It is a penalty. I'm fine with it being called. Well, I'm fine if its called every time it happened. It happened dozens of times in the game, yet we had one call that completely screwed our already thin chances of winning.
Thats how I see it. It's the right penalty call. But you're not calling anything for the last few minutes and you are letting the action go which is great... than with a few seconds to go you decide to call a soft hook on a player who tends to talk and complain alot. Pretty strange.
He's saying that Subban isn't captain material because he has made a politically incorrect comment. The argument goes that a true captain should sound extremely generic and positive in the media.
Montreal fans have a history with this belief system. When Pacioretty said he'd rather play 1st line in Hamilton than 3rd line in Montreal, they erupted. When Eller talked smack about the Edmonton Oilers, they erupted again. A montreal Canadien should only ever say something like "Us boys have been working hard, we believe in the coach and we're going to give a hundred and ten percent by focusing on defense".
This is the reason why 99% of all player interviews are worthless.
We need to ask ourselves why a politically correct response is the only acceptable one to the general public. Pro hockey (and it's fans) takes itself too seriously. This is not life and death, it is the way we spend a few hours a week escaping the realities of our lives.
Why do we (and I do not include myself) need to politically correct answers? Who's feelings are we concerned with?
You can't be serious? It's obviously jabbing. If true, you think Prust is dumb enough to voice his "hatred" on Twitter in a passive aggressive fashion? Cmon get a grip. Chirps aren't just for opponents ya know.
I don't want to criticize your or others ability to read for information, but I did say "while he clearly was joking".
My point is that PK does have a personality that can rub some people the wrong way. It isn't something we didn't know. The question is does that play a factor in an official's decision making process.
Stick around the hips, seems to me like it's a clear penalty..
From what I've heard though it's more about the timing of it. But what's weird to me is that the ref didn't raise his arm until late, so that's odd. But it's a penalty.
I also think it was a penalty. He started hooking too soon. If there was a rebound, he would have held up the player from a scoring chance. It's not like he hooked after the whistle. If he wanted to shield the goalie, he should have been moving his feet and used his body.
They were letting everything go, but that was around the net in the dying seconds. If he had hooked after the whistle, no problem.
I have been reading your posts for years Hackett and am almost always in agreement with your observations. I'm not sure I agree with your comment here. Yes, what you are saying is a possibility for sure. IMO however, Subban's "play" here was brilliant. He's forced the refs to "up their game" and put an onus on them to exhibit clear "impartiality" on their calls on Subban in the future because now EVERY CALL against Subban will be scrutized for it's validity. So, while it is indeed a "two edged sword", I think that it clearly puts the refs on notice on their calls against Subban in the future. IMHO, smart play by Subban.
I hope you are right. But I believe that the officials do not have enough accountability that forces them to up their game or change their culture. This presents a whole other issue that lies deeper than subban's actual comments.
All we hear about is how the supervisors send video to the refs for positive and negative feedback, and a reward system which theoretically chooses how far the officials go in the playoffs, but it seems awfully difficult to punish an official severely enough to change their ways.
Maybe there are a lack of qualified applicants to this position, which gives the officials a sense of security, but I'm not certain of that.
The fans have become knowledgeable in all facets of the game, including the officiating with the ease of learning tools such as the Internet and You-Tube. The referees should be learning the nuances of the NHL counterparts in the AHL for at least 4-6yrs. Before plying their trade as linesmen in the NHL for a couple of yrs. and a review board should be in place to ensure the quality of the decisions made and the effect of poor decisions on the final outcomes.
Hockey is a business after all is said and done, but the odd PP in favor of the home team probably doesn't hurt their product's sales at all. This has been part of keeping a level playing field for as long as I can remember. Being a Hab fan during the decades when the Habs were head and shoulders above their competition. It must have been a mandate to penalize the Habs regularly during the game, to ensure the flow of the game was erratic and the Habs couldn't get any continuity in pressure.
The Habs of the 1950's were a powerhouse and two minute minors were served regardless how often the opponent scored. Montreal with it's talent, could put a game out of reach during one PP, scoring 2-3 times in an era of tight defence and great goaltending. The NHL changed the rule to what we now have, due to the Habs strength and IMO if not for the refereeing and Clarence Campbell, the Habs may have won eight in a row in the 50's.
The expansion in 1967, doubled the existing Original Six to a dozen and the refereeing wasn't one of the major concerns, insuring the financial success of the new franchises was. The officiating has always been a pain in the backside for fans of NHL teams, it appears the league is nearing parity for the first time since the 60's IMO. Now would be the appropriate time to form a Program specifically designed to teach refereeing, much like the Team Canada's Program of Excellence for teenage players.
A program whose aim is directed towards teaching the same group of rules for participants from each country, with clear outlines (no vague penalties left for interpretation). This would instantly leave the game in the players hands and take out the intimidation tactics used by some coaches. (Freddy the Fog, Broad Street Bullies eg)
Only by putting the sport back in the players hands, does it insure the quality of play the fans enjoy instead of what the Owners & IIHF want to ensure the big payday.
NHL refs are a joke, they are the worst of any professional sports. Last night Pacioretty got hooked so badly skating through the neutral zone, the stick stay under his arm for a good 50 feet. The refs HAD put the whistles away. Ok fine, but to make that marginal call with 18 seconds left was not right. Must be nice to be an NHL ref, no accountability. You blow calls, you flat out are brutal and that is ok. Watching Tom Brady (whom I despise) yelling at the refs at the end of a game recently was refreshing, they needed to hear it.
Like I said, NHL officiating is a joke.
Jean Beliveau would have gently touched PK's shoulder just before the media came into the dressing room and PK would have saved his comments for his teammates. I don't think he's doing the team any favours even though I like a person/player who speaks his mind. There are just too many politically correct robots out there.
Thanks, Toronto Sun. Now to listen to three days worth of comments and discussion about the topic. It was a frustration-driven comment during the post-game, but now it's going to be picked apart, dissected, analyzed, and criticised to the point where discussion panels are going to push for him to be omitted for the Olympic squad.
Amazing on how you can take something that PK Subban said in Montreal and twist it into being Toronto's fault.
The NHL's referee quality assurance is very lacking. Here's a league who has been keeping Chris Lee employed for years. Well, in my opinion, Chris Lee is an arrogant, biased, flawed individual who shouldn't be presiding over a cake raffle, much less over professional sports. And he hasn't developped that reputation after turning pro, he has always been this way, going back to when he was in the QMJHL making sure every body check on a star player was a penalty and that you had a 50% chance of getting 2 for Unsportsmanlike Conduct if you tried to get an explaination for his ********, explaination he never gave you because he was too busy telling you he was in charge and telling you to shut up. Oh, and did I mention he's got nervous breath and he blows the whistle awfully quick when the goalie may or may not have the puck, yeah, he does that. Here's a guy who thinks HE'S the star on the ice.
The fact that Chris Lee has a job is proof whomever is hiring the refs is doing an awful job at it. Granted, they never trot out Lee in the Cup Finals or anything, but still.
Yes, but you see it after a lot of whistles in every game.
There was no whistle and PK had identified where the puck was (not covered by Price) and attempted to restrict/contain the opposing player's movement despite the fact that the forward didn't have possession of the puck.
Weak call but I'd say it's on the edge, there's definitely a call to be made. It can be argued that it was a puck battle or it can be considered interference/holding. Hooking was undoubtedly the wrong call.
Nowadays i'm never surprised when things are called to be personal with a ref having a vendetta, esp. the way it happened between S. Auger and Burrows in Vancouver. I think it happens more often than we think but it's not being made public.
I'm glad that, after months and months of us fans accusing referees having something personal against Subban (i.e. missed calls for, blatant phantom calls against), Subban himself is coming out and saying the same thing. Good for him, it's really about time he does so.