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Brayden Schenn to Leafs?

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Old
11-20-2013, 04:06 PM
  #101
WACCAttack
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I don't think my heart could bear it if Schenn went to the Leafs. I kind of tuned out Leafs fandom when they were bad, but now that they're OK + JVR trade + I'm in Toronto now, I find it insufferable. Overrate their team (fans of every team do this, but it's especially bad with the Leafs because Canadian sports media is a huge echo chamber) and as soon as a new player is acquired they're the second coming.


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Old
11-20-2013, 04:10 PM
  #102
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God, I can't wait until this Leaf fanbase high-horse thing blows over. The Leafs are performing at historically impossible rates, and when they come back to Earth they will float back down the standings.

The Flyers defense is also much better than believed around here.
Leaf fans aren't on any high horse... at least the knowledgable fans aren't.
We know that without our tendy duo, that we'd be struggling.
Also, saying we are on our high horse because I said Gardiner is more than a depth defenseman? You don't know what you're talking about if you don't think he has top pairing upside and looks to be well on his way of reaching it. Watch a full game of Jake and you'll see him walk around the other team like nothing.

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11-20-2013, 04:35 PM
  #103
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I don't mean to offend any Canadians here as it's not all of them. But anytime I see a PHI-(Canadian team) trade thread on the main boards it's us getting fleeced and them ripping on our players and GM. There's some Milan the god (Sens fan)guy ripping Schenn and Couturier in the Schenn thread right now. It's hilarious because he was crying about the no goal all night long so he feels the need to knock the Flyers all day. He says he's not impressed with Coots/Schenn and doesn't know how they went top 10. He says this after Coots and his line shut down Spezza line just last night. These boards are nuts.

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Old
11-20-2013, 04:35 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gavy View Post
Leaf fans aren't on any high horse... at least the knowledgable fans aren't.
We know that without our tendy duo, that we'd be struggling.
Also, saying we are on our high horse because I said Gardiner is more than a depth defenseman? You don't know what you're talking about if you don't think he has top pairing upside and looks to be well on his way of reaching it. Watch a full game of Jake and you'll see him walk around the other team like nothing.
You guys have been trying to trade us Gardiner for forever. I guarantee at least ten threads have been started by Leafs fans offering him to the Flyers. Mostly it was for Couturier. If he was really that good, that wouldn't happen every other week. By now, it is just obnoxious.

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Old
11-20-2013, 04:54 PM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gavy View Post
Leaf fans aren't on any high horse... at least the knowledgable fans aren't.
We know that without our tendy duo, that we'd be struggling.
Also, saying we are on our high horse because I said Gardiner is more than a depth defenseman? You don't know what you're talking about if you don't think he has top pairing upside and looks to be well on his way of reaching it. Watch a full game of Jake and you'll see him walk around the other team like nothing.
Those top pairing potential D men who are sheltered more than Franson and Paul Ranger at the moment?

I actually really like Gardiner... and think he will be a very good 3 in this league who can get 40 points and be a #1 PP guy. At most probably a #2 if the stars align.

But from watching him he seems to lack the defensive awareness to ever be a guy who can take tough minutes, but at the same time does not have 'elite' offensive instincts to get more than 45 points and therefore become a top pairing guy on offensive merit.

He reminds me of Matt Carle and Coburn in some ways, good players but not elite enough in certain aspects to be a #1.

I actually kind of hope I am wrong... as I do like him, but I think the chance he becomes a top pairing D man (who is not carried) is not that great, and the chance he becomes a #1 is very small. But with D men you never know I suppose.

At the moment I imagine he would slot in at 4-5 on the Flyers. He has had probably had easier minutes than any Flyers D man who has dressed this year.

So far this year Gus (our #6) is outproducing him defensively and offensively.

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Old
11-20-2013, 05:14 PM
  #106
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Totally agree.

What is that?

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Old
11-20-2013, 05:16 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiqkid View Post
I don't mean to offend any Canadians here as it's not all of them. But anytime I see a PHI-(Canadian team) trade thread on the main boards it's us getting fleeced and them ripping on our players and GM. There's some Milan the god (Sens fan)guy ripping Schenn and Couturier in the Schenn thread right now. It's hilarious because he was crying about the no goal all night long so he feels the need to knock the Flyers all day. He says he's not impressed with Coots/Schenn and doesn't know how they went top 10. He says this after Coots and his line shut down Spezza line just last night. These boards are nuts.
Your online hockey forum experience has nothing to do with them being Canadian and more to do with those people being idiots.

Don't get it twisted.

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Old
11-20-2013, 05:35 PM
  #108
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Unfortunately, since there's so many Leafs fans, it means there's a lot of idiots out there that have no clue what they're talking about that support them.

However, at least they aren't as bad as Habs fans

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11-20-2013, 05:36 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Four1 Lead View Post
Your online hockey forum experience has nothing to do with them being Canadian and more to do with those people being idiots.

Don't get it twisted.
Well what im saying is it's always the Canadien teams that offer the worst proposals. ALWAYS. How many good offers have you seen posted from TOR, EDM, OTT, MON, fans? Today was the first time I saw a good one from Montreal but I'm not sure if it was a MON fan. It was Patches, 1st rounder, and Hudon for the Schenns.

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11-20-2013, 05:37 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Wiqkid View Post
Well what im saying is it's always the Canadien teams that offer the worst proposals. ALWAYS. How many good offers have you seen posted from TOR, EDM, OTT, MON, fans? Today was the first time I saw a good one from Montreal but I'm not sure if it was a MON fan. It was Patches, 1st rounder, and Hudon for the Schenns.
there are a lot of bad trade proposals posted by every fan base, not just Canadian

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11-20-2013, 05:42 PM
  #111
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So sick of them trying to dump Gardiner on us all the time.

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Old
11-20-2013, 05:45 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Bob McKenzie - "Flyers want to get a really good D if they deal Brayden Schenn or Couturier"
Source: TSN Radio @TSN1050Radio

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Old
11-20-2013, 05:47 PM
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
So sick of them trying to dump Gardiner on us all the time.
Dump Jake Gardiner?


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Old
11-20-2013, 05:47 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
So sick of them trying to dump Gardiner on us all the time.
I hope you dont think that the Flyers fanbase is unique in regards to this lol

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Old
11-20-2013, 05:57 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
So sick of them trying to dump Gardiner on us all the time.
Haven't you heard? Gardiner is the new Kaberle!

Carter for Kaberle slowly became Coots for Gardiner.

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Old
11-20-2013, 06:25 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Source: TSN Radio @TSN1050Radio
And by good I hope he means a #1

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Old
11-20-2013, 06:30 PM
  #117
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And by good I hope he means a #1
He said "really good". I take that as basically saying they won't be moved because I don't think many "really good" defensemen are available.

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Old
11-20-2013, 06:33 PM
  #118
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And by good I hope he means a #1
The Flyers aren't getting any OELs or Pietrangelos but Gardiner and the like just isn't worth it, so their in a particularly crappy situation. Only Flyers are getting a #1 is via the draft IMO, just cross you're fingers and hope we draft the next Weber.

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Old
11-20-2013, 07:04 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
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There is only one really good defender on the Habs, and they have been scouting us. I wonder how long until the Scheen+ Morin rumors surface for subban lol

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Old
11-20-2013, 07:08 PM
  #120
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http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklun...-Zotto/1/55836



Also chasing down the Brayden Schenn for Jake Gardiner rumor. Thus far, more coming from north of the border than around here, but digging deeper.

More to come..

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Old
11-20-2013, 07:18 PM
  #121
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Seriously, Schenn for Gardiner is a terrible trade for the flyers. No way can Homer do that. No way.

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Old
11-20-2013, 07:54 PM
  #122
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Ways to get a number 1 defenseman:

1. Draft + Develop
2. Offersheet
3. A trade opening for an impending UFA (UFA must be leaving on his own accord for financial reasons)

Basically all three options are equally hard. Where #1 is concerned, you actually have to commit to drafting these players in high percentage areas of the draft. We've been conducting, posting, and discussing the math on this for years, but there was a huge period of time when the Flyers just didn't draft defensemen high. We could debate the reasons forever, but that left a visible hole within our organization. Fear of failure, comfort with success, market visibility before fluctuation...all solid theories, maybe not all incorrect or correct. Regardless of this though, we've moved on. 8 of the last 14 draft picks have been defensemen; some taken fairly high. This would've been unheard of for mid-2000's Philadelphia.

Where #2 is concerned, we already know this story. You can't always throw money at the problem even if you try your damn hardest to back the other team into a corner. Ed Snider played the game, and regardless of your feelings about letting Carle walk for free (I still can't believe that was a real gripe around here), going hard after Weber was the right idea. If you think we jumped the gun, then possibly. It's hard to tell why decisions are made the way they are, but fortune favors the bold. Waiting for Weber may not have been fruitful either.

As far as #3, see Pronger. These are the guys that don't make it to free-agency unless they're something sneaky going on; see Suter. Basically, you're still going to pay an arm and a leg, but in the end it's generally worth it. These situations are just as rare as #2 and as hard to contend with as #1 because it throws your ability to play #1 out the window. That's what happened to us anyway.

So realistically, teams just don't trade young, able-bodied and sound-minded #1 defensemen. It doesn't happen. There is no "we have too many of them" nonsense to speculate on either before someone from Toronto claims "take some of our awesome sauce off our hands." Particularly when it comes to defensemen, stick to the belief that if you're supposedly getting a deal, you probably aren't. Guys like Gardiner and Franson are not the deal you're looking for, and I can tell you exactly why. The deal you're looking for does not exist. You're just going to end up regretting it. vanRiemsdyk for LSchenn was different. We pretty much knew what the drawbacks and flaws of both guys were going in. We weren't looking at a lead winger for a lead defenseman. That was a complimentary winger for a complimentary defenseman. As far as looking for that one guy by trading key offensive players; any opportunity is a feint, a trap, a hoax.

So this leads me to my point. Keep calm, carry on, and for the love of god, don't trade Brayden Schenn or Sean Couturier, or really anybody. This team is built to develop like fine wine. We still need a number one defenseman, but develop him. Our team is young enough, and everyone knows we draft well. Keep our window never-ending and eventually you will strike gold. Also, always remember, depth wins championships; not elite stature.

LSchenn, Gustafsson, Gostisbehere, Morin, Hagg, Alt, Manning, Lauridsen, Larsson, Wilcox, and Valsiliev. Work from there. Your offense is already set long-term.

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Old
11-20-2013, 07:55 PM
  #123
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if it's contract related, why would we be shopping him now? If we're having problems this summer, then we trade him, but not now

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Old
11-20-2013, 08:04 PM
  #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CS View Post
Ways to get a number 1 defenseman:

1. Draft + Develop
2. Offersheet
3. A trade opening for an impending UFA (UFA must be leaving on his own accord for financial reasons)

Basically all three options are equally hard. Where #1 is concerned, you actually have to commit to drafting these players in high percentage areas of the draft. We've been conducting, posting, and discussing the math on this for years, but there was a huge period of time when the Flyers just didn't draft defensemen high. We could debate the reasons forever, but that left a visible hole within our organization. Fear of failure, comfort with success, market visibility before fluctuation...all solid theories, maybe not all incorrect or correct. Regardless of this though, we've moved on. 8 of the last 14 draft picks have been defensemen; some taken fairly high. This would've been unheard of for mid-2000's Philadelphia.

Where #2 is concerned, we already know this story. You can't always throw money at the problem even if you try your damn hardest to back the other team into a corner. Ed Snider played the game, and regardless of your feelings about letting Carle walk for free (I still can't believe that was a real gripe around here), going hard after Weber was the right idea. If you think we jumped the gun, then possibly. It's hard to tell why decisions are made the way they are, but fortune favors the bold. Waiting for Weber may not have been fruitful either.

As far as #3, see Pronger. These are the guys that don't make it to free-agency unless they're something sneaky going on; see Suter. Basically, you're still going to pay an arm and a leg, but in the end it's generally worth it. These situations are just as rare as #2 and as hard to contend with as #1 because it throws your ability to play #1 out the window. That's what happened to us anyway.

So realistically, teams just don't trade young, able-bodied and sound-minded #1 defensemen. It doesn't happen. There is no "we have too many of them" nonsense to speculate on either before someone from Toronto claims "take some of our awesome sauce off our hands." Particularly when it comes to defensemen, stick to the belief that if you're supposedly getting a deal, you probably aren't. Guys like Gardiner and Franson are not the deal you're looking for, and I can tell you exactly why. The deal you're looking for does not exist. You're just going to end up regretting it. vanRiemsdyk for LSchenn was different. We pretty much knew what the drawbacks and flaws of both guys were going in. We weren't looking at a lead winger for a lead defenseman. That was a complimentary winger for a complimentary defenseman. As far as looking for that one guy by trading key offensive players; any opportunity is a feint, a trap, a hoax.

So this leads me to my point. Keep calm, carry on, and for the love of god, don't trade Brayden Schenn or Sean Couturier, or really anybody. This team is built to develop like fine wine. We still need a number one defenseman, but develop him. Our team is young enough, and everyone knows we draft well. Keep our window never-ending and eventually you will strike gold. Also, always remember, depth wins championships; not elite stature.

LSchenn, Gustafsson, Gostisbehere, Morin, Hagg, Alt, Manning, Lauridsen, Larsson, Wilcox, and Valsiliev. Work from there. Your offense is already set long-term.
Very much enjoyed reading your post.

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Old
11-20-2013, 08:35 PM
  #125
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Would NOT trade Brayden unless it was severely lopsided in the Flyers favor.We gave up MIKE RICHARDS for this kid as well as Simmonds. How about we KEEP them!

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