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What happened in Buffalo?

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Old
11-02-2013, 08:16 PM
  #76
CarpeNoctem
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Step 1)Suck, tank for 2 yrs aka allow talent to develop, then draft McDavid
Step 2)Sign some good vets in two years
Step 3)Win games

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Old
11-02-2013, 08:21 PM
  #77
MayDay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarpeNoctem View Post
Step 1)Suck, tank for 2 yrs aka allow talent to develop, then draft McDavid
Step 2)Sign some good vets in two years
Step 3)Win games
Can't bank on McDavid, and I don't think the Sabres are.

Even if you finish dead last in the league, odds are still 75% that some other team is going to win the lottery and draft him. Under the new lottery system, the worst team only has a 1-in-4 chance of keeping the #1 pick.

I think the Sabres are just trying to accumulate as many high picks (1st & 2nd round) as possible, without counting on drafting any particular player.

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11-02-2013, 08:29 PM
  #78
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It's amazing that they say what was happening to Ristolainen and not only kept him in the lineup for reasons that boggle the mind but are now throwing Zadorov into the fire as well. Ristolainen is so helplessly outmatched it's hard to watch and they're burning a year of his ELC and jeopardizing a development of arguably their most important prospect.

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11-02-2013, 08:30 PM
  #79
smitty10
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Originally Posted by Dubi Doo View Post
I agree to a degree,but it's unfair to compare buffalo's tank to edmontons. Edmonton has completely neglected their blueline while buffalo may have the deepest prospect pool of defensive depth. Also all of Buffalo's rookies aren't playing in roles they cent handle. Edmonton forced top 6 minutes to all their rookies . Your comparison is faulty and narrow minded.
I think there are quite a few young players that are playing in the NHL that should be in the AHL. They may not be playing top 6 minutes, but they're still playing in a role they aren't ready for.

You are right that there aren't too many similarities in the positions of the players being picked by Buffalo, but Edmonton was a team of young players that have done nothing but lose at the NHL level. Hopefully for Buffalo's sake they can turn it around. These kids are going to go through a very tough few years of losing the VAST majority of the games they play. They could very well have the same reaction as Edmonton has. Only time will tell, but I really don't think they will be successful with this if they don't get McDavid.

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11-02-2013, 08:31 PM
  #80
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They are rebuilding. This has been happening since the Gaustad trade. The one Miller was so upset about.

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11-02-2013, 09:16 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by quentez View Post
(How did Ville Leino become a 4th liner?)
Most likely around the same time he started playing like one around 2 seasons + 10 games ago.

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Old
11-02-2013, 09:30 PM
  #82
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Buffalo still hasn't recovered from losing their top two centers and #1 defenseman in the span of two years back in 2007 and 2008. They got nothing for Briere, Drury, and Campbell.

Regier dropped the ball hard on the Briere/Drury situation and the franchise is still paying for it. Losing your top two centers for zero return will cripple a franchise for years, the effects we're still seeing today.

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11-02-2013, 09:48 PM
  #83
MayDay
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Originally Posted by Richie10 View Post
Buffalo still hasn't recovered from losing their top two centers and #1 defenseman in the span of two years back in 2007 and 2008. They got nothing for Briere, Drury, and Campbell.
Bolded isn't true.

Campbell was traded at the deadline to San Jose for Steve Bernier and a 2008 first round pick that became Tyler Ennis. Bernier was subsequently traded to Vancouver for a 2009 third round pick (Brayden McNabb) and a 2010 second round pick. The 2010 pick was packaged with Nathan Paetsch to Columbus in exchange for Raffi Torres. Torres later left Buffalo as a free agent.

So to sum up, in exchange for Brian Campbell, the Sabres got Tyler Ennis and Brayden McNabb, as well as stints of play from Steve Bernier and Raffi Torres.

By the way, it was actually San Jose who lost Campbell for nothing. After sending Bernier and their first-round pick to Buffalo for Campbell, the Sharks failed to sign him to an extension, and he walked as a free agent a few months later.

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Old
11-02-2013, 09:51 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie10 View Post
Regier dropped the ball hard on the Briere/Drury situation and the franchise is still paying for it. Losing your top two centers for zero return will cripple a franchise for years, the effects we're still seeing today.
Larry Quinn had a strict policy to not talk about contract extensions during the season. It's rumored that Regier had similar 5 year 25 Million contracts on the table for both of them and was told to hold off on them until after the season. The Drury one in particular was agreed on by both sides. I'm not sure about Briere.

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11-02-2013, 10:23 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by blankall View Post
You should never rebuild from the defense out. It's way too hard to predict who will develop into a top pairing dman. Forwards are much easier to predict.
Strongly disagree. Dmen take a lot longer to develop, and you need some core guys to build around. I really like Risto, Zad, Pysyk & McCabe. Not all will make it, but the more good prospects you have the better the chances.

Bottom line is that a bunch of the kids need to develop. Take the BPA and start filling holes. It'll take time but they need to be patient.

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11-02-2013, 10:43 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moskau View Post
Larry Quinn had a strict policy to not talk about contract extensions during the season. It's rumored that Regier had similar 5 year 25 Million contracts on the table for both of them and was told to hold off on them until after the season. The Drury one in particular was agreed on by both sides. I'm not sure about Briere.
Based on his public comments, I think it's pretty clear that Briere would have taken the 5x5 deal if it had been made during the season. The question is - if we had extended Briere and Drury, what would have happened with Vanek?

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11-02-2013, 11:34 PM
  #87
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They're in tank mode. They need it. Have accumulated a good glut of prospects in the last couple years. Now they need a top 3-calibre pick, or two.

Only concern is playing so many young players, when there may be a concern of rushing their development.

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11-02-2013, 11:41 PM
  #88
gallagt01
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Originally Posted by Ishdul View Post
It's amazing that they say what was happening to Ristolainen and not only kept him in the lineup for reasons that boggle the mind but are now throwing Zadorov into the fire as well. Ristolainen is so helplessly outmatched it's hard to watch and they're burning a year of his ELC and jeopardizing a development of arguably their most important prospect.
What are you talking about? Ristolainen hasn't looked out of place at all. He's looked pretty good for an 18-year-old rookie, actually.

Zadorov is getting his nine-game look and will likely be sent down when he reaches that limit.

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11-02-2013, 11:41 PM
  #89
WarriorofTime
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Originally Posted by hockeywoot View Post
They're in tank mode. They need it. Have accumulated a good glut of prospects in the last couple years. Now they need a top 3-calibre pick, or two.

Only concern is playing so many young players, when there may be a concern of rushing their development.
The ones who are good will make it and the ones who aren't will bust, but not because they were rushed which people will claim but because prospects bust. Players drafted in the 8-16 range Grigorenko, Girgensons, Ristolainen, and Zadorov) are hardly can't miss prospects. If they all make it that'd be a huge shock. But as long as they don't all miss they should be ok with lots of other prospects and picks in the system. What they really need to add is a bonafide blue chipper that you typically find in the Top 3 of drafts. They remind me a bit of the Hawks right before adding Kane and Toews. Lots of 1st and 2nd round picks and young players on a bad roster.

It's tough to say what effect rushing a prospect has on his longterm development. Nino Niederreiter seems to be getting it together in Minnesota. Malhotra went on to have a very productive career. These are the two most obvious examples I can point to and say a player that was clearly rushed. Lots of other players that appeared to be rushed and flat out busted may have just busted anyways. After all, lots of once highly thought of prospects toil in Juniors or the minors or overseas and never make an impact in the NHL.

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11-02-2013, 11:42 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarpeNoctem View Post
Step 1)Suck, tank for 2 yrs aka allow talent to develop, then draft McDavid
Step 2)Sign some good vets in two years
Step 3)Win games
It doesn't work. Believe me, I'm an Oiler fan.

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11-02-2013, 11:46 PM
  #91
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Hands on owner?

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11-02-2013, 11:47 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Xoto86 View Post
It doesn't work. Believe me, I'm an Oiler fan.
Not everytime sure, but it works more often than signing 30+ year old past their prime free agents to a massive contract, and trading away picks for similar players and finish 9th every year.

Trust me I'm a Leafs fan, we did that for years

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11-02-2013, 11:50 PM
  #93
Ishdul
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Originally Posted by gallagt01 View Post
What are you talking about? Ristolainen hasn't looked out of place at all. He's looked pretty good for an 18-year-old rookie, actually.

Zadorov is getting his nine-game look and will likely be sent down when he reaches that limit.
I'm talking about Rasmus Ristolainen, who in short evaluation has looked like the single worst non-enforcer playing right now and has looked absolutely lost every time I've seen him. On a team that might be one of the worst teams of all time he sticks out as particularly worrisome.

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11-02-2013, 11:51 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Ishdul View Post
I'm talking about Rasmus Ristolainen, who in short evaluation has looked like the single worst non-enforcer playing right now and has looked absolutely lost every time I've seen him. On a team that might be one of the worst teams of all time he sticks out as particularly worrisome.
I know you're talking about Ristolainen. Your analysis of his play -- and most Sabres fans would agree -- is terribly off. He's been fine. Nobody is worried about him at all.

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11-03-2013, 12:38 AM
  #95
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Shouldn't have kept Vanek after he signed that offer sheet with Edmonton. It was the beginning of the end.
I could not believe the Sabres matched that offer. I know Drury and Briere just left but for 4 first rounders you go sign a UFA for christs sakes.

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Old
11-03-2013, 12:41 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by hockeywoot View Post
They're in tank mode. They need it. Have accumulated a good glut of prospects in the last couple years. Now they need a top 3-calibre pick, or two.

Only concern is playing so many young players, when there may be a concern of rushing their development.
Their prospects are all 12 to 25th and second rounders. Only 1 guy is top 10. And he was 8th. I guess Hodgson is 10th as well.

You cant stock your team with mid to low first rounders and expect a dynasty . If they sell off Ott and Miller, they will have utterly nobody left to raise their prospects.

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Old
11-03-2013, 09:14 AM
  #97
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Any team who has 4 underagers up at the same time (and none of them are the elite, blue chip type) seriously needs to re-evaluate their organization.

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11-03-2013, 09:21 AM
  #98
MayDay
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Originally Posted by HughJanus View Post
Any team who has 4 underagers up at the same time (and none of them are the elite, blue chip type) seriously needs to re-evaluate their organization.
Q: And how can the Sabres obtain those elite, blue chip types?

A: By doing what they're doing right now.

Seems to me the Sabres have re-evaluated their previous strategy (trying to patch up a shoddy core through free agency). They know they need those elite players you mentioned. But they can't attract them as free agents and they can't trade for them. So they are trying to get them the only other way they can.

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11-03-2013, 09:26 AM
  #99
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uh let's see.

# of times the Sabres have had a top 5 pick since 1987:2.

So gee, we finally decide to tank and be a scrub team like 80% of the teams have done since 1987 and they get called out on it... Get real. The Sabres are gunning for back to back top 2 overall draft picks. And that's fine by me

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11-03-2013, 09:50 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by MayDay View Post
Q: And how can the Sabres obtain those elite, blue chip types?

A: By doing what they're doing right now.

Seems to me the Sabres have re-evaluated their previous strategy (trying to patch up a shoddy core through free agency). They know they need those elite players you mentioned. But they can't attract them as free agents and they can't trade for them. So they are trying to get them the only other way they can.
My point is not obtaining those blue chip players, my point is that they are most likely destroying the prospects they have. If getting McDavid is so important, dress AHL plugs for two years, don't bring up teenagers into this cesspool with no leadership.

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