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Easiest shutout for future HoF Cam Talbot

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Old
11-17-2013, 03:00 PM
  #451
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
People associate him with automatic 1-3-1.
Which he rarely used in Hamilton or Tampa....

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11-17-2013, 03:02 PM
  #452
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Not sure he'd necessarily implement the same system.
It's very likely he learned his lesson. He hardly used it in Hamilton.

And I don't know how anyone can be so afraid of being "boring" when you consider how we play this year. It ain't exactly firewagon hockey.

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11-17-2013, 03:04 PM
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Most frustrating thing to watch is why on Earth have they changed their playing style of last year? I thought MT was a genius making them play that way with a strong forecheck, teams getting caught in their zone because of it and our D squad making sure the puck was not staying in our zone for long. Now in one damn summer we're back playing the "Last place in the East way". It's unreal. Why is Therrien doing that?

I have to admit I saw a change occur in last year's playoffs where they were playing more defensively. As if MT was not comfortable making them play the way they did in the season, even though it brought success to them. I don't get it. He's either the most stubborn coach i've ever seen or it was a fluke.

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11-17-2013, 03:13 PM
  #454
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It really didn't seem that bad to me. The game was a bit sloppy, but New York never really took over. Both teams looked off, but with our lineup finally healthy I think we will do well over the next few games. I really liked how Emelin looked offensively. Gallagher looked off, but he was sick, and Prust only just got back. We will be ok. Especially with Price playing like he is.

I do hope to see Briere play more than Desharnais though. The former looks to be coming around.

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11-17-2013, 03:14 PM
  #455
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Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
Most frustrating thing to watch is why on Earth have they changed their playing style of last year? I thought MT was a genius making them play that way with a strong forecheck, teams getting caught in their zone because of it and our D squad making sure the puck was not staying in our zone for long. Now in one damn summer we're back playing the "Last place in the East way". It's unreal. Why is Therrien doing that?

I have to admit I saw a change occur in last year's playoffs where they were playing more defensively. As if MT was not comfortable making them play the way they did in the season, even though it brought success to them. I don't get it. He's either the most stubborn coach i've ever seen or it was a fluke.
This is bang on!! MT had them forchecking like crazy early last year, and it worked...

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11-17-2013, 03:46 PM
  #456
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I have no idea what happened to this team other than them playing way over their heads for the most part last season.. During the first 40 games or so last season the Habs were playing great but the ending to last season after clinching a playoff spot and the playoffs were an embarrassing disaster..

I guess it was just a sign of things to come since things haven't improved much this year from what we witnessed at the end of last season.

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11-17-2013, 03:59 PM
  #457
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I think they have tuned him out. The whole team has given up on him and the season hence why they are so easy to play against.

However, the players on the ice are ultimately responsible. We do not have the depth and the good players to complete with half the league. A number of coaches have come and gone but the results have been the same, a mediocre team and boring product on the ice.
I think we could play much better with our current group, but we should be making moves to improve this team too. We shouldn't wait for our veterans to lose some value, and we should target better players on open market.

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11-17-2013, 04:22 PM
  #458
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Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
Most frustrating thing to watch is why on Earth have they changed their playing style of last year? I thought MT was a genius making them play that way with a strong forecheck, teams getting caught in their zone because of it and our D squad making sure the puck was not staying in our zone for long. Now in one damn summer we're back playing the "Last place in the East way". It's unreal. Why is Therrien doing that?

I have to admit I saw a change occur in last year's playoffs where they were playing more defensively. As if MT was not comfortable making them play the way they did in the season, even though it brought success to them. I don't get it. He's either the most stubborn coach i've ever seen or it was a fluke.
It's weird, Habs went from puck possession + very aggressive forechecking team back to Martin style passive forecheck with collapsing/shot block D with essentially the same players.

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11-17-2013, 04:24 PM
  #459
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
It's weird, Habs went from puck possession + very aggressive forechecking team back to Martin style passive forecheck with collapsing/shot block D with essentially the same players.
Even under Martin we played a more puck possession game as he wasn't preaching for a dump and chase play.

But I don't understand, even Therrien said in his press conference a couple games back that they have to get back to the ways of last year where they forechecked hard, so no sure what's going on.

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11-17-2013, 04:50 PM
  #460
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
It's weird, Habs went from puck possession + very aggressive forechecking team back to Martin style passive forecheck with collapsing/shot block D with essentially the same players.
The Habs didn't change their style, the opposition changed their style against the Habs.

Before Therrien, Montreal played a cautious offensive game and most teams gave them space and waited for those annoying chips and dumps. Montreal had room but was afraid to use it. Last season, Montreal switched to a quick, aggressive breakout pass that gave them neutral zone control and moved them up ice fast with the puck on their sticks. Huge difference.

Unfortunately, other teams have adjusted. They're now rushing our defence deep in our zone, interrupting our breakout passes and forcing us back into chips, flips and desperate long passes that end up as icing whistles. Habs have lost their set-up pass to forwards, which means they've lost the neutral zone.

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11-17-2013, 05:15 PM
  #461
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Sad bunch of bipolar *****es we have on this forum...
They're simply off their meds, mate. Don't be too harsh with them.

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11-17-2013, 05:21 PM
  #462
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Originally Posted by Lshap View Post
The Habs didn't change their style, the opposition changed their style against the Habs.

Before Therrien, Montreal played a cautious offensive game and most teams gave them space and waited for those annoying chips and dumps. Montreal had room but was afraid to use it. Last season, Montreal switched to a quick, aggressive breakout pass that gave them neutral zone control and moved them up ice fast with the puck on their sticks. Huge difference.

Unfortunately, other teams have adjusted. They're now rushing our defence deep in our zone, interrupting our breakout passes and forcing us back into chips, flips and desperate long passes that end up as icing whistles. Habs have lost their set-up pass to forwards, which means they've lost the neutral zone.
The Habs used to limit time and space for opposition D to make breakout passes too. They are really aggressive and it was refreshing to watch. Now they send one play and he usually stands and waits for opposition to move puck up ice.

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11-17-2013, 05:52 PM
  #463
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Wow Roy, that GDT is unreal

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11-17-2013, 05:53 PM
  #464
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
The Habs used to limit time and space for opposition D to make breakout passes too. They are really aggressive and it was refreshing to watch. Now they send one play and he usually stands and waits for opposition to move puck up ice.
Yeah, it's become opposite-world in the two zones. The opposition plays Montreal tight, while Montreal gives the opposition tons of space along the entire perimeter of the ice, allowing forwards to skate untouched into the Habs' zone. I get the Habs' strategy, and it works well if the defence can keep the opposition in the perimeter and force turnovers, but the Habs are being out-skated and out-positioned around Price. Shooting lanes open, players sneak in uncovered, Price gets shelled.

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11-17-2013, 05:57 PM
  #465
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Originally Posted by Lshap View Post
The Habs didn't change their style, the opposition changed their style against the Habs.

Before Therrien, Montreal played a cautious offensive game and most teams gave them space and waited for those annoying chips and dumps. Montreal had room but was afraid to use it. Last season, Montreal switched to a quick, aggressive breakout pass that gave them neutral zone control and moved them up ice fast with the puck on their sticks. Huge difference.

Unfortunately, other teams have adjusted. They're now rushing our defence deep in our zone, interrupting our breakout passes and forcing us back into chips, flips and desperate long passes that end up as icing whistles. Habs have lost their set-up pass to forwards, which means they've lost the neutral zone.
You may be right. But even our play in the offensive zone has changed. Our Ds used to chip in a lot more so that the other teams were caught in their zone a long time cause we always had a fourth guy helping out. Now it's the teams that do this very thing to us.

What's worrisome is that one team realised the flaw in the Habs' system and now everybody is using this against us now. Last game, they just couldn't get out of the zone.

Nevertheless, Therrien may blame his players all he wants but it's the coaching staff that's failing to adjust. They need to do something.


Last edited by Kimota: 11-17-2013 at 06:04 PM.
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11-17-2013, 06:03 PM
  #466
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Originally Posted by Lshap View Post
Yeah, it's become opposite-world in the two zones. The opposition plays Montreal tight, while Montreal gives the opposition tons of space along the entire perimeter of the ice, allowing forwards to skate untouched into the Habs' zone. I get the Habs' strategy, and it works well if the defence can keep the opposition in the perimeter and force turnovers, but the Habs are being out-skated and out-positioned around Price. Shooting lanes open, players sneak in uncovered, Price gets shelled.
I remember last year Price was hardly seeing any rubber. Habs were so dominant, he was a non-issue for most games(until the playoffs came along). The puck was not staying enough in the Habs' zone for him to be really challenged or receive a good number of pucks.

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11-17-2013, 08:24 PM
  #467
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You may be right. But even our play in the offensive zone has changed. Our Ds used to chip in a lot more so that the other teams were caught in their zone a long time cause we always had a fourth guy helping out. Now it's the teams that do this very thing to us.

What's worrisome is that one team realised the flaw in the Habs' system and now everybody is using this against us now. Last game, they just couldn't get out of the zone.

Nevertheless, Therrien may blame his players all he wants but it's the coaching staff that's failing to adjust. They need to do something.
Yup. Last night's game was like watching a 55-minute penalty-kill. Painful. It's easy to say we just need bigger defensemen who can punish opposing forwards (a legit strategy, actually), but going with the horses we have means keeping our speed game and working on a different way to move the puck to our forwards.

Gallagher's style is perfect for this -- he backchecks and is always on the puck, moving it out. Plekanec, Bournival, Gionta, Moen are also good at helping out in their own zone. Problem is the defensively-challenged half of our forwards -- mostly Desharnais, Briere, Bourque -- who leave the D stranded.

As to the D, Diaz is the perfect example of last year's system struggling to upgrade to system.2. He's no longer given time to make that great first pass and he can't overpower anyone. He gets stuck. Bouillon is more physical in the corners but less agile everywhere else, which is why he's been horribly out of position so often.

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I remember last year Price was hardly seeing any rubber. Habs were so dominant, he was a non-issue for most games(until the playoffs came along). The puck was not staying enough in the Habs' zone for him to be really challenged or receive a good number of pucks.
Maybe that's the strategy! Diabolically brilliant! Implement the Halak-Protocal by allowing 40+ shots per game and transform your head-case goalie into Patrick Roy.

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11-17-2013, 11:21 PM
  #468
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Originally Posted by Lshap View Post
Yup. Last night's game was like watching a 55-minute penalty-kill. Painful. It's easy to say we just need bigger defensemen who can punish opposing forwards (a legit strategy, actually), but going with the horses we have means keeping our speed game and working on a different way to move the puck to our forwards.

Gallagher's style is perfect for this -- he backchecks and is always on the puck, moving it out. Plekanec, Bournival, Gionta, Moen are also good at helping out in their own zone. Problem is the defensively-challenged half of our forwards -- mostly Desharnais, Briere, Bourque -- who leave the D stranded.

As to the D, Diaz is the perfect example of last year's system struggling to upgrade to system.2. He's no longer given time to make that great first pass and he can't overpower anyone. He gets stuck. Bouillon is more physical in the corners but less agile everywhere else, which is why he's been horribly out of position so often.



Maybe that's the strategy! Diabolically brilliant! Implement the Halak-Protocal by allowing 40+ shots per game and transform your head-case goalie into Patrick Roy.
Good point about Diaz, he really seem like the D most affected about the change. He's hardly a puck-moving D right now. And how some guys like DD, Frodo and Bourque are affected by it, cause they've never been good defensively.

All in all cause MT is having them play a 5-men coverage defensive style and not everybody can do it.

As for the goalie, my philosophy is that when he becomes too important in a game, it's cause you're doing something wrong.

We have to go back to last year's speed game but like you said if the league has figured how to counter that system, the team is either ****ed or they have to do something else. I'm not sure if the coaching staff has the brain power to figure it out.

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11-17-2013, 11:33 PM
  #469
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This team will go nowhere without a true #1 center. The worst thing about it is that we actually have one in the lineup but don't use it. We're just wasting his development right now. Starting to look like the Seguin situation in Boston.

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11-17-2013, 11:55 PM
  #470
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This team will go nowhere without a true #1 center. The worst thing about it is that we actually have one in the lineup but don't use it. We're just wasting his development right now. Starting to look like the Seguin situation in Boston.
Seemed to work out okay for Seguin

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11-17-2013, 11:59 PM
  #471
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This team will go nowhere without a true #1 center. The worst thing about it is that we actually have one in the lineup but don't use it. We're just wasting his development right now. Starting to look like the Seguin situation in Boston.
To be fair, extra curricular stuff did not exactly help Seguin off the ice. Still, he seems to have come around, he definitely upped his game in Dallas.

Anyway, going back to your point, I do think that it is worth noting that Seguin did lose some precious time to learn the centreman position while in Boston, and I agree that it is worth letting Galchenyuk learn through this.

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11-18-2013, 12:00 AM
  #472
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You guys are such cry-babies. For all we know we're going on a 12-4-1 stretch all the way to christmas.

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