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In-season Proposals, Rumors, Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics) XLIV

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Old
10-18-2013, 01:54 PM
  #51
Avs For Life
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I wonder what type of return we could get for Staz, Wilson, 2014 1st maybe even add Elliott in

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10-18-2013, 02:05 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Avs For Life View Post
I wonder what type of return we could get for Staz, Wilson, 2014 1st maybe even add Elliott in
Bozak + Second Round Pick.

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10-18-2013, 02:06 PM
  #53
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I wonder what type of return we could get for Staz, Wilson, 2014 1st maybe even add Elliott in
I think you'd be underwhelmed. I'd imagine the return on that package would be multiple parts rather than a top 2 defender which is what the AVs really need.

That's the thing that bothers me with trading Stastny...the AVs won't get real value because he's an UFA. I'd rather they try to find a way to sign him and keep him around. If the time comes where they need to trade a centerman, I'd rather the AVs be able to offer something more than a pending UFA because the return would be of higher quality.

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Old
10-18-2013, 02:17 PM
  #54
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I think you'd be underwhelmed. I'd imagine the return on that package would be multiple parts rather than a top 2 defender which is what the AVs really need.

That's the thing that bothers me with trading Stastny...the AVs won't get real value because he's an UFA. I'd rather they try to find a way to sign him and keep him around. If the time comes where they need to trade a centerman, I'd rather the AVs be able to offer something more than a pending UFA because the return would be of higher quality.
Another reason I like the idea of getting an older fill in like Erhoff, Campbell, Timmonen, etc. Then we can focus on retaining all our forwards because we'd have the lineup to start contending once they get a postseason or two of experience under their belts, and if 2-3 years down the line Bigras isn't there and we need to make a trade for a top 2 Dman again we can then trade a center in the middle of his contract or some of the other prospects we'll have assembled in that time.

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Old
10-18-2013, 02:19 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by expatriated_texan View Post
I think you'd be underwhelmed. I'd imagine the return on that package would be multiple parts rather than a top 2 defender which is what the AVs really need.

That's the thing that bothers me with trading Stastny...the AVs won't get real value because he's an UFA. I'd rather they try to find a way to sign him and keep him around. If the time comes where they need to trade a centerman, I'd rather the AVs be able to offer something more than a pending UFA because the return would be of higher quality.
You are probably right, but the problem with giving up anyone else in the top 9 is that I think they are big parts of our future aside from probably Tanguay. He has a few years left but in the grand scheme of things he wont be here much longer.

I look at our roster and see so many pieces that I really like and do not want to give up. Those are as follows

Duchene, PAP, ROR, Landy, Ginner, Mack, Downie, EJ, Hejda, Barrie, Varly, Giggy (Due to his influencne on Mack)

I guess Downie might be movable...but Id rather not.

The remaining pieces arent going to get us much...leaving FA and the draft. Staz is the biggest piece I would want to move and I doubt after trading for him we would move Tangs. I just see that top 9 being unbelievable in a few years.

I suppose a Staz + Downie package might turn some heads more than the Staz + Wilson or Elliott would. I just like what Downie brings to our lineup.

FTR I do not want McGinn going anywhere. He may not be crazy like Downie...but I LOVE what he brings to our team.

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Old
10-18-2013, 02:34 PM
  #56
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Staz is too important right now to trade. He isn't on the scoreboard but is a monster defensively so far. We cannot trade him. I have to hope we keep him or this team will take a hit a lot larger than some of you think

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Old
10-18-2013, 03:02 PM
  #57
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Everyone speaks of Ehrhoff like he's a 35 year old. He's the same age as Rob Blake when he came to the Avs (31).

Not that Ehrhoff is Blake, but Ehrhoff likely still has at least 5 productive years in him.

Figure in that 5 years who is likely to be around and contributing:
EJ - all 5
Hejda - 2-4 more? and likely a bottom or 2nd pairing near the end
Barrie - all 5 unless traded
Wilson - 2 more, but could be out played for a bottom pairing role by the end of his current deal
Benoit - may get resigned for 1 or 2 more years.so far looks like a good 4/5 player, but in a similar spot as Wilson
Sarich- will not be resigned
Elliott - Huge question mark here, likely part of the trade IMO
Bigras - 4 years as he likely makes this team next year
Siemens - 4 years as he likely earns a spot next year
Guenin and Holden - ????

This team is ready for playoffs starting next year if they can keep the forward core together (ROR, Stastny, McGinn, Downie all resigned)

Starting 14-15
Ehrhoff-EJ
Hejda-Barrie
Wilson - Benoit
Bigras - Siemens

That is a good foundation for a core of vet and young D that likely stay together for 4 years while our forwards are good enough to compete as they are now.

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Old
10-18-2013, 03:15 PM
  #58
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I'd move a first for Ehrhoff easily. He'd fix a lot of our PMD problems and take some of the pressure off EJ and Barrie to perform that role. Benoit could settle down into a 2nd/3rd pairing role which would help him big time.

Ehrhoff - EJ
Hejda - Barrie
Benoit - Sarich
Wilson

I like that a lot, especially if we can jettison Wilson somewhere for an asset. Elliott can jump up into the NHL next year once Sarich's contract is up or Sarich can get another one year deal and the two can rotate in/out. Siemens can get spot duty during injury and spend another year or two developing. Bigras then comes into the NHL in 2-3 years.

Good stuff.

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Old
10-18-2013, 03:16 PM
  #59
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With the cap going up next year, and very likely the next few years after that, losing Stastny is not a foregone conclusion. It just depends on whether he wants more than his current deal, or less. I imagine the Avs could re-sign him for a lower salary but will have to kick in extra years for added security.

I still think the Avs should try O'Reilly at center in a shutdown role. That's what he's built to do. With MacKinnon and Duchene handling softer minutes O'Reilly and Landeskog can give the opposition hell and score points to boot. So long as Staz is here, I wouldn't mind seeing this:

MacKinnon - Duchene - Parenteau
McGinn - Stastny - Tanguay
Landeskog - O'Reilly - Downie

IMO Stastny's played really well to start the season.

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Old
10-19-2013, 06:07 PM
  #60
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Do you guys think Adam Larsson can be gotten for cheaper than what he's worth?

He's been underwhelming under NJ's system and coach and is wasting away it seems.

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Old
10-19-2013, 06:12 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by avsfan89 View Post
Do you guys think Adam Larsson can be gotten for cheaper than what he's worth?

He's been underwhelming under NJ's system and coach and is wasting away it seems.
Can't imagine Lou letting him go for cheap

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Old
10-19-2013, 06:55 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by avsfan89 View Post
Do you guys think Adam Larsson can be gotten for cheaper than what he's worth?

He's been underwhelming under NJ's system and coach and is wasting away it seems.
What about Tyler Myers? Similar case, I think.

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Old
10-19-2013, 06:57 PM
  #63
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Do you guys think Adam Larsson can be gotten for cheaper than what he's worth?

He's been underwhelming under NJ's system and coach and is wasting away it seems.
No. Lou Lamoriello won't simply dump a prospect like that. DeBoer will be long, long gone before Larsson gets moved. And rest assured, DeBoer will be fired before next season.

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Old
10-20-2013, 12:24 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by avsfan89 View Post
Do you guys think Adam Larsson can be gotten for cheaper than what he's worth?

He's been underwhelming under NJ's system and coach and is wasting away it seems.
Maybe I'm missing someone in recent history, but I don't think teams under anything but crazy circumstances give up on top 5 picks for a long time. He's not going anywhere.

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Old
10-20-2013, 03:04 AM
  #65
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Maybe I'm missing someone in recent history, but I don't think teams under anything but crazy circumstances give up on top 5 picks for a long time. He's not going anywhere.
how about if the player is unhappy? larsson has given some worrysome quotes lately. Could be another kyle turris situation that we should be in the mix if that is the case.

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Old
10-20-2013, 10:28 AM
  #66
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Maybe I'm missing someone in recent history, but I don't think teams under anything but crazy circumstances give up on top 5 picks for a long time. He's not going anywhere.
2010- Tyler Seguin (3 years), Nino Niederreiter (1 year).
2009-Brayden Schenn (8 games)
2008-Luke Schenn (4 years)
2007- JVR (3 years), Turris(3 Years), Hickey (0 Years),
2006- Johnson (2.5 years), Staal (6 years), Kessel (3 years)

By year I mean seasons on the NHL club before being traded. So EJ for example was already on his 4th year with St. Louis, but he had only played 2 and a half seasons with them.

They all got pretty big returns though. I'd imagine Larsson has at least this season, and next, before being looked at as a possible trade candidate.


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Old
10-20-2013, 10:37 AM
  #67
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I don't think Larsson is going to be traded and if he was, I'm not sure Avs should pursue him. I think eventually he'll be a player but there would have to be a lot of developing involved and I'm concerned about the lack of foot speed. I don't know what he and Devils are doing, but the guy looks slower now than he did when drafted and he wasn't a speed demon back then.

If he was drafted 14th, I doubt anyone here would want to trade for him with how he's looking.

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10-20-2013, 10:40 AM
  #68
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I honestly think an oldie that lets us keep the current team together, think Erhoff, Soupy, Timmonen, etc., helps us a lot more than an expensive reclamation project. We just need someone who can smooth bigras's transition once he arrives, and someone who can fill that spot until he does, so the rest of the team's development isn't being held back.

But I'm really high on Siemens and Bigras so long as we have good vets in their place for now, the way Hejda serves as an example to Siemens.

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10-20-2013, 11:10 AM
  #69
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I honestly think an oldie that lets us keep the current team together, think Erhoff, Soupy, Timmonen, etc., helps us a lot more than an expensive reclamation project. We just need someone who can smooth bigras's transition once he arrives, and someone who can fill that spot until he does, so the rest of the team's development isn't being held back.

But I'm really high on Siemens and Bigras so long as we have good vets in their place for now, the way Hejda serves as an example to Siemens.
I agree with you. Hejda is the perfect example. You go out and get a vet that can hold down a spot until the young guys are ready.
I just very much believe that you should under no circumstance give up assets besides capspace for such a player.

Only exception maybe Ehrhoff because he is on a fairly cheap contract and younger than Campbell or Timmonen.
I am still not sure that a 34 year old Ehrhoff (his age when we should realistically start contending for the cup) is worth the assets we will have to sacrifice for him. Still mainly a matter of his price tag.

Just stay away from Campbell.
Simply ask how much money Dan Boyle, Willie Mitchell, Klesla or Nikitin want for 2 -3 years on July 1st.
Or what Timmonen would ask for one year...

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10-20-2013, 11:25 AM
  #70
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You need to look at more than just what that player will give us 3 years from now, you have to look at how much more the rest of the team will grow over the next 3 years with him in place. Our forwards would be so much more developed with a legit defense behind them that lets them start gaining playoff experience this season. And on the backend guys like EJ, Barrie and Bigras would learn so much more with an erhoff or Campbell around than they will with the team trying to pass Guenin/Wilson/Benoit off as top 4 dmen.

That to me is what would be worth giving away our pick for, that developmental boost on the players we already. That to me would make a much bigger difference than another promising youngster or two.

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Old
10-20-2013, 11:25 AM
  #71
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I agree with you. Hejda is the perfect example. You go out and get a vet that can hold down a spot until the young guys are ready.
I just very much believe that you should under no circumstance give up assets besides capspace for such a player.

Only exception maybe Ehrhoff because he is on a fairly cheap contract and younger than Campbell or Timmonen.
I am still not sure that a 34 year old Ehrhoff (his age when we should realistically start contending for the cup) is worth the assets we will have to sacrifice for him. Still mainly a matter of his price tag.

Just stay away from Campbell.
Simply ask how much money Dan Boyle, Willie Mitchell, Klesla or Nikitin want for 2 -3 years on July 1st.
Or what Timmonen would ask for one year...
The thing is though that Ehrhoff is a big piece to get us to the playoffs and contending.
Getting Ehrhoff now could very well lead to very important playoff-experience.

EDIT: And what cgf said

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Old
10-20-2013, 11:25 AM
  #72
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Biron retires

Good guy and not a bad goalie in his Buffalo days. Another player, I grew up watching retires.

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Old
10-20-2013, 11:37 AM
  #73
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Biron retires

Good guy and not a bad goalie in his Buffalo days. Another player, I grew up watching retires.
You're getting old bro . Selanne and Jagr are pretty much the only guys left that were playing when I was first watching hockey.

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Old
10-20-2013, 11:57 AM
  #74
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You're getting old bro . Selanne and Jagr are pretty much the only guys left that were playing when I was first watching hockey.
Yeah, that's how I feel right now. Luckily, I still have Broduer,Tangs,Alfie,Elias and the 2 you mentioned.

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Old
10-20-2013, 12:06 PM
  #75
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Yeah, that's how I feel right now. Luckily, I still have Broduer,Tangs,Alfie,Elias and the 2 you mentioned.
You have 2-3 more years haha

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