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David Desharnais fights back!

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01-04-2014, 06:45 PM
  #51
LyricalLyricist
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze View Post
What would Desharnais do without Pacioretty?
I guess what he did in his rookie year?

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01-04-2014, 06:45 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze View Post
What would Desharnais do without Pacioretty?
Achieve god status.

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01-04-2014, 06:46 PM
  #53
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I was all aboard the ship DD to the moon train...but now i'm intrigued....he's been playing really well.....i think if you give him another big winger permanently he'll stay good and not fall into limbo again

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01-04-2014, 06:47 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze View Post
What would Desharnais do without Pacioretty?
Let's all loose sleep over this great philosophical question.

Brilliant and so not redundant...

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01-04-2014, 06:49 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by habsfanatics View Post
Link?
It was while they were in the AHL together and was about the difference in coaching styles between Boucher and Cunneyworth. I can't find the exact quote I was looking for but this article alludes to it but doesn't have the actual quote which was quite full of praise.

Quote:
Pacioretty credits Randy Cunneyworth and the new staff in Hamilton for not stifling his creativity, enabling him to absorb the all-important lessons mistakes will offer without fear of immediate demotion; claiming their hands-off approach has led him back on course
http://montreal.ctvnews.ca/the-engel...#ixzz2pTbbReWH

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01-04-2014, 06:50 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Habstraction View Post
Let's all loose sleep over this great philosophical question.

Brilliant and so not redundant...
Thanks for compliment! <333333

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01-04-2014, 06:56 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Impossible Glory View Post
Problem is, management likes him. If they tolerate him when he's average and gave him that big contrat, they probably love him a lot now that he is hot. I'd be pretty surprised if they trade him in the near future, even if it pains me to say that.
That's my big worry. If we was just a place holder until Galchenyuk is ready to be the #1 center then it made no sense to extend him for 4 years. They may have started to have doubts during his first 20 games, but they probably feel vindicated now that he's producing.

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01-04-2014, 07:00 PM
  #58
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Here is a Desharnais conspiracy theory, that explains why management overuses him.

1) They see Eller as a future 2nd line centre. He's getting there, but he's not there yet. The EGG line experiment showed that he could produce explosively if given the right opportunities, that's a done deal, but given his future role they want him to be more effective on defense.
2) They see Galchenyuk as the future 1st line centre, and for now he is developing at a reasonable rate given that he is 19, he could play more, but ...
3) Desharnais does not fit into the big picture but he needs to be traded eventually. If he keeps going PPG he will have his second 60 point season, he should then be traceable allowing some promotion for Galchenyuk next year.

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01-04-2014, 07:09 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze View Post
I honestly can't wait till he's off the team.
Me too...that day can't come soon enough.

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01-04-2014, 07:09 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorinth View Post
It was while they were in the AHL together and was about the difference in coaching styles between Boucher and Cunneyworth. I can't find the exact quote I was looking for but this article alludes to it but doesn't have the actual quote which was quite full of praise.



http://montreal.ctvnews.ca/the-engel...#ixzz2pTbbReWH
This link doesn't seem to imply in any way at all what you suggested he said though. I don't see any reason to doubt him here, but I don't thik he's necessarily crediting Cunneyworth as being a stellar coach, only that he helped him in his own game. Maybe that credit it is warranted, Cunneyworth is not a good coach, we all know that, but that's not to say he couldn't be useful to young players developing in the AHL.

The Hunters are notorious for working well with Jr level players in London, but that doesn't make them a good coach at the NHL level.

I' sure Patches probably rightfully feels Cunneyworth helped him in some way. Nothing wrong with that.

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01-04-2014, 07:13 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Here is a Desharnais conspiracy theory, that explains why management overuses him.

1) They see Eller as a future 2nd line centre. He's getting there, but he's not there yet. The EGG line experiment showed that he could produce explosively if given the right opportunities, that's a done deal, but given his future role they want him to be more effective on defense.
2) They see Galchenyuk as the future 1st line centre, and for now he is developing at a reasonable rate given that he is 19, he could play more, but ...
3) Desharnais does not fit into the big picture but he needs to be traded eventually. If he keeps going PPG he will have his second 60 point season, he should then be traceable allowing some promotion for Galchenyuk next year.
Now if only there were a way to make him grow a few inches. I don't see how we can trade a 5'6 one dimensional center with a $3.5m cap hit.

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01-04-2014, 07:15 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Here is a Desharnais conspiracy theory, that explains why management overuses him.

1) They see Eller as a future 2nd line centre. He's getting there, but he's not there yet. The EGG line experiment showed that he could produce explosively if given the right opportunities, that's a done deal, but given his future role they want him to be more effective on defense.
2) They see Galchenyuk as the future 1st line centre, and for now he is developing at a reasonable rate given that he is 19, he could play more, but ...
3) Desharnais does not fit into the big picture but he needs to be traded eventually. If he keeps going PPG he will have his second 60 point season, he should then be traceable allowing some promotion for Galchenyuk next year.
I don't see it, I don't think the habs locked him up to a four your deal with the plan of using him as a placeholder to move him a year later. You could be correct, but I just don't see it. I think they think DD can contribute to a successful team. I agree with them. The problem I have is utilization from the coach as it seems to be the same from most of the fans who harp on DD. Not necessarily a hate on DD the player, but the usage of DD. Obviously there are extreme opinions who would rather trade him for nothing no matter what he's doing.

I kind of liken it to the Boullion/Murray debates. Boullion is unquestionably the better player imo, but fans would rather see an inferior Murray for 12/13minutes a night than Boullion for 20 minutes. That's a legit criticism, but I don't think it should reflect poorly on Boullion either because the coach has a hard-on for him. Go with your best players, but use them appropriately.

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01-04-2014, 09:12 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Here is a Desharnais conspiracy theory, that explains why management overuses him.

1) They see Eller as a future 2nd line centre. He's getting there, but he's not there yet. The EGG line experiment showed that he could produce explosively if given the right opportunities, that's a done deal, but given his future role they want him to be more effective on defense.
2) They see Galchenyuk as the future 1st line centre, and for now he is developing at a reasonable rate given that he is 19, he could play more, but ...
3) Desharnais does not fit into the big picture but he needs to be traded eventually. If he keeps going PPG he will have his second 60 point season, he should then be traceable allowing some promotion for Galchenyuk next year.
1) Yes. He is not there yet. His October run was fabulous.
2) Yes, He will be a first line center but he needs to continue to evolve. Putting him as a first line center is not the answer now. For now he is third among forwards which is great. Seems that Habs management is doing something right.
3) Expecting 60 points from DD is a little bit too much but he will get 50+ points seems a better expectation. He should be in top-4 with Pacioretty (most likely first), Plekanec and Galchenyuk. Also he does pretty well in faceoffs.

I do understand many about Eller and Galchenyuk.
But Eller is behind DD on the PP and in offense.
Galchenyuk is another story, he will be the center next year or the following one. Many want to push Eller and Galchenyuk ahead of DD but they are not there yet.
For now, it seems to me that the Habs management are going toward Eller to be the replacement for Plekanec and Galchenyuk to replace Desharnais.

But we are not there yet!

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Old
01-04-2014, 09:53 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I guess what he did in his rookie year?
Be a defensive liability on the 4th line and be a PP only specialist?

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01-04-2014, 10:33 PM
  #65
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Be a defensive liability on the 4th line and be a PP only specialist?
He made 18 ESP out of 22 Points. All in 43 games. Just above .5PPG. If with 4th liners then there you go, without max.

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01-04-2014, 11:03 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
He made 18 ESP out of 22 Points. All in 43 games. Just above .5PPG. If with 4th liners then there you go, without max.
14 ESP in 43 games:
http://www.nhl.com/ice/player.htm?id...011&gameType=2

Led the team in ES GA/ ES minute played:
http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...51+52+13+15+29

Played with Pouliot/Darche/White:
http://www.cs.unb.ca/~mwf/habs/2010-.../forwards.html

Then there's this season where he had a chance to show what he is without Pacioretty which amounted to nothing. I don't think he's shown he can bring anything if Pacioretty gets injured/suspended/traded especially with the current powerplay setup which has nothing in terms of downlow play. On the flip side, 10/11 and Pacioretty's production without Desharnais aside, I'm not convinced Pacioretty would have success without his BFF Desharnais on his line either. He's played probably 200+ games with Desharnais since the AHL and seems to not try as hard if they are in the lineup but separate lines. To me this is more of a scary thought since he is the long term franchise LW.


Last edited by Watsatheo: 01-04-2014 at 11:14 PM.
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01-05-2014, 01:05 AM
  #67
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You are in some dream world. Trade him!!!

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Old
01-05-2014, 02:24 AM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
14 ESP in 43 games:
http://www.nhl.com/ice/player.htm?id...011&gameType=2

Led the team in ES GA/ ES minute played:
http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...51+52+13+15+29

Played with Pouliot/Darche/White:
http://www.cs.unb.ca/~mwf/habs/2010-.../forwards.html

Then there's this season where he had a chance to show what he is without Pacioretty which amounted to nothing. I don't think he's shown he can bring anything if Pacioretty gets injured/suspended/traded especially with the current powerplay setup which has nothing in terms of downlow play. On the flip side, 10/11 and Pacioretty's production without Desharnais aside, I'm not convinced Pacioretty would have success without his BFF Desharnais on his line either. He's played probably 200+ games with Desharnais since the AHL and seems to not try as hard if they are in the lineup but separate lines. To me this is more of a scary thought since he is the long term franchise LW.
Pacioretty is an elite player who would even higher totals if he had more complete player being his center...like Galchenyuk. His production with Desharnais is nothing special; it's typical for elite players to enhance a "good enough" straggler's production to elite levels. He production contributed to a deteriorating Gomez's 10 assists in 2010-2011 and was on pace for about 30 goals if he had 82 games to play. Had Chara not rendered him unable to play, Gomez would have had higher point totals and he probably would have hit 20 goals.

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01-05-2014, 02:35 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
He made 18 ESP out of 22 Points. All in 43 games. Just above .5PPG. If with 4th liners then there you go, without max.
http://www.hockey-reference.com/play.../scoring/2011/

Most of his production involved skilled guys even then.

Benoit Pouliot was a mess of a skill player, but that doesn't mean that he didn't have his "skilled moments". In addition, I see some Subban, Wisniewski, Kostitsyn, Cammalleri, Weber, and two goals from our dear Max Pacioretty.

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01-05-2014, 02:38 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by 24get View Post
1) Yes. He is not there yet. His October run was fabulous.
2) Yes, He will be a first line center but he needs to continue to evolve. Putting him as a first line center is not the answer now. For now he is third among forwards which is great. Seems that Habs management is doing something right.
3) Expecting 60 points from DD is a little bit too much but he will get 50+ points seems a better expectation. He should be in top-4 with Pacioretty (most likely first), Plekanec and Galchenyuk. Also he does pretty well in faceoffs.

I do understand many about Eller and Galchenyuk.
But Eller is behind DD on the PP and in offense.
Galchenyuk is another story, he will be the center next year or the following one. Many want to push Eller and Galchenyuk ahead of DD but they are not there yet.
For now, it seems to me that the Habs management are going toward Eller to be the replacement for Plekanec and Galchenyuk to replace Desharnais.

But we are not there yet!
Galchenyuk is outproducing DD despite playing less and barely getting any PP time anymore. Explain to me how he's not ready but DD is?
You don't need to use him as a 1st center. He should be getting DD's spot.
He should be centering a sheltered line.

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01-05-2014, 02:41 AM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze View Post
What would Desharnais do without Pacioretty?
We discuss the wonders of what he could do with Patric Hornqvist and David Jones(Calgary), just a couple of big 20 goal scorers that can see their goal-scoring numbers rise into 30s with the elite playmaker that is David Desharnais.

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01-05-2014, 02:59 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Prallchengher View Post
http://www.hockey-reference.com/play.../scoring/2011/

Most of his production involved skilled guys even then.

Benoit Pouliot was a mess of a skill player, but that doesn't mean that he didn't have his "skilled moments". In addition, I see some Subban, Wisniewski, Kostitsyn, Cammalleri, Weber, and two goals from our dear Max Pacioretty.
So...he passes to skilled players?

Question was what he would do without max and he produced 0.5ppg without max in his rookie year.

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01-05-2014, 10:02 AM
  #73
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Honestly the issue hasn't really been his production. He was producing during our last place finish season too.

The issue is that his production is (argued) to be directly negatively correlated to this team's overall success and development.

The fact is that he wouldn't produce with Gionta and Moen on his line, and he can't be depended upon to be a game breaker who can be relied upon either. That's his "deal" so to speak.

Keep making threads based on his point streak though, as if people don't watch games. Your 17 twitter followers expect more from you Habsterix.
Excuses, excuses and more excuses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JLP View Post
I hope those who rate Desharnais' value as an NHL centre highly will post exactly that on other teams' boards. I'd be interested to see what sort of trade offers other teams' fans might post.
True. I mean, any non-NHL centre would be almost a point per game for the last 20 or so and 131 points in 219 career games... The exaggeration on this board is laughable at best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bieber fever View Post
lol at Desharnais listed at 5'7. I saw him in person a couple of time he's more like 5,5 5'6
Complaint department here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Max would be fine playing with Eller, Galchenyuk or Plecs. Pretty sure he'd probably improve actually. He doesn't need DD anymore than Kessel needs Bozak.

If DD didn't have Max...
You're going with suppositions. Desharnais' production is a fact.

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01-05-2014, 11:36 AM
  #74
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It also isn't a coincidence that the PP went to crap as soon as DD was put back on it.

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01-05-2014, 03:02 PM
  #75
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It also isn't a coincidence that the PP went to crap as soon as DD was put back on it.
Has it actually gone to crap?

Anyhow, with Subban and Markov QBing our power play, if it is not top-5 in the league, the forwards are not doing their job.

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