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Jacob Markstrom - Not Impressed.

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10-16-2013, 01:37 AM
  #1
flapanthersfan
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Jacob Markstrom - Not Impressed.

i've had enough time to watch Markstrom now with the time he has gotten last year and the first few games this year and feel comfortable enough to say that i'm not at all impressed with his game.

people hate me on here for being critical of our youngsters (namely, Gudbranson) but keep in mind I also said Barkov's vision is better than Huberdeau's, so I'm willing to give credit where credit is due.

But with Jacob, his game is just not passing the eye test at all right now. He reminds me of Anders Lindback way too much (who I also called would be a bust for Tampa, btw).

They both rely way too much on their size. their footwork is sloppy, their angles are terrible and both play way too deep in their net. The only goalie who has been successful in this era playing like that is Lundqvist, and he just seems to be a freak with ridiculous natural ability and reflexes.

Markstrom continues to get beat from poor angles and random shots as a result of all this. needless to say, the Hornqvist goal today was awful, but the shot that hit all three posts minutes after that was just as bad and isn't the type of shot that should be beating him, and it seems to constantly.

He makes some impressive saves, but so does Lindback. two great saves doesn't make up for two softies. he's not consistent at all. I understand our defense is abysmal right now, but there's just way too much lacking from his game at the moment.

Like I've said with Gudbranson, I'm not writing him off as a prospect. But his game is NOT EVEN CLOSE To where it needs to be to be a legitimate starter in this league....and I suspect that's why we went out and signed Thomas when we finally had the finances to do so. our management likely doesn't either.



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10-16-2013, 01:49 AM
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JonathanHuberdoh
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Posted this in the other thread but I guess it's more relevant in this thread:

Now I am always a big defender of Markstrom. We really can't blame him for losing these games, but tonight he did not help us at all.

This team has always been the kind of team that needs big saves to win games. Our game in Dallas was a great win but remember Thomas made a lot of big saves.

Although Markstrom hasn't been awful, that 4th goal was pretty weak and we haven't had any big stops from Marky at all this season. His one victory he wasn't required to stand on his head because we scored 6.

Again, I am not blaming Marky for the losses because our defensive lapses are inexcusable, but it would be nice to see some big saves from him to keep us in games.

Our offense and defense are **** poor right now, but this team has ALWAYS had great goaltending, no matter how bad we've been. Last season and the start of this season, it's not the case, and it's resulting in more losses at a much wider margin.

To reiterate, I am NOT blaming Markstrom. This team lost every single one of those games, not Markstrom. But as you mentioned the 4th goal, it would've been nice for him to stop that. Tonight may have ended in a completely different way. I also don't really care if he makes a couple of big saves in the 3rd because if he's giving up goals like that, those saves end up being irrelevant anyways.

Do you guys remember that game he had in Montreal two seasons ago? We were outshot something like 41-25 and Markstrom stopped all but 1 and we won 2-1. He was beyond dominant, almost god-like in that game. That is the Markstrom I know we can have, he's just not there right now.

The guy has a lot of talent that you're not giving him credit for. You're putting too much on his size but he has incredible reflexes. His mistakes are things that can be taught and fixed. His angles are off (hence the bad angle goals), and his rebound control is pretty bad as well. He needs to work on holding onto the puck, as well as squeezing his glove to ensure the puck stays in there. Again, these are things that can be improved through coaching and proper practice.

Also remember, the kid is an extremely emotional player. You can see it in his body language, and right now his confidence is pretty low. It's clear how much he blames himself on each goal he gives up. It's tough on the kid and he's going through some growing pains, just like the team is.

It's still too early to give up on him.

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10-16-2013, 03:26 AM
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Wanted him to stay another full year in San Antonio with Thomas-Clemmer as the tandem at the start of the season, but obviously with the Thomas injury, Marky needs to stay up for now. Not sure if we need a different goaltending coach up here, Tallas isn't helping. One thing for sure, we didn't finish dead last a year ago simply because of injuries, the goaltending was a big reason IMO.

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10-16-2013, 06:03 AM
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He sits too far back and seems to fight the puck. That gw last night was awful, but that's what happens when you hug the corners and don't cut off the angles.

Still, there are plenty if breakdowns in front of him, so he's likely always of the mad scramble and when it's gonna come again. Dunno if it's a coaching thing, he just is what he is, or a result of the play in front, but he has a lot of development left. Still, how would he be in Detroit? We have to improve this D.

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10-16-2013, 06:26 AM
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The defense is doing him No favors.
However, he is not playing like a NHL goaltender. Don't know if keeping him up with the Panthers will help or hurt him

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10-16-2013, 06:38 AM
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He probably lacks confidence in his defenders, so he's relying more on his tendency to play deep in net instead of challenging outside of the crease.

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10-16-2013, 07:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ratmanfu View Post
He probably lacks confidence in his defenders, so he's relying more on his tendency to play deep in net instead of challenging outside of the crease.
We have a winner. This team is so bad that Markstrom has to continually overthink his game which is probably why he makes miraculous saves followed up by a softie. He likely has to always be anticipating a pass because he knows his defense will both give up the pass and let them walk right in.

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10-16-2013, 07:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ratmanfu View Post
He probably lacks confidence in his defenders, so he's relying more on his tendency to play deep in net instead of challenging outside of the crease.
Confidence, IMO, is the most important aspect when challenging outside the crease. If you lack confidence, albeit in yourself or your teammates in front of you, you arent going to challenge the opposition as frequently, and you are going to go more into a defensive mode. Couldnt we all take life as an example to that, meaning how we are more protective when we are less confident, and vice versa? Once we see this team's defense improve, meaning the forwards as well ,we will see a better Markstrom.

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10-16-2013, 07:15 AM
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Funny, I was going to make an identical thread but aimed at Kulikov. What exactly was he doing on the goal in question, anyway?

I admit, I haven't watched a lot of FLA games, but from what I've seen Kulikov has been absolutely awful in his own end.

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10-16-2013, 07:41 AM
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markstrom needs more development. he needs to hold on to the puck when he gloves it instead of having it bounce out of his glove and trickle in the crease, he's been inconsistent, poor angles and deep in net. i don't believe he's ready to be a starting goalie on any nhl team at this point in his development.
i'm still not super impressed with kulikov, but he is improving a bit.

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10-16-2013, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by RampageNate View Post
Funny, I was going to make an identical thread but aimed at Kulikov. What exactly was he doing on the goal in question, anyway?

I admit, I haven't watched a lot of FLA games, but from what I've seen Kulikov has been absolutely awful in his own end.
Yeah, haven't been impressed with him, but I haven't been for a couple years.

So far as Markstrom, Ratmanfu has it right. Hard to really play the game when you're trying to compensate for the defensive lapses.

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10-16-2013, 07:51 AM
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w/r/t Markstrom, I agree he's not ready to be a full time starter in the NHL. He is, however, ready and able to be a sufficient backup at the NHL level. He has very little left to prove at the AHL level and needs to see NHL shots, IMO.

He's been very good to dominant in the AHL while backstopping average (to bad) teams. He shouldn't be getting full time starts in Florida, but he should be Thomas' backup and just continue to learn the speed of the NHL game.

I know Jacob's personality very well and sending him to San Antonio would be a huge mistake, IMO.

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10-16-2013, 08:17 AM
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Originally Posted by RampageNate View Post
Funny, I was going to make an identical thread but aimed at Kulikov. What exactly was he doing on the goal in question, anyway?

I admit, I haven't watched a lot of FLA games, but from what I've seen Kulikov has been absolutely awful in his own end.
I have no idea. I actually thought he was injured because he didn't even move.

Kulikov has shown stretched of consistency at a high enough level. He can move the puck well, plays good defense, but has trouble making decisions with the puck in his own zone when he tries to be patient with puck and make a good play instead of just getting the puck out. Last year he was our best d-man.

I do think our suspect goaltending and weak/stupid play from our forwards really puts pressure on all of our dmen

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10-16-2013, 08:21 AM
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Markstrom has to work on his angles and his glove. He is constantly dropping the puck. It causes chaos and gives the opposing team undeserved second chances.

Our team needs good consistent goaltending, period. It doesn't matter if the team in front of him is playing poorly, we can't have any goalie let in soft goals on a regular basis.

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10-16-2013, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
Markstrom has to work on his angles and his glove. He is constantly dropping the puck. It causes chaos and gives the opposing team undeserved second chances.

Our team needs good consistent goaltending, period. It doesn't matter if the team in front of him is playing poorly, we can't have any goalie let in soft goals on a regular basis.
I agree...he does need to work on a few things...one being rebound placement and the other being high glove side (I find he drops to butterfly too soon and too often).

I think he's still better than Clemm at this point. Whether or not he's better than Thomas is still TBD.

Thomas didn't look great either, in my opinion and getting him back still won't solve the defensive deficiencies.

Goals 2 through 4 were 100% preventable last night. Kulikov with yet another giveaway then didn't pick up Fisher back door. The third goal was partially Markstrom's fault, but I still don't understand how nobody picked up the guy going to the net on the rebound (Marky made the first save, after all). Blame the 4th goal on Markstrom all you want, but Kulikov was caught too high and Weaver completely backed off leaving a wide open lane for Hornqvist. Sure, it's a weak goal, but he shouldn't even have been able to get a shot off from there in the first place.

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10-16-2013, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
Markstrom has to work on his angles and his glove. He is constantly dropping the puck. It causes chaos and gives the opposing team undeserved second chances.

Our team needs good consistent goaltending, period. It doesn't matter if the team in front of him is playing poorly, we can't have any goalie let in soft goals on a regular basis.
How does it not matter? He's still a young goalie and he has constant breakdowns in front of him. He lacks confidence that the puck will be cleared and it forces him to think he has to sit further back in the crease.

Massive domino affect.

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10-16-2013, 08:57 AM
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I've never been impressed with Markstrom. He had like two ridiculous games a few years ago where he stood on his head but other than that, nothing special. Let's be honest, every backup goaltender we've ever had has stood on his head and stolen a game once or twice, it's being consistently on your game that makes you a good goaltender. I also don't buy the bad defense excuse. We had some pretty putrid teams when Luongo was here but you could easily look at him and recognize how amazing he was playing despite the awful team in front of him. Blaming the defense is a losers excuse. It's also pretty obvious what management thinks of him when a guy who hasn't played in a whole year and skips most of preseason instantly becomes #1 on the depth chart.

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10-16-2013, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by flapanthersfan View Post
They both rely way too much on their size. their footwork is sloppy, their angles are terrible and both play way too deep in their net.

Markstrom continues to get beat from poor angles and random shots as a result of all this.
Agree with these pretty much. Seems like Markstrom gets beat up high quite a bit. Down low he can make great stops mostly because of his size but when itīs a high shot that doesnīt hit him seems like itīs hard for him to recover. He just drops down into butterfly and if he doesnīt have the angle itīs game over. But like said the 4th goal was just bad and a horrible read from him, never shouldīve gone in.


Play him as a backup for two years behind TT, probably the best thing that could happen to him now.

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10-16-2013, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Gaebriel View Post
I've never been impressed with Markstrom. He had like two ridiculous games a few years ago where he stood on his head but other than that, nothing special. Let's be honest, every backup goaltender we've ever had has stood on his head and stolen a game once or twice, it's being consistently on your game that makes you a good goaltender. I also don't buy the bad defense excuse. We had some pretty putrid teams when Luongo was here but you could easily look at him and recognize how amazing he was playing despite the awful team in front of him. Blaming the defense is a losers excuse. It's also pretty obvious what management thinks of him when a guy who hasn't played in a whole year and skips most of preseason instantly becomes #1 on the depth chart.
Louie scrambled plenty and had experience. I'm not a Luongo fan, but he did better behind a better defense.

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10-16-2013, 09:08 AM
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when he looked his best was two years ago... We were alot better that year in every area of the game. I like what we have in Markstrom. Hes not ready to steal games all the time like a thomas or a more experienced goalie can...
It also may just come down to his style of play. Markstrom relies more on his d to clear pucks out.. you can argue rebound control etc etc... but every goalie is different and defense needs to adjust to the goalies strengths too.

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10-16-2013, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by FinlandPanther View Post
We have a winner. This team is so bad that Markstrom has to continually overthink his game which is probably why he makes miraculous saves followed up by a softie. He likely has to always be anticipating a pass because he knows his defense will both give up the pass and let them walk right in.
This is an accurate assesment. On that fourth goal Markstrom was cheating to stop the pass, which why Hornqvist scored.

I don't understand why the blue line is garbage right now. No chemistry / comfort level on any of the pairings.

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10-16-2013, 09:24 AM
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How does it not matter? He's still a young goalie and he has constant breakdowns in front of him. He lacks confidence that the puck will be cleared and it forces him to think he has to sit further back in the crease.

Massive domino affect.
Huh? It applies to any goalie. We can't let in soft goals. I don't think you need an explanation why that's a requirement.

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10-16-2013, 09:30 AM
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Huh? It applies to any goalie. We can't let in soft goals. I don't think you need an explanation why that's a requirement.
No, we clearly can't allow soft goals, but the comment on the defense not mattering was what I was refuting. It all plays together.

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10-16-2013, 09:47 AM
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No, we clearly can't allow soft goals, but the comment on the defense not mattering was what I was refuting. It all plays together.

The very definition of a weak goal is that the defense doesnīt matter- itīs a weak goal by the goalie.

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