reason he was not. With that said, Holmgren is on an extremely short leash.

(I know these types of posts are frowned upon so mods can feel free to delete it)
I am slightly scared to see what happens if Homer is sent packing. I wonder if Hextall would make big changes or try to work with what he has and tinker the lineup in different ways?

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10-09-2013, 03:52 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Hollywood Couturier View Post
With that said, Holmgren is on an extremely short leash.
I think it will be pretty cut and dry: playoffs or fired.

I am not so sure Hextall or whoever will be able to do much better than Holmgren with Snider still here. This team needs difference makers and they can only be had in the draft.

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10-09-2013, 03:55 PM
  #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
I am slightly scared to see what happens if Homer is sent packing. I wonder if Hextall would make big changes or try to work with what he has and tinker the lineup in different ways?
I wouldn't worry too much. With this team, what kind of big changes could there be? Giroux isn't going anywhere. That's really the only guy that would be considered a "big change" to me. I know everyone loves the Schenns and Couturier and Read, but if one of those guys go I don't think I would consider it a "big change" for the team. Now, if multiple guys get dealt that is a different story, but I can't see that happening. Cough...jynx...cough.

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10-09-2013, 04:12 PM
  #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood Couturier View Post
Take this with a grain of salt but I was talking to someone who knows a couple of the higher ups in the Flyers organization and knows all of the announcers but Laviolette was fired on the team plane after the Carolina game and Holmgren was supposed to be fired Monday morning and for whatever reason he was not. With that said, Holmgren is on an extremely short leash.

(I know these types of posts are frowned upon so mods can feel free to delete it)
Jeesh..that was a dangerous way of firing a coach if true. I hope the pilot's cabin was locked! What did they do put him in the back seats next to the bathroom or lock him in there with a clogged toilet?

But seriously sounds kind of odd...I would like to know why Holmgren survived? To me the organization has it planned out with his escape plan that he would "step down" and Hexy would take over...

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10-10-2013, 02:38 AM
  #155
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I think Homer will step down by the end of the season. Maybe there is already an agreement in place.

Firing both headcoach and GM the same night would have left the organization in turmoil. Now there is still a chance things settle down and Berube gets them back on track...

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10-10-2013, 08:46 AM
  #156
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Originally Posted by dats81 View Post
I think Homer will step down by the end of the season. Maybe there is already an agreement in place.
Holmgren has been quoted before as saying the thing he loves most is scouting and that with being a GM, he couldn't do that as much as he would like. With last years lockout, he would have had a ton more time to do it before the season started and it could of rekindled his love for it. He might have hired Hextall knowing full well he didn't want to be GM much longer, success or not.

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10-10-2013, 08:51 AM
  #157
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I doubt there was any plan to fire Homer the same day as Lavy. Firing a GM three games into a season makes no sense. A new GM isn't going to turn the team around three games into the season. Maybe closer to the deadline if things don't change, or at the end of the season, but throwing Hextall in there right now isn't going to do anything. If they were going to fire Homer it would have happened after last season. My guess is Homer makes a trade sometime around the holidays of Thanksgiving and Christmas at the latest. If it doesn't make an impact, he's gone right around the Olympics. If it does make an impact, his job is safe until the end of the year, when things will be reevaluated based on where the team winds up.

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10-10-2013, 08:58 AM
  #158
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Originally Posted by OccupySouthBroadSt View Post
Jeesh..that was a dangerous way of firing a coach if true. I hope the pilot's cabin was locked! What did they do put him in the back seats next to the bathroom or lock him in there with a clogged toilet?

But seriously sounds kind of odd...I would like to know why Holmgren survived? To me the organization has it planned out with his escape plan that he would "step down" and Hexy would take over...
"Okay, Lavi, I have to come clean: that isn't just any old knapsack, it's a parachute. We're letting you go." [PUSH]


EDIT: "Next on Flight Plan ..."


Last edited by BernieParent: 10-10-2013 at 10:09 AM.
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Old
10-15-2013, 09:39 PM
  #159
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Tick Tock Tick Tock Tick Tock....

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10-15-2013, 09:43 PM
  #160
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I hope they lose to Pittsburgh by 15 so this clown finally gets fired.

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10-15-2013, 09:48 PM
  #161
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I hope whomever succeeds Homer doesn't make panic trades right out from the gates

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10-15-2013, 09:57 PM
  #162
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I'm confused.

How would firing Homer solve anything?

On paper, the team is extremely deep offensively, has a core set of veteran D-men and brought in a solid young G who has played extremely well.

How is it his fault our core set of offensive players have been spinning their tires since the 2012 post season?

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10-15-2013, 10:06 PM
  #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hckyplayer8 View Post
I'm confused.
A team that is ill-assembled by the GM and might miss the playoffs two years in a row confuses you? Clearly...

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10-15-2013, 10:13 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by OccupySouthBroadSt View Post
A team that is ill-assembled by the GM and might miss the playoffs two years in a row confuses you? Clearly...
I suppose you looked at the current roster and made the bold prediction that McGinn would be the team leader in goals through 7 games with three?

I bet you also looked at the roster and predicted such an abysmal start?

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10-15-2013, 10:27 PM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hckyplayer8 View Post
I'm confused.

How would firing Homer solve anything?

On paper, the team is extremely deep offensively, has a core set of veteran D-men and brought in a solid young G who has played extremely well.

How is it his fault our core set of offensive players have been spinning their tires since the 2012 post season?
that is the biggest misconception about the Flyers. it was Lavy's system that opened things up and helped them score a few more goals. this team is not deep offensively.

Giroux. ok. highly skilled forward. then what? Schenn's ok, but he's never proven anything at the NHL level. Hartnell and Simmonds are grinders. they are not highly skilled forwards. Voracek played great over a half season, but like Schenn he has to prove he can do it over 82 games. Read kinda sucks and is invisible most nights. Couts? he's not offensive. Giroux (and i guess Vinny) are the only highly skilled forwards on this team.

Homer and everyone else VASTLY overrated the forwards. they aren't that good. and the D is a total mess. two aging vets in Timomen and Streit that need to retire. Mez, Gros and Coburn flatout suck. Luke Schenn is the only one who's good. and even then he's not a #1, just a solid top 4 guy.

what a mess this team is right now. to think how close they were in 2010. Homer has completely screwed it all up. time to get Hexy in here and see what he can do. but fixing this mess won't be easy.

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10-15-2013, 10:28 PM
  #166
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Squabbling aside...GM replacement is a long term impact.

You won't see changes from a GM replacement take place till the new GM brings in personnel and players they see fit to.

We have a extremely promising roster who has shown improvement under the new coach.

Could the coaching change have been done sooner? Of course, but after several previous impressive showings, I'm sure Homer didn't want to short change Lavi.

If you are looking at the current 1-6 record and are screaming for a GM change, you aren't looking for immediate short term improvements; you just have an ax to grind with Homer.

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10-15-2013, 10:38 PM
  #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hckyplayer8 View Post
I suppose you looked at the current roster and made the bold prediction that McGinn would be the team leader in goals through 7 games with three?

I bet you also looked at the roster and predicted such an abysmal start?
I've been criticizing Holmgren since the lockout offseason. I have been on record saying I was going to judge him going forward from the Carter and Richards trades which I thought he did well. He has been pretty crappy since those trades and hasn't done his part to take the next step. I said keeping Lavi this year was going to be a big mistake and sure enough it was. I didn't think Streit, Lecavalier nor Emery was going to all of the sudden make this team a contender..all he did was make lateral moves and fixed some of his own mistakes by buying his way out of previous ones (Bryz was the biggest). A few seasons ago Holmgren said that the Flyers had "overrated" their team....I felt they were doing the same this offseason especially when Snider said his optimism was at "another level." I knew we were in trouble when he said that....

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10-15-2013, 10:47 PM
  #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bauer View Post
that is the biggest misconception about the Flyers. it was Lavy's system that opened things up and helped them score a few more goals. this team is not deep offensively.

Giroux. ok. highly skilled forward. then what? Schenn's ok, but he's never proven anything at the NHL level. Hartnell and Simmonds are grinders. they are not highly skilled forwards. Voracek played great over a half season, but like Schenn he has to prove he can do it over 82 games. Read kinda sucks and is invisible most nights. Couts? he's not offensive. Giroux (and i guess Vinny) are the only highly skilled forwards on this team.

Homer and everyone else VASTLY overrated the forwards. they aren't that good. and the D is a total mess. two aging vets in Timomen and Streit that need to retire. Mez, Gros and Coburn flatout suck. Luke Schenn is the only one who's good. and even then he's not a #1, just a solid top 4 guy.

what a mess this team is right now. to think how close they were in 2010. Homer has completely screwed it all up. time to get Hexy in here and see what he can do. but fixing this mess won't be easy.
Harts has been a consistent +20 goal +40 pt player through his entire career.
Jake was a proven +40 pt player pre Lavi.
Vinny another proven high pts producer.

Major pissing in the cornflakes of our D. They are not nearly as bad as you are saying.

I'll give you Mez and Coburn but Grossman and Schenn both finished in the top 40 for blocked shots last year. Grossman finished the season with a -1 and with his stay at home mentality, defensive breakdowns got better with his addition.

I'll def. agree we still lack the #1 D.

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10-15-2013, 11:28 PM
  #169
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To fire the GM after you just fired the coach looks even worse than firing the coach after less than a week of the season

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10-15-2013, 11:43 PM
  #170
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
To fire the GM after you just fired the coach looks even worse than firing the coach after less than a week of the season
He's never going to get fired anyway..even if he should. He will "step down" it's almost a foregone conclusion...

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10-15-2013, 11:47 PM
  #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bauer View Post
that is the biggest misconception about the Flyers. it was Lavy's system that opened things up and helped them score a few more goals. this team is not deep offensively.

Giroux. ok. highly skilled forward. then what? Schenn's ok, but he's never proven anything at the NHL level. Hartnell and Simmonds are grinders. they are not highly skilled forwards. Voracek played great over a half season, but like Schenn he has to prove he can do it over 82 games. Read kinda sucks and is invisible most nights. Couts? he's not offensive. Giroux (and i guess Vinny) are the only highly skilled forwards on this team.

Homer and everyone else VASTLY overrated the forwards. they aren't that good. and the D is a total mess. two aging vets in Timomen and Streit that need to retire. Mez, Gros and Coburn flatout suck. Luke Schenn is the only one who's good. and even then he's not a #1, just a solid top 4 guy.

what a mess this team is right now. to think how close they were in 2010. Homer has completely screwed it all up. time to get Hexy in here and see what he can do. but fixing this mess won't be easy.
::nods head vigorously:: couldn't agree more

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10-16-2013, 12:54 AM
  #172
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
To fire the GM after you just fired the coach looks even worse than firing the coach after less than a week of the season
Not that I necessarily think Holmgren should be fired now anyway, but... who cares how it looks?

This is a franchise that prides itself on being competitive every year. We're now looking at two straight years of missing the playoffs, if something doesn't change soon.

If the organization thinks that Holmgren deserves to be relieved of duty because of the current direction of the team, then he should be fired immediately, not at some arbitrary point in the future when it might 'look better'.

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10-16-2013, 01:12 AM
  #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hckyplayer8 View Post
I'm confused.

How would firing Homer solve anything?

On paper, the team is extremely deep offensively, has a core set of veteran D-men and brought in a solid young G who has played extremely well.

How is it his fault our core set of offensive players have been spinning their tires since the 2012 post season?
so he can only receive credit for building this team if things go well? but when things go poorly he gets a free pass?
maybe some of these guys arent as good as people think. firing Lavy sure as changed things. we are 2 fluke goals away from being 0-7.

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10-16-2013, 07:50 AM
  #174
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Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
so he can only receive credit for building this team if things go well? but when things go poorly he gets a free pass?
maybe some of these guys arent as good as people think. firing Lavy sure as changed things. we are 2 fluke goals away from being 0-7.
I never said that. He gets his fair share of bad credit with the Bob trade and his annual over payments to trash like Shelley and Rosehill.

People pissed and moaned that Lavi was still the coach with each passing L.

They get their wish and when things don't magically change overnight they go looking for the next person to run out of town.

I'm just looking for anybodies reasoning how letting Homer go improves us immediately in the short term.

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10-16-2013, 08:48 AM
  #175
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Originally Posted by hckyplayer8 View Post
I never said that. He gets his fair share of bad credit with the Bob trade and his annual over payments to trash like Shelley and Rosehill.

People pissed and moaned that Lavi was still the coach with each passing L.

They get their wish and when things don't magically change overnight they go looking for the next person to run out of town.

I'm just looking for anybodies reasoning how letting Homer go improves us immediately in the short term.
It doesn't necessarily improve us immediately, but it's kinda one of those stitch-in-time things, not that the Flyers would have any idea what that means.

Let's take the Lavy situation. With him getting fired 3 games into the season, it's pretty obvious that he should have been fired after last season. If you're willing to fire him after three games, you didn't have faith in him in the first place. The longer the Flyers waited to fire him, the worse it was going to get. I think the same thing goes for Holmgren.

Although if Snider's the one driving the train, it's moot anyway.

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