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Trade Rumors/Speculation Thread Part V: Zib-a-dabba-do

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Old
11-20-2013, 10:26 PM
  #151
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Something that should be mentioned though... nothing is more individually important to a hockey player than his playing time. Nothing hurts more than having that time reduced or even taken away. They may rationalize it in terms of "whatever is best for the team", but it still hurts.

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Old
11-20-2013, 10:43 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Moore and Falk aren't taking the minutes the player needs to be effective when he's playing, is the point. We're not talking about my opinion here... we're talking about what Sather tells other GMs when they talk about DZ. I'm pretty certain that my characterization is very close to accurate, minus the cigar chewing.

You are probably correct about your characterization, but you better believe that the other GM's don't just acquiesce. If I am on the other side of that call I'd be telling you
"Come on Glenn, cut the BS. He is below Moore on the totem pole. He is being scratched in favor of Falk for God's sakes. Not only that, but your own coach is telling the world that DZ is not what you are telling me he is".
This is horse trading and every GM will use any leverage they can.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
It's also a fact he plays his best hockey slotted in to where he is currently unable to due to the depth the Rangers have on D. Yes, when he is scratched Moore and Falk are taking his 3rd pairing minutes which he only has (get ready for it, I know this is hard to understand) BECAUSE HE IS 3rd ON THE DEPTH CHART BEHIND STAAL AND McDONAGH.

This has nothing to do with other bottom pairing d-men taking his 3rd pairing minutes and everything to do with not having a spot in the roster for him to get optimal minutes and given an opportunity to succeed.

The powerplay is the only exception to that and as of late not even because McD has looked far better this year so far on the 1st unit.
And my argument is playing the bottom pairing is better than being up in the press box watching, knowing full well that Moore and Falk are struggling. You want DZ to succeed, play him because he is the better player. The rest is just hot air.

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Old
11-20-2013, 10:54 PM
  #153
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I've found this whole John Moore playing dreadfully thing to be completely over exaggerated

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Old
11-20-2013, 10:56 PM
  #154
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Problem with trading Del Z is that there's no real replacement. McL and Allen are not ready.

Also, why do fourth lines always have to be gritty players? If they can actually have a fourth line of guys who can PK, get PP time, have some skill, and learn the game while on entry level contracts, then the cap wouldn't be such a problem with this team every summer.

Remember when Datsyuk and later Zetterberg were fourth liners on Detroit in the early to mid 2000s?

I was always angry Weiss wasn't given more of a shot. That's a guy who'd be a perfect fourth liner or something like that.

Also,I just can't see Minny giving up Coyle after he was such a big part of the Burns trade. Maybe Stoner as a throw in.


I can see something like Del Zotto for Tom Gilbert and a Florida prospect like Drew Shore. I'd love to get Howden but gotta be a realist.

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Old
11-20-2013, 11:32 PM
  #155
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Since we are speculating in this thread, I speculate that no trade happens and AV gets to scratch DZ on a regular basis until Dolan remembers that coaching selection is not one of Sather's strong suits.
It was Dolan after all, that enabled Colton Orr to play every night.

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Old
11-20-2013, 11:35 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by White Plains Batman View Post
Problem with trading Del Z is that there's no real replacement. McL and Allen are not ready.

Also, why do fourth lines always have to be gritty players? If they can actually have a fourth line of guys who can PK, get PP time, have some skill, and learn the game while on entry level contracts, then the cap wouldn't be such a problem with this team every summer.

Remember when Datsyuk and later Zetterberg were fourth liners on Detroit in the early to mid 2000s?

I was always angry Weiss wasn't given more of a shot. That's a guy who'd be a perfect fourth liner or something like that.

Also,I just can't see Minny giving up Coyle after he was such a big part of the Burns trade. Maybe Stoner as a throw in.


I can see something like Del Zotto for Tom Gilbert and a Florida prospect like Drew Shore. I'd love to get Howden but gotta be a realist.
trade Del Zotto for a player that they could have signed in August. that is just dumb.. Shore is alright but if that is the best offer, id rather keep Del Zotto till something better comes along..

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Old
11-20-2013, 11:37 PM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
I've found this whole John Moore playing dreadfully thing to be completely over exaggerated
Agree 100%. Made the same comment in the last post-game thread. It's become like accepted fact, game after game, without regard for his actual play. I think part of it quite frankly is those who root for MDZ (consciously or unconsciously) twisting the fact that he's not playing like Karlsson into an argument that he sucks and shoot sit in favor of the guy they're rooting for.

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Old
11-20-2013, 11:40 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
trade Del Zotto for a player that they could have signed in August. that is just dumb.. Shore is alright but if that is the best offer, id rather keep Del Zotto till something better comes along..
For once I agree with you.

If the right deal is not there then they shouldn't do it. Bernmeister doesn't run the rangers. We don't just make deals for the sake of making them. MDZ still has a lot to offer. I think he goes out tomorrow night and plays a solid game with a couple of points. It worked for Zucc. If we had the forward depth, then Pouliot would be scratched.

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Old
11-20-2013, 11:57 PM
  #159
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Well there is something going on between DZ and AV. When a coach publicly announces scratching a guy a day before a game instead of game day, that means that he really doesn't like the guy or something that guy did. Follow that up by three games? Something went down.

That's not sending a message, that's giving him the Ballard treatment. If the defense was top tier, and had a 20 minute muncher that can play both special teams who could walk on in then yeah I can understand making the move. This is just AV getting rid of Torts boy and getting his Arron Rome on with Falk.

Just more distractions and excuses as the team doesn't look close to being a contender. AV better hold other players to that consistency quote, because other than nepotism I cannot believe Pouliot has yet to be a scratch or Brassard not get thrown over and over and not produce.

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Old
11-21-2013, 02:29 AM
  #160
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A couple of basic points that I think we need to keep in mind in the coming months.

1. Slats could pull something off it it makes sense any day now. But remember that he is stubborn. Most trades that he makes seems to involved players or teams that we know that he has worked with for a like half a year.

Ie, if Slats is making calls now, he knows that he just as well might be making the ground work for something that is done in March or in the Summer.

2. 5-6 teams in the West could be cut off come January. That has not been the case in an extremely long time. At previous deadlines, 2-3 teams have been rebuilding. The East is alot tougher, but its 16 teams competing for 8 spost and I wouldn't be suprised if 3-4 teams at least is cut off between January and March. Possibly 5 (there are like 5 teams that should be a bit too weak to compete in the East this year).

That will open things up.

3. I will touch on this subject in another post when I am my usual ridiculous self, but the market is extremely tough right now. But the GMs also has new tools (taking on a portion of the contract (both cap and cash, same relation)) that could open some situations up. It will take a little time for them to get comfortable with this, but it might make sense for us to look into this going forward. We saw it in the Versteeg deal. A vet was dealt to a team that couldn't have paid up for him unless a 50% of the cap hit was taken on.

4. A couple of problems when making a deal is price and not value. I work alot with big transactions and its extremely obvious how things can change dramatically over night when something happens on the other side of the globe with out it really changing anything for the parties involved.

What happens is that the guy buying something all of a sudden wants a bit of a discount because its bad time, while the guy selling something still wants to get paid as usual because in reality its nothing wrong with what he is selling. The "value" is the same, like EBITDA with a mutiple, but they want to price it diffrently.

And this of course applys to any area, among them us trying to deal Del Zotto. We see posts at this place or the trade boards about "how couldn't people have seen how much MDZ sucks before, he actually turned the puck away twice against X eehhehhe". If you have that opinion you don't have a good track of how good the avg D, of the 180 Ds playing regulary in this league, is. Its a hurdle in the way for us. Teams want to get a bargain. We want to get fairly paid. We need something to get past that. That something could be:

(i) We get a player in the exact same position more or less as Del Zotto. Another player caught in a log-jam (think Turris for Rundblad). Another player that is underperforming.

(ii) We deal Del Zotto to a team that desperately needs him (Philly maybe?).

(iii) We deal Del Zotto to a team that acknowledge the picture we have painted of the world. Ottawa for example, MDZ was fantastic against them in the PO's only a year+ ago.

When you look deals made, you can like almost always find a something that really kick-started the process that went down.


Last edited by Ola: 11-21-2013 at 02:47 AM.
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Old
11-21-2013, 02:42 AM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
A couple of things.

-Slats could pull something off it it makes sense any day now. But remember that he is stubborn. Most trades that he makes seems to involved players or teams that we know that he has worked with for a like half a year.

Ie, if Slats is making calls now, he knows that he just as well might be making the ground work for something that is done in March or in the Summer.

-5-6 teams in the West could be cut off come January. That has not been the case in an extremely long time. At previous deadlines, 2-3 teams have been rebuilding. The East is alot tougher, but its 16 teams competing for 8 spost and I wouldn't be suprised if 3-4 teams at least is cut off between January and March. Possibly 5 (there are like 5 teams that should be a bit too weak to compete in the East this year).

That will open things up.

-I will touch on this subject in another post when I am my usual ridiculous self, but the market is extremely tough right now. But the GMs also has new tools (taking on a portion of the contract (both cap and cash, same relation)) that could open some situations up. It will take a little time for them to get comfortable with this, but it might make sense for us to look into this going forward. We saw it in the Versteeg deal. A vet was dealt to a team that couldn't have paid up for him unless a 50% of the cap hit was taken on.
I think is waiting to see if Nash's addition helps the team before he pulls anything on MDZ. MDZ still 23. He's been in organization's favor for years. He's not just a Torts boy, he's a Slats boy.

Slats doesn't usually sell low on people. Somehow he did that with Gomez. Not his M.O. He sold high on Korpikowski. Sold high on Dubinsky and Anisimov.

Unless an offer blows him away I believe he keeps on to DZ unless the wheels start falling off here.

But there will definitely be a deal done by the trade deadline. AV needs more speed in the line up. Boyle on the 3rd line is killing everything. 4th line doesn't see much time. Noticeable shift in play between 1st two lines and 3rd line. Won't fly for long. AV likes balance.

Pyatt will only slow things down more. Only reason he plays is his effective PK ability. Someone who fits AV's system will be traded for... sooner or later...

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Old
11-21-2013, 02:43 AM
  #162
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Why not?

Not sure any of these trades (probably too many) would be realistic - but putting it out there nonetheless:

* - MDZ, JT Miller, Benoit Pouliot + pick for Evander Kane
* - Derrick Brassard for Patrik Berglund
* - Taylor Pyatt for Douglas Murray

* - Darrol Powe & MSC for Linus Omark & Jason LaBarbera (AHL deal)

Callup M Haley

Leaves this lineup:

FORWARDS
Brad Richards ($6.667m) / Evander Kane ($5.250m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Chris Kreider ($0.800m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Mats Zuccarello ($1.150m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Patrik Berglund ($3.250m) / Ryan Callahan ($4.275m)
Brian Boyle ($1.700m) / Dominic Moore ($1.000m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
Micheal Haley ($0.600m)

DEFENSEMEN
Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m) / Dan Girardi ($3.325m)
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Anton Stralman ($1.700m)
John Moore ($0.840m) / Justin Falk ($0.975m)
Douglas Murray ($1.500m)

GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)

BUYOUTS
Wade Redden ($0.000m)

BURIED in AHL
Arron Asham ($0.075m)
Jason LaBarbera ($0.075m)
------
SALARYCAP TOTALS (includes bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000
BONUSES: $650,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $1,079,188

Omark & Labarbera add missing skills to support evident deficiencies in Hartford. Kids should be winning.
Kane, Berglund & Murray add size & toughness in the NHL

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Old
11-21-2013, 03:04 AM
  #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
Not sure any of these trades (probably too many) would be realistic - but putting it out there nonetheless:

* - MDZ, JT Miller, Benoit Pouliot + pick for Evander Kane
* - Derrick Brassard for Patrik Berglund
* - Taylor Pyatt for Douglas Murray

* - Darrol Powe & MSC for Linus Omark & Jason LaBarbera (AHL deal)

Callup M Haley

Leaves this lineup:

FORWARDS
Brad Richards ($6.667m) / Evander Kane ($5.250m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Chris Kreider ($0.800m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Mats Zuccarello ($1.150m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Patrik Berglund ($3.250m) / Ryan Callahan ($4.275m)
Brian Boyle ($1.700m) / Dominic Moore ($1.000m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
Micheal Haley ($0.600m)

DEFENSEMEN
Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m) / Dan Girardi ($3.325m)
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Anton Stralman ($1.700m)
John Moore ($0.840m) / Justin Falk ($0.975m)
Douglas Murray ($1.500m)

GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)

BUYOUTS
Wade Redden ($0.000m)

BURIED in AHL
Arron Asham ($0.075m)
Jason LaBarbera ($0.075m)
------
SALARYCAP TOTALS (includes bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000
BONUSES: $650,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $1,079,188

Omark & Labarbera add missing skills to support evident deficiencies in Hartford. Kids should be winning.
Kane, Berglund & Murray add size & toughness in the NHL
Love the dedication to including cap implications in every post. Impressive. I would never have the patience to do this.

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Old
11-21-2013, 03:12 AM
  #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
Not sure any of these trades (probably too many) would be realistic - but putting it out there nonetheless:

* - MDZ, JT Miller, Benoit Pouliot + pick for Evander Kane
* - Derrick Brassard for Patrik Berglund
* - Taylor Pyatt for Douglas Murray

* - Darrol Powe & MSC for Linus Omark & Jason LaBarbera (AHL deal)

Callup M Haley

Leaves this lineup:

FORWARDS
Brad Richards ($6.667m) / Evander Kane ($5.250m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Chris Kreider ($0.800m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Mats Zuccarello ($1.150m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Patrik Berglund ($3.250m) / Ryan Callahan ($4.275m)
Brian Boyle ($1.700m) / Dominic Moore ($1.000m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
Micheal Haley ($0.600m)

DEFENSEMEN
Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m) / Dan Girardi ($3.325m)
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Anton Stralman ($1.700m)
John Moore ($0.840m) / Justin Falk ($0.975m)
Douglas Murray ($1.500m)

GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)

BUYOUTS
Wade Redden ($0.000m)

BURIED in AHL
Arron Asham ($0.075m)
Jason LaBarbera ($0.075m)
------
SALARYCAP TOTALS (includes bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000
BONUSES: $650,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $1,079,188

Omark & Labarbera add missing skills to support evident deficiencies in Hartford. Kids should be winning.
Kane, Berglund & Murray add size & toughness in the NHL
Rangers would likely have to add to all of those deals, but the brassard deal seems pretty close.

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Old
11-21-2013, 03:19 AM
  #165
Rust Heisenberg
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Trade proposal:

Someone finish my final for me (due in approximately 5 hours) and also somehow make my FCFF model work for my investments project...

in turn i will...

Not be an ass on this board (includes no condescending or satirical responses) for an entire week.

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Old
11-21-2013, 03:34 AM
  #166
Ola
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kenjets- Kick some arse!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
A couple of basic points that I think we need to keep in mind in the coming months.

1. Slats could pull something off it it makes sense any day now. But remember that he is stubborn. Most trades that he makes seems to involved players or teams that we know that he has worked with for a like half a year.

Ie, if Slats is making calls now, he knows that he just as well might be making the ground work for something that is done in March or in the Summer.

2. 5-6 teams in the West could be cut off come January. That has not been the case in an extremely long time. At previous deadlines, 2-3 teams have been rebuilding. The East is alot tougher, but its 16 teams competing for 8 spost and I wouldn't be suprised if 3-4 teams at least is cut off between January and March. Possibly 5 (there are like 5 teams that should be a bit too weak to compete in the East this year).

That will open things up.

3. I will touch on this subject in another post when I am my usual ridiculous self, but the market is extremely tough right now. But the GMs also has new tools (taking on a portion of the contract (both cap and cash, same relation)) that could open some situations up. It will take a little time for them to get comfortable with this, but it might make sense for us to look into this going forward. We saw it in the Versteeg deal. A vet was dealt to a team that couldn't have paid up for him unless a 50% of the cap hit was taken on.

4. A couple of problems when making a deal is price and not value. I work alot with big transactions and its extremely obvious how things can change dramatically over night when something happens on the other side of the globe with out it really changing anything for the parties involved.

What happens is that the guy buying something all of a sudden wants a bit of a discount because its bad time, while the guy selling something still wants to get paid as usual because in reality its nothing wrong with what he is selling. The "value" is the same, like EBITDA with a mutiple, but they want to price it diffrently.

And this of course applys to any area, among them us trying to deal Del Zotto. We see posts at this place or the trade boards about "how couldn't people have seen how much MDZ sucks before, he actually turned the puck away twice against X eehhehhe". If you have that opinion you don't have a good track of how good the avg D, of the 180 Ds playing regulary in this league, is. Its a hurdle in the way for us. Teams want to get a bargain. We want to get fairly paid. We need something to get past that. That something could be:

(i) We get a player in the exact same position more or less as Del Zotto. Another player caught in a log-jam (think Turris for Rundblad). Another player that is underperforming.

(ii) We deal Del Zotto to a team that desperately needs him (Philly maybe?).

(iii) We deal Del Zotto to a team that acknowledge the picture we have painted of the world. Ottawa for example, MDZ was fantastic against them in the PO's only a year+ ago.

When you look deals made, you can like almost always find a something that really kick-started the process that went down.
Ok, against the background of 4. and (i) above, its not easy at all to find potential scenarios out there. Yakupov is of course one option that fits the mold, but he is a former 1st round pick and MDZ is still probably to little to get him.

But we have more or less only looked at younger options. With the cap scenario, teams want to hang on to them.

Could a vet on a "bad" contract be an option (RB run for your losec!) -- with the team getting MDZ taking on money?

I mean, if we start at looking at vets with "bad contracts", that would make sense for us contracts aside, I think we will find alot more interesting names that teams might be willing to move. Looking at the teams in this league from A-Ö, here are some randon names just to name a few.

Bad contracts that would look better if a couple of million is taken back
Tyler Myers (6 x 5.5m)
Christian Erhoff (8 x 4m)
Alex Semin (5 x 7m)
Jeff Skinner (6 x 5.75m)
Nathan Horton (7 x 5.3m)
James Wisniewski (4 x 5.5m)
Johan Franzen (7 x 3.9m)
Ryane Clowe (5 x 4.85m) [jokle]
Vincent Lecavalier (5 x 4.5m)
Mark Streit (4 x 5.2m)
Brent Burns (4 x 5.7m)

Example 1
I mean take Tyler Myers for example. The kid is barely playing solid top 6 hockey right now, he is paid 5.5m per and is in a real negative situation. Buffalo is ridding themselves of misstakes made. Who in their right mind would take him -- with that contract?

OTOH, you got a 6'8 really young RIGHT defensemen. With a heavy shot. Decent first pass. Tremendous reach. Some toughness. He got a 48 pts season in the NHL under his belth.

If Buffalo took on like 25-30% of his contracta, up to 2m per, you get that D for 3.5m per locked up for 6 years. That would definitely put him in another light. The contracts signed out there are really nutty right now, and it seems like the going price for a top 4 D is creeping up towards 4-5m per. We could pay a top 4 D 3.5m per in 2019, I just imagine that could be tremendously valuble. And I definitely think Myers really could use a change of scenary and become a very solid top 4 D (while maybe not a Norris candidate like he was hyped).

Buffalo are rebuilding for sure. Would they be interested in like Michael Del Zotto, Kristo, Skjei and a 2nd round pick package for Tyler Myers and 30% of the contract? Would anyone do MDZ and Miller for Myers and 30% of contract?

Example 2
Detroit just needs to rebuild. They won't make a trade now, but they could be on the outside looking in in a couple of months.

Johan Franzen is on a nuts contract. Del Zotto would help them for sure. We wouldn't face cap-recapturing issues with Franzen due to Burke...

Would they be interested in making Franzen extremely attractive from a cap point of view by taking back say a mil of his 3.9m cap hit and getting Del Zotto and handful of young depth in return?

Like Franzen and 25% of contract (giving him a cap hit of 3m per) for Del Zotto, Oscar Lindberg, Kristo, Skjei and a 3rd rounder? We get our big PF for 4-5 years. We get PO experience and a proven winner. A LW that really could give Nash a board presence. Etc. Detroit jump starts their rebuilding process. They only take back 1m per year.

Bottom line, the proposed thinking is of course far fetched. But many of these guys on horrible contracts get alot more attractive if you take away a couple of millions of their cap hit. They go from players you wouldn't touch with a pole to actually becoming quite interesting.


Last edited by Ola: 11-21-2013 at 03:42 AM.
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Old
11-21-2013, 04:35 AM
  #167
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Would anyone else prefer for AV to play MDZ at LD for 16ish minutes plus 2PP and John Moore at RD for similar minutes for at least 5 games before doing anything drastic? DZ gets back to his natural position and is given a real opportunity and Moore shoots on his off-side and has the skating to get back. JM is advertised to play both sides and hasn't "thrived" so far on the left anyways. We already know DZ, like McD and Staal, is much better on the left. I don't buy the "Del Zotto needs Staal's minutes to play well" because he had a good stretch of hockey while Staal was out. Playing 22 minutes and playing 18 minutes aren't as drastically different as some are suggesting, and I believe giving DZ and JMoore solid, balanced 3rd pairing minutes and a chance to grow together on the second PP unit will help this team.

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Old
11-21-2013, 05:53 AM
  #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Callafan24 View Post
Would anyone else prefer for AV to play MDZ at LD for 16ish minutes plus 2PP and John Moore at RD for similar minutes for at least 5 games before doing anything drastic? DZ gets back to his natural position and is given a real opportunity and Moore shoots on his off-side and has the skating to get back. JM is advertised to play both sides and hasn't "thrived" so far on the left anyways. We already know DZ, like McD and Staal, is much better on the left. I don't buy the "Del Zotto needs Staal's minutes to play well" because he had a good stretch of hockey while Staal was out. Playing 22 minutes and playing 18 minutes aren't as drastically different as some are suggesting, and I believe giving DZ and JMoore solid, balanced 3rd pairing minutes and a chance to grow together on the second PP unit will help this team.
I've thought about trying to move McD or Staal over to the other side. But I don't know...

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11-21-2013, 06:04 AM
  #169
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I just feel like that would be counter productive because they are by far our best LD and play well with Danny and Stralzy. Concerning our bottom pairing, Falk hasn't impressed, DZ needs a shot on the left, and Moore could benefit from playing the right side with a comfortable DZ as his partner.

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11-21-2013, 06:15 AM
  #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Callafan24 View Post
Would anyone else prefer for AV to play MDZ at LD for 16ish minutes plus 2PP and John Moore at RD for similar minutes for at least 5 games before doing anything drastic? DZ gets back to his natural position and is given a real opportunity and Moore shoots on his off-side and has the skating to get back. JM is advertised to play both sides and hasn't "thrived" so far on the left anyways. We already know DZ, like McD and Staal, is much better on the left. I don't buy the "Del Zotto needs Staal's minutes to play well" because he had a good stretch of hockey while Staal was out. Playing 22 minutes and playing 18 minutes aren't as drastically different as some are suggesting, and I believe giving DZ and JMoore solid, balanced 3rd pairing minutes and a chance to grow together on the second PP unit will help this team.
Yea it's not a bad idea . Jmoore didn't practice rd but he should

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11-21-2013, 06:16 AM
  #171
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Darren Dreger said on TSN Radio that Glen Sather is making and taking calls on Michael Del Zotto.

Dreger was asked if the relationship wasn’t that good between Del Zotto and Alain Vignealut and said, “correct. Alain Vigneault took a bit of a swipe, or at least was very honest in answering a question about why Michael Del Zotto isn’t playing consistently for the Rangers today. He said that Del Zotto isn’t playing consistently enough and that sort of boils it down. The problem that Del Zotto has in the Rangers lineup is that he is playing as a third pairing guy behind the likes of McDonagh and Marc Staal on the right side so Glen Sather has been making calls and he has been receiving calls on Del Zotto. The Ottawa Senators, as we reported last night on Insider Trading (below) are among the teams who have shown interest in Del Zotto but the Rangers need to get something back in return and because the fact that he was a high pick and there is still upside in him they are probably asking for a whole lot.”

He added, after Dave Hodge mentioned that it should be an easy trade to make for a team looking for a forward to help them score goals, that “as of yesterday I was told that there were at least five or six teams who have called but we are in November and it’s still relatively early because even though there are a couple of teams in the NHL who are clearly not playoff contenders that’s it and any useful player is useful to the team he is playing on right now so it’s difficult to make trades. In Ottawa’s case it’s literally dollar in and dollar out which complicates things.
http://snyrangersblog.com/2013-14/20...-zotto-rumors/

They kept mentioning Ottawa because they are a Canadian team and its TSN.

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11-21-2013, 06:41 AM
  #172
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Dan Girardi is a concern

Ericsson is close to signing an extension in Detroit. McKenzie reported $4M for 4-5 years. Healey said on the Hotstove early in the season that Ericsson and Girardi are the two top free agent D. He believes the guy in Toronto will stay there. Ericsson didn't break the bank. Hammer in Chicago didn't break the bank. The numbers for Girardi are down. His PP time is gone. His minutes are down. Brooks reported the Rangers haven't made any progress with their free agents. His production is down. He is on pace for 4 goals and 8 points. Girardi isn't getting any assists.

http://www.extraskater.com/player/12...di#usage-stats


Last edited by RangerBoy: 11-21-2013 at 06:52 AM.
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11-21-2013, 06:52 AM
  #173
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
kenjets- Kick some arse!



Ok, against the background of 4. and (i) above, its not easy at all to find potential scenarios out there. Yakupov is of course one option that fits the mold, but he is a former 1st round pick and MDZ is still probably to little to get him.

But we have more or less only looked at younger options. With the cap scenario, teams want to hang on to them.

Could a vet on a "bad" contract be an option (RB run for your losec!) -- with the team getting MDZ taking on money?

I mean, if we start at looking at vets with "bad contracts", that would make sense for us contracts aside, I think we will find alot more interesting names that teams might be willing to move. Looking at the teams in this league from A-Ö, here are some randon names just to name a few.

Bad contracts that would look better if a couple of million is taken back
Tyler Myers (6 x 5.5m)
Christian Erhoff (8 x 4m)
Alex Semin (5 x 7m)
Jeff Skinner (6 x 5.75m)
Nathan Horton (7 x 5.3m)
James Wisniewski (4 x 5.5m)
Johan Franzen (7 x 3.9m)
Ryane Clowe (5 x 4.85m) [jokle]
Vincent Lecavalier (5 x 4.5m)
Mark Streit (4 x 5.2m)
Brent Burns (4 x 5.7m)

Example 1
I mean take Tyler Myers for example. The kid is barely playing solid top 6 hockey right now, he is paid 5.5m per and is in a real negative situation. Buffalo is ridding themselves of misstakes made. Who in their right mind would take him -- with that contract?

OTOH, you got a 6'8 really young RIGHT defensemen. With a heavy shot. Decent first pass. Tremendous reach. Some toughness. He got a 48 pts season in the NHL under his belth.

If Buffalo took on like 25-30% of his contracta, up to 2m per, you get that D for 3.5m per locked up for 6 years. That would definitely put him in another light. The contracts signed out there are really nutty right now, and it seems like the going price for a top 4 D is creeping up towards 4-5m per. We could pay a top 4 D 3.5m per in 2019, I just imagine that could be tremendously valuble. And I definitely think Myers really could use a change of scenary and become a very solid top 4 D (while maybe not a Norris candidate like he was hyped).

Buffalo are rebuilding for sure. Would they be interested in like Michael Del Zotto, Kristo, Skjei and a 2nd round pick package for Tyler Myers and 30% of the contract? Would anyone do MDZ and Miller for Myers and 30% of contract?

Example 2
Detroit just needs to rebuild. They won't make a trade now, but they could be on the outside looking in in a couple of months.

Johan Franzen is on a nuts contract. Del Zotto would help them for sure. We wouldn't face cap-recapturing issues with Franzen due to Burke...

Would they be interested in making Franzen extremely attractive from a cap point of view by taking back say a mil of his 3.9m cap hit and getting Del Zotto and handful of young depth in return?

Like Franzen and 25% of contract (giving him a cap hit of 3m per) for Del Zotto, Oscar Lindberg, Kristo, Skjei and a 3rd rounder? We get our big PF for 4-5 years. We get PO experience and a proven winner. A LW that really could give Nash a board presence. Etc. Detroit jump starts their rebuilding process. They only take back 1m per year.

Bottom line, the proposed thinking is of course far fetched. But many of these guys on horrible contracts get alot more attractive if you take away a couple of millions of their cap hit. They go from players you wouldn't touch with a pole to actually becoming quite interesting.


i disagree with both trades actually. I think that would be overpaying to get Myers but i like Miller and DZ for Myers with salary retained. I dont wanna trade a 2nd or Skjei tho, that would be too much.

i disagree with the Franzen trade because we are trading young kids for a vet who is in his 30s. IMO that would be horrible

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11-21-2013, 07:12 AM
  #174
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I would 100% take Girardi back on a $4-4.5/year deal. Preferably for 3 or 4 years.

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11-21-2013, 07:15 AM
  #175
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James Wisniewski would be a nice fit here but very tough to match up money. You also have to wonder whether Jarmo Kekalainen has the stomach to make another deal with the Rangers.

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