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Old
10-21-2013, 03:10 PM
  #126
OntOilFan
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Kevin Lowe is a bonafide moron and probably in the top five worst professional sports executives ever. This isn't news.

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10-21-2013, 03:12 PM
  #127
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Now now. Be fair to the man.

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10-21-2013, 04:50 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by harpoon View Post
My question is why hate him so much? Its not warranted. Not even close.

I think people forget that Lowe was only a GM for eight years. His tenure finished in 2008. New ownership took over and installed their stooge who could be counted on to follow the playbook.
No hate on my part but his job since 2008 has been President of Hockey operations. He's the name at the top rung of this organization every single year that we've finished worst in the league. He's been in charge of turning this thing around and been involved (to what degree is a valid arguement) with every hockey decision that has been made for over a decade. At what point do we decide he just might not be all that good at his job? When can we say that despite all the set backs and factors that have made it hard to turn this team into a contender we expect some kind of results from this organization? He's gone through one gm and 4 head coaches, when does he get called to task for his failure to hire the right people?

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10-21-2013, 05:44 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Halibut View Post
No hate on my part but his job since 2008 has been President of Hockey operations. He's the name at the top rung of this organization every single year that we've finished worst in the league. He's been in charge of turning this thing around and been involved (to what degree is a valid arguement) with every hockey decision that has been made for over a decade. At what point do we decide he just might not be all that good at his job? When can we say that despite all the set backs and factors that have made it hard to turn this team into a contender we expect some kind of results from this organization? He's gone through one gm and 4 head coaches, when does he get called to task for his failure to hire the right people?
Never according to some.

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10-21-2013, 05:56 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by OntOilFan View Post
Kevin Lowe is a bonafide moron and probably in the top five worst professional sports executives ever. This isn't news.
You have no idea how many bad executives there are in sports.

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Old
10-21-2013, 06:37 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Never according to some.
Speaking for myself (and some others possibly) it's not that he shouldn't be held accountable. He absolutely should be relieved of his job. You just shouldn't use events from the past out of context. Most of us loved Nail's celebration after he tied that Kings game last year because of the context of what took place with the reffing that night. If we look back on that without a proper view of what was actually going on then Nail looks like a total j-ass. It's the same with the Lowe-Burke feud/interview.

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10-21-2013, 06:47 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Isaak16 View Post
Speaking for myself (and some others possibly) it's not that he shouldn't be held accountable. He absolutely should be relieved of his job. You just shouldn't use events from the past out of context. Most of us loved Nail's celebration after he tied that Kings game last year because of the context of what took place with the reffing that night. If we look back on that without a proper view of what was actually going on then Nail looks like a total j-ass. It's the same with the Lowe-Burke feud/interview.
Or refusing to trade Mike Comrie unless he paid back his bonus money? Or the team's record under his tenure? Or the fact he is STILL making hockey decisions even after years and years of abject failure?

People point to 2006 as a high water mark for Lowe. To me it was his undoing. He traded for/signed a bunch of (mostly) pending ufa's. Pretty much all of whom flew the coup after Pronger pulled the wool over everyone's eyes by requesting a trade DURING the first year of a six year deal.

It really doesnt get any worse than that. The following rush to plug holes in the dyke resulted in a plethora of overpays and bad contracts that plagued the team for years. What we see out on the ice now is a direct result of the aftermath of 2006 and a big reason why we havent seen a playoff game since then.

Lowe's best years were as a player, followed by his brief tenure as coach (something he was actually good at), followed by his tenure as gm under EIG, which then went terribly wrong in 06 following the implementation of the salary cap. Lowe, not unlike his mentor Sather, have been awful with a blank cheque type ownership.

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10-21-2013, 07:00 PM
  #133
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It doesn't matter to me that we traded for a bunch of UFA's, the 2006 cup run was a special time for the entire city. It helped usher in a whole new wave of Oiler fans, plus what guy didn't like "shirts off for Horcoff." In reality the only asset that we lost of any significance was the outside chance we'd draft Lucic in the 2nd round.

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10-21-2013, 07:06 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Or refusing to trade Mike Comrie unless he paid back his bonus money? Or the team's record under his tenure? Or the fact he is STILL making hockey decisions even after years and years of abject failure?

People point to 2006 as a high water mark for Lowe. To me it was his undoing. He traded for/signed a bunch of (mostly) pending ufa's. Pretty much all of whom flew the coup after Pronger pulled the wool over everyone's eyes by requesting a trade DURING the first year of a six year deal.

It really doesnt get any worse than that. The following rush to plug holes in the dyke resulted in a plethora of overpays and bad contracts that plagued the team for years. What we see out on the ice now is a direct result of the aftermath of 2006 and a big reason why we havent seen a playoff game since then.

Lowe's best years were as a player, followed by his brief tenure as coach (something he was actually good at), followed by his tenure as gm under EIG, which then went terribly wrong in 06 following the implementation of the salary cap. Lowe, not unlike his mentor Sather, have been awful with a blank cheque type ownership.
No one is saying he was some great GM...... he had a few good moments though and I give him full marks for 2006. Why? Because it was the most fun I've had as an Oiler fan.

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10-21-2013, 07:06 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by shogun99 View Post
It doesn't matter to me that we traded for a bunch of UFA's, the 2006 cup run was a special time for the entire city. It helped usher in a whole new wave of Oiler fans, plus what guy didn't like "shirts off for Horcoff." In reality the only asset that we lost of any significance was the outside chance we'd draft Lucic in the 2nd round.
Not really. We barely even made the playoffs that year. The cinderella run was more fluke than by design.

Edmonton was a pariah for years after that. Still is really. We cant attract good veteran players. They invoke their nmc's and ntc's. That is why Mr six rings decided to ride the suck for picks after the Heatley debacle and the resulting season of crap.

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10-21-2013, 07:09 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Isaak16 View Post
No one is saying he was some great GM...... he had a few good moments though and I give him full marks for 2006. Why? Because it was the most fun I've had as an Oiler fan.
It breathed new life into the city and old crusty cynics as well as creating a whole new generation of fans. It was fun and special and all those things. But magic always comes with a price.

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10-21-2013, 07:27 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Halibut View Post
At what point do we decide he just might not be all that good at his job?
I guess we have to determine what being "good" at his job would look like.

During his tenure as GM the team lost three times to the Stars in the quarter finals, failed to qualify for post season three times and made one run all the way to the SC Finals. Given the budget constraints he was operating under at the time, and the mathematical realities of a thirty team league, I think that's a more than decent record for an eight year period. Is it "good"? Maybe not, but many teams around the league would have had a worse performance over those eight years.

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10-21-2013, 07:33 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Not really. We barely even made the playoffs that year. The cinderella run was more fluke than by design.

Edmonton was a pariah for years after that. Still is really. We cant attract good veteran players. They invoke their nmc's and ntc's. That is why Mr six rings decided to ride the suck for picks after the Heatley debacle and the resulting season of crap.
If you actually watched hockey that year, that was a very good team with very bad goaltending.
To suggest that Lowe shouldnt have made the moves that he did, with the resultant SCF 7th game, is patently ridiculous. Those trades as a whole were off the charts.

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10-21-2013, 07:40 PM
  #139
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If you actually watched hockey that year, that was a very good team with very bad goaltending.
To suggest that Lowe shouldnt have made the moves that he did, with the resultant SCF 7th game, is patently ridiculous. Those trades as a whole were off the charts.
Yes, of course you are right as always. Good thing you actually watched hockey that year. You would obviously know that Roloson posted a .905 sv% in his 19 regular season games with the Oilers. Good enough for 26th best in the league.

Of course that very good team with really bad goaltending was actually 12th in GA/G while 15th in GF/G. A real juggernaut they were. Last seed in the playoffs my eye. Odds on favourite? You bet.

Where he really shone was in the playoffs. But then again, it is fairly obvious to those who actually watched all the games these last seven years that the trades made that season provided short term gain at the expense of loooooooong term pain. Still felt today really.

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10-21-2013, 08:01 PM
  #140
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To suggest that Lowe shouldnt have made the moves that he did, with the resultant SCF 7th game, is patently ridiculous.
Its part of the loser mentality Replacement is talking about in his thread. Some fans have become so beaten and cowed by the years of failure and draft picks under Katz that they no longer recognize an intelligent hockey move.

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Those trades as a whole were off the charts.
Yes they were. Probably the best series of moves any Oiler GM has ever pulled off, and certainly a candidate for the best series of trades by any GM in the league over the first decade of the 2000s.

Jeff Woywitka
Doug Lynch
Eric Brewer
Mike York
4th round pick
Marty Reasoner
Yan Stastny
2nd round pick
1st round pick
Tony Salmalainen

---------------------------------

Chris Pronger
Jaroslav Spacek
Michael Peca
Dwayne Roloson
Sergei Samsonov


Other than Reasoner and Brewer and the 1st rounder, that's a bunch of junk traded away for really good NHL players.
And people praised Tamby when "cleared the junk" by releasing guys like POS and JFJ

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10-21-2013, 11:41 PM
  #141
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urgh, makes me sick flames fans are already saying monahan is better than nuge.


worst part is, monohan would be leading our team in goals and points. great player, but in all fairness, hes being properly insulated unlike our kids who have to do everything by themselves. URGH this franchise sometimes

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10-21-2013, 11:49 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Yes, of course you are right as always. Good thing you actually watched hockey that year. You would obviously know that Roloson posted a .905 sv% in his 19 regular season games with the Oilers. Good enough for 26th best in the league.

Of course that very good team with really bad goaltending was actually 12th in GA/G while 15th in GF/G. A real juggernaut they were. Last seed in the playoffs my eye. Odds on favourite? You bet.

Where he really shone was in the playoffs. But then again, it is fairly obvious to those who actually watched all the games these last seven years that the trades made that season provided short term gain at the expense of loooooooong term pain. Still felt today really.
Again, if you watched hockey, which is doubtful, Rolli had barely played all year when he got here & it took him a bit of time to get his game together.
And it was clear from watching the Oilers in the 1st 40 or so games there lack of goaltending was starting to really affect the team.
Its actually comical but typical that you actually critisize the actual real good moves that Lowe made.
But again, no surprise there.

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10-21-2013, 11:49 PM
  #143
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urgh, makes me sick flames fans are already saying monahan is better than nuge.


worst part is, monohan would be leading our team in goals and points. great player, but in all fairness, hes being properly insulated unlike our kids who have to do everything by themselves. URGH this franchise sometimes
Flames actually kept players that are capable of playing hockey. What a concept. Makes it so much easier for rookies to ease into the league when they aren't expected to carry the whole team.

Flames basically have a handful of Gordons, whereas we waited years to really get help and then we fell short.

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10-21-2013, 11:56 PM
  #144
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Again, if you watched hockey, which is doubtful, Rolli had barely played all year when he got here & it took him a bit of time to get his game together.
And it was clear from watching the Oilers in the 1st 40 or so games there lack of goaltending was starting to really affect the team.
Its actually comical but typical that you actually critisize the actual real good moves that Lowe made.
But again, no surprise there.
Really good moves. Right. Seven years of failure and counting.

Regular genius.

Hate to see what you consider bad moves.

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10-22-2013, 12:12 AM
  #145
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Really good moves. Right. Seven years of failure and counting.

Regular genius.

Hate to see what you consider bad moves.
Well, if you cant see the distinction between the moves that got them to the SCF and his other moves,well I just cant say much more than than your opinion speaks for itself.
No surprise here.

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10-22-2013, 12:16 AM
  #146
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Flames actually kept players that are capable of playing hockey. What a concept. Makes it so much easier for rookies to ease into the league when they aren't expected to carry the whole team.

Flames basically have a handful of Gordons, whereas we waited years to really get help and then we fell short.
yeah it just seems like their players don't really have a ton of skill, but they work hard and win battles and the kids are insulted for sure, you can tell.

And they won tonight, scored with 30 seconds left. monohan goal

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10-22-2013, 12:16 AM
  #147
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Well, if you cant see the distinction between the moves that got them to the SCF and his other moves,well I just cant say much more than than your opinion speaks for itself.
No surprise here.
The moves that got us to the Cup final WERE the moves that put us in the jackpot we are currently in.

That's what happens when you trade for a bunch of rentals.

Youre left with lint in your pockets once the party's over.

I cant make it any more plain than that.

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10-22-2013, 06:52 AM
  #148
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The moves that got us to the Cup final WERE the moves that put us in the jackpot we are currently in.

That's what happens when you trade for a bunch of rentals.

Youre left with lint in your pockets once the party's over.

I cant make it any more plain than that.
Funny, even if Vancouver won that last game and we didn't even make the playoffs in 2006, KLowe would probably still have his job and nothing would be any different.

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10-22-2013, 08:33 AM
  #149
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I'm a fan of Eakins. I think he has the ability the lead A team in the NHL to success eventually.

However...

The same things that I have been harping on for the last few years still apply to this mess of a team.

No balance
Too much finesse with no room to play because they are cream puff
Too much expectation put on the kids to lead the Oilers with no one to lead them
Not enough quality role players
Management is a bunch of rookies with little experience outside of the Oilers i.e and winning

And you know what? It's not just Kevin Lowe and management who needs to accept responsibility. It's also the responsibility of the fans as they have let Kevin Lowe and his cronies lead the Oilers to where they are now. The majority of the fans lapped it up.

And we still hear from people

Sign *generic finesse player*!
Sign *player under 6' and 180 lbs*!
*Draft McDavid!*
*Perron is the agitator we need!*

And you know with that type of thinking this team will go absolutely no where. Even if they make it to the playoffs in some god forsaken batch of rotten luck, they will be ground to a thin paste by the 3rd game.

This mess is too big to fix in a year or two. The problem is the culture of the Edmonton Oilers and everyone associated with it.

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10-22-2013, 08:37 AM
  #150
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An assessment of Kevin Lowe written in 2008 by Lowetide:

http://lowetide.ca/blog/2008/05/kevi...valuation.html

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