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Old
10-20-2013, 10:10 AM
  #1
SingnBluesOnBroadway
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The fish rots from the head down...

All talk of trades or replacing the coach is simply re-shuffling the deck chair on the Titanic. As long as this current front office remains in power the team will never move beyond what it has been ó a middle of the road team that might win a round of two in the playoffs. Any thought that this team is a Cup contender is delusional.

The GM's lazy, quick fix, smartest-guy-in-the-room mentality has trickled down to every part of this organization ó and that includes the purported draft master Gordie Clarke and the supposed personnel wizard Jeff Gorton. The inability, or unwillingness, to look beyond the season thatís right in front of them is what keeps this the franchise in a constant revolving door of mediocrity.

But the laziness of which I speak is no more evident than in the fact that the team lacks an identity and organizational philosophy. Because creating an identity and team philosophy takes time and hard work. Thatís why it seems the GM, and the AGM are basically throwing darts while blindfolded when it comes to signing players or making trades. And that results in making moves in a vacuum with no forethought whatsoever (see the madness of the Nash trade, Gaborik trade, Torts firing timeline as a good example of that short-sightedness).

So what is this team? Or what do the powers that be want it to be?

If they are a gritty in your face team, then thereís no place for Taylor Pyatt, Mats Zuccarello, Derick Brassard or Benoit Pouliot on this roster.

If they are a puck control, up-tempo, push the pace team, they simply lack the personnel and talent to play that way ó and a coach (or coaching change) canít change that

The lack of an organizational philosophy is also the reason for the stunning failure in free agency. Sure, the high profile signing bustsóDrury, Gomez, Redden, Kasparaitis, Holik and possibly Richardsóare well documented (and donít tell me the Gomez contract was OK because they got McDonagh, that was never the intent when Gomez was signe). But consider this: since the first lockout, this GM has spent $32.275M on bottom six, place-holder, gap-fillers in Arron Asham, Mike Rupp, Donald Brashear, Derek Boogaard, Benoit Pouliot, Taylor Pyatt, Dominic Moore, Ruslan Fedotenko, Jason Ward, Ville Nieminen, Aaron Voros and Patrick Rissmiller. How is it that in 13 years, the team has not been able to develop players who are better than the names listed above?

Maybe it will be that history will show that the greatest achievement of the John Tortorella years was the ability of the coach to serve as a buffer between the sloppy, lazy mentality of the front office and his players. He was able to defuse Glen Sather's blustering gobbledegook of "Our goal is to win the Stanley Cup" with something that the players could control "We're going to outwork you every shift." Now that heís gone, things seem to have reverted back to the way things were ó especially without Ryan Callahan. Maybe the biggest message that firing Torts sent was this: the inmates now run the asylum.

The fact is every part of this team deserves blame. But the true failure is with the directionless decision makers at the top Itís been 13 years and they have failed thoroughly to build an identity, philosophy or even long-term strategy. Just let that sink in for a second, itís taken 13 years to get this team toÖ.here.

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10-20-2013, 10:30 AM
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Pretty much.

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10-20-2013, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post

Maybe it will be that history will show that the greatest achievement of the John Tortorella years was the ability of the coach to serve as a buffer between the sloppy, lazy mentality of the front office and his players. He was able to defuse Glen Sather's blustering gobbledegook of "Our goal is to win the Stanley Cup" with something that the players could control "We're going to outwork you every shift." Now that heís gone, things seem to have reverted back to the way things were ó especially without Ryan Callahan. Maybe the biggest message that firing Torts sent was this: the inmates now run the asylum.
Agreed with this.

Too bad we know nothing is going to happen. Sather will be gone when he wants to retire or is dead. That is just the ****** reality we have to deal with.

People want a rebuild. I don't know if that is the answer, but this organization needs an identity and needs to stick with it for the Rangers to be successful.

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10-20-2013, 10:41 AM
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Agreed with this.

Too bad we know nothing is going to happen. Sather will be gone when he wants to retire or is dead. That is just the ****** reality we have to deal with.

People want a rebuild. I don't know if that is the answer, but this organization needs an identity and needs to stick with it for the Rangers to be successful.
i wont be shocked if he died while still GM.. i doubt he retires. he has a good thing here. lifetime contract.. can the Rangers buy out Glen Sather

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10-20-2013, 10:41 AM
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Look at drafting decisions. When you have a number 10 pick, you go with the best player available. Not someone who might pan out to an NHL dman.

Another part of the failure of the current front office. Bandaids year after year.

Well said.

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10-20-2013, 10:43 AM
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Good to have you back, SBOB. Miss your insightful posts now that you're "retired."

That being said, you've hit the nail on the head regarding this team's identity, or lack thereof. As someone who was in the fire Torts camp after the way in which he railroaded Marian Gaborik out of town, I will say, while the timing was spontaneous, the move was right.

Addressing your next point regarding the team's identity, I agree. They are attempting to transition from a defense-oriented shot blocking team, to a attacking, speed-based, transitional offense. While many of us (myself included) expected the team to be fine, it's obvious (even with injuries), that this team lacks the player personnel to conduct such a system. The breakout is a mess, the passing hasn't been crisp for the most part, and they desperately need speed infused into the top 9. While I'm not writing the season off after 7 road games played, there are causes for concern here. Lundqvist has seemingly caught this team's plague as well. They lack the players to run this system. Too many tweeners.

I think Glen Sather has, for the most part, done a better job since lockout Pt I, but anything was better than the throw **** against the wall and see what sticks philosophy they ran from 2000-04.

They seemingly have gotten back into that mindset. As for Rick Nash, always remember that he was PLAN B. The Rangers were hesitant to cave to Howson's demands, and if you recall, Shea Weber was given the grand tour by James Dolan. While the team is deep defensively, they sorely lack that true #1, especially with a guy like Weber being the rare RHD with the cannon shot.

You hit the nail on the head with this one.

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10-20-2013, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by qwertyaas View Post
Look at drafting decisions. When you have a number 10 pick, you go with the best player available. Not someone who might pan out to an NHL dman.

Another part of the failure of the current front office. Bandaids year after year.

Well said.
This is the microcosm. The small picture. Even if it turns out to be a huge mistake going forward. It's one pick.

That's the problem, everyone wants to pick on the little things. Picking McIlrath, the Nash trade, firing Torts, hiring AV, letting Prust walk, not playing the "kids." So on and so forth. What do you get when you add all of these things up? Poor management decisions and no long-term plan for what this team is supposed to look, or play like.

Dolan and Glenny boy have a one track mind that tunnel visions so hard they cannot see the fallout going on around them. Win the Stanley Cup, make the playoffs. Anything can happen! That's what they are focused on. Here and now, not 5 years from now. They got lucky with Lundqvist and have been riding that money train for 8 years, otherwise who knows how things would have played out. Even if he has his worst year of his career this year, they should give him 10 million over 10 years because those two clowns owe everything they've made to that guy.

Unfortunately even if we all today, right now, decided that the problem is at the top of the food chain, there's literally nothing we can do about it. This is life as a Rangers fan until Glen is gone, and maybe worse yet until Dolan gives ownership of this team to someone who cares about hockey and not money.

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10-20-2013, 11:09 AM
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Well that's the point exactly. It's not one decision but all these decisions that bring us to where we are today.

We aren't a Tarasenko away. But add that to poor signings, inability to build to your team identity, or even create one, and staying on a broken course and here we are

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10-20-2013, 11:12 AM
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Jeff Gorton has been in his current role since July 2011. Glen Sather is the boss. It doesn't matter if he has delegated the day to day ops to Gorton or before him Don Maloney. In 2006,Bobby Clarke resigned as Flyers boss. His AGM Paul Holmgren replaced him. He had different views than Clarke. Holmgren's teams made the ECF in 2008 and the Cup finals in 2010. Holmgren made a million trades. He was his own man. Jerry Reese is his own man too. I'm sure he had different views than Ernie but Ernie was the boss. Reese has fielded the worst Giants team since the 1970s. No running backs. No offensive line. No tight end. No pass rushers. Linebackers aren't important in the Giants scheme so Reese gets a pass too there. Reese doesn't talk to the media. He is taking a page from the Sather playbook. No accountability.

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I personally believe it would be more interesting to hear from someone qualified to explain the root of the problems the Giants are having and to offer substantive thoughts on potential solutions. I think Giants GM Jerry Reese fits that profile, and I think it would be good for him to speak publicly this week. Not today, necessarily, with the organization supporting coach Tom Coughlin on the day of his brother's funeral. Some things -- many things, actually -- are more important than football, and certainly this can wait. But when we all go back Wednesday and Thursday for interviews and news conferences in East Rutherford, I don't think it's too much to ask for the team's general manager to come out and answer some questions.

GM Jerry Reese has some difficult questions to answer concerning the Giants' early struggles.
Requests to interview Reese on Monday were declined, and it has been explained to me that he rarely talks in-season, with the possible exception of the bye week. The Giants' power structure is well established and respected by all involved. Reese's job is to put the roster together. Coughlin's is to coach the team. Reese giving all kinds of interviews in-season the way owner/GM Jerry Jones, for example, holds court in the locker room after every game would be unseemly given the separation of powers in the Giants organization. Fair enough.

But when the team starts 0-3 and there are legitimate questions being asked about whether it's actually built to win, it's time to consider making an exception. Accountability is always in-season, and there are questions that Reese is more qualified to answer right now than are the coaches and players who are giving interviews daily
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/gia...om-jerry-reese

Sather has to to go. If he has any self respect,Sather would admit his time running the team is over. He is 70 years old.

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Old
10-20-2013, 11:16 AM
  #10
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
All talk of trades or replacing the coach is simply re-shuffling the deck chair on the Titanic. As long as this current front office remains in power the team will never move beyond what it has been ó a middle of the road team that might win a round of two in the playoffs. Any thought that this team is a Cup contender is delusional.

The GM's lazy, quick fix, smartest-guy-in-the-room mentality has trickled down to every part of this organization ó and that includes the purported draft master Gordie Clarke and the supposed personnel wizard Jeff Gorton. The inability, or unwillingness, to look beyond the season thatís right in front of them is what keeps this the franchise in a constant revolving door of mediocrity.

But the laziness of which I speak is no more evident than in the fact that the team lacks an identity and organizational philosophy. Because creating an identity and team philosophy takes time and hard work. Thatís why it seems the GM, and the AGM are basically throwing darts while blindfolded when it comes to signing players or making trades. And that results in making moves in a vacuum with no forethought whatsoever (see the madness of the Nash trade, Gaborik trade, Torts firing timeline as a good example of that short-sightedness).

So what is this team? Or what do the powers that be want it to be?

If they are a gritty in your face team, then thereís no place for Taylor Pyatt, Mats Zuccarello, Derick Brassard or Benoit Pouliot on this roster.

If they are a puck control, up-tempo, push the pace team, they simply lack the personnel and talent to play that way ó and a coach (or coaching change) canít change that

The lack of an organizational philosophy is also the reason for the stunning failure in free agency. Sure, the high profile signing bustsóDrury, Gomez, Redden, Kasparaitis, Holik and possibly Richardsóare well documented (and donít tell me the Gomez contract was OK because they got McDonagh, that was never the intent when Gomez was signe). But consider this: since the first lockout, this GM has spent $32.275M on bottom six, place-holder, gap-fillers in Arron Asham, Mike Rupp, Donald Brashear, Derek Boogaard, Benoit Pouliot, Taylor Pyatt, Dominic Moore, Ruslan Fedotenko, Jason Ward, Ville Nieminen, Aaron Voros and Patrick Rissmiller. How is it that in 13 years, the team has not been able to develop players who are better than the names listed above?

Maybe it will be that history will show that the greatest achievement of the John Tortorella years was the ability of the coach to serve as a buffer between the sloppy, lazy mentality of the front office and his players. He was able to defuse Glen Sather's blustering gobbledegook of "Our goal is to win the Stanley Cup" with something that the players could control "We're going to outwork you every shift." Now that heís gone, things seem to have reverted back to the way things were ó especially without Ryan Callahan. Maybe the biggest message that firing Torts sent was this: the inmates now run the asylum.

The fact is every part of this team deserves blame. But the true failure is with the directionless decision makers at the top Itís been 13 years and they have failed thoroughly to build an identity, philosophy or even long-term strategy. Just let that sink in for a second, itís taken 13 years to get this team toÖ.here.
Amen.

....so, what could a Pyatt/Zuccarello package fetch?

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10-20-2013, 11:21 AM
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Well that's the point exactly. It's not one decision but all these decisions that bring us to where we are today.

We aren't a Tarasenko away. But add that to poor signings, inability to build to your team identity, or even create one, and staying on a broken course and here we are
You have to start somewhere, sometime. Its never been a good time under Sather to take a breath, really assess what we have here, and put in the legwork to make it better. The underlying problem to that is his failure/inability to concoct a vision for the type of team he wants -- Im not even getting into committing to that vision.

You take a look at this forum on any given day and the really scary thing is this circus of making moves in a vacuum isn't frowned upon - in fact, all too often, it is condoned.

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10-20-2013, 11:39 AM
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So..cut off the head of the human race?

...well, it's not a perfect metaphor...

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10-20-2013, 11:47 AM
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I'm sure some will accuse SBOB of panicking, but his post is painfully accurate.

What's also frustrating is that it took so long for the organization to field a team that put up a consistent effort, and now it seems like the country club mentality is creeping back in. Every time it seems like the organization may be headed in the right direction, they take a step back.

Sather showed how woefully out of touch he was with today's NHL as well as his own team during AV's press conference. Talking about how 6-5 games are more entertaining than 1-0 games, and how the game is changing to a more offensive style of play when in actuality scoring has declined since 2005-06. No matter who the coach is, the roster that Sather constructed is not capable of scoring consistently. Once again he fails to recognize his own shortcomings.

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10-20-2013, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
You have to start somewhere, sometime. Its never been a good time under Sather to take a breath, really assess what we have here, and put in the legwork to make it better. The underlying problem to that is his failure/inability to concoct a vision for the type of team he wants -- Im not even getting into committing to that vision.

You take a look at this forum on any given day and the really scary thing is this circus of making moves in a vacuum isn't frowned upon - in fact, all too often, it is condoned.
Some are just content with the short sightedness or just expect it. Just par for the course.

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10-20-2013, 12:07 PM
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The thread title earns bonus points for panache.

Still, a team not winning a cup does not necessarily equate to poor management. I thought the Rangers had a pretty clear identity the last two seasons, they just haven't found it this year.


It is interesting to note though that teams like Detroit and Chicago who have found success did not necessarily alter their playing style or organizational philosophy too much in the past 10-15 years.

If you are looking for consistency, then that's a solid point. But I can't really gauge the effort the FO has put in considering I'm not int he room with them. Sather did seem to spend more of last summer trying to put together the best possible deal for Rick Nash. He did bury Wade Redden (of course a problem that we never would have had if not for him) bought out Drury (ditto) and signed Richards as opposed to dealing pieces for him at the 2010 trade deadline, at a time we needed a first line center.

I still think we just have to swallow the bitter pill for a few weeks with a new coach on the road. A lot of more talented teams than ours would be struggling right now under those circumstances.

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10-20-2013, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
All talk of trades or replacing the coach is simply re-shuffling the deck chair on the Titanic. As long as this current front office remains in power the team will never move beyond what it has been ó a middle of the road team that might win a round of two in the playoffs. Any thought that this team is a Cup contender is delusional.

The GM's lazy, quick fix, smartest-guy-in-the-room mentality has trickled down to every part of this organization ó and that includes the purported draft master Gordie Clarke and the supposed personnel wizard Jeff Gorton. The inability, or unwillingness, to look beyond the season thatís right in front of them is what keeps this the franchise in a constant revolving door of mediocrity.

But the laziness of which I speak is no more evident than in the fact that the team lacks an identity and organizational philosophy. Because creating an identity and team philosophy takes time and hard work. Thatís why it seems the GM, and the AGM are basically throwing darts while blindfolded when it comes to signing players or making trades. And that results in making moves in a vacuum with no forethought whatsoever (see the madness of the Nash trade, Gaborik trade, Torts firing timeline as a good example of that short-sightedness).

So what is this team? Or what do the powers that be want it to be?

If they are a gritty in your face team, then thereís no place for Taylor Pyatt, Mats Zuccarello, Derick Brassard or Benoit Pouliot on this roster.

If they are a puck control, up-tempo, push the pace team, they simply lack the personnel and talent to play that way ó and a coach (or coaching change) canít change that

The lack of an organizational philosophy is also the reason for the stunning failure in free agency. Sure, the high profile signing bustsóDrury, Gomez, Redden, Kasparaitis, Holik and possibly Richardsóare well documented (and donít tell me the Gomez contract was OK because they got McDonagh, that was never the intent when Gomez was signe). But consider this: since the first lockout, this GM has spent $32.275M on bottom six, place-holder, gap-fillers in Arron Asham, Mike Rupp, Donald Brashear, Derek Boogaard, Benoit Pouliot, Taylor Pyatt, Dominic Moore, Ruslan Fedotenko, Jason Ward, Ville Nieminen, Aaron Voros and Patrick Rissmiller. How is it that in 13 years, the team has not been able to develop players who are better than the names listed above?

Maybe it will be that history will show that the greatest achievement of the John Tortorella years was the ability of the coach to serve as a buffer between the sloppy, lazy mentality of the front office and his players. He was able to defuse Glen Sather's blustering gobbledegook of "Our goal is to win the Stanley Cup" with something that the players could control "We're going to outwork you every shift." Now that heís gone, things seem to have reverted back to the way things were ó especially without Ryan Callahan. Maybe the biggest message that firing Torts sent was this: the inmates now run the asylum.

The fact is every part of this team deserves blame. But the true failure is with the directionless decision makers at the top Itís been 13 years and they have failed thoroughly to build an identity, philosophy or even long-term strategy. Just let that sink in for a second, itís taken 13 years to get this team toÖ.here.
I couldn't possibly agree more. Especially your closing thoughts; 13 years in any other organization would have seen at one or two total regime changes with same results that our last 13 have had. The lack of any evidence of a plan is painful and the fact that this team has no evident design (as you said: what are we?), no identity and not even an overall guiding philosophy with regards to where it's all supposed to be going, 13 years into the current supervision, is enough to make a fan sick.

I have to say, this season will be extremely rough on these boards and it will be for the very fact that we're all fans (big enough fans to spend our time discovering this place and returning time and again to post our thoughts). We just all have a different perspective on this team of ours. Some of us see these early games this year and we take them more as a sign that the bottom has fallen out again. We don't feel like we're simply watching some rough games at the beginning of a season, but that we're witnessing the culmination of the most recent rounds of blindly tossing darts (to borrow from your post). Others, perhaps more optimistic or simply less fed up, see it as early games that the team can rebound from and scorn us for our "sky is falling" mentality. I agree with, and empathize with both sides of the argument. I don't want to see our team "blown up" and the players that I've come to love as Rangers scattered to other teams so that we can endure a few seasons of awfulness while they succeed in other jerseys. I also fully recognize that there is ample time for the team to turn this season around and have a winning record which, on the surface (although, in my opinion, only on the surface), makes blowing it up seem unnecessary. The problem is, even if this team has a winning record, all of the issues that Singn' brings up are still 100% valid and any thought that this team is actually a Cup contender truly is delusional. Once you accept that, simply righting the ship enough to make it to the post season this year becomes little more than a bandaid, or reshuffling the deck chairs, and still does not address the organizational ills that are plaguing this team and will continue to impede us from truly moving forward.

Again, I really just have to agree with every word that Singn' posted.

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10-20-2013, 12:15 PM
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Bring back John Davidson

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10-20-2013, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Because creating an identity and team philosophy takes time and hard work. Thatís why it seems the GM, and the AGM are basically throwing darts while blindfolded when it comes to signing players or making trades. And that results in making moves in a vacuum with no forethought whatsoever (see the madness of the Nash trade, Gaborik trade, Torts firing timeline as a good example of that short-sightedness).
Oh, Singin'......how many years do we go back on these boards? As I said, the most galling part of this is that they WERE well on their way to develop the identity and team philosophy. All the ended when Jackass fired Tortarella. It began with the Nash trade. It has continued...

The most frustrating part is that we FINALLY had a product to be proud of on the ice. The AHL team played the same. ALL of the players played EXACTLY the way that the coach wanted to. There was true accountability. All of the players stood up for each other. They did not back down an inch from anyone and were among the most hardest working teams in hockey.

Off course, as is almost always the case, it was not good enough for Jackass. And so, back in time we go to see play that is unrootable for.

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10-20-2013, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post

The GM's lazy, quick fix, smartest-guy-in-the-room mentality has trickled down to every part of this organization — and that includes the purported draft master Gordie Clarke and the supposed personnel wizard Jeff Gorton. The inability, or unwillingness, to look beyond the season that’s right in front of them is what keeps this the franchise in a constant revolving door of mediocrity.
(see the madness of the Nash trade, Gaborik trade, Torts firing timeline as a good example of that short-sightedness).



Maybe it will be that history will show that the greatest achievement of the John Tortorella years was the ability of the coach to serve as a buffer between the sloppy, lazy mentality of the front office and his players. He was able to defuse Glen Sather's blustering gobbledegook of "Our goal is to win the Stanley Cup" with something that the players could control "We're going to outwork you every shift." Now that he’s gone, things seem to have reverted back to the way things were — especially without Ryan Callahan. Maybe the biggest message that firing Torts sent was this: the inmates now run the asylum.

The fact is every part of this team deserves blame. But the true failure is with the directionless decision makers at the top It’s been 13 years and they have failed thoroughly to build an identity, philosophy or even long-term strategy. Just let that sink in for a second, it’s taken 13 years to get this team to….here.
Unfortunately you're not saying anything new and saying it here accomplishes nothing except maybe get a few peoples feathers ruffled.

I particularly hate getting rid of Gaborik and then Torts. If you were getting rid of Torts you shouldn't have done the Gab trade. But short-sightedness so yea.

Nash trade wasn't madness at all. Gab and Richards fell off a cliff. It was a smart move but the two studs became absolute duds possibly bc of the coach you are slightly praising. or possibly for some other reason. But let's face it if Gabs had been having an 80 pt season (which he'd done multiple times in his short career here), Richards played like he did his first year and Nash did what he did last year, add stepan, hagelin and the D then we'd have had a really fun season. But those two crashed and burned and so we are stuck spinning the wheel again.

Every1 wants to express joy that Richards has found his game and people want to do I told you so's bc Gabs looks good so far in Clb. But those two things do not erase how atrocious and invisible they were all last year. Those two tanking so suddenly and simultaneously has likely set this franchise back to the stone age. So a big hearty thanks goes out to them. Sometimes it's the players too. In this case it is. Doesn't absolve that idiot GM but I don't want us failing to put blame where it belongs. Telling Korpikoski to stuff it in his ass and get back on the ice might have helped this team too last year. But inmates and asylums and all that. So would having Tarasenko provided he wasn't injured which seems to be his M.O. Can't even imagine having had a rookie tarasenko AND Korp AND cherepanov with Nash, stepan, Gabs and Richards (maybe not richards he'd have probably blown last year anyway). But Cherepanov obviously had a terrible tragedy, Korp was able to dictate how Sather runs our franchise and I believe the 10 draft has been done to death but it still drives me insane


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10-20-2013, 12:42 PM
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I particularly hate getting rid of Gaborik and then Torts. If you were getting rid of Torts you shouldn't have done the Gab trade. But short-sightedness so yea.

Nash trade wasn't madness at all. Gab and Richards fell off a cliff. It was a smart move but the two studs became absolute duds possibly bc of the coach you are praising. or possibly for some other reason.
History may look back at the firing of Torts as one of the Rangers biggest mistakes since the signing of Keane and Skrudland or the trading of Mattias Norstrom.

The Nash trade in particular hurt as it disrupted chemistry and took away some of the core.

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10-20-2013, 12:50 PM
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Oh, Singin'......how many years do we go back on these boards? As I said, the most galling part of this is that they WERE well on their way to develop the identity and team philosophy. All the ended when Jackass fired Tortarella. It began with the Nash trade. It has continued...

The most frustrating part is that we FINALLY had a product to be proud of on the ice. The AHL team played the same. ALL of the players played EXACTLY the way that the coach wanted to. There was true accountability. All of the players stood up for each other. They did not back down an inch from anyone and were among the most hardest working teams in hockey.

Off course, as is almost always the case, it was not good enough for Jackass. And so, back in time we go to see play that is unrootable for.
In addition to my post above, I'd say that this is also a big part of how I see things. A lot of posters have said "we have an identity, we're just struggling on the road with a new coach". I disagree. I think that if you can't see that the identity we HAD built, culminating in the ECF appearance, had begun to erode last year and has been entirely abandoned now with the coaching change, than you're not as dialed in as you probably think you are. As you say, the most damning part of the whole thing is that two years ago, we had a strong identity, strong core, no questions about "what" our team was, no questions about effort or toughness and finally it felt like we'd found our team and had a product to be proud of.

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10-20-2013, 12:51 PM
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I was just passing by, continuing my lurking, and then hit this post.

Bang on SBOB! Your words are so true...They apply now as they have from the very first year of the Buffoon from Banf-f-f-f...(F Troop any one?).....And seeing TRUEBLUE on here reminds me how long us Ranger fans have had to suffer this incompetent fool.....But, hey, keep on signing the Pouilot's of the world because you are so much smarter than everybody including the 5 teams that couldn't wait to get rid of him...

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10-20-2013, 12:55 PM
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History may look back at the firing of Torts as one of the Rangers biggest mistakes since the signing of Keane and Skrudland or the trading of Mattias Norstrom.

The Nash trade in particular hurt as it disrupted chemistry and took away some of the core.
How did that NAsh trade cause Richards and Gabs to disappear? Doesn't make sense to me. I think the move was fine and I don't think it did much to the chemistry of the team. They had zero offensive chemistry to begin with and the D was pretty much the same all season last year

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10-20-2013, 01:01 PM
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History may look back at the firing of Torts as one of the Rangers biggest mistakes since the signing of Keane and Skrudland or the trading of Mattias Norstrom.

The Nash trade in particular hurt as it disrupted chemistry and took away some of the core.
It will. Tortorella had a lot of critics for various reasons, but his Rangers teams won. The Rangers didn't play a pretty style or light up the score sheet but they won games. Some complained about all the shot blocking. They hated the terrible power play (rightly so). They hated the way he handled the media and all the ice time Boyle got. And the criticism directed at him meant less directed at his players.

But I didn't hear anyone complain when the Rangers played in the Eastern Conference Finals for the first time in 15 years and genuinely looked like contenders. He was given a roster with a stellar starting goalie and a group of hardworking albeit unspectacular skaters and was smart enough to play a style that got the most out of their talents. What's that thing called where a group of individual players works together to achieve the same goal even though they all have varying levels of talent and ability? Oh yeah, a team.

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10-20-2013, 01:18 PM
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I always felt the PP issues were player issues and not coaching. Didn't think Torts should have been fired

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