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Philadelphia Phillies (MLB): Wheels and Sarge out.

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Old
10-19-2013, 11:17 PM
  #301
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The Phillies have been terrible these past two years mainly because of an atrocious bullpen, but not finding adequate replacements for Werth and Victorino has also been a problem. Need to find a right handed bat again.

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10-20-2013, 04:06 PM
  #302
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So Cardinals vs. Red Sox in the Series? Two teams who have been dominating for over a decade are competing for another championship. Ugh, go Sox I guess. So glad we have Ben Revere to replace Shane Victorino. **** you Amaro.

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10-20-2013, 04:11 PM
  #303
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Amaro really needs to go. He has been trying to replace Werth for 3years now and couldn't get it done. We would have been better off giving Werth that crazy money than trading all of our prospects for guys like Pence and then having them leave. At least then we might have a couple more prospects that could start contributing or be used to trade for bullpen help. And resigning Rollins was stupid, it was pretty obvious long before his contract was up that he wasn't anything other than a good defensive shortstop anymore. How does Amaro still have a job?

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10-20-2013, 05:01 PM
  #304
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So Cardinals vs. Red Sox in the Series? Two teams who have been dominating for over a decade are competing for another championship. Ugh, go Sox I guess. So glad we have Ben Revere to replace Shane Victorino. **** you Amaro.
At least Pitt got knocked out... It was amazing to see the emergence of Pirates fans in south central PA this year. Funny seeing all the front running Steelers/Pens fans I know around here that have been Phillies fans for the last 20 years suddenly become huge Pirates fans.

"I've always been a Pirates fan. (Insert some stupid Pirates memory from when they were a kid in order to prove their fandom). I just rooted for the Phillies cause they're also from PA".

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10-20-2013, 05:14 PM
  #305
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At least Pitt got knocked out... It was amazing to see the emergence of Pirates fans in south central PA this year. Funny seeing all the front running Steelers/Pens fans I know around here that have been Phillies fans for the last 20 years suddenly become huge Pirates fans.

"I've always been a Pirates fan. (Insert some stupid Pirates memory from when they were a kid in order to prove their fandom). I just rooted for the Phillies cause they're also from PA".
In the Phillies chamionship season the stadium was filled to the brim with fairweather fans.

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10-20-2013, 05:39 PM
  #306
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In the Phillies chamionship season the stadium was filled to the brim with fairweather fans.
Went over your head.

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10-20-2013, 07:09 PM
  #307
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Went over your head.
How? Seemed like you complaining about fans showing up only when they're doing well which goes for pretty much every team out there.

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10-20-2013, 09:25 PM
  #308
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I loved Victorino when he was here, but it was time to move on. He was a disaster as a LHH the last couple of years. It's no coincidence he hit so well after he scrapped the whole switch hitting thing.

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10-20-2013, 10:08 PM
  #309
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I loved Victorino when he was here, but it was time to move on. He was a disaster as a LHH the last couple of years. It's no coincidence he hit so well after he scrapped the whole switch hitting thing.
Yes cause we have no need of right handed hitters on the Phillies. I was for trading Shane if we got something in return but we got nothing. You might as well kept Victorino and Pence. This year we were missing a two outfield positions and in need of right handed bats. What did we get in return for these guys? A number 5 pitcher and a catcher who can't even be a catcher anymore.

I don't care if they are over the hill or not the smartest hitters. They were still better than the pig slop that we replaced them with.

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10-20-2013, 10:08 PM
  #310
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At least we can say this, if he wins the WS again, at least he wore red while doing so.

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10-20-2013, 11:19 PM
  #311
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Yes cause we have no need of right handed hitters on the Phillies. I was for trading Shane if we got something in return but we got nothing. You might as well kept Victorino and Pence. This year we were missing a two outfield positions and in need of right handed bats. What did we get in return for these guys? A number 5 pitcher and a catcher who can't even be a catcher anymore.

I don't care if they are over the hill or not the smartest hitters. They were still better than the pig slop that we replaced them with.
I don't disagree there, but Victorino ran his course here. He was showing signs of decline and really didn't show he was worthy of a long term deal on an aging team. Ruben got something for him at least. You can say Martin is a number 5, but he's a special arm (arm not pitcher). He may flame out. He may be a great reliever. I don't have a problem taking that kind of chance. The Pence situation was the definition of mismanagement. It turned out to be an expensive rental. One you could argue wasn't even necessary. It set the franchise back a couple of years in my opinion.

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10-21-2013, 07:01 AM
  #312
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Originally Posted by StevensCakeBakerBacker View Post
At least Pitt got knocked out... It was amazing to see the emergence of Pirates fans in south central PA this year. Funny seeing all the front running Steelers/Pens fans I know around here that have been Phillies fans for the last 20 years suddenly become huge Pirates fans.

"I've always been a Pirates fan. (Insert some stupid Pirates memory from when they were a kid in order to prove their fandom). I just rooted for the Phillies cause they're also from PA".
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How? Seemed like you complaining about fans showing up only when they're doing well which goes for pretty much every team out there.
Switching teams isn't exactly the same as jumping on a bandwagon.

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I loved Victorino when he was here, but it was time to move on. He was a disaster as a LHH the last couple of years. It's no coincidence he hit so well after he scrapped the whole switch hitting thing.


I spent far too much time *****ing to my tv that he should drop the LHH, and then what happens? He goes to another team and drops the LHH....****ing kills me.

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10-21-2013, 10:11 AM
  #313
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I don't disagree there, but Victorino ran his course here. He was showing signs of decline and really didn't show he was worthy of a long term deal on an aging team. Ruben got something for him at least. You can say Martin is a number 5, but he's a special arm (arm not pitcher). He may flame out. He may be a great reliever. I don't have a problem taking that kind of chance. The Pence situation was the definition of mismanagement. It turned out to be an expensive rental. One you could argue wasn't even necessary. It set the franchise back a couple of years in my opinion.
You didn't have to give him a long term deal. Rumors were that Victorino wanted to stay and had no interest in going anywhere else, just like Utley. However, the Phillies didn't have interest in trying to work out a deal with Victorino. Just tell the guy to bat right handed and suddenly he's a fine hitter. That's the problem with this organization, they refuse to tell their players to do anything and then they allow them to get away with it.

Halladay pitching when he was obviously injured
Rollins swinging for the fences but still being given the position of leadoff hitter
Howard refusing to hit balls to the left side or figuring out what a slider looks like yet still being allowed to bat cleanup

Order them to do something and if they don't then put them down in the lineup or sit them. Victorino batted right handed this year and had a .294 average and more homeruns than all but two of our players. If someone would've just told him to do that years ago, suddenly his career is back on track.

As for Pence, everything was wrong about that. They traded too much for him originally and then they should've held onto him, but instead they traded him for nothing. Classic Ruben doing something before even thinking about it like when he traded Lee the first time.

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10-23-2013, 07:30 PM
  #314
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Terrible call already in the World Series.

Woah. Umps changed their call.

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10-23-2013, 07:32 PM
  #315
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And over turned. Thank god.

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10-23-2013, 09:02 PM
  #316
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I think the Phils need to go on a full rebuild or raise the payroll substantially. They need to go one way or the other because what they are doing now, just is not working. I understand we already have the third highest payroll, but we cannot keep trading all of our prospects to fill our roster needs. I would like to see them raise the payroll to sign some free agents so we don't have to trade our prospects. The only thing I would trade any of our top prospects for is a RH outfielder who is young and can be with the team for a long time. Otherwise fill our roster through free agency so that we can start bringing our prospects up trough the leagues.

My ideal offseason for offense would be to get a pure leadoff hitter like Ellsbury(if he makes it to FA) so we can move Rollins down to #2 or even further. And the second thing we need is that RH outfielder we have been missing since Werth and Pence. Maybe I would trade either prospects or Brown and prospects for a guy like Stanton from Miami since he is young and could be kept around for the long term.

My hopeful lineup would be

Ellsbury CF
Rollins SS
Utley 2B
Howard 1B
Stanton RF
Brown LF
Ruiz C
Asche 3B

or

Ellsbury
Utley
Stanton
Howard
Rollins
Brown
Ruiz
Asche

If we don't start raising the payroll I feel like we are going to be stuck with a middle of the pack team. I believe the above lineups could get our offense going and get us back to playoff contention.

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10-23-2013, 09:49 PM
  #317
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Maybe I would trade either prospects or Brown and prospects for a guy like Stanton from Miami since he is young and could be kept around for the long term.

If we don't start raising the payroll I feel like we are going to be stuck with a middle of the pack team. I believe the above lineups could get our offense going and get us back to playoff contention.
Yeah, you aren't getting Stanton for Brown + the prospects the Phillies have. The farm team isn't in a very good shape and other teams would offer more than what the Phils can. I see no reason the Marlins would downgrade from Stanton to Brown and a couple prospects that aren't likely to amount to much.

I don't see how raising the payroll will help. Which players out there are young enough that the contract won't look bad? Plus, with RAJ as the GM I shudder to think the kind of contract he would give out; that Howard extension looks worse and worse each year. The core and majority of the team is still compromised of aging, declining players. I think the best way to get better would be to get top, young prospects, but you have to draft at the top for those.

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10-23-2013, 10:07 PM
  #318
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Yeah, you aren't getting Stanton for Brown + the prospects the Phillies have. The farm team isn't in a very good shape and other teams would offer more than what the Phils can. I see no reason the Marlins would downgrade from Stanton to Brown and a couple prospects that aren't likely to amount to much.

I don't see how raising the payroll will help. Which players out there are young enough that the contract won't look bad? Plus, with RAJ as the GM I shudder to think the kind of contract he would give out; that Howard extension looks worse and worse each year. The core and majority of the team is still compromised of aging, declining players. I think the best way to get better would be to get top, young prospects, but you have to draft at the top for those.
So what do you think we should do? Because in all honesty the only other options i see are to blow it up or continue to be a mediocre team until this core ages out of the league. I guess we could have a good season if Howard, Utley and Rollins rebound with big years but we will still need to get a real leadoff hitter, a right handed power hitter and a lot of bullpen help.

I do think Howard will have a much better season because he will be getting healthier but we still need to upgrade this roster a lot. The outfield was terrible offensive and defensively as a whole this season

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10-24-2013, 06:45 PM
  #319
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So what do you think we should do? Because in all honesty the only other options i see are to blow it up or continue to be a mediocre team until this core ages out of the league. I guess we could have a good season if Howard, Utley and Rollins rebound with big years but we will still need to get a real leadoff hitter, a right handed power hitter and a lot of bullpen help.

I do think Howard will have a much better season because he will be getting healthier but we still need to upgrade this roster a lot. The outfield was terrible offensive and defensively as a whole this season
I think those are the only two choices there are. I highly doubt Rollins or Howard will have better years.

The fastest way would be to blow it up, but I don't think there are many teams out there that would trade good prospects for the veterans on this team unless it is for Hamels or Lee. In fact the best way might be to trade one of the aces, but then you open a hole in the rotation. Quite a predicament the Phillies are in.

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10-24-2013, 08:03 PM
  #320
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They aren't going to blow it up. They aren't getting rid of Howard and Rollins. Best hope is they raise the payroll a good amount after this new tv deal. Even if the market is mediocre there is no other options with Ruben as GM. Hope for a good offseason cause Ruben has shown he refuses to trade older guys. Otherwise, prepare to suck again.

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10-24-2013, 08:50 PM
  #321
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There is no one on this team I wouldnt trade. I guess if Ruben could ever assemble a competent bullpen, they could potentially compete for the wildcard.

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10-26-2013, 11:18 PM
  #322
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that was a crazy ending, wow.

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10-26-2013, 11:25 PM
  #323
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Where does everyone stand on that call?

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10-26-2013, 11:51 PM
  #324
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Mixed feelings. My main issue was with how far towards second base Craig was at the time he tripped. Is he still considered in the baseline there? Can you really touch third then take a step back towards second then run home and still draw an interference call?

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10-27-2013, 12:04 AM
  #325
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honestly dont know how to feel about it. what i do know is Saltalamacchia should have never thrown to 3rd and Jay should have been walked with Kozma up behind him.

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