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Could Weber be trade. Alternate route proposal

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Old
10-29-2013, 10:05 AM
  #26
Persona5
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
It would depend when and why the trade occurs. If it happened this afternoon, I'd believe Poile was on his way for a mental evaluation. If it's in several years, Jones developed as hoped, Josi and / or Klein remain solid members of the blueline, the pipeline is restocked ... then maybe it makes sense to trade Weber.
One of Weber/Jones/Klein/Ellis will be traded within 3 years. My bet is it won't be Weber or Jones although if Jones will be playing at a level that demands a high end contract things could change on Weber.

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10-29-2013, 10:18 AM
  #27
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Phabs, why trade for more defense? We need offense not defense. If we trade for RNH like you suggest, if he goes down with an injury we have no offense to show for it and we've added two d in your proposal. Top 3 forward, top 6 forward and 1st round pick or top 6 forward prospect. We are looking to add significant offensive pieces. We wouldn't need top 4 defense. Bottom pairing defense is easier to get and we would be set with jones Josi Klein and Ekholm in the top 4.

As far as money goes, as v82 says, it isn't our money, don't worry about it. If it makes the team better short and long term and we have the ability to attract bigger name free agents because they know we want to win you make the deal.

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10-29-2013, 01:58 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Persona5 View Post
One of Weber/Jones/Klein/Ellis will be traded within 3 years. My bet is it won't be Weber or Jones although if Jones will be playing at a level that demands a high end contract things could change on Weber.
Josi?

Jones probably won't be on the block. If Weber can return what we all want then he could be, but I don't think many teams have what it takes.

It's much easier to just trade Josi/Ellis/Ekholm and a 1st and get a good young forward than trade our best player and start from scratch.

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Old
10-29-2013, 02:16 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Soundgarden View Post
Josi?

Jones probably won't be on the block. If Weber can return what we all want then he could be, but I don't think many teams have what it takes.

It's much easier to just trade Josi/Ellis/Ekholm and a 1st and get a good young forward than trade our best player and start from scratch.
As much as Trotz loves his D oriented playstyle I do not see him wanting to keep defensemen on their offhand long term. Nashville will not move one of their left handed D. It will be a righty that goes if anyone does.

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10-29-2013, 04:04 PM
  #30
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As much as Trotz loves his D oriented playstyle I do not see him wanting to keep defensemen on their offhand long term. Nashville will not move one of their left handed D. It will be a righty that goes if anyone does.
Hamhuis/Timonen

Hamhuis/Eaton

Zidlicky/York




All of these were pairs for long periods of time under Trotz. Heck one of our first consistant pairings was Boughner and Berehowsky, both are right handed.

I can name less right/left pairs under Trotz than I can same handed pairs.

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10-30-2013, 03:32 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
As far as money goes, as v82 says, it isn't our money, don't worry about it. If it makes the team better short and long term and we have the ability to attract bigger name free agents because they know we want to win you make the deal.
One more major minor detail I left out is the Nhl recapture penalty. He must be traded sooner than later or we will not like it. The following is five differant time frames we could trade Weber. Pay close attention to how our part of the penalty goes up the more we pay of his salary. The first one is if we trade him today we would only face 3+ million dollar cap hit for three years but the last two are down the road like you are wanting us to trade him causes us to take on a 8+ and 9+ million dollar cap hit for three years. This is just an example of what could happen if he retires when he is 37.

If Shea Weber retires or defects in the 2023 off-season (age 37 as of July 1 that year), and was traded to the Edmonton Oilers 15 percent of the way through the 2013-14 season, following is an estimated breakdown of the recapture penalties for the involved teams.
Nashville Predators (2023-24 through 2025-26)
$3,788,095 x 3 years
Edmonton Oilers (2023-24 through 2025-26) $3,069,048 x 3years

If Shea Weber retires or defects in the 2023 off-season (age 37 as of July 1 that year), and was traded to the Edmonton Oilers 66 percent of the way through the 2013-14 season, following is an estimated breakdown of the recapture penalties for the involved teams.


Nashville Predators (2023-24 through 2025-26) $2,743,810 x 3years
Edmonton Oilers (2023-24 through 2025-26) $4,113,333 x 3years

If Shea Weber retires or defects in the 2023 off-season (age 37 as of July 1 that year), and was traded to the Edmonton Oilers 66 percent of the way through the 2014-15 season, following is an estimated breakdown of the recapture penalties for the involved teams.
Nashville Predators (2023-24 through 2025-26) $4,791,429 x 3years
Edmonton Oilers (2023-24 through 2025-26) $2,065,714 x 3years

If Shea Weber retires or defects in the 2023 off-season (age 37 as of July 1 that year), and was traded to the Edmonton Oilers in the 2016 off-season, following is an estimated breakdown of the recapture penalties for the involved teams.
Nashville Predators (2023-24 through 2025-26) $8,190,476 x 3years
Edmonton Oilers (2023-24 through 2025-26)
$0 x 3years

If Shea Weber retires or defects in the 2023 off-season (age 37 as of July 1 that year), and was traded to the Edmonton Oilers in the 2017 off-season, following is an estimated breakdown of the recapture penalties for the involved teams.
Nashville Predators (2023-24 through 2025-26) $9,571,429 x 3years
Edmonton Oilers (2023-24 through 2025-26)
$0 x 3years


IF/When he is traded it will be this year. Yes it is not our money but that money we are throwing at him could be spent on offense.
Wondering how others would fill depending on what we got in a Weber deal would you feel comfortable trading Josi or Klein as well?


Last edited by predshabs: 10-30-2013 at 07:17 AM.
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Old
10-30-2013, 08:42 AM
  #32
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So now we need to trade Weber immediately just in case he decides to retire in 10 years to save potential cap space, not real dollars?

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Old
10-30-2013, 08:47 AM
  #33
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What if he asks for a trade? Which I could see him doing. Poile has stated he would accomadate a player who asked for a trade a la Erat. If it gets out that he wants to be traded, Poile will get bent over.

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10-30-2013, 08:57 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
So now we need to trade Weber immediately just in case he decides to retire in 10 years to save potential cap space, not real dollars?
Your missing the point. Others stated waiting two to three years, that is my argument against that. If you are planning on trading him in two to three years you are better off doing it now or never because the more of his salary we pay the worse off the cap recapture will be. I do not know about most teams but I would believe three years of 8-9 million dollars would put a damper on us then even though cap will probably be up there then.

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10-30-2013, 09:35 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by predshabs View Post
Your missing the point. Others stated waiting two to three years, that is my argument against that. If you are planning on trading him in two to three years you are better off doing it now or never because the more of his salary we pay the worse off the cap recapture will be. I do not know about most teams but I would believe three years of 8-9 million dollars would put a damper on us then even though cap will probably be up there then.
Trading him out of a fear that he might retire at some point before his contract ends is the wrong motivation. The only reason to trade him is because the real benefits and costs are comparable and the front office believes that the potential exists for the benefits to eventually outweigh the costs.

The entire reason people are saying to wait a couple of years is because the team simply does not have the depth on the blueline to lose Weber without a defender coming back. Jones is playing well through his first 12 games, but, it is an extremely small sample size. Josi hasn't returned from his concussion and the risk of cumulative effects is a concern. Ekholm is playing ok on the second pair, but, he needs another year or two of development before he solidifies as a 2nd pair defender.

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10-30-2013, 02:00 PM
  #36
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In 10 years, that 7.8 cap hit will probably be top line dman caps but not top 5 in their position money anyway. Even if we did eat some cap 10 years from now, it will not be that big of a deal

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10-30-2013, 10:18 PM
  #37
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Please stop the trade Weber crap!!! He is the face of the Franchise, and there is nothing coming back that will ever be worth giving him up right now. Attendance will drop if Weber leaves because everyone will know the team has given up.


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10-31-2013, 12:28 AM
  #38
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Trading him out of a fear that he might retire at some point before his contract ends is the wrong motivation. The only reason to trade him is because the real benefits and costs are comparable and the front office believes that the potential exists for the benefits to eventually outweigh the costs.

The entire reason people are saying to wait a couple of years is because the team simply does not have the depth on the blueline to lose Weber without a defender coming back. Jones is playing well through his first 12 games, but, it is an extremely small sample size. Josi hasn't returned from his concussion and the risk of cumulative effects is a concern. Ekholm is playing ok on the second pair, but, he needs another year or two of development before he solidifies as a 2nd pair defender.
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
So now we need to trade Weber immediately just in case he decides to retire in 10 years to save potential cap space, not real dollars?
My reasons have nothing to do with fear.
It does not make since to pay the man any further IF trading him is inevitable.

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10-31-2013, 12:37 AM
  #39
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Please stop the trade Weber crap!!! He is the face of the Franchise, and there is nothing coming back that will ever be worth giving him up right now. Attendance will drop if Weber leaves because everyone will know the team has given up.
Attendance will go down if we continue to lose 6-1 as well. We need a change. Changing the Coach will not do it, he gets the most out of our players. Gm will not do it he can only sign people willing to come to nashville. So the only thing left is the players. Weber will fetch us a 2-3 pieces to try and fix the problem. I know it may not happen but who knows. If not someone will be moved to add some offense.

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10-31-2013, 08:04 AM
  #40
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My reasons have nothing to do with fear.
It does not make since to pay the man any further IF trading him is inevitable.
Your statement that his trade is "inevitable" is based on assumption, not fact. So is the attempted justification that even if we were to trade him, he would retire early leaving a potential recapture situation so it has to be immediate. Then there is the further assumption that Edmonton, your single trade partner of choice presented here, would part with the players you listed such as their top center (they'd have Gordon, Acton, and Acrobello as their top three without RNH).

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10-31-2013, 09:15 AM
  #41
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Please stop the trade Weber crap!!! He is the face of the Franchise, and there is nothing coming back that will ever be worth giving him up right now. Attendance will drop if Weber leaves because everyone will know the team has given up.
I agree. Our D is pretty solid with little in the cupboard.
Wilson, Bourque, Stalberg, Cullen, Hendricks, Clune, Spaling, etc. aren't producing. (at least Goose is valuable in the FO circle)
The team is built to grind and defend, like it or not. (Preds hockey)

Trading Weber makes little sense, especially with no forward spots available and Beck/Watson on deck.
Hes' consistently one of our top point leaders and currently has more goals than everyone not named Hornqvist.

jmo

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10-31-2013, 09:43 AM
  #42
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I agree. Our D is pretty solid with little in the cupboard.
Wilson, Bourque, Stalberg, Cullen, Hendricks, Clune, Spaling, etc. aren't producing. (at least Goose is valuable in the FO circle)
The team is built to grind and defend, like it or not. (Preds hockey)

Trading Weber makes little sense, especially with no forward spots available and Beck/Watson on deck.
Hes' consistently one of our top point leaders and currently has more goals than everyone not named Hornqvist.

jmo
Yep, good post. In other words, if we traded Weber, the biggest team need would be......Weber.

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10-31-2013, 10:38 AM
  #43
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So.....can we play anyway?
i dont expect it to happen for either team since we just named Spezza captain, and he's a UFA next year - while as many have said Weber is the face of the franchise.
However assuming a signed spezza at $7 million for 5 or 6 years.

Spezza and LHD Wiercioch for Weber.

Gives you the true #1 center it appears is the top priority and a good young LS puck moving defenceman.

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10-31-2013, 11:26 AM
  #44
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So.....can we play anyway?
i dont expect it to happen for either team since we just named Spezza captain, and he's a UFA next year - while as many have said Weber is the face of the franchise.
However assuming a signed spezza at $7 million for 5 or 6 years.

Spezza and LHD Wiercioch for Weber.

Gives you the true #1 center it appears is the top priority and a good young LS puck moving defenceman.
As good a player as he is, Spezza, at 30, is an unattractive return in a Weber trade. I'd only consider trading Weber if we get a legitimate, young, top line forward (center) back in the deal.

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10-31-2013, 10:05 PM
  #45
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Attendance will go down if we continue to lose 6-1 as well. We need a change. Changing the Coach will not do it, he gets the most out of our players. Gm will not do it he can only sign people willing to come to nashville. So the only thing left is the players. Weber will fetch us a 2-3 pieces to try and fix the problem. I know it may not happen but who knows. If not someone will be moved to add some offense.
There would never be anything coming back as good as Weber, Unless it's Crosby. You would create more issues than it's worth. Let's Trade Weber for Yak, Nurse and 2 1st's sounds good on Paper, but What happens in 3 years when Yak Bolts for the KHL, Nurse doesn't turn out as projected, and the 2 1st's are mid and late round picks that don't pan out. Then we are left with nothing while watching Weber win the Norris and lead his team to the Cup and in 20 years when he's going into the HOF as a Oiler he thanks the Preds for making one of the worst trades in history. I'm going cliche on you and saying "A bird in hand is better then 2 in the bush"


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11-01-2013, 03:30 AM
  #46
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I agree. Our D is pretty solid with little in the cupboard.
Wilson, Bourque, Stalberg, Cullen, Hendricks, Clune, Spaling, etc. aren't producing. (at least Goose is valuable in the FO circle)
The team is built to grind and defend, like it or not. (Preds hockey)

Trading Weber makes little sense, especially with no forward spots available and Beck/Watson on deck.
Hes' consistently one of our top point leaders and currently has more goals than everyone not named Hornqvist.

jmo
The best response you have is we have no forward spots available, really? I could think of plenty of them, like the whole top line as of right now.

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There would never be anything coming back as good as Weber, Unless it's Crosby. You would create more issues than it's worth. Let's Trade Weber for Yak, Nurse and 2 1st's sounds good on Paper, but What happens in 3 years when Yak Bolts for the KHL, Nurse doesn't turn out as projected, and the 2 1st's are mid and late round picks that don't pan out. Then we are left with nothing while watching Weber win the Norris and lead his team to the Cup and in 20 years when he's going into the HOF as a Oiler he thanks the Preds for making one of the worst trades in history. I'm going cliche on you and saying "A bird in hand is better then 2 in the bush"
I have never said anything about Nurse,Yak, and 2 firsts.

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Old
11-01-2013, 07:42 AM
  #47
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I have never said anything about Nurse,Yak, and 2 firsts.
I did not say you did. I'm just giving you a hypothetical trade proposal that I have seen. Other than Crosby there is no one I want. Young offensive studs would be nice to have but Trotz ruins them. Name one player coming back that is as good as Weber?

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11-02-2013, 03:21 AM
  #48
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I did not say you did. I'm just giving you a hypothetical trade proposal that I have seen. Other than Crosby there is no one I want. Young offensive studs would be nice to have but Trotz ruins them. Name one player coming back that is as good as Weber?
Lets think about this. Lets use my trade proposal of Weber for Eberle,Gagner,Nurse.

Eberle and Gagner would add a top line RW and a #2 Center(#1 on our team as of now).
Eberle would fit in here pretty good anyways he is good on the defensive side as well as offensive.
Nurse gives you another LHD that could balance out our top four if we trade Weber. Check out some videos of this kid he is awesome.

None of these players are Weber but they are three pieces that would go along way to making this team better and best of all they are all still young.

Who knows if Weber will be traded or not but I believe he could fetch us some pieces we need to add here for the future if we want to see a Stanley cup here. Think about how good Josi(if the concussions do not get him) and Jones are. We would not have to depend on Weber to be our top point producers if you added some other pieces not to mention we have some decent offensive players in the system.

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11-02-2013, 09:59 AM
  #49
Gnashville
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Lets think about this. Lets use my trade proposal of Weber for Eberle,Gagner,Nurse.

Eberle and Gagner would add a top line RW and a #2 Center(#1 on our team as of now).
Eberle would fit in here pretty good anyways he is good on the defensive side as well as offensive.
Nurse gives you another LHD that could balance out our top four if we trade Weber. Check out some videos of this kid he is awesome.

None of these players are Weber but they are three pieces that would go along way to making this team better and best of all they are all still young.

Who knows if Weber will be traded or not but I believe he could fetch us some pieces we need to add here for the future if we want to see a Stanley cup here. Think about how good Josi(if the concussions do not get him) and Jones are. We would not have to depend on Weber to be our top point producers if you added some other pieces not to mention we have some decent offensive players in the system.
Gagner is another Legwand
Eberle is just fodder for Trotz's doghouse
and Nurse is a goon all the highlights I saw are of him fighting

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