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Old
11-18-2013, 12:18 PM
  #276
Psuhockey
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The flyers can only move 1 forward from the lineup with Laughton on the way. After that, they would be backfilling with players not ready like Cousins or huge question marks like Straka and Akeson. If they resign Downie that could be two but that's pushing it. The best bet is to bandaid in free agency. Next years crop isn't great but maybe Markov isn't re-upped by the Canadians. Or it is possible Girardi makes it to UFA with the huge salary he would command and the rangers having to re-up the whole team next year. It is stupid IMO for any decent defenseman to not check out what UFA has to offer with the crazy salaries that are being thrown around.

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11-18-2013, 12:19 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
I have been saying this all along. nobody is going to trade their top pairing defenseman. especially a guy who can run the PP. Stop with the stupid proposals and be patient with our young guys. The Flyers finally have a nice young group of defenseman in the system. let them develop and see what we have.
And when they do get here dont start throwing out the B word after 25 games if things dont go well right away when they do get to the big club.
I wouldnt mind them looking at Gardiner or Kulikov in the offseason if thats the direction they decided to go in. With Mez on his way out and with Timonens status beyond this season being up in the air it would be fine to look at a player like Kulikov. If the price is right of course.
Exactly this. There are so few #1 defensemen in this league, and every team wants one. Realistically, the only way to get one of these guys anymore is to draft and develop one. Which is certainly not an exact science.

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11-18-2013, 03:08 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
We need someone better than Carle. If we're trading assets to acquire a guy he needs to be able to shoot and QB a PP.
I agree 100% with you. We need to be patient and just keep adding to our core of young players. Not blowing up the team. I firmly believe that this team is not that far from being a contending team. A scoring winger would be a plus. It is nice to think that we now are very solid in net and have some prospects behind them in the future. As far as Luke goes, I am a huge fan and look forward to the day he and Sam Morin get to play together. Keep the faith people.

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11-20-2013, 07:08 AM
  #279
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Originally Posted by FreshPerspective View Post
It almost worked with Weber but the Suter and Parise attempt was really foolish IMO..that was the one that caused both Carle and Jagr to split.

From what I recall of Meltzer's point on this was that even with Coburn's signing they had tagging space at one point to get Carle signed. Don't remember the exact details. Sure Holmgren would have had to be creative with the cap but we know how that goes. He figured he would go for the homeruns..high risk and high reward. Sometimes you win those and sometimes you don't. Ask Ryan Howard.....your best bet is small ball in the long run. Holmgren is not that kind of GM and like you noted it's b/c of a win now mentality which is fine but not something sustainable...that's all. We paid a price last season..hopefully not this one.
Holmgren screwed up he kept the wrong defenseman, he should have traded Coburn and resigned Carle.
And why in the world do we need another defensive defenseman (Schenn) when we can't move the puck out of our defensive zone.
We needed an offensive minded defenseman like Carle, Holmgren just doesn't get it!!!

I would be okay trading Luke for a #1 defenseman.
I would be willing to give them both Schenn's if that's the going price for a real #1 defenseman.
If I thought the Flyers were able to develop defenseman I would be willing to wait, but
they have not given any evidence that they have the patience or coaching skills to develop a offensive defenseman.
We would be better served gutting some of the team for a young NHL ready defenseman, and drafting more forwards next year.


Last edited by DecadesofFutility: 11-20-2013 at 07:38 AM.
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11-20-2013, 07:37 AM
  #280
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Carle was fine while he was here. I don't think we'd've gotten much of a discount, Carle would not have been worth it with his new contract.

We could use an offensive D-man. We don't need Carle.

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11-20-2013, 08:20 AM
  #281
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Darren Dreger said on NHL Live last night that the Flyers might be looking to move Luke Schenn because he's had a bad year. Am I watching the same Schenn as these people? I really don't think he's been bad this year, but I'm being told by guys like Dreger and people on Facebook that Schenn is the worst dman in the league.

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11-20-2013, 08:27 AM
  #282
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Schenn was great last night. No idea what he's on.

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11-20-2013, 08:29 AM
  #283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDinklage Morgoone View Post
Darren Dreger said on NHL Live last night that the Flyers might be looking to move Luke Schenn because he's had a bad year. Am I watching the same Schenn as these people? I really don't think he's been bad this year, but I'm being told by guys like Dreger and people on Facebook that Schenn is the worst dman in the league.
Probably speculating since Schenn was benched this year by Berube.

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11-20-2013, 08:30 AM
  #284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zod View Post
Carle was fine while he was here. I don't think we'd've gotten much of a discount, Carle would not have been worth it with his new contract.

We could use an offensive D-man. We don't need Carle.
That maybe your opinion mine is that Carle is better than any offensive defenseman that the Flyers have on their roster.

And Carle was certainly more valuable to this team than Luke Schenn has been.

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11-20-2013, 08:59 AM
  #285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DecadesofFutility View Post
That maybe your opinion mine is that Carle is better than any offensive defenseman that the Flyers have on their roster.

And Carle was certainly more valuable to this team than Luke Schenn has been.
I tend to agree with this..but I think the Flyers did the right thing making Coburn the priority over Carle although supposedly they had tagging space to sign Carle as well to a more reasonable contract than the one he got with Tampa. Letting him fall into the open market is what drove up his price which is only natural in the business world. However, as Meltzer noted on one of his twitter posts at the time....if you have a need which in this case the Flyers did for a PMD since they didn't get Suter..you have to overpay. Going with a committee of 3 scrub cusp NHL players in Gervais, Foster and then Huskins to compensate for the big minutes Carle played didn't cut it as we saw...and again all you did was increase 3 fold the chances of boneheaded play on D.

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11-26-2013, 01:09 PM
  #286
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Confession, Luke Schenn is not good and i really do think be a fringe nhler at this point. We need to find a way to dump his contract.

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11-26-2013, 01:34 PM
  #287
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I have to admit that he looks just like an average 3rd pairing stay at home defenseman so far this season.

Last season he really seemed to play with more confidence and carried the defense when all those injuries occurred. He needs to be more of a factor for this team to warrant a 3.6M cap hit.

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11-26-2013, 01:47 PM
  #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
Confession, Luke Schenn is not good and i really do think be a fringe nhler at this point. We need to find a way to dump his contract.
So next year our defense will be

Coburn-Streit
Gustafsson-Grossmann
??????-??????
??????

Schenn isn't a fringe NHLer because players like that spend time in the AHL and/or extended time as healthy scratches, and considering the Cap is going up and Kimmo and Meszaros are coming off the books there's no good reason for the Flyers to dump his contract.


Last edited by Curufinwe: 11-26-2013 at 01:54 PM.
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11-26-2013, 01:55 PM
  #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
So next year our defense will be

Coburn-Streit
Gustafsson-Grossmann
??????-??????
??????
coburn-streit
gus-grossman
ghost-alt/lauridsen ???

dude, your guess is as good as mine. I wouldn't hate that third pairing in another year or so, but next year is probably too soon for one or both of those guys to make the jump (if at all)

edit:: still don't think we should dump Luke, but he makes too much to do too little.

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11-26-2013, 01:57 PM
  #290
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Ghost will need time in the AHL, and Lauridsen was a disaster in the preseason and has the same deficiencies as Schenn only they're much more pronounced. I do think Alt could play a role here next year.

Schenn isn't justifying his cap hit this season, but last season he was worth every penny. There's no reason he can't get back to that level.

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11-26-2013, 01:59 PM
  #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
So next year our defense will be

Coburn-Streit
Gustafsson-Grossmann
??????-??????
??????

Schenn isn't a fringe NHLer because players like that spend time in the AHL and/or extended time as healthy scratches, and considering the Cap is going up and Kimmo and Meszaros are coming off the books there's no good reason for the Flyers to dump his contract.
He's been a healthy scratch many times in TO and it already has started happening here this season.

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11-26-2013, 02:04 PM
  #292
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No, he wasn't. In Toronto he played in 310 out of 328 possible games, and 12 of the games he missed were as a rookie due to injury.


Last edited by Curufinwe: 11-26-2013 at 02:33 PM.
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11-26-2013, 02:17 PM
  #293
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Originally Posted by SCOREacek View Post
He's been a healthy scratch many times in TO and it already has started happening here this season.
5 games in 4 years in Toronto. Not exactly many times.

12 in first year missed due to injury.

3 2nd year scratched. 2 in 4th year... and another... but that one he was apparently banged up as well.

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11-26-2013, 02:20 PM
  #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
So next year our defense will be

Coburn-Streit
Gustafsson-Grossmann
??????-??????
??????
The defense should be:

UFA/trade - Coburn
Streit Grossman
Gustafsson-Alt

Luke Schenn can't skate, handle the puck or make smart safe decisions this year. True he looked great last year, but that's last year. Whether the flyers make the playoffs or don't, the blueline needs to be upgraded. If that costs B Schenn, Simmonds, Laughton or even Voracek, so be it. The flyers won't be competing for Stanley Cup without an upgrade.

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11-26-2013, 02:20 PM
  #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShaneTrain View Post
coburn-streit
gus-grossman
ghost-alt/lauridsen ???

dude, your guess is as good as mine. I wouldn't hate that third pairing in another year or so, but next year is probably too soon for one or both of those guys to make the jump (if at all)

edit:: still don't think we should dump Luke, but he makes too much to do too little.
I just threw up a little in my mouth. Seriously, Laurisden and Ghost are your solution?

Schenn is 24 y/o. He isn't a fringe NHLer. Laurisden is the definition of a fringe NHLer.

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11-26-2013, 02:23 PM
  #296
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I just don't think he is or ever will be that good a defenseman.
I actually think this bear could give him a run for his money. Similar skating styles



Last edited by MP92: 11-26-2013 at 02:28 PM.
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11-26-2013, 02:28 PM
  #297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
The defense should be:

UFA/trade - Coburn
Streit Grossman
Gustafsson-Alt

Luke Schenn can't skate, handle the puck or make smart safe decisions this year. True he looked great last year, but that's last year. Whether the flyers make the playoffs or don't, the blueline needs to be upgraded. If that costs B Schenn, Simmonds, Laughton or even Voracek, so be it. The flyers won't be competing for Stanley Cup without an upgrade.
So, your good with Grossmann making his dough as the #3/#4 but Schenn can't skate and doesn't make smart safe decisions?

Grossmann is Schenn with 5 years of experience and a few concussions.

If you don't like Grossmann in your top 4 then I understand not wanting Schenn there but if you are good with Grossmann then you shouldn't be concerned with Schenn.

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11-26-2013, 02:29 PM
  #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
The defense should be:

UFA/trade - Coburn
Streit Grossman
Gustafsson-Alt

Luke Schenn can't skate, handle the puck or make smart safe decisions this year. True he looked great last year, but that's last year. Whether the flyers make the playoffs or don't, the blueline needs to be upgraded. If that costs B Schenn, Simmonds, Laughton or even Voracek, so be it. The flyers won't be competing for Stanley Cup without an upgrade.
Grossmann can't skate or handle the puck any better than Schenn, and is much more injury prone. Dumping Schenn when his value is at its lowest would be poor use of an asset.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOREacek View Post
I just don't think he is or ever will be that good a defenseman.
I actually think this bear could give him a run for his money. Similar skating styles
Get caught making an exaggerated claim that is wholly unsupported by the evidence. Post a dumb video in response.

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Old
11-26-2013, 02:33 PM
  #299
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Last night Luke Schenn looked hesitant out there.....for a guy who is limited with his skating ..overthinking is death sentence for him. He better get his crap together. One particular incident looked comical last night...he flubbed the puck and tried to retrieve it with a poke checking action as if his stick and blade were a spear. Looked like a caveman...booga booga...

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11-26-2013, 02:36 PM
  #300
JDinkalage Morgoone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lancer247 View Post
I just threw up a little in my mouth. Seriously, Laurisden and Ghost are your solution?

Schenn is 24 y/o. He isn't a fringe NHLer. Laurisden is the definition of a fringe NHLer.
Grass is greener here. I don't get the infatuation for Ollie. Mark Alt and Ghost aren't solutions either. I don't understand what Schenn did to make everyone hate him.

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