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Old
12-06-2013, 07:37 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by 1865 View Post
They haven't both played well for....I don't know how long.
They are both grinders that make a living in front of the net on deflections and rebounds. They both rely on the line mates to start the play and they'll finish. If the team has issues entering the zone they aren't going to have much success. They are both on track for @ 15 goals which is 5-10 less then where they project.

It's foolish to think this team doesn't need both in their line up. This team is small and not imposing as it is. Take one of them out of the line up and
they're smaller then the habs.

Voracek is a bigger issue right now.

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12-06-2013, 07:52 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by MickeyMelchiondo View Post
a) we're talking bout hartnell
b) we don't have other skilled players in there

hence, redundancy
We don't have other skilled players in the top 9?

I am completely failing to see your point about redundancy. In the NHL players are deployed in such a way that no individual can take up more than a fragment of the playing time needed to fill a position. If you are talking about having 4 or 5 scoring centermen on a roster, then yes, that is a player redundancy. But two power forwards is not.

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12-06-2013, 09:43 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by lancer247 View Post
They are both grinders that make a living in front of the net on deflections and rebounds. They both rely on the line mates to start the play and they'll finish. If the team has issues entering the zone they aren't going to have much success. They are both on track for @ 15 goals which is 5-10 less then where they project.

It's foolish to think this team doesn't need both in their line up. This team is small and not imposing as it is. Take one of them out of the line up and
they're smaller then the habs.

Voracek is a bigger issue right now.
Absolutely agree with this ! If Voracek had their heart with his skillset he would be one heck of a threat !Hopefully Jake can get it going consistently .

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12-11-2013, 09:42 PM
  #79
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Scott Hartnell is a complete ****ing imbecile and an outright liability most nights. Trade him to any poor fool who still wants him, i'm done with his stupid ****ing plays, his childish tantrums and his utterly anonymous offensive performances.

**** off Scott Hartnell, i'm sick of your ****.

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12-11-2013, 09:56 PM
  #80
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Doubt Hartnell moves. He will go to Africa as ambassador of the Flyers and feed starving children in Sudan. He is the master of PR and being a great guy..too bad he cant score.

Expect comments next year about how disappointed he was about missing the playoffs and how in shape he is and excited to start the season and make amends....blah blah blah.

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12-11-2013, 11:31 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Damaged Goods View Post
We don't have other skilled players in the top 9?

I am completely failing to see your point about redundancy. In the NHL players are deployed in such a way that no individual can take up more than a fragment of the playing time needed to fill a position. If you are talking about having 4 or 5 scoring centermen on a roster, then yes, that is a player redundancy. But two power forwards is not.
To call them two power forwards is a stretch or at least a bit of over simplification there.

It's redundant because they both are only good for goal scoring. Neither of them stand out as playmakers and neither of them are good two-way players. Neither of them are able to play a PK. It's not even like they can score goals from all over the place either. They both function in the NHL as players who go into dirty areas and score goals off of deflections and garbage goals in front of the net and sometimes off the rush.

There's just no need for more then one player like that. It's like having two versions of Knuble. Just not necessary or even useful really.

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Old
12-12-2013, 11:57 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by SgtJoseph View Post
Absolutely agree with this ! If Voracek had their heart with his skillset he would be one heck of a threat !Hopefully Jake can get it going consistently .
I don't blame Voracek one bit, his speed can't be matched by his linemates and Jake often finds himself alone at the net because Hartnell is a snail. Quite often I watch Jake blast into the offensive zone and no one is there for him to pass to.

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12-12-2013, 12:52 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by FlyersFanz View Post
I don't blame Voracek one bit, his speed can't be matched by his linemates and Jake often finds himself alone at the net because Hartnell is a snail. Quite often I watch Jake blast into the offensive zone and no one is there for him to pass to.
move Read up and Hartnell down - switch.

It would break up our best line, but somethings got to give and Hartnell isn't going to be traded (as much as we'd like due to his play)

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12-12-2013, 01:09 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by dingbathero View Post
move Read up and Hartnell down - switch.

It would break up our best line, but somethings got to give and Hartnell isn't going to be traded (as much as we'd like due to his play)
I have been thinking the same but breaking up that 3rd line might be difficult with their success, maybe bring up Schenn or Simmer to play with Giroux and Jake. Simmer plays relatively the same style in front of the net that Hartnell used to do.

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Old
12-12-2013, 01:32 PM
  #85
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Too many round pegs for square holes...

All this line shuffling just proves how we lack complementary players....it's like trying to complete one jigsaw puzzle from two different boxes of pieces.

Nice job Holmgren......I hate to see him try and assemble Ikea furniture

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12-12-2013, 01:41 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1865 View Post
Scott Hartnell is a complete ****ing imbecile and an outright liability most nights. Trade him to any poor fool who still wants him, i'm done with his stupid ****ing plays, his childish tantrums and his utterly anonymous offensive performances.

**** off Scott Hartnell, i'm sick of your ****.
Blasting Toews into the net after he scored was the last straw for me.

Your team has just been hurt by a goal against, and your first reaction is to lost your goddamned mind and IMMEDIATELY hurt your team further with a PK?

He can tie cinder blocks around his neck and wander into a tar pit for all I care. That's complete unacceptable. It's the sort of thing children do.

This is a contract that needs to go away. I don't care if he goes on to score 30 goals elsewhere, I don't think we can justify the risk of keeping him. Imagine what he'll be like when he REALLY starts declining.

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Old
12-12-2013, 01:43 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by FreshPerspective View Post
Nice job Holmgren......I hate to see him try and assemble Ikea furniture
He once bought an Ikea couch and wound up with this when he was done:



Hanrahan misread the instructions and failed to correct his mistakes.

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Old
12-12-2013, 01:44 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Blasting Toews into the net after he scored was the last straw for me.

Your team has just been hurt by a goal against, and your first reaction is to lost your goddamned mind and IMMEDIATELY hurt your team further with a PK?

He can tie cinder blocks around his neck and wander into a tar pit for all I care. That's complete unacceptable. It's the sort of thing children do.

This is a contract that needs to go away. I don't care if he goes on to score 30 goals elsewhere, I don't think we can justify the risk of keeping him. Imagine what he'll be like when he REALLY starts declining.
Yeah I was pretty annoyed by that as well....completely undisciplined. Looked like a complete meathead on national TV

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12-12-2013, 01:52 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Blasting Toews into the net after he scored was the last straw for me.

Your team has just been hurt by a goal against, and your first reaction is to lost your goddamned mind and IMMEDIATELY hurt your team further with a PK?

He can tie cinder blocks around his neck and wander into a tar pit for all I care. That's complete unacceptable. It's the sort of thing children do.

This is a contract that needs to go away. I don't care if he goes on to score 30 goals elsewhere, I don't think we can justify the risk of keeping him. Imagine what he'll be like when he REALLY starts declining.
im sure there is one Flyer fan here who loved that stupidity by Hartnell.

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12-12-2013, 02:24 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Damaged Goods View Post
I am completely failing to see your point about redundancy.
see below:
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
It's redundant because they both are only good for goal scoring. Neither of them stand out as playmakers and neither of them are good two-way players. Neither of them are able to play a PK. It's not even like they can score goals from all over the place either. They both function in the NHL as players who go into dirty areas and score goals off of deflections and garbage goals in front of the net and sometimes off the rush.

There's just no need for more then one player like that. It's like having two versions of Knuble. Just not necessary or even useful really.
well-put
the most important part of this is the fact that neither Hartnell or Simmons are good 2-way players; having more than 1 guy like Matt Read who can skate/play-d/score a bit/etc is fine and not "redundant" in a damaging way...

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12-12-2013, 02:31 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Blasting Toews into the net after he scored was the last straw for me.

Your team has just been hurt by a goal against, and your first reaction is to lost your goddamned mind and IMMEDIATELY hurt your team further with a PK?

He can tie cinder blocks around his neck and wander into a tar pit for all I care. That's complete unacceptable. It's the sort of thing children do.

This is a contract that needs to go away. I don't care if he goes on to score 30 goals elsewhere, I don't think we can justify the risk of keeping him. Imagine what he'll be like when he REALLY starts declining.
Dumbass move is what I thought when I saw that last night, talk about crippling the team. Hartnell has had way too many minus games this season and has become a liability on the ice. His contract was a joke (NTC and 6yrs?) wait 2 or 3 years and see what he's become...a complete pylon! I shouldn't be too surprised..Flyers mgmt gives way too much for too long for mediocre players (other than G)

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12-12-2013, 02:41 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Blasting Toews into the net after he scored was the last straw for me.

Your team has just been hurt by a goal against, and your first reaction is to lost your goddamned mind and IMMEDIATELY hurt your team further with a PK?

He can tie cinder blocks around his neck and wander into a tar pit for all I care. That's complete unacceptable. It's the sort of thing children do.

This is a contract that needs to go away. I don't care if he goes on to score 30 goals elsewhere, I don't think we can justify the risk of keeping him. Imagine what he'll be like when he REALLY starts declining.
agree. i want him off this team so badly right now.

he has a NTC, but does he have a NMC? can we just send him down? it's not like he's helping the team win or anything. a Phantoms scrub could contribute more than he could right now.

if Homer hasn't already asked him to waive his NTC then he should be fired. we need to get rid of Hartnell now before he gets any worse.

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Old
12-12-2013, 02:51 PM
  #93
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agree. i want him off this team so badly right now.

he has a NTC, but does he have a NMC? can we just send him down? it's not like he's helping the team win or anything. a Phantoms scrub could contribute more than he could right now.

if Homer hasn't already asked him to waive his NTC then he should be fired. we need to get rid of Hartnell now before he gets any worse.
Hartnell can be traded only to a list of teams he has on his list....its a LTD NTC.
Speculative teams on his list: Senators, Bruins, Coyotes(really?),Ducks, Blackhawks and Kings
Not sure if he can be sent down, I doubt it though.


Last edited by FlyersFanz: 12-12-2013 at 02:58 PM.
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Old
12-12-2013, 04:33 PM
  #94
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When we traded Richy and Carts, we got a pretty good season out of the returns. It over rated everything. Well, we've come down to earth now. We have a ton of young talent that isn't fully developed yet. Simmonds is just now entering his prime years. For once I'd like to see patience win out. If a move absolutely MUST be made, then that move should be to fire Holmgren, not trade away our youth. That line of thinking is going to perpetuate this. I say let the new coach work his magic, and let the youth develop. If we get rid of any player at all it should be Streit. He's absolutely brutal with the turnovers and so far hasn't shown me anything more than what Gus shows.
This for sure- meanwhile Richards and Carter, particularly Richards, has developed into what was originally expected of them; Richards a slightly skilled, two-way player; capable of 60-70 points per season but who elevates his game to a far different level depending on the circumstances. Carter meanwhile, when he's healthy, is capable of up to 40 goals a season and they've both become what the Flyers thought they'd be when they were drafted. Not sure of where the return will end up but Flyers would do well to leave well enough alone. Still think they would have moved both Hartnell and Briere at the time except for the goofy contracts they had and, in the case of Hartnell, still have. Now the Flyers are stuck with him for better or worse (mostly worse, so far).

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12-12-2013, 04:33 PM
  #95
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Simmonds for Edler what do you think?

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Old
12-12-2013, 04:37 PM
  #96
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Simmonds for Edler what do you think?
The Flyers would need to get a better winger than Simmonds before they traded him for a defender.

I'd rather they try and move Simmonds for someone like Marco Scandella given the depth the Wild has at defense.

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12-12-2013, 07:22 PM
  #97
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There is an offer on the trade boards made by a Habs fan that they as a group seem to be in favor of:

Simmonds + 2nd for Beualieu + Collberg + 1st.

I know I'm not as enthralled with Simmonds as much as others but even so I think that's very good value for him. Beau projects to be a #2/3 offensive dman with size and Collberg to be a top 6 small sniper with speed. We draft well in the 1st rnd so that's another mid 6 forward or 2nd pairing dman in all likelihood. I'd probably have to make that trade.

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12-12-2013, 07:56 PM
  #98
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I move Hartnell 99 times out of 100 over Simmonds. I think it'd be a huge mistake to keep Hartnell during any "shakeup."

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Old
12-12-2013, 08:02 PM
  #99
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Good first period for the line, but I can't see them having any real success against non Edmonton/Montreal type teams. THey spend so much time chasing the puck.

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12-12-2013, 09:46 PM
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Who would of thought both of them on the same line would actually be decent?

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