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The Carey Price Discussion Thread (Part 7) Can't Win Olympic Games Edition

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Old
11-17-2013, 08:06 PM
  #551
Lafleurs Guy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Right now, he TOTALLY is. Hence the Save%. And we're still a bad team. Somehow though, when we were a bad team and he had subar save%, it didn't count, he had TONS of reasons why his Save% wasn't great. But now that his Save% is awesome....so he is. I would ask for some consistency here....
2 for medicore D 2 for good...

Anyone want to put in the tiebreaker here?

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Old
11-17-2013, 08:23 PM
  #552
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It's crazy how good Price's stats are compared to his win/loss ratio...

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Old
11-17-2013, 09:38 PM
  #553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
2 for medicore D 2 for good...

Anyone want to put in the tiebreaker here?
Good/good loss. Happens.

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Old
11-17-2013, 10:18 PM
  #554
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Game 1: Price Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 2: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 3: Price Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 4: Budaj Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 5: Price Good, Defense Bad - Win
Game 6: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Win
Game 7: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 8: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 9: Price Mediocre, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 10: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 11: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 12: Budaj Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 13: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 14: Price Mediocre, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 15: Budaj Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 16: Price Good, Defense Bad - SO Loss (1 point)
Game 17: Price Mediocre, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 18: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 19: Price God, Defense Bad - SO Loss (1 point)
Game 20: Budaj Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 21: Price Good, Defense Good - Loss

Okay by a vote of 3-2 D has been judged to be 'good'...

Also noticed that I was missing game 13 which was a nice win for us. It is included here.

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Old
11-17-2013, 10:31 PM
  #555
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Good/good loss. Happens.
Offense bad.

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Old
11-18-2013, 06:27 AM
  #556
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theosis View Post
It's crazy how good Price's stats are compared to his win/loss ratio...
It's really sad actually. The Habs are 26th in 5-on-5 GF and 21st overall in GF/G. So basically, unless this team scores on the PP they are in trouble.

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Old
11-18-2013, 11:38 AM
  #557
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Originally Posted by Tuggy View Post
It's really sad actually. The Habs are 26th in 5-on-5 GF and 21st overall in GF/G. So basically, unless this team scores on the PP they are in trouble.
Which is fine during the regular season. In the playoffs, though, teams pay extra attention to discipline and referees are more reluctant to use their whistle, so I agree that it's something to be concerned about.

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Old
11-18-2013, 11:41 AM
  #558
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Which is fine during the regular season. In the playoffs, though, teams pay extra attention to discipline and referees are more reluctant to use their whistle, so I agree that it's something to be concerned about.
It's most definitely not fine during the regular season. This team can barely create any pressure 5 on 5 and without Price/Budaj, they would likely be in last place or close to it.

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Old
11-18-2013, 11:43 AM
  #559
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Right now, he TOTALLY is. Hence the Save%. And we're still a bad team. Somehow though, when we were a bad team and he had subar save%, it didn't count, he had TONS of reasons why his Save% wasn't great. But now that his Save% is awesome....so he is. I would ask for some consistency here....
I think youre missing the point ... The team is no winning

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Old
11-18-2013, 07:25 PM
  #560
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Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
I think youre missing the point ... The team is no winning
Back at you. Price does everything he can for this team to win. Not his fault if we have a bad D and average forwards. Save% says it all. Wins and losses column, a little less ESPECIALLY for Price. So as far as missing the point....you have a spot right close to me.

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Old
11-18-2013, 08:18 PM
  #561
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It's a team game though and Price is not doing enough to get the wins. If the team can't score during regulation + OT, it's his job to blank the opponent all the way through the shootout and hope that his team can score at least one goal there.

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Old
11-18-2013, 08:36 PM
  #562
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pine View Post
It's a team game though and Price is not doing enough to get the wins. If the team can't score during regulation + OT, it's his job to blank the opponent all the way through the shootout and hope that his team can score at least one goal there.
This is the most ******** post ever...and that says a lot.

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Old
11-18-2013, 08:38 PM
  #563
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Originally Posted by Habnot View Post
This is the most ******** post ever...and that says a lot.

It says something, all right

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Old
11-18-2013, 08:54 PM
  #564
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habnot View Post
This is the most ******** post ever...and that says a lot.
I think it was sarcasm. Course on this site you never know.

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Old
11-18-2013, 09:17 PM
  #565
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
I think it was sarcasm. Course on this site you never know.
LOL - I'm so used to reading Price bashing that sarcasm didn't even come to mind - now whose ******** :-)

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Old
11-19-2013, 09:22 PM
  #566
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No need to wait for votes here. Good, good, win. Also **** Dany Heatley.

Game 1: Price Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 2: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 3: Price Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 4: Budaj Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 5: Price Good, Defense Bad - Win
Game 6: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Win
Game 7: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 8: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 9: Price Mediocre, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 10: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 11: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 12: Budaj Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 13: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 14: Price Mediocre, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 15: Budaj Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 16: Price Good, Defense Bad - SO Loss (1 point)
Game 17: Price Mediocre, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 18: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 19: Price God, Defense Bad - SO Loss (1 point)
Game 20: Budaj Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 21: Price Good, Defense Good - Loss
Game 22: Price Good, Defense Good - Win

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Old
11-19-2013, 09:27 PM
  #567
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Haha just noticed game 19

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Old
11-19-2013, 09:39 PM
  #568
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Haha just noticed game 19
Yeah, somebody else wrote that and I just decided to keep it.

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Old
11-20-2013, 12:41 AM
  #569
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
No need to wait for votes here. Good, good, win. Also **** Dany Heatley.

Game 1: Price Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 2: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 3: Price Good, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 5: Price Good, Defense Bad - Win
Game 6: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Win
Game 7: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 8: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 9: Price Mediocre, Defense Bad - Loss
Game 10: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 11: Price Good, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 13: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 14: Price Mediocre, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 16: Price Good, Defense Bad - SO Loss (1 point)
Game 17: Price Mediocre, Defense Mediocre - Loss
Game 18: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Game 19: Price Good, Defense Bad - SO Loss (1 point)
Game 21: Price Good, Defense Good - Loss
Game 22: Price Good, Defense Good - Win
Out of 19 games
Price: 15 Good 3 Mediocre , 0 Bad
Defense: 7 Good , 5 Mediocre, 6 Bad

Price record in the 3 games with 4 goals againts: 0 points
Game 14 MIN L .840
Game 9 EDM L .875
Game 1 TOR L .895

Price record in the 3 games with 3 goals againts: 2 points
Game 17 OTT L .870
Game 7 CBJ W .909
Game 3 CGY L .880

Price record in the 12 games with 2 goals or less againts: 16 points
W: 7 L: 3 OT loss: 2


Total Price:
18/36 (50%) Points
8/18 (44.4%) Wins

Total Team:
24/44 (54.5%) Points
11/22 (50%) Wins

By your assessment without Price in the nets we should see a drop in the win% but the stats show differently. When you take the same horrible defense and put it in front of a backup goalie the team has a higher win ratio.

Of course i'm not saying i'm not happy with Price's form so far but don't you think your over-evaluating him and under estimating our D?

It makes absolutely no sense for this crappy defense to be playing better in front of a Backup goalie...it should be the opposite. And don't bring the Budaj played vs worst teams excuse....this is the NHL and besides from your grades it looks like we have the worst Defense so it cancels out.

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Old
11-20-2013, 08:13 AM
  #570
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Genesis76 View Post
Out of 19 games
Price: 15 Good 3 Mediocre , 0 Bad
Defense: 7 Good , 5 Mediocre, 6 Bad

Price record in the 3 games with 4 goals againts: 0 points
Game 14 MIN L .840
Game 9 EDM L .875
Game 1 TOR L .895

Price record in the 3 games with 3 goals againts: 2 points
Game 17 OTT L .870
Game 7 CBJ W .909
Game 3 CGY L .880

Price record in the 12 games with 2 goals or less againts: 16 points
W: 7 L: 3 OT loss: 2


Total Price:
18/36 (50%) Points
8/18 (44.4%) Wins

Total Team:
24/44 (54.5%) Points
11/22 (50%) Wins

By your assessment without Price in the nets we should see a drop in the win% but the stats show differently. When you take the same horrible defense and put it in front of a backup goalie the team has a higher win ratio.

Of course i'm not saying i'm not happy with Price's form so far but don't you think your over-evaluating him and under estimating our D?

It makes absolutely no sense for this crappy defense to be playing better in front of a Backup goalie...it should be the opposite. And don't bring the Budaj played vs worst teams excuse....this is the NHL and besides from your grades it looks like we have the worst Defense so it cancels out.
I think what we're seeing is that we are ignoring the metric of the offense. Price was miraculous, surrendered 1 goal and lost to the Rangers.

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Old
11-20-2013, 08:34 AM
  #571
Lafleurs Guy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Genesis76 View Post
Out of 19 games
Price: 15 Good 3 Mediocre , 0 Bad
Defense: 7 Good , 5 Mediocre, 6 Bad

Price record in the 3 games with 4 goals againts: 0 points
Game 14 MIN L .840
Game 9 EDM L .875
Game 1 TOR L .895

Price record in the 3 games with 3 goals againts: 2 points
Game 17 OTT L .870
Game 7 CBJ W .909
Game 3 CGY L .880

Price record in the 12 games with 2 goals or less againts: 16 points
W: 7 L: 3 OT loss: 2


Total Price:
18/36 (50%) Points
8/18 (44.4%) Wins

Total Team:
24/44 (54.5%) Points
11/22 (50%) Wins

By your assessment without Price in the nets we should see a drop in the win% but the stats show differently. When you take the same horrible defense and put it in front of a backup goalie the team has a higher win ratio.

Of course i'm not saying i'm not happy with Price's form so far but don't you think your over-evaluating him and under estimating our D?

It makes absolutely no sense for this crappy defense to be playing better in front of a Backup goalie...it should be the opposite. And don't bring the Budaj played vs worst teams excuse....this is the NHL and besides from your grades it looks like we have the worst Defense so it cancels out.
A couple of things here...

Your numbers seem to be wrong. You say in games Price played it was zero bad games for the D? Am I misreading this? I'll look it over again but that's what I'm reading here. Edit: Yup I misread... sorry.

And YES, we DO shelter the backup. We put him in against weaker teams for the most part. The exception so far this season being Colorado where Budaj used to play. Look at the teams: Rangers (who we own), Edmonton, Columbus and Colorado.

Yet you want us to ignore his competition and say it's the "worst excuse"... wake up and smell what you're shoveling. Gee, I wonder why the team's D doesn't play as well against San Jose or St. Louis instead of ****ing Columbus? That's what you want to argue about? Go away.

As far as this year goes, Price has outright stolen four points for us. No question about this. A couple of days ago that represented a full 20% of our points and now only represents about 17%. And that's just the most obvious steals.

What I'm really interested to see now is how the addition of Emelin affects the D. He's been in the lineup for two games and we now have two games with the D being good. I was worried about his health but he looked pretty good last night. Should be interesting to see how this trends going forward.

If nothing else what we'll see here is less Murray and maybe less Bouillion. That alone makes us much, much better. So to go back to the debates from last year... its not so much that Emelin is a great blueliner as much as it is that he's eating up ice that our horrible blueliners would otherwise get. And that helps us tremendously. I expect us to play a lot better going forward now that he's back and (seemingly) healthy.

Again, I don't think the collapse from last season was coincidentally tied to his injury. Emelin being hurt meant more Bouillion and more Bouillion = more goals against.

As for me being easy on the D... I've said they've been mediocre in some games and have respected the voters. Against the Rangers most in the main thread said we played like crap and one guy who voted 'good' said we were totally outplayed... but I still listed 'good.' I think I've been more than fair to the D.

We haven't seen a bad game from Price yet. (One will be coming I'm sure.) Look at the Ottawa game... his numbers were terrible. But how were the goals scored? Two screens and a tape to tape pass from Markov to a Senator. You think those are Price's fault instead of the D's? I'd say the D was responsible for all three goals. Yet we gave them a mediocre grade instead of bad. And we punish Price with a mediocre grade despite this. So how is this being unfair to the D?


Last edited by Lafleurs Guy: 11-20-2013 at 11:35 AM.
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Old
11-20-2013, 08:39 AM
  #572
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Price has let in more than 2 goals just twice so far this year...that's pretty damn impressive.

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Old
11-20-2013, 08:45 AM
  #573
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Price has let in more than 2 goals just twice so far this year...that's pretty damn impressive.
That would be impressive, if it were true. He had 6 games with more than 2 goals and 12 with 2 or less goals.

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Old
11-20-2013, 08:47 AM
  #574
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That would be impressive, if it were true. He had 6 games with more than 2 goals and 12 with 2 or less goals.
Forgot "in his last 10 games", which would have been more reflective of the stat I was looking at

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Old
11-20-2013, 05:02 PM
  #575
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As a bonafide Price "hater" it feels good to finally have a reason to become a Price "lover" ! Now if only we had a competent coach we'd be going places.

What I like is how well Price played in Tampa in front of Yzerman's team and again yesterday against Harding, his competition for team Canada. I think that the Olympics is like the carrot on the stick and Price is really responding and striving to prove his doubters wrong.

As a canadian I'm not sure I was comfortable with him in nets for the country but now I think I am finally startingto become comfortable with the idea, heck even looking forward to it.

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