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Stepan, Callahan, and McDonagh on Team USA (Continued U.S. Roster Discussion)

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01-01-2014, 10:42 PM
  #126
frozenrubber
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
Did they make the Olympic ice larger this time around compared to when Canada and USA were in the finals 4 years ago?
Sochi will use the international standard rink (200x100ft), or 15ft wider than a NHL rink.

Vancouver used NHL sized rinks b/c they used GM Place and didn't want to build new infrastructure.

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01-01-2014, 10:43 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
Did they make the Olympic ice larger this time around compared to when Canada and USA were in the finals 4 years ago?
pretty sure Vancouver was NA(NHL) sized ice.

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01-01-2014, 10:45 PM
  #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frozenrubber View Post
Sochi will use the international standard rink (200x100ft), or 15ft wider than a NHL rink.
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Originally Posted by Dactyl View Post
pretty sure Vancouver was NA(NHL) sized ice.
Interesting. Who decides what size it will be...the IOC or the host nation?

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01-01-2014, 10:47 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
Interesting. Who decides what size it will be...the IOC or the host nation?
i thought it would be the IIHF/IOC but i guess its the host nation. im also pretty sure Canada has struggled on larger ice in the past (could someone confirm or deny this?) so this should be pretty interesting. Russia is home and most of their players have had experience on that ice size. it really becomes a different game.

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01-01-2014, 10:48 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Dactyl View Post
pretty sure Vancouver was NA(NHL) sized ice.
2002 Salt Lake City Olympics used IIHF sized ice. Vancouver only used NHL size as the rink was already built and they didn't create a new facility just for the Olympics.

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01-01-2014, 10:51 PM
  #131
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I thought last Olympics was played on small ice?

Anyway, McDonagh is absolutely essential for USA on big ice. 1st or 2nd pairing minutes are a must with his skating. He can match anyone stride for stride. Chasing down Kovalchuk and Kessel specifically come to mind.

Callahan made it on reputation and I have no clue how Stepan is there. Still pretty exciting to have three of our guys represent that team.

I think Nash makes Canada on his reputation, Lundqvist and Hagelin for Sweden, Zuccarello for Norway. Does Stralman have a shot?

It really is a shame what's happening to Marc Staal. Not too long ago. I remember him being pencilled in for this tournament. Actually in 11-12 Sportsnet did a little prediction thing and one of the guys had Staal, Girardi, and Del Zotto as an extra for Team Canada. How times have changed over such a short period of time, haha.

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01-01-2014, 10:52 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Dactyl View Post
i thought it would be the IIHF/IOC but i guess its the host nation. im also pretty sure Canada has struggled on larger ice in the past (could someone confirm or deny this?) so this should be pretty interesting. Russia is home and most of their players have had experience on that ice size. it really becomes a different game.
Interestingly, Canada has done quite well on larger ice historically:

Quote:
You can go right back to the historic 1972 Summit Series between Team Canada and the Soviet Union. The Soviets, who had virtually no experience of playing on NHL rinks, won two and tied one out of the four games in Canada, while Team Canada won three times on the larger ice at Luzhniki Arena in Moscow, even though this was the first time most of the Canadians had ever seen a big rink.

Two of the USSR’s most memorable wins were accomplished on small rinks: the 8-1 victory over the host country in the 1981 Canada Cup final in Montreal and the 6-0 thrashing of the NHL All Stars at the Madison Square Garden in New York in 1979.

Fast forward to modern times. Canada has been international hockey’s most consistent performer in the last six-year period, with all its IIHF wins coming on international sized rinks. The 2002 Olympic gold medal was won in Salt Lake City, USA, but the rink was enlarged to meet IIHF standards. The 2003, 2004 and 2007 men’s World titles were won on big ice sheets in Helsinki, Prague and Moscow.

Conversely, Canada was not able to capitalize on the “advantage” of hosting the 2008 World Championship in Quebec City’s ancient and small Le Colisée. The 72nd World Championship--the first ever in Canada --was won by Russia, with all its players having learned their hockey fundamentals on big-ice rinks.
http://www.iihf.com/home-of-hockey/n...ash=34358868c3

The players you select matter more than the ice size.

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01-01-2014, 10:55 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by frozenrubber View Post
Interestingly, Canada has done quite well on larger ice historically:



http://www.iihf.com/home-of-hockey/n...ash=34358868c3
The players you select matter more than the ice size.
okay thanks. idk why i thought that. Canadas speed and skill actually seem to go well with larger ice. i still think Russia is motivated, they have firepower and a lot of them dont have to adjust to the ice surface. Russias gonna be scary.

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01-01-2014, 11:19 PM
  #134
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The problem with Russia is a mediocre defense.

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01-01-2014, 11:24 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Dactyl View Post
i thought it would be the IIHF/IOC but i guess its the host nation. im also pretty sure Canada has struggled on larger ice in the past (could someone confirm or deny this?) so this should be pretty interesting. Russia is home and most of their players have had experience on that ice size. it really becomes a different game.
I don't like the bottom-six checking lines mantra on this bigger ice. In that ESPN article the architects admitted they lack speed on this team. They have good skaters on defense. Probably Orpik's only redeeming quality. It is concerning, but we'll see.

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01-01-2014, 11:48 PM
  #136
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So because Byslma is the coach, Orpik was picked? Thats ********

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01-01-2014, 11:58 PM
  #137
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So because Byslma is the coach, Orpik was picked? Thats ********
Not necessarily, but he definitely had some say. The article claims he was a lock from the start. Not sure if Ballsma was the major influence there or not.

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01-02-2014, 12:22 AM
  #138
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How the hell is our goaltending questionable

We have Ryan Miller
Miller has had a great season, and was likely driven by his desire to play in the olympics; however, he has been mediocre for the past couple of years. No doubt he deserves to be there, but Bishop has been just as good this season.

Quick has resumed skating, but likely won't be back for another week I think. That means a month till the olympics and coming back from a major groin injury, who knows how he will react to that.

Howard has had an average season, and again Bishop has been better.

I just don't think they were the strongest goalie picks, and I think we have gone from what was a strength to something that has some significant questions. Honestly if Quick was healthy, I think it would make a huge difference, but I still would have rather seen Bishop over Howard.

Quick (pre-injury), Miller, Bishop I would have been ok with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McDonagh View Post
I thought last Olympics was played on small ice?

Anyway, McDonagh is absolutely essential for USA on big ice. 1st or 2nd pairing minutes are a must with his skating. He can match anyone stride for stride. Chasing down Kovalchuk and Kessel specifically come to mind.
If McDonaugh is chasing down Kessel then something has gone terribly wrong in the game.

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01-02-2014, 12:43 AM
  #139
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If McDonaugh is chasing down Kessel then something has gone terribly wrong in the game.

Pretty sure Wisconsin by Russia while everyone was celebrating Christmas.

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01-02-2014, 01:24 AM
  #140
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Just got around to reading that ESPN article. I am only about half way though it but as I am reading it I am wondering if it was such a good idea to publish it. Some of the guys who weren't picked may still get picked if there are injuries, but in the article the selection committee is pretty harsh about some of their play. I wonder if there are injuries and guys like Ryan or Byf, or Johnson who were criticized in the article would let that bother them if they were selected as replacements.

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01-02-2014, 02:03 AM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
Not necessarily, but he definitely had some say. The article claims he was a lock from the start. Not sure if Ballsma was the major influence there or not.
I dont see how Johnson or Yandle didnt make it over Orpik. Not sure what the reason was behind that

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01-02-2014, 02:12 AM
  #142
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Originally Posted by RangersHank View Post
I dont see how Johnson or Yandle didnt make it over Orpik. Not sure what the reason was behind that
That espn article doesn't explain that reasoning but it does offer this nugget:

"The locks are identified; Ryan Suter, Paul Martin, Ryan McDonagh and Brooks Orpik, whom the coaches are emphatic they want on the team."

Bylsma is the coach, he wanted his players. Orpik and Martin were locks from the beginning while Yandle had to battle against the Johnsons, Seth Jones and Byf.

Reading that article is just so damn frustrating. They say they want the best players but leave out Ryan and Yandle, two of the highest scoring Americans at their position. And Okposo, the 2nd highest scoring american this season. They seem to be all over the place with their reasons, and I can't stomach their quick dismissal of Bishop for Howard. They claim they looked at more than this season for players and that helped Howard get selected, but it is obvious they didn't apply that same reasoning to some of the other ones they left off like Erik Johnson (who played well in Vancouver) or Ryan. They claim that they wanted to focus on Dmen who could move the puck up to the Offense well, but leave Yandle off the roster, they said Ryan doesn't have enough PP points this year to justify a roster spot, I mean forget the fact he is on that Ottawa team...

The way they bash players, who will no doubt read that article, is mind boggling. It be very interesting to see how they do this year and if they don't do well it will be interesting to see where the US is in four years.


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01-02-2014, 02:32 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by truebluegoalie View Post
That espn article doesn't explain that reasoning but it does offer this nugget:

"The locks are identified; Ryan Suter, Paul Martin, Ryan McDonagh and Brooks Orpik, whom the coaches are emphatic they want on the team."

Bylsma is the coach, he wanted his players. Orpik and Martin were locks from the beginning while Yandle had to battle against the Johnsons, Seth Jones and Byf.

Reading that article is just so damn frustrating. They say they want the best players but leave out Ryan and Yandle, two of the highest scoring Americans at their position. And Okposo, the 2nd highest scoring american this season. They seem to be all over the place with their reasons, and I can't stomach their quick dismissal of Bishop for Howard. They claim they looked at more than this season for players and that helped Howard get selected, but it is obvious they didn't apply that same reasoning to some of the other ones they left off like Erik Johnson (who played well in Vancouver) or Ryan. They claim that they wanted to focus on Dmen who could move the puck up to the Offense well, but leave Yandle off the roster, they said Ryan doesn't have enough PP points this year to justify a roster spot, I mean forget the fact he is on that Ottawa team...

The way they bash players, who will no doubt read that article, is mind boggling. It be very interesting to see how they do this year and if they don't do well it will be interesting to see where the US is in four years.

Thats very weird. Maybe they wanted to go in a different direction this olympics? I'm not sure but hopefully they made the right choices. Wheeler is a funny choice too and the Howard pick is the craziest imo. I really thought Bishop would make the team.

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01-02-2014, 03:44 AM
  #144
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That article by ESPN provided great insight. Terrific read.

I thought it was ridiculous that Orpik was considered a lock from the beginning. I understand that Bylsma is the coach, but Orpik doesn't even deserve to be in discussion for the team. He just isn't good enough. Sounds like he is just the 7th D-Man, so its not that big of a deal, although I think he should be 8th. Fowler is a better D-Man than Orpik. Hope what was said in that article isn't the way that it will be in Sochi. I think the two Pittsburgh guys should be the 7th and 8th D-Man on the team.

I understand why Ryan wasn't picked. They want to be play a very conservative style. I still would have picked Ryan over Oshie. Yandle not making it was another travesty. Again, I understand why, but Yandle got shafted. Orpik should not have been on the team, Yandle should have.

This is how I see the lines:

Parise-Pavelski-Kane
JVR-Kesler-Kessel
Pacioretty-Stepan-Wheeler
Brown-Backes-Callahan
Do Not Dress: Stastny-Oshie

Suter-Carlson
McDonagh-Faulk
Fowler-Shattenkirk
Do Not Dress: Martin-Orpik


Quick
Miller
Howard

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01-02-2014, 04:39 AM
  #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stan the caddy View Post
The problem with Russia is a mediocre defense.
This will be a nasty team (if healthy which is a big??) to meet on the big ice

Sedin - Sedin - Eriksson
Franzen - Zetterberg - Alfredsson
Mojo - Bäckström - Hagelin
Steen - Berglund - Landeskog

Hörnqvist, Zinbajed/Silfverberg

Karlsson - Kronwall
OEL - Hjalmarsson
Hedman - Brodin

Oduya, Edler/Ericsson

Hank
Whatever

The Ryan & Yandle omissions are very hard to understand IMO. You ice the best players in a short tournament. Not fill presumptive holes with role players that do not have time to gel anyways.

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01-02-2014, 06:02 AM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Dactyl View Post
i thought it would be the IIHF/IOC but i guess its the host nation.
I think a couple of years ago, the IIHF decided that every international tournament in North America (USA/Canada) could go on NHL-sized rinks, while every tournament elsewhere could happen on olympic sized rinks. This includes the Olympics, World Champs, JWC etc.

Its up to the host to decide, and the cost of changing allready astablished rinks for international tournaments was considered too high.

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01-02-2014, 06:14 AM
  #147
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The USA has no chance with Martin, Orpik and Fowler on defense. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

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01-02-2014, 09:17 AM
  #148
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My thoughts on Stepan:

He definitely offers a different skill set than the other centers. I think Joe Micheletti nailed it in the broadcast the other day. Stepan is a good playmaker, good on the power play. Furthermore, he has been a "good soldier" for Team USA in the past.

on Bobby Ryan:

I would have liked to see him on the roster. You can never have enough scoring options. In my opinion, power play is the 2nd most important factor in winning a tournament like this (after goaltending). The other PP wingers ahead of Ryan would be Kessel, Parise, JVR, and Kane. A good group but always good to have more options should things not click or someone get hurt.

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01-02-2014, 09:22 AM
  #149
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So because Byslma is the coach, Orpik was picked? Thats ********
Or because they wanted to add another dimension of toughness. If you wanted to add someone like Yandle, you start running the risk of a roster that is too redundant.

After watching the Rangers stumble through roster building for years and years, you'd think we'd know by now that clear and defined roles are an important issue when building a team.

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01-02-2014, 09:24 AM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Or because they wanted to add another dimension of toughness. If you wanted to add someone like Yandle, you start running the risk of a roster that is too redundant.

After watching the Rangers stumble through roster building for years and years, you'd think we'd know by now that clear and defined roles are an important issue when building a team.
It's stunning to see a GM actually build a team, not a roster comprised of names and all stars.

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