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2013-14 Adirondack Phantoms (AHL), ECHL, NCAA, Juniors, International, etc. part II

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12-30-2013, 01:08 PM
  #126
BobbyClarkeFan16
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I get what Clown Baby is saying about Morin. It wasn't just Laughton that burned him, but other players in camp burned him. I think it's a well known fact that smaller, faster and shiftier players give him a problem.

At the same time, because Morin is so tall and gangly, his center of gravity is going to be much higher and that makes it harder to keep up with the smaller players because he's off balance, hence the reason why they burn by him. When he hits the 230 - 235 pound mark, that's when I expect to see the gap control issues be resolved and players won't beat him to the outside and that they're going to end up flattened. His center of gravity will be lower and his balance will be much better, making the footwork issues easier to address.

Morin is actually quite safe because even if he doesn't develop an offensive game, he's got the upside of being a young Derian Hatcher or Jason Smith type of defender. That's not exactly a bad thing......

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12-30-2013, 01:39 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
Morin is actually quite safe because even if he doesn't develop an offensive game, he's got the upside of being a young Derian Hatcher or Jason Smith type of defender. That's not exactly a bad thing......
Those are the same comparisons, along with Adam Foote, that Luke Schenn got when drafted 5th overall. Morin has a ton of tools, but nothing about an 18-year old defender is "safe" to me because he's still got significant improvements to make both physical and mental before he's a top 4 type defenseman.

Again, no reason he can't be there, but I wouldn't call it a lock that he makes those necessary development either. Tyler Myers and Jamie Oleksiak both demonstrate the ups and downs of going from a hulking first round defensive prospect to an impact player that sticks at the NHL level.

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12-30-2013, 01:44 PM
  #128
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Lots of people said that the main thing Morin needed to develop this year was offense.

He's doing just that. I'm fine with him right now.

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12-30-2013, 01:47 PM
  #129
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Lots of people said that the main thing Morin needed to develop this year was offense.

He's doing just that. I'm fine with him right now.
While I did think offense was important I was on the boat that he needed to work on his 1 on 1 game defensively. He gets beat way to much especially with smaller players. And this still constantly happens. Anyone who saw the super series saw it happen also.

Long way to go with a 18 yr old though.

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12-30-2013, 01:51 PM
  #130
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Dont want to give up on this kid hes going to be a beast and i believe he just turned 18 awhile back so lots of time to get his game together.

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12-30-2013, 02:25 PM
  #131
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Dont want to give up on this kid hes going to be a beast and i believe he just turned 18 awhile back so lots of time to get his game together.
You do not have to worry about me being one of the nay sayers. I love this kid and cannot wait for the day he laces them up for the big club.

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12-30-2013, 07:46 PM
  #132
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Those are the same comparisons, along with Adam Foote, that Luke Schenn got when drafted 5th overall. Morin has a ton of tools, but nothing about an 18-year old defender is "safe" to me because he's still got significant improvements to make both physical and mental before he's a top 4 type defenseman.
The mental part doesn't worry me at all with Morin. He seems to have a very good head on his shoulders and he's very observant. Laperriere noted that when Morin was in town for the rookie camp. The physical part of the game is just going to take time. Once his frame fills out, I think everything will come together then. I'm sure that there's a number of limitations to Morin's game simply because he hasn't filled out.

As for Schenn, I still think he can be a Foote clone. He needs to quit focusing his workouts on bulking up and instead focus on mobility. He's big enough, now he needs to improve his foot speed - something that can be done by carrying a little less weight and focusing more on mobility.

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Again, no reason he can't be there, but I wouldn't call it a lock that he makes those necessary development either. Tyler Myers and Jamie Oleksiak both demonstrate the ups and downs of going from a hulking first round defensive prospect to an impact player that sticks at the NHL level.
Tyler Myers is kind of a sad story because I think the talent is there, but because the team is so bad, he's being asked to do way too much to compensate for the lack of talent and it's completely killed his confidence. Myers would be a player I'd love to see the Flyers try to acquire because I think he'd flourish under John Paddock's watch (Paddock has an excellent history with regards to developing defensemen).

As for Oleksiak, he's being brought along slowly. Is it the right way? I don't know. But at the same time, I think every team in the league is looking at the Myers situation in Buffalo and the last thing anyone wants to do is rush a big, young defenseman into the NHL, and then see him fall apart due to unrealistic expectations and pressure. Oleksiak will probably be called up by mid-season and will probably stick around Dallas. People forget that big defenseman don't usually make an impact until a minimum 25 years of age (Myers is the exception to the rule, but even then, he had two good seasons and has pretty much fallen apart).

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12-30-2013, 08:08 PM
  #133
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Morin's Offense has really come alone recently and i think much of this has to do with Jan Kostalek being in Sweden. Rimouski has a stacked defense and Morin plays on the shutdown pairing. Rarely does he get ice time with joly , trainor , or deluca. But now he is getting more ice time with the higher scorers and he is putting up points. His goal the other night was beautiful, he put on the full display of athleticism and power and it was quite impressive.

But i agree his 1 on 1 play leaves a lot to be desired, and one thing that i have found with bigger players is that once their skates stop moving they are slow to react and slow to cover space. I think he is going to need a lot of work with derien hatcher and hopefully chris pronger.

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12-30-2013, 09:28 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
The mental part doesn't worry me at all with Morin. He seems to have a very good head on his shoulders and he's very observant. Laperriere noted that when Morin was in town for the rookie camp. The physical part of the game is just going to take time. Once his frame fills out, I think everything will come together then. I'm sure that there's a number of limitations to Morin's game simply because he hasn't filled out.

As for Schenn, I still think he can be a Foote clone. He needs to quit focusing his workouts on bulking up and instead focus on mobility. He's big enough, now he needs to improve his foot speed - something that can be done by carrying a little less weight and focusing more on mobility.

Tyler Myers is kind of a sad story because I think the talent is there, but because the team is so bad, he's being asked to do way too much to compensate for the lack of talent and it's completely killed his confidence. Myers would be a player I'd love to see the Flyers try to acquire because I think he'd flourish under John Paddock's watch (Paddock has an excellent history with regards to developing defensemen).

As for Oleksiak, he's being brought along slowly. Is it the right way? I don't know. But at the same time, I think every team in the league is looking at the Myers situation in Buffalo and the last thing anyone wants to do is rush a big, young defenseman into the NHL, and then see him fall apart due to unrealistic expectations and pressure. Oleksiak will probably be called up by mid-season and will probably stick around Dallas. People forget that big defenseman don't usually make an impact until a minimum 25 years of age (Myers is the exception to the rule, but even then, he had two good seasons and has pretty much fallen apart).
When I referred to mental, what I meant was understanding how to use his physical size to his advantage while minimizing the liabilities it creates. Morin has been growing and is still growing into his massive frame and it takes time for players of size to understand the limitations and advantages that presents. It's not about whether he has the mental faculties, its about watching a ton of tape, trying new things, getting coached appropriately, etc.

All I was saying was sort of what you were eluding to at the end.... the path for a big defenseman is long and winding. Myers and Oleksiak may or may not make it as far as being top 4 defenseman on a championship caliber team. With Morin... we'll see. I'm optimistic, but not supremely confident he can get there. No reason he can't.

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12-30-2013, 09:33 PM
  #135
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let's just draft Ehlers he's a LW, can fly with the speed he got and he can beat any defensemen wide with that speed.

we get a very good prospect and he would teach Morin how to not get beaten by fast guys

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12-31-2013, 10:08 AM
  #136
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Hagg is very smooth and does not rattle. 2-2 so far.

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01-02-2014, 09:10 AM
  #137
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Watching Zadorov today makes me pray we made the right choice with Morin.

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01-02-2014, 09:31 AM
  #138
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Watching Zadorov today makes me pray we made the right choice with Morin.
I wanted the Flyers to pick him so badly. It was between Zad and Risto in my mind and when Buffalo nabbed Risto I was excited Zad was still there but Flyers went with Morin instead and of course Buffalo picked Zad later in the round.

I don't know enough to say anything but I sincerely hope the Flyers weren't blinded by Morin's size.

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01-02-2014, 10:14 AM
  #139
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I wanted the Flyers to pick him so badly. It was between Zad and Risto in my mind and when Buffalo nabbed Risto I was excited Zad was still there but Flyers went with Morin instead and of course Buffalo picked Zad later in the round.

I don't know enough to say anything but I sincerely hope the Flyers weren't blinded by Morin's size.
Funny..we were on the same page. I was hoping for Risto 1st as I figured Nurse would be gone. And when Buff took Risto...Zads was my pick. I has Morin pegged as a 15-20 guy. I don't see what Morin can do that Zads can't. Both big dmen that can skate, except that Zads is further along in development. Now it could go to being Russian, which wouldn't surprise me. I have my fingers crossed for Morin.

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01-02-2014, 11:04 AM
  #140
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Funny..we were on the same page. I was hoping for Risto 1st as I figured Nurse would be gone. And when Buff took Risto...Zads was my pick. I has Morin pegged as a 15-20 guy. I don't see what Morin can do that Zads can't. Both big dmen that can skate, except that Zads is further along in development. Now it could go to being Russian, which wouldn't surprise me. I have my fingers crossed for Morin.
Zadorov definitely looks tremendous and certainly looks like he'll have a bigger impact sooner than Morin, but at the end of the day, it's definitely too early to make much in the way of predictions. Zadorov is probably a lot closer to his peak physical maturity than Morin. Morin probably has another 20 lbs to add (assuming the 210lbs is accurate), whereas Zadorov at 221lbs is probably almost done.

I do agree though that in a re-draft, there's a good chance that the Flyers take Zadorov. They had Zadorov as a top 10 talent as I recall and only a couple slots behind Morin. Tough to argue that his stock isn't up a little more than Morin's.

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01-02-2014, 11:10 AM
  #141
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All I know is, if things still pan out they way they are right now in the standing, Buffalo can have #1 and #2 overall this coming draft, adding Reinhart and Ekblad on top of Zads and Rist... scary ****.

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01-02-2014, 11:28 AM
  #142
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Zadorov definitely looks tremendous and certainly looks like he'll have a bigger impact sooner than Morin, but at the end of the day, it's definitely too early to make much in the way of predictions. Zadorov is probably a lot closer to his peak physical maturity than Morin. Morin probably has another 20 lbs to add (assuming the 210lbs is accurate), whereas Zadorov at 221lbs is probably almost done.

I do agree though that in a re-draft, there's a good chance that the Flyers take Zadorov. They had Zadorov as a top 10 talent as I recall and only a couple slots behind Morin. Tough to argue that his stock isn't up a little more than Morin's.
I think there is a little bit of overreaction here around Zadorov. Despite his offensive uptick in the WJC's I still don't think he'll bring much offense to the pro level. Don't get me wrong his goals were very nice but also on 5 vs. 3's where you can just unload on the puck and the shooting lane was the size of a 18 wheeler. I think the Flyers picked Morin over Zadorov because Morin knows his game a little better. He knows he is not an offensive guy and plays within his own game.

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01-02-2014, 11:31 AM
  #143
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If it makes you guys feel any better, we weren't taking Zadorov regardless of Morin. Our next best was Mirco Mueller. Zadorov was next on the Flyers list after Mueller.

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01-02-2014, 11:39 AM
  #144
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Originally Posted by kjbhockey View Post
I think there is a little bit of overreaction here around Zadorov. Despite his offensive uptick in the WJC's I still don't think he'll bring much offense to the pro level. Don't get me wrong his goals were very nice but also on 5 vs. 3's where you can just unload on the puck and the shooting lane was the size of a 18 wheeler. I think the Flyers picked Morin over Zadorov because Morin knows his game a little better. He knows he is not an offensive guy and plays within his own game.
To be fair, Zadorov was coming off 2 goals and 4 assists in his 8 OHL games after his NHL stint too, so it's a little more than this tournament that have shown some offensive improvements. As a I said in his prospect thread, I'm not sure that what Zadorov is showing is real either, but it's hard to suggest it's not.

I wasn't a Zadorov or Morin guy going into last year's draft, but I can see why both players were so well thought of.

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01-02-2014, 11:47 AM
  #145
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All I know is, if things still pan out they way they are right now in the standing, Buffalo can have #1 and #2 overall this coming draft, adding Reinhart and Ekblad on top of Zads and Rist... scary ****.
I think NYI will defer the pick till next year if it's #1 or #2.

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01-02-2014, 11:48 AM
  #146
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I think NYI will defer the pick till next year if it's #1 or #2.
The problem with that is, if they suck again, they will just give Buffalo a better player the next year.

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01-02-2014, 11:50 AM
  #147
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It was a terrible trade that should get Snow fired.

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01-02-2014, 11:53 AM
  #148
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It was a terrible trade that should get Snow fired.
Snow, Wang and Capuano need to go. They are a seriously awful organization in terms of management and ownership. Seriously, Buffalo may be sucking right now, but I still think in the end, they completely owned the Islanders in that trade. More one sided than Coburn for Zhamnov.

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01-02-2014, 12:02 PM
  #149
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Snow, Wang and Capuano need to go. They are a seriously awful organization in terms of management and ownership. Seriously, Buffalo may be sucking right now, but I still think in the end, they completely owned the Islanders in that trade. More one sided than Coburn for Zhamnov.
Since the trade Buffalo actually have a better point % as well!

Buffalo are 9-15-3 (.389) and the Isles are 9-17-4 (.367)!

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01-02-2014, 12:02 PM
  #150
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People in the WJC thread are saying Laughton is going bald already.

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