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Zack Smith's awesomeness cannot be denied

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12-29-2013, 03:04 PM
  #51
thinkwild
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I've always loved the make up of this line thinking it could be the best 3rd line since Ricci, Thornton, Sundstrom. They havent quite got there yet.

But it is worth noting that Greening Smith and Neil ironically are still written in by most fans here as the 4th line when doing line up charts. But clearly, they have been lining up against some of the top players in the league lately, as Smith has often been called on to do, playing as our top shut down line against the likes of Ovechkin, Crosby, and Krejci recently.

Some fans in such denial over this role that they then come in wondering how is it possible that Smiths line, the 4th line, got just as much ice time as our top line.

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12-29-2013, 03:18 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by thinkwild View Post
I've always loved the make up of this line thinking it could be the best 3rd line since Ricci, Thornton, Sundstrom. They havent quite got there yet.

But it is worth noting that Greening Smith and Neil ironically are still written in by most fans here as the 4th line when doing line up charts. But clearly, they have been lining up against some of the top players in the league lately, as Smith has often been called on to do, playing as our top shut down line against the likes of Ovechkin, Crosby, and Krejci recently.

Some fans in such denial over this role that they then come in wondering how is it possible that Smiths line, the 4th line, got just as much ice time as our top line.
The only thing is, I think on a championship calibre team this is a perfect 4th line, so we want them to be a 4th line.

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12-29-2013, 03:31 PM
  #53
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Mac tend to try to line them up against the other team's top line, so they end up with more ice time. As a result they usually get crushed, but at least it makes it possible for our top lines to avoid going toe to toe against tougher competition.

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12-29-2013, 03:44 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by StefanW View Post
Mac tend to try to line them up against the other team's top line, so they end up with more ice time. As a result they usually get crushed, but at least it makes it possible for our top lines to avoid going toe to toe against tougher competition.
Crushed? They win more battles than they lose, it's not a coincidence that Spezza's line has the worse plus/minus on this team & that's not even against the other team's best lines. They are Ottawa's best shut down line, energy line & their most consistent line game in & game out. I wish the other players on this team would play with the kind of heart the Smith line plays with in every game & maybe we wouldn't be losing every other game. While so many on here keep ragging on this line PM keeps playing them the most because he can trust them to play a smart defensive game & not give the puck away. They have been awsome.

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12-29-2013, 03:46 PM
  #55
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In a salary cap era, that would surely be a luxurious option to have as a 4th line. Hopefully we can get there one day. But im not sure the 3rd/4th line distinction is as meaningful here as filling required roles.

Neil on the 3rd line may still sometimes get 10-12 minutes while Pageau on the 4th line may get 14-15 just because of specialty teams. Unbelievably to me, there are still some that question the value of Neils role and how he plays it. Or dont recognize how strong a role Smith has been playing as he develops into a key character role player. Calling Smith's a 4th line role doesnt seem wise resource allocation to me, ymmv.

Greenings role is still under construction for sure, he has all the tools, it seems just out of his grasp sometimes and then other times you can see it is there. Could swap a Laz, Stone, or Peumpel there for a better complementary role and a huge change in dynamic.

If our top lines were amongst the leagues best, our support lines could look and be used a lot better too.

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12-29-2013, 03:51 PM
  #56
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Crushed? They win more battles than they lose, it's not a coincidence that Spezza's line has the worse plus/minus on this team & that's not even against the other team's best lines. They are Ottawa's best shut down line, energy line & their most consistent line game in & game out. I wish the other players on this team would play with the kind of heart the Smith line plays with in every game & maybe we wouldn't be losing every other game. While so many on here keep ragging on this line PM keeps playing them the most because he can trust them to play a smart defensive game & not give the puck away. They have been awsome.
Crushed. Annihilated. Wiped out. They have brutal possession numbers, and were sitting at under 40% last game. They don't score much and they get scored on. But, as I said, those things are expected when you line up against top lines from the other team.

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12-29-2013, 04:08 PM
  #57
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Crushed, annihilated, and wiped out seems slightly unsubstantiated hyperbole to me too. They are a support line used in a shut down role against some of the leagues top lines and relatively successfully, Holding up their possession time and scoring prowess against those top lines they are trying to shut down doesnt seem to be selecting the stats that best measure their roles to me.

If Michalek Spezza Ryan became one of the leagues best lines as we dreamed about in training camp, the reduced time going to Smith Greening Neil could possibly also be appreciated in a new light.

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01-02-2014, 09:34 PM
  #58
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another GWG tonight.


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01-02-2014, 09:40 PM
  #59
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another GWG tonight.

You too?

From the PGT:

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GW
Game-winning goals. After the final score has been determinded, the goal which leaves the winning team one goal ahead of its opponent is the game-winning goal (example: if Team A beats Team B 8-3, the player scoring the fourth goal for Team A receives credit for the game-winning goal).
Note: Goals scored during a shootout are not credited as game-winning goals.

http://proicehockey.about.com/od/lea..._explained.htm

GWG – Game-winning goals – Number of game-winning goals the player has scored (a goal is considered game winning when the team would win the game without scoring any more goals, for example, the third goal in a 5–2 win)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_hockey_statistics

ie Mac with the GWG.



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01-02-2014, 09:55 PM
  #60
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You too?

From the PGT:





haha oops, mixed those up

moving on... go smith!

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01-03-2014, 07:45 AM
  #61
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haha oops, mixed those up

moving on... go smith!
I think Smith has become one of those players where if we ever move him, we'll never get back a player who will be as important to the team. Kind of like Neil when he is playing a smart game. Smith has been a beaut this year. Never trade this guy if he keeps playing the way he is.

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01-03-2014, 09:34 AM
  #62
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I think Smith has become one of those players where if we ever move him, we'll never get back a player who will be as important to the team. Kind of like Neil when he is playing a smart game. Smith has been a beaut this year. Never trade this guy if he keeps playing the way he is.
I was laughed at when I said that Smith is one of the best passers on the team. His physical play, solid shot, great checking, good face offs, decent puck control and speed would never be replaced if the team moved him. He is actually under payed for what he brings.

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01-03-2014, 09:35 AM
  #63
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I think Smith has become one of those players where if we ever move him, we'll never get back a player who will be as important to the team. Kind of like Neil when he is playing a smart game. Smith has been a beaut this year. Never trade this guy if he keeps playing the way he is.
Let's not forget that he's been awful for about half the year. Great to see he's finding his game though...

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01-03-2014, 10:08 AM
  #64
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It's definitely encouraging since he started off fairly hot in the NHL, then looked lost for about a year.

If he continues to chip in here and there, and play physical then all is good in the hood.

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01-03-2014, 10:22 AM
  #65
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Let's not forget that he's been awful for about half the year. Great to see he's finding his game though...
What?

Smith has been very effective pretty much all year. Same with last year. There's a reason the coaching staff has been high on him for so long.

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01-03-2014, 10:22 AM
  #66
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It's funny how points automatically makes you all think players are great. Don't get me wrong Smith is ok but he still has massive issues that need addressing. He has zero brains. He's lost in the defensive zone alllllllllll the time. Takes too many stupid penalties, he was lucky that he didn't get into it with Stuart at the end of the game like what the hell is he thinking? Up a goal and you go try to pick a fight? Stupidity at it's finest. The good thing is his faceoffs are good, he seems to be able to be at the right place at the right time and is actually scoring which is good.

It drives me crazy when players have good physical attributes but are so weighed down by bad judgement and IQ.

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01-03-2014, 10:31 AM
  #67
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What?

Smith has been very effective pretty much all year. Same with last year. There's a reason the coaching staff has been high on him for so long.
Nope. I see it the same as John Holmes:

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It's definitely encouraging since he started off fairly hot in the NHL, then looked lost for about a year.

If he continues to chip in here and there, and play physical then all is good in the hood.

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01-03-2014, 01:18 PM
  #68
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Let's not forget that he's been awful for about half the year. Great to see he's finding his game though...
Unfair, Smith only struggled on the road trip to start the year and has been surprisingly good since. He is finally rewarded by soring goals lately

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01-03-2014, 01:40 PM
  #69
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Unfair, Smith only struggled on the road trip to start the year and has been surprisingly good since. He is finally rewarded by soring goals lately
It seems to be very difficult for some people to see a player playing well when he's not scoring.

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01-03-2014, 01:47 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by StefanW View Post
Crushed. Annihilated. Wiped out. They have brutal possession numbers, and were sitting at under 40% last game. They don't score much and they get scored on. But, as I said, those things are expected when you line up against top lines from the other team.
I see where you got that, it's exactly what Yost wrote ... can't stand his corsi crap.

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What?

Smith has been very effective pretty much all year. Same with last year. There's a reason the coaching staff has been high on him for so long.
Exactly, people like the pretty boys on here & don't appreciate the hard working bottom six players as much as the coaches do.

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It's funny how points automatically makes you all think players are great. Don't get me wrong Smith is ok but he still has massive issues that need addressing. He has zero brains. He's lost in the defensive zone alllllllllll the time. Takes too many stupid penalties, he was lucky that he didn't get into it with Stuart at the end of the game like what the hell is he thinking? Up a goal and you go try to pick a fight? Stupidity at it's finest. The good thing is his faceoffs are good, he seems to be able to be at the right place at the right time and is actually scoring which is good.

It drives me crazy when players have good physical attributes but are so weighed down by bad judgement and IQ.
Couldn't disagree with you more including how you see things. Your bias against bottom six forwards is so transparent, you obviously prefer the skilled players & don't appreciate the grinders on the team. I think the give aways that Spezza & Karlsson do make me question their hockey IQ, the risks they take are often more stupid than successful, it works both ways. Too many stupid give aways, too many stupid mistakes, terrible defensively, lazy getting back on defence,.

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01-03-2014, 01:49 PM
  #71
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It seems to be very difficult for some people to see a player playing well when he's not scoring.
It apparently seems to be very difficult for some people to see a player playing poorly in the defensive zone.

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01-03-2014, 01:52 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by StefanW View Post
Crushed. Annihilated. Wiped out. They have brutal possession numbers, and were sitting at under 40% last game. They don't score much and they get scored on. But, as I said, those things are expected when you line up against top lines from the other team.
I see where you got that, it's exactly what Yost wrote ... can't stand his corsi crap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cujomi View Post
What?

Smith has been very effective pretty much all year. Same with last year. There's a reason the coaching staff has been high on him for so long.
Exactly, people like the pretty boys on here & don't appreciate the hard working bottom six players as much as the coaches do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GimmeMyJetpack View Post
It's funny how points automatically makes you all think players are great. Don't get me wrong Smith is ok but he still has massive issues that need addressing. He has zero brains. He's lost in the defensive zone alllllllllll the time. Takes too many stupid penalties, he was lucky that he didn't get into it with Stuart at the end of the game like what the hell is he thinking? Up a goal and you go try to pick a fight? Stupidity at it's finest. The good thing is his faceoffs are good, he seems to be able to be at the right place at the right time and is actually scoring which is good.

It drives me crazy when players have good physical attributes but are so weighed down by bad judgement and IQ.
Couldn't disagree with you more including how you see things. Your bias against bottom six forwards is so transparent , you obviously prefer the skilled players & don't appreciate the grinders on the team. I think the give aways that Spezza & Karlsson do make me question their hockey IQ, the risks they take are often more stupid than successful, it works both ways. Too many stupid give aways, too many stupid mistakes, terrible defensively, lazy getting back on defence, this team would have a much better record if it wasn't for all those errors.

Smith for the record was simply standing up for himself against Stuart who went after him first & they both would have gone off, Winn would not have had an advantage. There is a reason why PM continues to praise Smith. It drives me crazy when players like Spezza & Karlsson are so weighed down by bad judgement & IQ.

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01-03-2014, 02:08 PM
  #73
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Nope. I see it the same as John Holmes:
Well considering that he's consistently received great reviews from the coach, and has been a player that has been heavily leaned upon by the team I'll just leave it at that. He played great in his role last year, and has played great this year. He's one of the more underrated players on the team.

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01-03-2014, 02:13 PM
  #74
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Couldn't disagree with you more including how you see things. Your bias against bottom six forwards is so transparent, you obviously prefer the skilled players & don't appreciate the grinders on the team. I think the give aways that Spezza & Karlsson do make me question their hockey IQ, the risks they take are often more stupid than successful, it works both ways. Too many stupid give aways, too many stupid mistakes, terrible defensively, lazy getting back on defence,.

I get it. You don't like advanced stats, you prefer the so called heart and soul guys. blah blah blah...When have I ever said that I preferred skilled guys? When did I ever compare him to Spezza or Karlsson? I actually critique Spezza the exact same way that I critique Smith so I'm not exactly sure where you are getting this. If anything I'm guilty of liking players who are smart, responsible and passionate top 6 or bottom 6.

as for the advanced stats stuff I just want to ask you this. Do you think that the more you shoot the greater chance you have to score?

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01-03-2014, 03:58 PM
  #75
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Well considering that he's consistently received great reviews from the coach, and has been a player that has been heavily leaned upon by the team I'll just leave it at that. He played great in his role last year, and has played great this year. He's one of the more underrated players on the team.
Oh neat, the "the coach knows best" argument.

I like Smith, but to say he played well, when he wasn't playing well, because MacLean said so, is a pretty hollow argument.

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