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Old
12-03-2013, 07:44 AM
  #951
NikC
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Originally Posted by Barnaby View Post
I disagree on that…

I'll admit that you can count me as a guy who gets pumped up when players fight. Enforcer vs enforcer doesn't do much for me, but the in game fighting to defend teammates, and change momentum is an appealing part of the game for me. I think it can effect a hockey game, because it may change how certain teams play the game, and it can be a major momentum shifter.
This. Employing past prime goons for staged fights isn't the answer. Nasty, punishing players that can add value in this area outside their position.

Losing fights and getting manhandled hurts the morale or at least it should.
Maybe complacency is the bigger problem.

We need an upgrade in skill but we sorely need an upgrade in physicality

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12-03-2013, 07:50 AM
  #952
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Before anyone rips me for not wanting toughness, I do want toughness. What I don't want in the slightest are goons that play 3 minutes a night and get paid to pound faces in. I have no interest in those. We already had a talentless hack that Tortorella had a love connection with in Bickel. I hated Bickel throughout his entire tenure and was thrilled when he was sent back to the AHL, where he belongs.

Same goes for guys like Orr, Janssen, Scott, and whichever other goons are out there doing nothing but fighting with other goons devoid of talent.

What I want are players who can
A.) play hockey
B.) play tough, go to the rough areas, and muck it up in the corners.

And I am not of the opinion that goons fighting goons do anything to change to momentum of the game.

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12-03-2013, 08:22 AM
  #953
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I dont care if the team doesnt have another fight for the rest of the season. That stuff is virtually worthless.

But I want a team that takes the body every shift. Thats been non-existent this season.

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12-03-2013, 08:44 AM
  #954
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I dont care if the team doesnt have another fight for the rest of the season. That stuff is virtually worthless.

But I want a team that takes the body every shift. Thats been non-existent this season.
You need athletes and not Manorexic pretty boys out there. What was the deal with John Moore dropping down to 207?

Came in at 215, a 6'3" 225 skating version of John Moore is Kreider's body on defense.

Pouliot looks like his bones will break the rare instance he takes it to the slot, always turning his body away from contact and being ok with a turnover.

Dorsett's a trooper, admire is heart and willingness, but he's called Twigy for a reason, man can that kid take a fistful.

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Old
12-03-2013, 09:18 AM
  #955
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Clearly Boyle wasn't jumped here as Jonathon stated...Boyle knew it was coming and was square to him...Carkner doing his job for Boyle roughing up Karlsson the game before...and for all the Bickel haters look at him trying to help his team mates




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vy608FsoZnA

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12-03-2013, 09:40 AM
  #956
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Mental toughness is just as big of a problem as physical toughness, perhaps even moreso. They are utterly incapable of tying a game in the 3rd period, and while the team generally has been good at holding a lead this year, they blew leads in two of the last three games. For the past month, this team will be a game over .500, only to lose the next one and be back to .500 again. This team isn't resilient and wilts pretty easily.

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12-03-2013, 09:45 AM
  #957
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Mental toughness is just as big of a problem as physical toughness, perhaps even moreso. They are utterly incapable of tying a game in the 3rd period, and while the team generally has been good at holding a lead this year, they blew leads in two of the last three games. For the past month, this team will be a game over .500, only to lose the next one and be back to .500 again. This team isn't resilient and wilts pretty easily.
Good point. Who could have foreseen that part of the game slipping when they started importing perennial losers from Columbus at a large clip?

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12-03-2013, 09:47 AM
  #958
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Good point. Who could have foreseen that part of the game slipping when they started importing perennial losers from Columbus at a large clip?
Or a former high 1st round pick who can't find a team and wasn't offered a contract by his last team.

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12-03-2013, 09:48 AM
  #959
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Good point. Who could have foreseen that part of the game slipping when they started importing perennial losers from Columbus at a large clip?
this is why the Rangers should have went after Ryan or Ladd a few years ago.. teams that trade for players from winning cultures usually benefit.. rangers have too many players from that losing mentality.. not a good match at all

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12-03-2013, 09:49 AM
  #960
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Or a former high 1st round pick who can't find a team and wasn't offered a contract by his last team.
The Pouliot and Pyatt signings of the last 2 seasons exemplify Sather perfectly. Quick and, most of all, lazy.

These are the 2 guys handpicked by the GM to be depth stopgaps, and they are as close to worthless as they come.

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12-03-2013, 09:50 AM
  #961
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Before anyone rips me for not wanting toughness, I do want toughness. What I don't want in the slightest are goons that play 3 minutes a night and get paid to pound faces in. I have no interest in those.
Why do we beat this argument to death. Absolutely no one is calling for a goon.

There's a difference between building a soft, skilled team and playing a goon or two on the 4th line to keep other team's honest, and building a gritty team from top to bottom with size, speed, and skill.

Hell, we have a soft, "skilled" team without any sense of team toughness and look how we get pushed around every game regardless of win or loss.

Those of you proposing that we protect our players and keep other team's honest with our "lethal PP" need to wake the **** up.

We need to add skill, speed, and toughness to our lineup to compete with the league's elite; the going isn't going to get any easier come playoff time. It's not like you can only add toughness, or only skill, or only speed; every contender has a balance. Given our current makeup and skill-set, would you rather model this roster after the Bruins, Blues, Kings, and Sharks, or the Red Wings and Penguins?

Almost everyone can agree that we need a top-9 LW, a top-9 Center, and a RHD.

So instead of contemplating whether or not we need to address toughness while we watch our identity-deprived, undersized, timid roster play inconsistent, you-never-know-what-you're-going-to-get .500 hockey, we should be contemplating how we can improve our roster, who we should target, and how we can acquire such assets from organizational positions of strength. With big name, high-value players hitting Free Agency these upcoming off seasons (Callahan, Girardi, Lundqvist, Stralman, MDZ, Brassard, Staal...) now is the time to identify where we are headed as an organization. Start negotiating extension offers with our UFA's and if the talks go nowhere up to the deadline, find the best returns around the league that make this team better now and in the immediate future.

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Old
12-03-2013, 09:57 AM
  #962
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
The Pouliot and Pyatt signings of the last 2 seasons exemplify Sather perfectly. Quick and, most of all, lazy.

These are the 2 guys handpicked by the GM to be depth stopgaps, and they are as close to worthless as they come.
Yup, and he's too stubborn to correct his mistakes. That's his most glaring fault, and the main reason for our perennial mediocrity.

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12-03-2013, 10:23 AM
  #963
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I would take McGrattan in a heartbeat but thats me...





Quote:
Originally Posted by Callafan24 View Post
Why do we beat this argument to death. Absolutely no one is calling for a goon.

There's a difference between building a soft, skilled team and playing a goon or two on the 4th line to keep other team's honest, and building a gritty team from top to bottom with size, speed, and skill.

Hell, we have a soft, "skilled" team without any sense of team toughness and look how we get pushed around every game regardless of win or loss.

Those of you proposing that we protect our players and keep other team's honest with our "lethal PP" need to wake the **** up.

We need to add skill, speed, and toughness to our lineup to compete with the league's elite; the going isn't going to get any easier come playoff time. It's not like you can only add toughness, or only skill, or only speed; every contender has a balance. Given our current makeup and skill-set, would you rather model this roster after the Bruins, Blues, Kings, and Sharks, or the Red Wings and Penguins?

Almost everyone can agree that we need a top-9 LW, a top-9 Center, and a RHD.

So instead of contemplating whether or not we need to address toughness while we watch our identity-deprived, undersized, timid roster play inconsistent, you-never-know-what-you're-going-to-get .500 hockey, we should be contemplating how we can improve our roster, who we should target, and how we can acquire such assets from organizational positions of strength. With big name, high-value players hitting Free Agency these upcoming off seasons (Callahan, Girardi, Lundqvist, Stralman, MDZ, Brassard, Staal...) now is the time to identify where we are headed as an organization. Start negotiating extension offers with our UFA's and if the talks go nowhere up to the deadline, find the best returns around the league that make this team better now and in the immediate future.

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Old
12-03-2013, 10:28 AM
  #964
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id rather have Stu Bickel up front over Pouliot and Pyatt at the moment

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12-03-2013, 12:45 PM
  #965
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We have this thing where we take scrappy, fast goons and turn them in to players. Am I alone in thinking that Haley has some potential?

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12-03-2013, 12:46 PM
  #966
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We have this thing where we take scrappy, fast goons and turn them in to players.
Source?

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12-03-2013, 12:46 PM
  #967
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Originally Posted by Elvis Presley View Post
Am I alone in thinking that Haley has some potential?
Probably not, as alarming as that is.

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12-03-2013, 01:12 PM
  #968
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Originally Posted by Elvis Presley View Post
We have this thing where we take scrappy, fast goons and turn them in to players. Am I alone in thinking that Haley has some potential?
Haley is hurt. Hes also been referenced as a grade A **** teammate at more than one spot in his career.

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Old
12-03-2013, 01:27 PM
  #969
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Originally Posted by Elvis Presley View Post
We have this thing where we take scrappy, fast goons and turn them in to players. Am I alone in thinking that Haley has some potential?
the one was that was Orr.. McIntyre we never gave a chance but had some games with Penguins and Oilers.. other than that most of the Rangers goons were over the hill Brashear, Rupp, McCarthy etc..

Prust was luck by trade. at least he can kill penalties.. not many tough guys do that.

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12-03-2013, 01:35 PM
  #970
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Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
the one was that was Orr.. McIntyre we never gave a chance but had some games with Penguins and Oilers.. other than that most of the Rangers goons were over the hill Brashear, Rupp, McCarthy etc..

Prust was luck by trade. at least he can kill penalties.. not many tough guys do that.
Did the Rangers have MacIntyre? Are you thinking McAllister?

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12-03-2013, 01:37 PM
  #971
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Did the Rangers have MacIntyre? Are you thinking McAllister?
Rangers had McIlntrye in their Hartford Wolfpack team like JAM to an AHL contract. they had their chance to sign him.. McAllister he was another bum, who else was their Dave Krapa i mean Karpa.. Sather the king of useless crap

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12-03-2013, 01:39 PM
  #972
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Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
the one was that was Orr.. McIntyre we never gave a chance but had some games with Penguins and Oilers.. other than that most of the Rangers goons were over the hill Brashear, Rupp, McCarthy etc..

Prust was luck by trade. at least he can kill penalties.. not many tough guys do that.
Konopka can. 65% on faceoffs. 65% and fills a huge need.

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12-03-2013, 01:42 PM
  #973
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Konopka can. 65% on faceoffs. 65% and fills a huge need.
Offensive black hole.

The center ice position should be for players who skate well and can create some offense. The wings should be the bangers. That is why Konopka is not as valuable. He is great on face-offs and can get punched in the face, but he can't create any offense. Hands of stone.

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12-03-2013, 01:44 PM
  #974
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Konopka can. 65% on faceoffs. 65% and fills a huge need.
The Rangers already have a good faceoff man on the 4th line who doesn't take faceoffs.

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12-03-2013, 01:45 PM
  #975
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Offensive black hole.

The center ice position should be for players who skate well and can create some offense. The wings should be the bangers. That is why Konopka is not as valuable. He is great on face-offs and can get punched in the face, but he can't create any offense. Hands of stone.
That's why he's a role player. Line up on 4LW, and have him take draws then to maximize the asset to it's full potential. Seriously this guy owns the face-off circle. Yannick Perault played more than a dozen years in the league on that alone.

Find offense elsewhere, there are quite a few holes on the roster that need upgrading.

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