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Rangers trade Brandon Mashinter to Chicago for Kyle Beach

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Old
12-07-2013, 12:19 PM
  #176
Inferno
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we're such a blah team right now. no personality, nothing really sets us apart other than our goaltending.

under torts we used to play hard, and be a tough team to play against night in and night out.

under AV we're very vanilla, i've yet to "get" this team. what are we? does anyone have an answer?

what we arent is a tough team to play against.

toughness isnt just about hitting and fighting, its 99% mental.

tough teams can kill you with goals.

I dont consider the pens a tough team, but they are in first place on an annual basis.

playoffs are a crapshoot, but that team is tough to play against.

Chicago is a soft team, but youre not going to find a tougher team to play against than them. Detroit never used to fight, but made the playoffs seemingly every year ive been alive.

what are we? anyone?

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12-07-2013, 12:20 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
The Rangers made sure to acquire Dorsett in the Gaborik deal. They recognize that they need players who bring intensity on a nightly basis. These guys, while annoying, get other players involved by creating havoc. It was something Avery was great at.
yep. i know ppl hated Avery, but i loved what he brought when he was on.

he was a focal point player. everyone was so focused on killing him they totally forgot about our real offensive players.


difference is that Sean could actually play...he needed to walk that line, and it seemed to get too hard fo rhim to do that in the end.

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Old
12-07-2013, 12:23 PM
  #178
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Avery actually had some hockey skills. Can't say the same for Beach.

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Old
12-07-2013, 12:59 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by Alien Valuating View Post
So Beach got kicked off his SEL team because they signed Erik Christensen? Sounds promising.
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Beach can play at the 4th line level in the NHL. He was buried behind some promising young talent in Chicago like Saad, Pirri, Moron, Hayes, McNeil, etc.

It's a good move. Buy low, no risk, brings something the entire organization lacks.
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Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
any chance he gets a few games down the road with the lack of energy and toughness on this team?? im hoping for him.. was a fan during his draft year.
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
A torn labrum causes bad grammar? lol Feel better.
No the drugs im taking do that.

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Old
12-07-2013, 02:08 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
yep. i know ppl hated Avery, but i loved what he brought when he was on.

he was a focal point player. everyone was so focused on killing him they totally forgot about our real offensive players.


difference is that Sean could actually play...he needed to walk that line, and it seemed to get too hard fo rhim to do that in the end.
This type of player got to have some skill to begin with AND be able to walk this line without becoming a detriment to his team. There are only a few players out there who can handle this role effectively but most can't - those whose reputation is having a loose screw. That **** gets old pretty fast.

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Old
12-07-2013, 02:20 PM
  #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
we're such a blah team right now. no personality, nothing really sets us apart other than our goaltending.

under torts we used to play hard, and be a tough team to play against night in and night out.

under AV we're very vanilla, i've yet to "get" this team. what are we? does anyone have an answer?

what we arent is a tough team to play against.

toughness isnt just about hitting and fighting, its 99% mental.

tough teams can kill you with goals.

I dont consider the pens a tough team, but they are in first place on an annual basis.

playoffs are a crapshoot, but that team is tough to play against.

Chicago is a soft team, but youre not going to find a tougher team to play against than them. Detroit never used to fight, but made the playoffs seemingly every year ive been alive.

what are we? anyone?
We're mediocre. That's our identity, unfortunately.

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Old
12-07-2013, 04:13 PM
  #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
we're such a blah team right now. no personality, nothing really sets us apart other than our goaltending.

under torts we used to play hard, and be a tough team to play against night in and night out.

under AV we're very vanilla, i've yet to "get" this team. what are we? does anyone have an answer?

what we arent is a tough team to play against.

toughness isnt just about hitting and fighting, its 99% mental.

tough teams can kill you with goals.

I dont consider the pens a tough team, but they are in first place on an annual basis.

playoffs are a crapshoot, but that team is tough to play against.

Chicago is a soft team, but youre not going to find a tougher team to play against than them. Detroit never used to fight, but made the playoffs seemingly every year ive been alive.

what are we? anyone?
Pittsburgh has always had pests, hitters, fighters, etc. Orpik, Asham, Cooke, Glass, Engelland, Godard, etc.

Detroit has always had McCarty, Kocur, Avery, Tootoo, Shanny, Lapointe, Maltby, etc.

Chicago has Bollig, Bolland, Carcillo, Bickell, etc

Let's not kid ourselves, each of these successful teams had certain players that went a long way towards making them a "tough" team to play against. The mental effect that you mentioned permeated from those players up through the ranks.

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Old
12-07-2013, 04:34 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by kovazub94 View Post
Don't like this trade because of "opportunity cost". Wasting time on doing their due diligence on this trade essentially trading potential 4th line toughness for potential (at most) 4th line agitation. Remember Avery? He could actually play at NHL level on the bottom lines and occasionally fill in higher, and still he couldn't find ANY takes and had to accept retirement. This one is going to be a total waste.
To put it like this, I saw some of Beech in Sweden and went "oh is he really that bad???". But I didn't see him much and he could have been out of shape or whatever.

But if he is that bad, I agree with you for sure. There are kids out there that got potential, and the best orgs seperates themselves from the rest by making their own bed.

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Old
12-07-2013, 05:37 PM
  #184
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Saw a bunch of his fights. Seems to lose a lot.

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Old
12-07-2013, 05:40 PM
  #185
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There's really nothing to dislike about this deal. Beach is only 23 (about to be 24), and plenty of these types of players don't start hitting their peak until 25/26 or so. Something about the balance between edge and maturity. Mashinter wasn't doing anything for us. If Beach doesn't become and NHLer, oh well, nothing lost. If he does, win for us.

I'm not particularly worried about him being a dirty player, or whatever. If he contributes to wins, that's all that matters. People get too caught up in the classy/not classy arguments.

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Old
12-07-2013, 05:46 PM
  #186
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Yeah, good teams have players who normally cross the line sometimes. Keeps other teams on their toes

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12-07-2013, 05:49 PM
  #187
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And, as we've seen, agitators can single-handedly win playoff series if they're good enough at it.

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Old
12-07-2013, 07:01 PM
  #188
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And, as we've seen, agitators can single-handedly win playoff series if they're good enough at it.
Do you really think Avery single-handedly won those Atlanta and NJ series in '07/'08?

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12-07-2013, 07:06 PM
  #189
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Saw a bunch of his fights. Seems to lose a lot.
he will fit in very well here..

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Old
12-07-2013, 07:08 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Do you really think Avery single-handedly won those Atlanta and NJ series in '07/'08?
Devils series in 08. Although he was instrumental in getting Kovalchuk off his game in 07, the Thrashers really stood no chance in that series.

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12-07-2013, 07:10 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Devils series in 08. Although he was instrumental in getting Kovalchuk off his game in 07, the Thrashers really stood no chance in that series.
We didn't play the Devils in the playoffs in 2009. We were beaten in 7 games by the Capitals.

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Old
12-07-2013, 07:11 PM
  #192
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We didn't play the Devils in the playoffs in 2009. We were beaten in 7 games by the Capitals.
My edit beat your response. It was a typo.

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Old
12-07-2013, 07:16 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Devils series in 08. Although he was instrumental in getting Kovalchuk off his game in 07, the Thrashers really stood no chance in that series.
Eh I think they would've won those series anyway.

I think Avery was a valuable player back then, but absurdly overrated.

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Old
12-07-2013, 07:21 PM
  #194
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Eh I think they would've won those series anyway.

I think Avery was a valuable player back then, but absurdly overrated.
The Rangers scored 19 goals in 5 games in the series against the Devils against the Vezina winning goaltender. I have to think that the crux of that series was knocking Brodeur off his game.

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Old
12-07-2013, 09:26 PM
  #195
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Jagr was the best player for either team in the Devils series. Avery had a role and it helped.

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Old
12-08-2013, 03:48 AM
  #196
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
There's really nothing to dislike about this deal. Beach is only 23 (about to be 24), and plenty of these types of players don't start hitting their peak until 25/26 or so.
No, there isn't anything to dislike about this deal in particular. There's plenty to dislike, however, about the continuation of a flawed teambuilding strategy. This move is simply another in the stream of moves that attempt to address roster holes with major question marks.

Sather collects busted first rounders like Crosby collects points.

Brassard, Boyle, Pyatt, Pouliot, and now Beach. Not an impact player in the bunch. Always a smart teambuilding strategy: collecting other team's mistakes. If Beach is a year or two away from hitting his peak, then it is reasonable to expect that his peak won't be very high.

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Old
12-08-2013, 08:33 AM
  #197
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Originally Posted by NYR Sting View Post
No, there isn't anything to dislike about this deal in particular. There's plenty to dislike, however, about the continuation of a flawed teambuilding strategy. This move is simply another in the stream of moves that attempt to address roster holes with major question marks.

Sather collects busted first rounders like Crosby collects points.

Brassard, Boyle, Pyatt, Pouliot, and now Beach. Not an impact player in the bunch. Always a smart teambuilding strategy: collecting other team's mistakes. If Beach is a year or two away from hitting his peak, then it is reasonable to expect that his peak won't be very high.
And that's just for this year. Sather's rosters since the 2000s are riddled with reclamation projects.

Tedenby will be a Ranger in two years. McCardle next year.

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