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Keep Calm and Cleary On... I can't believe this thread is still needed.

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Old
11-22-2013, 04:24 PM
  #151
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Originally Posted by SimplySolace View Post
Maybe this is Babcock's way of giving him a last chance to show what he can do before Weiss+Alfie return and a move has to be made? Someone's gotta go eventually.
That could very well be. Something has to give here and though I think Sammy is the most likely guy to sit, something needs to happen and I wouldn't be terribly surprised to see Cleary in the press box instead of, or with Sammy.

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11-22-2013, 04:25 PM
  #152
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That could very well be. Something has to give here and though I think Sammy is the most likely guy to sit, something needs to happen and I wouldn't be terribly surprised to see Cleary in the press box instead of, or with Sammy.
Not even just pressbox. Since Sammy can't be waived for anything worth a damn, maybe they shock us and waive their golden boy.

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11-22-2013, 04:32 PM
  #153
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I'm more sad about the downward spiral of Dan Cleary than I am mad about his role. I used to like the guy, he used to bring real value to the team. He used to have clutch moments. He was gritty and effective and versatile and could provide some offensive punch like an actual top-6 winger at times. He was a glue guy, with empirical value and intangibles that made him a crowd favorite. "I can see clearly now, the rain is gone...."

What we have now makes me a panda. The rain has come back. The obstacles are apparently blurry.
Think you're a bit too "stuck in the past" and nostalgic regarding Cleary. But I think management is obviously the same way.

Guy really hasn't been a relevant hockey player in like 3 years. It's not like his decline is a sudden development. He's been awful for the better part of the last two years.

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11-22-2013, 04:37 PM
  #154
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Think you're a bit too "stuck in the past" and nostalgic regarding Cleary. But I think management is obviously the same way.
Noooooo, not at all. I want him off the roster as bad as anyone. I annoy my wife complaining about him during games. Even as a Holland supporter, I find fault with his signing.

I'm just stating facts about his past. As bad as he is now, you can't deny what he's done in the past if you're being honest. At no point do I see that as a defense of what Cleary is now, or as evidence he should stay on the team. I'm simply making a comment about how disappointing it is to see a player, who once had value and was actually fun to watch, decline into what he is now. It's too bad is all.


Quote:
Guy really hasn't been a relevant hockey player in like 3 years. It's not like his decline is a sudden development. He's been awful for the better part of the last two years.
I agree with that. I think he took a big dip from 11/12 to 12/13, and now another big dip from 12/13 to this year. He's barely a shell of his former self.

IT'S SAD, FRK IT, THAT'S ALL I'M SAYING!

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11-22-2013, 04:41 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by jaster View Post
I agree with that. I think he took a big dip from 11/12 to 12/13, and now another big dip from 12/13 to this year. He's barely a shell of his former self.

IT'S SAD, FRK IT, THAT'S ALL I'M SAYING!
Haha it is sad Jaster. I suppose you're allowed to have a heart

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11-22-2013, 04:45 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by SimplySolace View Post
Plays on the top line with Z+D and gets 1st line PP time. Gee, I wonder why..
and so does Cleary, Franzen, Sammy.. what's your point? It's about putting the puck in the net and he has done that.

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11-22-2013, 05:41 PM
  #157
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and so does Cleary, Franzen, Sammy.. what's your point? It's about putting the puck in the net and he has done that.
In what games have those three played top line minutes with D+Z together? Obviously none of them as much as Bertuzzi has.

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11-23-2013, 09:09 AM
  #158
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In what games have those three played top line minutes with D+Z together? Obviously none of them as much as Bertuzzi has.
and he's cashed in on an opportunity. He's so bad he scores goals when he gets the chance to play on the top line... oh no!

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11-23-2013, 10:51 AM
  #159
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and so does Cleary, Franzen, Sammy.. what's your point? It's about putting the puck in the net and he has done that.
Not so sure you want to include Cleary in a discussion of guys who have cashed in on playing on the top line (or with Datsyuk)... he was terrible last year with Pavel and not only did Cleary not score, he went a long way towards extinguishing Datsyuk's offense.

Agree with you on Bert, though- he's look better than I expected this year and has put up some points. I don't see him being effective anywhere else in the lineup, either, so they kinda have to play him there.

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11-23-2013, 10:59 AM
  #160
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Not so sure you want to include Cleary in a discussion of guys who have cashed in on playing on the top line (or with Datsyuk)... he was terrible last year with Pavel and not only did Cleary not score, he went a long way towards extinguishing Datsyuk's offense.

Agree with you on Bert, though- he's look better than I expected this year and has put up some points. I don't see him being effective anywhere else in the lineup, either, so they kinda have to play him there.
well I hate even mentioning ole Danny boy because I'm sure some little Tim Bits could play better then him.

But yeah, Bert thrives more than anyone when he is with Pavel and Pavel has a little more room with him on the ice as his protector. There has always been great chemistry between the two. I'm sure that playing with Pavel makes Bert feel a few years younger.

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11-23-2013, 11:02 AM
  #161
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Just wait until Daniel's confidence moves up from "middle." Watch out NHL! The only reason he's struggling is because his confidence is "middle."

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11-23-2013, 11:03 AM
  #162
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Just wait until Daniel's confidence moves up from "middle." Watch out NHL! The only reason he's struggling is because his confidence is "middle."
He might give Ovechkin a run for his money

ps - where does this "middle" reference come from?

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11-23-2013, 11:08 AM
  #163
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Noooooo, not at all. I want him off the roster as bad as anyone. I annoy my wife complaining about him during games. Even as a Holland supporter, I find fault with his signing.

I'm just stating facts about his past. As bad as he is now, you can't deny what he's done in the past if you're being honest. At no point do I see that as a defense of what Cleary is now, or as evidence he should stay on the team. I'm simply making a comment about how disappointing it is to see a player, who once had value and was actually fun to watch, decline into what he is now. It's too bad is all.




I agree with that. I think he took a big dip from 11/12 to 12/13, and now another big dip from 12/13 to this year. He's barely a shell of his former self.

IT'S SAD, FRK IT, THAT'S ALL I'M SAYING!
I agree Jaster.

I think Holland can see both sides of this.

It is easy on a message board to say "FIRE HIM NOW". But Holland is a human being, and Cleary is an organizational friend. And what you do in that case is this: You tell Cleary he is falling down the depth chart. Cleary says, just give me some more time, its just a slump. Holland figured maybe last years playoffs was Cleary coming out of a slump, he only took him back on the cheap. But Cleary must know he is on thin ice. I imagine Holland has told him as much. I think the minutes he is getting now, is not necessarily idiocy. It is putting a nail in the coffin. Look how much time we gave you, Look who we let you play with? Sorry, but you are now off the team. Half way through this season is realistically when Cleary OR Sammy will be fired. I basically expect 1 of them to go when DD gets back from LTIR.

When Holland brought up Nyquist, He knew what he was doing. To trade Tatar for prospects or scraps is not going to happen. We don't have the salary to really move young guys for high price players. Basically the best options are to trade sammy or waive cleary. Even if you waive Cleary, he might come back later if no one claims him.

In either Case, Holland has a heart I am sure. And he is delaying getting rid of cleary to give him a chance to do something. As long as he does not do anything impressive… I think his time here is running out. Goodwill can only go so far. The difference between Nyquist and Cleary is so vast, it has to excentuate how badly Cleary has gotten.

Edit: Please don't respond to this post just to say "its a business" "I know better" "Cleary should be gone long ago" because we all know that. I am just saying that what I am saying is closer to the truth of what is happening. You don't need to remind me how bad he is playing now. I am just saying that Holland KNOWS this, but is still just giving him a little more rope to hang himself. That way the Red Wings "gave him a chance" and everyone in the locker room can say, "sorry man, but he really did give you a chance".

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11-23-2013, 11:10 AM
  #164
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Originally Posted by tunasnacks View Post
well I hate even mentioning ole Danny boy because I'm sure some little Tim Bits could play better then him.

But yeah, Bert thrives more than anyone when he is with Pavel and Pavel has a little more room with him on the ice as his protector. There has always been great chemistry between the two. I'm sure that playing with Pavel makes Bert feel a few years younger.
Even a feeling a few years younger, Bert would still be a few years past his prime.

I'm hoping that Bert continues to have a solid year and then rides off into the sunset after this year. I feel like the Wings are on borrowed time with his health and he's due to break down at any time now.

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11-23-2013, 11:11 AM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Brick Top View Post
Even a feeling a few years younger, Bert would still be a few years past his prime.

I'm hoping that Bert continues to have a solid year and then rides off into the sunset after this year. I feel like the Wings are on borrowed time with his health and he's due to break down at any time now.
I feel the same way; honestly I think any health issues this year push Bert to retirement, if he isn't already leaning that way, and I suspect he is.

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11-23-2013, 11:12 AM
  #166
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“It’s not enough,” coach Mike Babcock said. “The bottom line though, is confidence is a tough thing in the league. We’re hoping ideally that playing him with Pav might help him. Pav is a pretty good player. We need Pav to be going big-time for us to have success, and helping him is probably more important in someways that helping Cleary, but that’s our thought process right now.”
http://www.freep.com/article/2013112...TS05/311230053

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11-23-2013, 11:15 AM
  #167
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Originally Posted by Brick Top View Post
Even a feeling a few years younger, Bert would still be a few years past his prime.

I'm hoping that Bert continues to have a solid year and then rides off into the sunset after this year. I feel like the Wings are on borrowed time with his health and he's due to break down at any time now.
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Originally Posted by SoupNazi View Post
I feel the same way; honestly I think any health issues this year push Bert to retirement, if he isn't already leaning that way, and I suspect he is.
I'm a huge Bert fan and also believe this will be his last year. Hope he has a great rest of the season and go out on a high note.

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gracias

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11-23-2013, 11:17 AM
  #168
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^^

This just states Cleary will only get a little time up there. He is on a shorter leash than his normal 200 feet.

Its a slow process, but lets just hope he keeps playing badly. Because he is hanging himself with all the time he is getting.

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11-23-2013, 11:22 AM
  #169
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^^

This just states Cleary will only get a little time up there. He is on a shorter leash than his normal 200 feet.

Its a slow process, but lets just hope he keeps playing badly. Because he is hanging himself with all the time he is getting.
Still debating on if I should wear my Kronwall jersey or if I should have a "Cleary for MVP" shirt for Wednesday against Boston... my group of friends on all wearing one at the game

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11-23-2013, 11:23 AM
  #170
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We need Pav to be going big-time for us to have success, and helping him is probably more important in someways that helping Cleary, but that’s our thought process right now.”
Fire this clown. Oh it's more important to help a horrible player that has 3 points on a 1 year deal than your best player?

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11-23-2013, 11:24 AM
  #171
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Good old Babs, king of the understatement.

"We need Pav to be going big-time for us to have success, and helping him is probably more important in someways that helping Cleary."

Yes Babcock, I would agree with this. Considering that getting Cleary in his top form results in a still subpar NHL scoring line forward, while Datsyuk is one half of the engine that drives the Wings right now.

I'd say keeping Datsyuk going and in a position to be productive is just a LITTLE BIT more important than getting Cleary going

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11-23-2013, 11:26 AM
  #172
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Good old Babs, king of the understatement.

"We need Pav to be going big-time for us to have success, and helping him is probably more important in someways that helping Cleary."
No kidding, Mike.

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11-23-2013, 11:26 AM
  #173
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Originally Posted by tunasnacks View Post
Still debating on if I should wear my Kronwall jersey or if I should have a "Cleary for MVP" shirt for Wednesday against Boston... my group of friends on all wearing one at the game
Go with "Jeers 4 Clears"

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11-23-2013, 11:29 AM
  #174
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Still debating on if I should wear my Kronwall jersey or if I should have a "Cleary for MVP" shirt for Wednesday against Boston... my group of friends on all wearing one at the game
How is that a debate? Your friends should shun you if you wear the Kronwall jersey, and you might be banned from HF for making a poor choice (Soupnazi will make that happen).

You wear the "Cleary for MVP" shirt to the Joe and become part of the legacy of those who have supported important social causes in this country's history.

I'm just here to help

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11-23-2013, 11:39 AM
  #175
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How is that a debate? Your friends should shun you if you wear the Kronwall jersey, and you might be banned from HF for making a poor choice (Soupnazi will make that happen).

You wear the "Cleary for MVP" shirt to the Joe and become part of the legacy of those who have supported important social causes in this country's history.

I'm just here to help
I actually like Kronwall even though he ****s up a lot... oh well. I have a Shanny jersey. Might get a DeKeyser and a Datyuk Winter Classic.

Might just have to wear the shirt!

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