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5 reasons why we should offer Souray around

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Old
12-12-2006, 07:02 PM
  #51
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There is no point in trading Souray unless we receive a significantly better player in return. Since this is very unlikely to happen, we're better off keeping him with the team. We're only going to trade him if we are going to miss the playoffs and not until the trade deadline.

If we always trade our upcoming UFAs because we could lose them for nothing, we'll never get anywhere.

We could lose him on the UFA market. Big deal. We can also sign UFAs. I'll admit we're at a disadvantage compared to some other markets, but that's just the way it is.

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12-12-2006, 07:03 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Catch-22 View Post
Mike,
Given your above post (UFA for UFA) , don't you think it's unlikely Edmonton will trade stoll? I think he has a year left after this one. That's another reason I thought Comrie might be a good option.
Yeah. Something would need to be added to Souray, or Souray would need to sign an extension in advance, I suppose.

It depends though. Edmonton may not consider Stoll a core player, and he is their third-line center officially. Reasoner's playing well, and I'd probably deal Souray + a good prospect for Stoll. If Edmonton wants to take a serious run this year and had some reason to believe Souray would a) be an integral piece to a run; b) sign there at a reasonable amount, I could definitely see this deal having some interest for both parties.

Regardless, it is a bit of a reach, but it's about the only type of deal I'd see as mutually beneficial in the case of Souray.

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Old
12-12-2006, 07:32 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Yeah. Something would need to be added to Souray, or Souray would need to sign an extension in advance, I suppose.
My understanding is that in the NHL other teams can't negotiate with players prior to the trade. So you can't get the sign-and-trade type deals you get in the NBA.
Now, I'm sure that Montreal could negotiate an extension while having a trade in place, contacting the team for negotiations, but I've never heard of this happening in the NHL.

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Old
12-12-2006, 07:38 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Catch-22, Resident Rejean Houle of the HFBoards Habs Board
To Phoenix: Souray, Samsonov and Aebischer.
To Montreal: Mike Comrie and Keith Ballard.
Mike Comrie?!

Quote:
Originally Posted by TSN's Scouting Report on Mike Comrie
Flaws: Doesn't have ideal NHL size. Must put his Edmonton ordeal behind him. Needs to work on his play without the puck.
A small defensive liability as our second line centre? Is this just so you can post incessently about him and his flaws once he gets here? Do you miss Ribeiro or something?

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12-12-2006, 08:03 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by RedScull View Post
My understanding is that in the NHL other teams can't negotiate with players prior to the trade. So you can't get the sign-and-trade type deals you get in the NBA.
Now, I'm sure that Montreal could negotiate an extension while having a trade in place, contacting the team for negotiations, but I've never heard of this happening in the NHL.
It happens. Remember the Havlat deal? The minute he was dealt to Chicago, he signed an extension.

That was in the off-season, but it's the same principal.

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Old
12-13-2006, 09:25 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Catch-22 View Post
1) Souray has outperformed himself to this point, meaning he has done better up until now than he will do for the rest of the season. He's not going to score 25-30 goals, so his value is higher now than it will probably ever be again. I agree with this and will address everything else

2) The Habs need to improve their mobility on defense. Souray is an offensive contributor but he is slow and not very good defensively; a -8.Most of his points were on the PP. PP doesn't count for +/-. Realistically he's more of a +4

3) Souray is injury prone. He will inevitably miss some time this season. He might even miss tonight's game due to injury. So again, he may be worth more now than at any time again.Hasn't had a serious injury all year. Has had a minor injury. But I see your point.

4) While we do need the offense that Souray brings, it would be better if that offense came from a more productive centre and if our defense was more sound in its own end.We need people who can shoot from the point. All though sometimes I see Souray + Broken Stick, still. We can easily bring up Lapierre or Kostitsyn if we need a bit more offensive depth. They certainly both would do better then Downey/Murray and it seems, Begin as well.

5) Souray becomes a UFA at the end of this season. While this does hurt his trade value, there remains the real possibility that he wants to be closer to his daughter in CA. If there is any truth to that, we better trade him soon because (a) we don't want to lose hom for nothing Trueand (b) he is worth more now with 50 games left than he is with 30 games left in the season.Not True. At the deadline a team looking for a rebuild season will pick him up for sure. Either that or a team looking to win the cup who needs a big D will trade for him A trade at the deadline is the only exception, but that would be a gamble because you would have to bank that on his production remaining consistent until then and on his health. You'd also have to hope that the ideal centre is available at that time and you would miss your opportunity if that player were to become available before the deadline.Your right, it would be a gamble. But right now it would be a waste of $ to trade him because he hasn't proven consistency. If he plays well all year up until the deadline with no serious injuries, he'll have a super inflated value and we can pick up somebody like a nice 2nd line C in trade with a team that needs better D or has too many stay at home D

To Phoenix: Souray, Samsonov and Aebischer.Possibly the worst trade offer I've seen on this forum period.
A) Samsanov will be great for the playoffs
B) Souray alone will get us something good, why package him.
To Montreal: Mike Comrie and Keith Ballard.


If anything JUST Sammy + Abby in a package. Or Souray alone.

I'd say we could probably pick somebody really good up for Souray @ Deadline.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Souray would take a pay cut to work in California. Meaning teams of that region might be willing to giveup somebody good for Souray. With the entire NHL knowing Souray's situation, it doesn't put him in a very good position to get good pay in California. I'm sure a team like SJ/ANA/LA would be able to pick him up for 4.0mill next season. Anywhere else close to 5.5+

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Old
12-13-2006, 09:26 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Yeah. Something would need to be added to Souray, or Souray would need to sign an extension in advance, I suppose.

It depends though. Edmonton may not consider Stoll a core player, and he is their third-line center officially. Reasoner's playing well, and I'd probably deal Souray + a good prospect for Stoll. If Edmonton wants to take a serious run this year and had some reason to believe Souray would a) be an integral piece to a run; b) sign there at a reasonable amount, I could definitely see this deal having some interest for both parties.

Regardless, it is a bit of a reach, but it's about the only type of deal I'd see as mutually beneficial in the case of Souray.

I agree that Edmonton may not consider him a core player and one of the advantages to your proposal is that it still leaves us with Aebischer as deadline bait. One of the other advantages is that Edmonton's depth at centre makes it more likely that they wouldn't require a third line centre in return as part of the deal. As you highlighted though, Edmonton would have to think that Souray would be instrumental in some playoff run this year because, despite being from Elk Point, I don't know if that's where he wants to be any more than Montreal come the offseason.

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12-13-2006, 12:29 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Catch-22 View Post
I agree that Edmonton may not consider him a core player and one of the advantages to your proposal is that it still leaves us with Aebischer as deadline bait. One of the other advantages is that Edmonton's depth at centre makes it more likely that they wouldn't require a third line centre in return as part of the deal. As you highlighted though, Edmonton would have to think that Souray would be instrumental in some playoff run this year because, despite being from Elk Point, I don't know if that's where he wants to be any more than Montreal come the offseason.
Aebischer is no Roloson. We're not going to get value for him at the deadline, and we'd be better off having him around for the playoffs anyway. When Huet goes cold, it lasts for a couple games. We need someone else in net.

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Old
12-13-2006, 12:38 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by RedScull View Post
Aebischer is no Roloson. We're not going to get value for him at the deadline, and we'd be better off having him around for the playoffs anyway. When Huet goes cold, it lasts for a couple games. We need someone else in net.
I'm just not sure it's necessary, with Danis and Halak in Hamilton. Both are probably better than Aebischer already.

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12-13-2006, 01:05 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Catch-22 View Post
I agree that Edmonton may not consider him a core player and one of the advantages to your proposal is that it still leaves us with Aebischer as deadline bait. One of the other advantages is that Edmonton's depth at centre makes it more likely that they wouldn't require a third line centre in return as part of the deal. As you highlighted though, Edmonton would have to think that Souray would be instrumental in some playoff run this year because, despite being from Elk Point, I don't know if that's where he wants to be any more than Montreal come the offseason.
Has there been any indication that Stoll isn't part of Edmonton's core ? I like Stoll, and he'd be a great acquisition, but I don't see why Edmonton does this. Sykora's there on a 1 year isn't he ?

The only way I'd look to deal Souray is to improve this year,this playoff, and while I see you've put thought and effort into it, I just don't see a fit. I don't like the Comrie idea, to me he stereotypes a player you clearly disdain, so I find that an odd idea.

I don't see Souray as as bad a d man as some, and I just haven't seen anything that I think makes sense from 2 teams pov. Not that it couldn't , I just don't see it.

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12-13-2006, 01:18 PM
  #61
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5 Reasons We Should Keep Souray

5 Reasons We Should Keep Souray

1. Power Play, his presence makes opposing teams play high up to the blue line to keep him from getting his shot off which leaves our forwards more room to make plays, if teams play low on the PK then we feed Souray the puck and he fires a few. This affects the whole dynamic of our PP and is invaluable.

2. Toughness : Get rid of Souray and you will immediately see Huet/Aebi in trouble with net crashers. Yes we have other tough guys on the team but Souray has definitely taken that role upon himself and does a good job at it.

3. Character : Many posters will say this is "unknown" because we aren't in the locker room but all one has to do is listen to RDS "son et images" when Souray is wearing the mic and you can see that he's a natural leader type player.

4. Trade Value : Every GM knows he's a free agent at the end of the season...so the same reason you've given for wanting to shop him is the same reason we won't get what he's worth. You don't mortgage a team for a Rental player, which is what Souray would be to any team looking to acquire him.

5. To spite people who start threads about trading a key player for bogus reasons.

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Old
12-13-2006, 01:30 PM
  #62
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Players contribute in three areas... in the offensive zone, in the defensive zone and in the dressing room. Evaluating the third factor is the most difficult of all but when I see Souray being interviewed I always get the impression that he is a positive influence on the team.

I would like to see him stay for as long as possible.

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