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Weekly Feature #3 - 10 Worst Trades/Draft Picks of all-time

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Old
12-08-2006, 12:18 AM
  #51
Amateur Hour
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Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth View Post
Adam Oates: 19 games as a Flyer, 12 points

Martin Vagner: 0 NHL games
Maxime Daigneault: 0 NHL games
Derek Krestanovich: 0 NHL games
Maxime Ouellet: 12 NHL games, 2 W

Try to say that the Flyers lost this trade. I dare you.
Who's to say we would have made those same exact flop picks?

Here's a list of a few draft picks made right after Vagner (1st round) who are now NHL regulars: Jim Slater (ATL), Jarret Stoll (EDM), Trevor Daley (DAL), Duncan Keith (CHI), Matthew Stajan (TOR). Heck, even Hannu Toivonen (BOS) is a very promising goalie prospect, even though he's had his struggles recently.

Here's a list of a few draft picks made right after Daigneault (2nd round) who are now NHL regulars: Ole-Kristian Tollefsen (CLB), Erik Christensen (PIT), Matthew Lombardi (CGY)

There were also a bunch of draft picks made after Krestanovich who have turned out to be NHL regulars (Paul Ranger of TB, Jaroslav Balastik of CLB, Petr Prucha of NYR, Maxime Talbot of PIT, Stefan Kronwall of TOR, to name some). Yes, hindsight is 20/20 and there is no way of knowing if the Flyers would have picked any of the players I listed. However, my point remains: trading 1st, 2nd, AND 3rd round picks for a 39-year-old rent-a-center is a terrible deal, I don't care how desperate you are. I refuse to believe there wasn't another player available at the deadline who wouldn't have cost much less. Most of my fellow Flyers fans were irate when trade was made then and still consider it to be one of Clarke's most myopic moves during his tenure as GM.

Sure, this trade didn't come back to bite us when you look at the players that OTHER TEAMS selected with the picks... but who knows what players we would have selected? Yeah, yeah, it was a weak draft, but weak or not, every draft still produces its fair share of solid NHLers.

So, in conclusion, I'll accept your dare... The Flyers LOST this trade.



Last edited by Amateur Hour: 12-08-2006 at 12:24 AM.
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Old
12-08-2006, 02:41 PM
  #52
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Who's to say we would have made those same exact flop picks?

Here's a list of a few draft picks made right after Vagner (1st round) who are now NHL regulars: Jim Slater (ATL), Jarret Stoll (EDM), Trevor Daley (DAL), Duncan Keith (CHI), Matthew Stajan (TOR). Heck, even Hannu Toivonen (BOS) is a very promising goalie prospect, even though he's had his struggles recently.

Here's a list of a few draft picks made right after Daigneault (2nd round) who are now NHL regulars: Ole-Kristian Tollefsen (CLB), Erik Christensen (PIT), Matthew Lombardi (CGY)

There were also a bunch of draft picks made after Krestanovich who have turned out to be NHL regulars (Paul Ranger of TB, Jaroslav Balastik of CLB, Petr Prucha of NYR, Maxime Talbot of PIT, Stefan Kronwall of TOR, to name some). Yes, hindsight is 20/20 and there is no way of knowing if the Flyers would have picked any of the players I listed. However, my point remains: trading 1st, 2nd, AND 3rd round picks for a 39-year-old rent-a-center is a terrible deal, I don't care how desperate you are. I refuse to believe there wasn't another player available at the deadline who wouldn't have cost much less. Most of my fellow Flyers fans were irate when trade was made then and still consider it to be one of Clarke's most myopic moves during his tenure as GM.

Sure, this trade didn't come back to bite us when you look at the players that OTHER TEAMS selected with the picks... but who knows what players we would have selected? Yeah, yeah, it was a weak draft, but weak or not, every draft still produces its fair share of solid NHLers.

So, in conclusion, I'll accept your dare... The Flyers LOST this trade.
Thats some outstanding research. Exactly along the lines of what I was gonna post until I saw ur post. We might not even have took any of the above mentioned guys like Lombari or Daley, but whos to say the guys we woulda took couldnt still be projects now, and regardless of who we took @ the time those kinda picks were very very valuable and we gave them away for rubbish.

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Old
12-11-2006, 12:43 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth View Post
You're going to have to dig through flyershistory.com for their playoff records, but wikipedia lists Clarke's tenures as GM.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Clarke

Personally, everything he did in his first stint was null and void. It may have hurt the team, but he was still learning the ropes of managing a sports franchise. I don't think he was 5 years removed from the game before Snider named him the general manager.

(OT: If anyone ever says that Clarke made the Lindros trade, be sure to give them a polish icicle for me. People still haven't picked up that it was actually Jay Snider who made the trade. Clarke was too busy winning a cup in Dallas. )
Farwell made the trade. But Clarke was not winning a cup in Dallas. Clarke was the GM in Minnesota, then Florida before returning to the Flyers

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Old
12-11-2006, 12:45 PM
  #54
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#5. 1990 4th overall selection, Mike Ricci - Ricci had been touted as th e#1 overall pick for two years leading up to the draft, but injuries and others surpassed him with Nolan, Nedved and Primeau going ahead of Ricci. The Flyers debate was the safe choice with Ricci, "a poor man's Clarke", who was actually more like Ron Sutter, or a brilliant talent from Czechoslovakia. At that point no Soviet or Eastern European player had been slected this high. At the time getting players from behind the iron curtain was an uncertainty. The Flyers passed, and the Penguins, one pick behind jumped, and had Jaromir Jagr in their opening night line-up.

.

In the 1990 Hockey News draft preview, the then recently fired Bob clarke talked about how he thought Jagr was the best player in the draft and that is who he would select. Ugh, huh?

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Old
12-17-2006, 10:49 PM
  #55
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what about the lindros trade? forsberg, thibault(who was traded for Roy) + more picks/players/millions in cash
Philadelphia Flyers traded Ron Hextall, Peter Forsberg, Steve Duchesne, Kerry Huffman, Mike Ricci, Chris Simon, 1st round selection (Jocelyn Thibault) in 1993, 1st round selection (later traded to the Toronto Maple Leafs, later traded to the Washington Capitals - Nolan Baumgartner) in 1994 and cash to the Quebec Nordiques for Eric Lindros.http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/...ame=nhl-flyers

I still cant believe they traded all those players + cash for Lindros. I mean basically at the time they were both supposed to be great players. I just dont understand why they would give so much for one player. And even after playing almost 80 games less than Lindros, Forsberg is not very far behind him in total pts and has a better +/-. Who knows whether or not Forsberg + all these players would have helped bring a cup to the Flyers like he did in Colorado.
GP G A Pts +/-
Forsberg 663 242 591 833 +223
Lindros 740 372 485 857 +214

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Old
12-17-2006, 11:10 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by FlyersWillRock View Post
Philadelphia Flyers traded Ron Hextall, Peter Forsberg, Steve Duchesne, Kerry Huffman, Mike Ricci, Chris Simon, 1st round selection (Jocelyn Thibault) in 1993, 1st round selection (later traded to the Toronto Maple Leafs, later traded to the Washington Capitals - Nolan Baumgartner) in 1994 and cash to the Quebec Nordiques for Eric Lindros.http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/...ame=nhl-flyers

I still cant believe they traded all those players + cash for Lindros. I mean basically at the time they were both supposed to be great players. I just dont understand why they would give so much for one player. And even after playing almost 80 games less than Lindros, Forsberg is not very far behind him in total pts and has a better +/-. Who knows whether or not Forsberg + all these players would have helped bring a cup to the Flyers like he did in Colorado.
GP G A Pts +/-
Forsberg 663 242 591 833 +223
Lindros 740 372 485 857 +214
I can't believe that 5 out of those 8 players returned to play for the Flyers at some point (Forsberg, Hextall, Duchesne, Huffman and even Baumgartner).

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Old
12-17-2006, 11:33 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by FlyersWillRock View Post

I still cant believe they traded all those players + cash for Lindros. I mean basically at the time they were both supposed to be great players. I just dont understand why they would give so much for one player. And even after playing almost 80 games less than Lindros, Forsberg is not very far behind him in total pts and has a better +/-. Who knows whether or not Forsberg + all these players would have helped bring a cup to the Flyers like he did in Colorado.
GP G A Pts +/-
Forsberg 663 242 591 833 +223
Lindros 740 372 485 857 +214
#1. At the time they weren't both "supposed to be great players."

Lindros was seen as the "Next One" A generational talent, possible future top 5 player of all-time.

Forsberg was thought of to be a #1 center. People were actually stunned when the Flyers selected Forsberg with the 6th pick. He was expected to be taken somewhere around 15th.

#2. This trade didn't make Quebec/Colorado. They were stacked after years of suckage.

Take a look at the players they drafted starting in 1987 up until the day the Lindros trade was made:

Joe Sakic
Garth Snow
Curtis Leschyshyn
Stephane Fiset
Valeri Kamensky
Alexei Gusarov
Claude Lapointe
Mats Sundin
Adam Foote
Owen Nolan
Andrei Kovalenko
Alexander Karpotsev
Eric Lindros
Rene Corbet
Bill Lindsay
Janne Laukkanen


You could very well argue that with that collection of talent 2 Stanley Cups was the absolute least they should have done.

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Old
12-17-2006, 11:51 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
#1. At the time they weren't both "supposed to be great players."

Lindros was seen as the "Next One" A generational talent, possible future top 5 player of all-time.

Forsberg was thought of to be a #1 center. People were actually stunned when the Flyers selected Forsberg with the 6th pick. He was expected to be taken somewhere around 15th.

#2. This trade didn't make Quebec/Colorado. They were stacked after years of suckage.

Take a look at the players they drafted starting in 1987 up until the day the Lindros trade was made:

Joe Sakic
Garth Snow
Curtis Leschyshyn
Stephane Fiset
Valeri Kamensky
Alexei Gusarov
Claude Lapointe
Mats Sundin
Adam Foote
Owen Nolan
Andrei Kovalenko
Alexander Karpotsev
Eric Lindros
Rene Corbet
Bill Lindsay
Janne Laukkanen


You could very well argue that with that collection of talent 2 Stanley Cups was the absolute least they should have done.
Very nice to see that list. Many many people forget all those pieces they had in place in Quebec before the Lindros trade was made. I think if you switch Lindros and Forsberg, the results are still the same. A couple cups for Colorado, none for Philly.

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Old
12-18-2006, 02:03 PM
  #59
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Dear John,

Kent Manderville for Billy Tibbets.

Love,
Dave

PS: Kent Manderville for Billy Tibbets.


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