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01-15-2007, 02:49 AM
  #1
n8
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Sophomore Slump

It bothers me that Petr Prucha's name appears in trade rumors so often. Has Ranger brass given up on him so easily?

1) Teams know to watch for this kid. It'd be naive to expect Prucha to get all the same chances this year.

2) He's no longer playing LW on the 1st PP unit and cashing in on Jagr goodness. Gee, I wonder why he isn't scoring any power play goals?

3) Sophomore slump? I really hope this kid gets at least one more season to show us what he's got.

4) Center? I mean, Matt Cullen? Despite his speed, I don't envision him as your ideal set up man. We all know this. I mean, at least Steve Rucchin has had extensive experience as a 1st line center playing with Kariya and Selanne so he knew how to sit back and make things happen for his wingers.


Part 2 of my post points out some notable victims of the slump.


Jarome Iginla
as rookie: 21-29-50
sophomore: 13-19-32

Mike York
as rookie: 26-24-50
sophomore: 14-17-31

more relevant? same year/age as petr. is he in every colorado trade rumor? (i dunno really, but haven't heard him mentioned in any i've read).
Marek Svatos
as rookie: 32-18-50
so far this year: 10-14-24 - on pace for 45 points.

and looking more-so at # of goals...
Daniel Sendin
as rookie: 20-14-34
as sophomore: 9-23-32

Petr Prucha
as rookie: 30-17-47
so far this year: 10-9-19 - on pace for 34 points.
I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir, but what gives?


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01-15-2007, 03:06 AM
  #2
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Who knows if it's the Rangers throwing his name around in trade proposals, so much as other teams asking about him all the time.

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01-15-2007, 04:57 AM
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Awesome that you're bringing this up, n8, because I was following Svatos lately seeing how many seemed to point at a Prucha-Svatos comparison of sorts last season, and I really don't see that big of a difference.

I doubt the Rangers trade Prucha as much as I doubt the Avalanche trade Svatos, I think it's just a case of making headlines than real intent to trade Prucha.

Right now I don't think we have a more promising young forward, he's already shown he can play, and he does everything rather than cherry pick for piling up easy goals.

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01-15-2007, 06:45 AM
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If Prucha gets traded it would be as Sam said in his blog,
Quote:
the very sort of deal that would haunt the Rangers down the road (see: Marc Savard, Sergei Zubov, even Alex Kovalev in Pittsburgh).
(http://rangers.lohudblogs.com/) I couldnt agree more with that sentiment, Prucha has already put up 40 or so goals in his NHL career thus far. Granted he has been struggling a little bit thus far this season but I dont know if there is a better more promising foward in the Rangers system. If he goes anywhere they better get a good return and not a draft pick or an older vet who isnt going to do anything(see Ruchinsky).

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01-15-2007, 06:58 AM
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I think a big reason for all these Prucha issues is because many don't understand what Prucha is all about. See all the fuzz last season, about him not beeing used on the 2nd line, for example.

Its a misunderstanding of what Prucha is all about, which is allot more then scoring goals.

Two diffrent Czech National Team coaches have taken Prucha over big NHL stars like Martin Havlat twice before Prucha even made it to the NHL. This at a time when he had 11 goals and 13 assists in 48 games and 7 goals and 10 assists in 47 games in the Czech League.

Prucha were a goalscorer in Juniors, when he were drafted the reports on him went like "1-way sniper". Prucha made it to the Czech League, and made a name for himself there by playing on a checking line, something he did for 3 straight years for Pradubice and two times for the Czech Republic in excaptionally good WCH's. Both times they basically had access to all the top players. And two diffrent coaches thought Prucha should be one of only less then a handful of Czech players, ahead of stars like Havlat because of his work on a checking line.

In terms of skill what made Prucha so great in Europe were that he worked extremely hard, he played well defensivly, he were excellent next to Jiri Dopita (typical big center) on the national team, he helped out a ton gooing back to his own end to start tranistion plays, and were still the first man on the forecheck, and then back again beeing the first man home on the backcheck, he complimented that with his offensive touch and playmaking ability. Besides always playing his best hockey when it matters the most. In other words beeing a coach dream.

Prucha's "problem" is that he scored a ton last season... He buried everything, were extremely effective, check out his shooting % for example. He went into this season trying to pickup were he left last season, but didn't get the same conditions. Naturally lost some confidence, and have kind of gotten away from what have made him successful the last 5 seasons. Thats beeing a really good player in all aspects of the game, and taking pride in it.

I don't think Pruchas problems today are deeper then confidence and typical soapmore issues. I defenitly belives he have a really good career infront of him, a assumption I base on what I've seen of him the last 4 seasons, not what I can read out at NHL.com.

One slightly bigger problem is that Prucha have to change his game a bit from how he played in Europe. For the Czech he used to go really deep into his own zone, win the puck and transport it out of his own zone. Something he did really really well, especially when he played with a big and slow center like Dopita. In the NHL Prucha have gotten into trouble when gooing deep into the defensive zone, because the battles he won in Europe with his intensity, he is now loosing because of his size. He must find diffrent ways to get involved and contribute more in the transition game in the NHL. Something I think he will do.

The bottomline is the Prucha is a young player, and a late bloomer to start with, and in all aspects got potential to become a perfect complimentary player. Like with a bigger center with mobility issues. He got a tremendous touch around the net and tremendous workethic. But, Petr Prucha will never score 30-40 goals unless he plays in a really good enviorment, but he can still contribute!

All he needs to do is keep working hard, keep developing like he have the last 3 seasons, keep becomming more experienced, get out of this "soapmore" slump.

I defenitly don't want to see him traded.

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01-15-2007, 07:28 AM
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Agreed

I really like Prucha's game and contributions. In NY we always like to make people out to be what we want instead of appreciate them for what they are. Look at the number of games vs goals scored, Prucha is doing pretty well, as good as anybody besides the first line. The Rangers ARE NOT one player or a creaky veteran away from ANYTHING. We need forwards who know how to play and check; carry play and contribute, unlike some things we have seen this year; better seen only from time to time. When we lost the HMO line the team is not carrying play and pressuring other teams the same way. Sure they didn't score, we have better scoring now, but it is not translating into wins. The Rangers are getting better, it is what it is. Give me a ton of players who really play a two way game, help the D, help the Goalie, we will win our share. Jmho... Our next game is Leafs; beat Devils!!!

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01-15-2007, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
I think a big reason for all these Prucha issues is because many don't understand what Prucha is all about. See all the fuzz last season, about him not beeing used on the 2nd line, for example.

Its a misunderstanding of what Prucha is all about, which is allot more then scoring goals.

Two diffrent Czech National Team coaches have taken Prucha over big NHL stars like Martin Havlat twice before Prucha even made it to the NHL. This at a time when he had 11 goals and 13 assists in 48 games and 7 goals and 10 assists in 47 games in the Czech League.

Prucha were a goalscorer in Juniors, when he were drafted the reports on him went like "1-way sniper". Prucha made it to the Czech League, and made a name for himself there by playing on a checking line, something he did for 3 straight years for Pradubice and two times for the Czech Republic in excaptionally good WCH's. Both times they basically had access to all the top players. And two diffrent coaches thought Prucha should be one of only less then a handful of Czech players, ahead of stars like Havlat because of his work on a checking line.

In terms of skill what made Prucha so great in Europe were that he worked extremely hard, he played well defensivly, he were excellent next to Jiri Dopita (typical big center) on the national team, he helped out a ton gooing back to his own end to start tranistion plays, and were still the first man on the forecheck, and then back again beeing the first man home on the backcheck, he complimented that with his offensive touch and playmaking ability. Besides always playing his best hockey when it matters the most. In other words beeing a coach dream.

Prucha's "problem" is that he scored a ton last season... He buried everything, were extremely effective, check out his shooting % for example. He went into this season trying to pickup were he left last season, but didn't get the same conditions. Naturally lost some confidence, and have kind of gotten away from what have made him successful the last 5 seasons. Thats beeing a really good player in all aspects of the game, and taking pride in it.

I don't think Pruchas problems today are deeper then confidence and typical soapmore issues. I defenitly belives he have a really good career infront of him, a assumption I base on what I've seen of him the last 4 seasons, not what I can read out at NHL.com.

One slightly bigger problem is that Prucha have to change his game a bit from how he played in Europe. For the Czech he used to go really deep into his own zone, win the puck and transport it out of his own zone. Something he did really really well, especially when he played with a big and slow center like Dopita. In the NHL Prucha have gotten into trouble when gooing deep into the defensive zone, because the battles he won in Europe with his intensity, he is now loosing because of his size. He must find diffrent ways to get involved and contribute more in the transition game in the NHL. Something I think he will do.

The bottomline is the Prucha is a young player, and a late bloomer to start with, and in all aspects got potential to become a perfect complimentary player. Like with a bigger center with mobility issues. He got a tremendous touch around the net and tremendous workethic. But, Petr Prucha will never score 30-40 goals unless he plays in a really good enviorment, but he can still contribute!

All he needs to do is keep working hard, keep developing like he have the last 3 seasons, keep becomming more experienced, get out of this "soapmore" slump.

I defenitly don't want to see him traded.
I'm following Prucha for long time, because i cheer for his home Czech team, Pardubice.
I would correct few things - Prucha was selected only once to national team above the Havlat, in second case Havlat had some virus.
During the lockout year, Prucha played on 4h line, but with Hemsky.
4th line in NHL isn't exactly the same as in Czech league, youngsters play often on 4th line, and they have more ice time than 4th line here in NHL.
I was really surprised by Prucha's number last year, because i thought his upside is much lower. But i'm not surprised as many here by his numbers this year - i think this year numbers are where he belongs, range 35-40 points per season.
But with his nature and animal "crash into net" instincts, he will have problems to survive in this league for more than 5-8 years....boy i'm really scared sometimes watching his play.
But from every his play you can see that he plays with big heart and with no-fear factor.

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01-15-2007, 07:51 AM
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n8...

this is an interesting comment: "He's no longer playing LW on the 1st PP unit and cashing in on Jagr goodness. Gee, I wonder why he isn't scoring any power play goals?"

The question would be, should he still be somewhat effective on the PP even without Jagr? He needs to be his own player.

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01-15-2007, 08:25 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n8 View Post
It bothers me that Petr Prucha's name appears in trade rumors so often. Has Ranger brass given up on him so easily?

1) Teams know to watch for this kid. It'd be naive to expect Prucha to get all the same chances this year.

2) He's no longer playing LW on the 1st PP unit and cashing in on Jagr goodness. Gee, I wonder why he isn't scoring any power play goals?

3) Sophomore slump? I really hope this kid gets at least one more season to show us what he's got.

4) Center? I mean, Matt Cullen? Despite his speed, I don't envision him as your ideal set up man. We all know this. I mean, at least Steve Rucchin has had extensive experience as a 1st line center playing with Kariya and Selanne so he knew how to sit back and make things happen for his wingers.


Part 2 of my post points out some notable victims of the slump.


Jarome Iginla
as rookie: 21-29-50
sophomore: 13-19-32

Mike York
as rookie: 26-24-50
sophomore: 14-17-31

more relevant? same year/age as petr. is he in every colorado trade rumor? (i dunno really, but haven't heard him mentioned in any i've read).
Marek Svatos
as rookie: 32-18-50
so far this year: 10-14-24 - on pace for 45 points.

and looking more-so at # of goals...
Daniel Sendin
as rookie: 20-14-34
as sophomore: 9-23-32

Petr Prucha
as rookie: 30-17-47
so far this year: 10-9-19 - on pace for 34 points.
I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir, but what gives?

I doubt prucha gets traded this year. If, with increased playing time he still exhibits the problems he's had in his own end next year, then I start believing the rumors. He is one of the few young forwards that we have that is a sniper. They are hard to come by.

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01-15-2007, 09:32 AM
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Ola
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kostik View Post
I was really surprised by Prucha's number last year, because i thought his upside is much lower. But i'm not surprised as many here by his numbers this year - i think this year numbers are where he belongs, range 35-40 points per season.But with his nature and animal "crash into net" instincts, he will have problems to survive in this league for more than 5-8 years....boy i'm really scared sometimes watching his play.
But from every his play you can see that he plays with big heart and with no-fear factor.
I think we have the same opinion on Prucha.

Though I wouldn't put it like that he have a 35-40 pt "range". In a situation were Prucha would play one season, for a team I didn't know, and I had to bet on how much he would score, I might bet on 40 pts.

Though I think a big problem is that when a kid like Prucha scores 30 legit goals, and are on pace for 40 if he had played all games, some make him a "30-goal scorer". And if he aren't scoring 30, since a Brendan Shanahan are playing in the position he used to play in, something is wrong.

I can defenitly see Prucha scoring 30 goals for us again, I think his touch in the NHL, which I honestly can say that I didn't know how good it was after watching him play for the Czech National team, is still very good. Its just that the enviroment you are in have such a tremendous impact on how many pts you will score.

If we have that in mind, together with what kind of player Prucha is, I am not upset of how he is used, since I know he can be a much better player in some situations then he have been this season, I know there are some aspects of his game that he still must adjust to the NHL before he reaches his prime, and I know that he will/would play like he did last season when/if he are put in a situation like that again.

And I also don't care at all if Prucha gets 30 goals or not, what matters is how Prucha develops and how the organization goes. And I know how big impact Prucha can do for his team not playing on the 1st line, as long as he is playing his game, something I am sure you have seen in Pradubice.

Prucha might get injury problems, but I am not all that worried about that, he goes flying because he is light, its not always harmful to be sent flying. Buys who are built like bulls and always stands on there skates are more often injured then kids like Prucha.

If he stays healty, I do think that he have potential to become a much better player later in his career. Without beeing a physical speciman, in terms of skating and stickhandling also, he is still a tremendous hockeyplayer, who solves allot of situations really easy. Some guys keeps developing well into their 30's, hopefully Prucha can be one of thoose.

I think Daniel Alfredsson in Ottawa is a good example. I remember his young days from the SEL, and very recently saw a game with him from the mid 90's. While he were a good skater, and had a good shot and could handle the puck, nobody sane would have guessed that he would have become the complete player he is today in the NHL.

Its all about keep developing and adjusting, and finding areas that you can be successful in the NHL. I hope that Prucha can become a bigger force in the transition game, go deep more and help out, thats so valuble, and that he maybe can become more of a playmaker and create more offense beside finnishing. And that he around the age of 30 or later have become a very complete top 2 line player.


Last edited by Ola: 01-15-2007 at 09:41 AM.
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Old
01-15-2007, 09:53 AM
  #11
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Prucha is a player that can succeed in the new NHL. With more PP time and a decent center to play with, he can very effective. We trade him, we'll regret it.

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01-15-2007, 12:07 PM
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Prucha is a player that can succeed in the new NHL. With more PP time and a decent center to play with, he can very effective. We trade him, we'll regret it.
I think that sums it up pretty well there, Pizza. There are any number of reasons why Prucha's production has fallen this season, but you just get the feeling that we'd regret trading him. Some other team will give him big minutes on the top or second line and prime PP minutes, and he'll be a legitimate scorer again, IMO.

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01-15-2007, 12:52 PM
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I like Prucha a lot...

but at this point, I'm really trying to figure out what he is. His production being down is no surprise (I did think he can still net 20-25 goals on a full schedule this season). His effort cannot be denied. His nose for the net cannot be denied. I do question his puckhandling ability, as well as his effectiveness getting back on 'D' (the effort's there, but that's all well and good, it's how effective a player is that I care about most). If he's going to be a one-dimensional player (a scorer), the fine, but if he's not scoring and there isn't a role in which he can score, one needs to question how useful he is. He's had a rough go at it this season, even when he was out there on 5-on-3s with Jagr & Co. He's had a lot of trouble getting good wood on the puck (I do argue that's because of his lack of chances which has hurt his rhythm). He's had a good deal of trouble dealing with the cycle and playing in traffic generally (too fancy sometimes, falling other times, and mostly losing the puck). He still needs to grow as a player, and he needs to be effective on his own a bit more. We do make excuses for him - I think some are warranted (I've offered up some), and some are excuses because we like how hard the kid tries.

In the end, the organization needs to decide if this is a kid that fits, and if not, if there is a good return out there for a player that does fit. I do agree that Prucha for Ruca is crazy - but can rationalize why to some that could make a bit of sense, as personally, right now, Ruca is the better all-around player, and the Rangers may be in the need of more all-around players as opposed to a one-dimensional player who's at his best playing with the best player in the world. If Prucha goes, it better be for a 25 year old playmaking centerman, something this team is not long on.

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01-15-2007, 02:20 PM
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I thought this thread was about Renneys second season with the Rangers

Prucha might get 20 to 25 goals this season which isn't bad for his second year..The problem is Renney puts Prucha in as many situations to fail as he does to succeed..(hope that makes sense)

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01-15-2007, 02:24 PM
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Someone like Prucha with such a light body defenitly have 10 years left of his prime.

Right now he aren't a great fit, he and Shanahan aren't a great fit together. Hossa-Betts-Ward have played really well, and probably will be our 3rd line when it counts.

Prucha right now could be a really important cog on a line with Krog and Ortmayer, a line I think could be great for us.

I am perfectly fine with Prucha playing in a role like that this season, who knows next year, maybe Straka have left a big hole after him. Maybe Prucha is a great fit next to Dubinsky on a 3rd line with Betts and Co on the 4th.

From my perspective, I wouldn't move Prucha unless its for someone we really need.

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01-15-2007, 04:10 PM
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I say bring up Callahan and Byers and try Prucha at center on a kid 3rd line. Oh but wait, we need to win the cup this year.

By the way, at one time I said Byers was a wasted pick... I think I might have been wrong. Sorry Dane.

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01-15-2007, 04:29 PM
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He's in a slump and that's understandable, what's not, is the positions that Renney puts him in, (and then it's expected he do well), he was even sat, which makes no sense at all. He should be a 20-25 goal guy, and more if he gets more pp time. If NY wants to trade him they better do it for someone who will fill his void.

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01-15-2007, 04:39 PM
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Is he in a slump?

4 goal in 10 games = 32 goal season. That's better than he's been all season.

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01-15-2007, 04:58 PM
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As I posted on the main board and SoS points out here... is that he has not been given every chance to succeed. As most know goal scorers need to play in order to produce. If you take a Jarome Iginla and play him 10 minutes a night he will not score as much as he would at 15 minutes a night.

Prucha has not been given consistent chances, but when he has -- there has been production. Also the arrival of Shanny took away his PP time and thus makes it harder for Prucha to score on the PP where he seems to excel.

Honestly part of the problem stems from Renneys line formulations and PP setups. If Shanny were moved to the 2nd unit and Prucha to the first I think we'd see a lot more of Jagr shooting and Prucha scoring garbage goals.

Of course we will not see this change from TR because well that's just how he is. Stubborn.

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01-15-2007, 07:07 PM
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To make people feel better:

Quote:
Petr Prucha isn't being offered to the St. Louis Blues for Martin Rucinsky -- though Blues president John Davidson would love for that to be the case.
http://blogs.nydailynews.com/rangers/

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