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Mikko Koivu [Mod Warning Post #955]

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01-05-2014, 10:46 PM
  #201
ThatGuy22
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Originally Posted by thestonedkoala View Post
Good defensively, chips in offensively. Would you consider Cooke a top 6 winger when he was scoring 15-20 goals a season?
If he was adding a 40-50 assists, absolutely.

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01-05-2014, 10:47 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by thestonedkoala View Post
Brodin.



Really? Koivu is a perfect 3rd line center. And you know what? Maybe we should be looking at that as Cup favorites? If that is to get us over the hump of playoff bubble to cup favorites is to address that hole, then let's fix it.
WOW, you figured it out. Now all Fletcher has to do is find a center thats better than Koivu. There's what, maybe 30 guys (at most) in the world who fit that bill? Shouldnt be very hard at all.

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01-05-2014, 10:48 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by thestonedkoala View Post
Brodin.



Really? Koivu is a perfect 3rd line center. And you know what? Maybe we should be looking at that as Cup favorites? If that is to get us over the hump of playoff bubble to cup favorites is to address that hole, then let's fix it.
GREAT IDEA!!! Lets just fix it. Which one of the 15ish centers in the NHL better than Koivu is just going to be given to us or is even available.

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01-06-2014, 12:49 AM
  #204
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Originally Posted by ThatGuy22 View Post
If he was adding a 40-50 assists, absolutely.
So, just assists? Let's see how Cooke does on the top 6 with guys like Poms, Parise, Granlund and Nino and top pairing for PP time and see how many assists he can get

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Originally Posted by J22 View Post
WOW, you figured it out. Now all Fletcher has to do is find a center thats better than Koivu. There's what, maybe 30 guys (at most) in the world who fit that bill? Shouldnt be very hard at all.
Shouldn't be too hard to find a guy that can push Koivu down. Grabovski would fit well in the top 6. Why we didn't sign him is a mystery. As for 30?

There's more than thirty. Koivu has racked up a lot of assists but that's easy to do when you have top minutes. Here's a list of centers that have more goals than him:

Sidney Crosby
Tyler Seguin
Ryan Getzlaf
Phil Kessel
Patrick Marleau
Joe Pavelski
John Tavares
Ryan Kesler
Matt Duchen
Valtteri Filppula
Ryan Johansen
David Backes
Jonathan Toews
Frans Nielsen
Pavel Datsyuk
Jeff Carter
Tomas Hertl
Jamie Benn
Logan Couture
Ryan O'Reilly
Steven Stamkos (lawl!)
Anze Kopitar
Tomas Plekanec
Andrew Cogliano
Claude Giroux
Nick Bonino (who?)
Nathan MacKinnon
Craig Smith
Antoine Vermette
Artem Anisimov
Mike Cammalleri
Evegni Malkin
Jiri Hudler
Ryan Nugent Hopkins
Jason Spezza
Mikail Grabovski
Martin Hanzal
Paul Stastny
Tyler Johnson
Nazem Kadri
Mike Fisher
Andrew Shaw
Sean Monahan
Nicklas Backstrom
Henrik Sedin
Eric Staal
Kyle Turris
Mike Riberio
Brad Richards
Olli Jokinen
Patrice Bergeon
Brayden Schenn
Alex Killorn
Alex Galchenyuk
Lars Eller
Mika Zibanejad
David Krejci (who is coincidentally a lot like Koivu)
Mike Santorelli
Tommy Wingels
Johan Franzen
Jordan Staal
Adam Henrique
Tyler Toffoli
Vincent LeCavalier
Zack Smith

65 players are ahead of him in goals scored. Some of these are second line and third line centers (as well, some don't play center all that much)...

You'd expect a lot of assists from a guy that is playing the third most minutes for any center in the NHL. The fact that he has only 35 points when guys like Matt Duchene has more points and less time on the ice is bad. I would like to see what a more offensive center would be able to do in Koivu's stead.

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Originally Posted by ThatGuy22 View Post
GREAT IDEA!!! Lets just fix it. Which one of the 15ish centers in the NHL better than Koivu is just going to be given to us or is even available.
Mikael Grabovski would have been nice to plug in the top 6 (and possibly push Koivu down...Granlund, Grabovski, Koivu). Hell, we would have kick the tires on a guy like Filppula when he was available (again, top 6 and swapping out Granlund and Koivu). Derek Roy might have had some chemistry with Poms. Or Mike Riberio. Take a gamble on a guy like Burmistrov to work with Granlund. How about Vermette in a year?

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01-06-2014, 01:18 AM
  #205
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Originally Posted by thestonedkoala View Post
So, just assists? Let's see how Cooke does on the top 6 with guys like Poms, Parise, Granlund and Nino and top pairing for PP time and see how many assists he can get



Shouldn't be too hard to find a guy that can push Koivu down. Grabovski would fit well in the top 6. Why we didn't sign him is a mystery. As for 30?

There's more than thirty. Koivu has racked up a lot of assists but that's easy to do when you have top minutes. Here's a list of centers that have more goals than him:

Sidney Crosby
Tyler Seguin
Ryan Getzlaf
Phil Kessel
Patrick Marleau
Joe Pavelski
John Tavares
Ryan Kesler
Matt Duchen
Valtteri Filppula
Ryan Johansen
David Backes
Jonathan Toews
Frans Nielsen
Pavel Datsyuk
Jeff Carter
Tomas Hertl
Jamie Benn
Logan Couture
Ryan O'Reilly
Steven Stamkos (lawl!)
Anze Kopitar
Tomas Plekanec
Andrew Cogliano
Claude Giroux
Nick Bonino (who?)
Nathan MacKinnon
Craig Smith
Antoine Vermette
Artem Anisimov
Mike Cammalleri
Evegni Malkin
Jiri Hudler
Ryan Nugent Hopkins
Jason Spezza
Mikail Grabovski
Martin Hanzal
Paul Stastny
Tyler Johnson
Nazem Kadri
Mike Fisher
Andrew Shaw
Sean Monahan
Nicklas Backstrom
Henrik Sedin
Eric Staal
Kyle Turris
Mike Riberio
Brad Richards
Olli Jokinen
Patrice Bergeon
Brayden Schenn
Alex Killorn
Alex Galchenyuk
Lars Eller
Mika Zibanejad
David Krejci (who is coincidentally a lot like Koivu)
Mike Santorelli
Tommy Wingels
Johan Franzen
Jordan Staal
Adam Henrique
Tyler Toffoli
Vincent LeCavalier
Zack Smith

65 players are ahead of him in goals scored. Some of these are second line and third line centers (as well, some don't play center all that much)...

You'd expect a lot of assists from a guy that is playing the third most minutes for any center in the NHL. The fact that he has only 35 points when guys like Matt Duchene has more points and less time on the ice is bad. I would like to see what a more offensive center would be able to do in Koivu's stead.



Mikael Grabovski would have been nice to plug in the top 6 (and possibly push Koivu down...Granlund, Grabovski, Koivu). Hell, we would have kick the tires on a guy like Filppula when he was available (again, top 6 and swapping out Granlund and Koivu). Derek Roy might have had some chemistry with Poms. Or Mike Riberio. Take a gamble on a guy like Burmistrov to work with Granlund. How about Vermette in a year?


I'm sorry, I thought we were going to have an intelligent conversation. If you cant find atleast 10 names on that list that dont play center, you probably shouldnt continue.

Since you seem to be fond of making lists, would you be willing to make a few more for us?

- List the names of centers with more assists than Koivu. The Idea is to find a guy to play with shoot first guys like Parise and Pominville right? Why would you base a list off of purely goal scoring?

- List the names of centers with more points than Koivu. If the major knock on Koivu is that he doesnt score enough points, then getting a guy who scores more points should be the main focus, no?

- Now that you have the 2 lists above, list all of the centers that the Wild could even hope to acquire.


Look, The Wild absolutely need another quality center and I dont think anybody would complain if the find somebody better than Koivu, Its just most of us realize that its not near as easy as you think it is.

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Old
01-06-2014, 01:25 AM
  #206
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Originally Posted by thestonedkoala View Post
Long post inserted here
Your list is a bunch of ********.

Most of those guys don't even play C.

Koivu is not at all a problem on this team, and he is not going anywhere.

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01-06-2014, 05:00 AM
  #207
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This thread is hilarious. That is all.

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01-06-2014, 05:11 AM
  #208
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This thread is absolute gold. How to troll 101.

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01-06-2014, 08:28 AM
  #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thestonedkoala View Post
So, just assists? Let's see how Cooke does on the top 6 with guys like Poms, Parise, Granlund and Nino and top pairing for PP time and see how many assists he can get



Shouldn't be too hard to find a guy that can push Koivu down. Grabovski would fit well in the top 6. Why we didn't sign him is a mystery. As for 30?

There's more than thirty. Koivu has racked up a lot of assists but that's easy to do when you have top minutes. Here's a list of centers that have more goals than him:

Gibberish about Goals

65 players are ahead of him in goals scored. Some of these are second line and third line centers (as well, some don't play center all that much)...

You'd expect a lot of assists from a guy that is playing the third most minutes for any center in the NHL. The fact that he has only 35 points when guys like Matt Duchene has more points and less time on the ice is bad. I would like to see what a more offensive center would be able to do in Koivu's stead.



Mikael Grabovski would have been nice to plug in the top 6 (and possibly push Koivu down...Granlund, Grabovski, Koivu). Hell, we would have kick the tires on a guy like Filppula when he was available (again, top 6 and swapping out Granlund and Koivu). Derek Roy might have had some chemistry with Poms. Or Mike Riberio. Take a gamble on a guy like Burmistrov to work with Granlund. How about Vermette in a year?
Lists are fun. Here is the list of Centers(actual centers, no Phil Kessel crap) that have more primary points(Goals + First Assists) in the entire NHL.

1 Sidney Crosby 45 P1
2 Ryan Getzlaf 39 P1
3 John Tavares 36 P1
4 Tyler Seguin 36 P1
5 Evgeni Malkin 34 P1
6 Joe Pavelski 33 P1
7 Jonathan Toews 31 P1
8 Matt Duchene 31 P1
9 Joe Thornton 28 P1
10 Mikko Koivu 28 P1

Pretty good company.

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01-06-2014, 08:31 AM
  #210
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Originally Posted by thestonedkoala View Post
So, just assists? Let's see how Cooke does on the top 6 with guys like Poms, Parise, Granlund and Nino and top pairing for PP time and see how many assists he can get
What the heck are you talking about? Its not just assists. You asked if Cooke was a top 6 forward with 15-20 goals. If he was capable of adding the type of assists Koivu does, he absolutely would be.

But he is not capable of that.

Henrik Sedin has broke 20 goals less than Koivu. Is he not a first line center either?

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01-06-2014, 09:01 AM
  #211
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While I can agree with the bolded, can you name 1 player on the roster that you cant say that for?

.
Yes, but no other player on this team is more willing to literally pass away from prime scoring opportunities than our Kaptain. He is the most frustrating to watch, for sure.

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01-06-2014, 09:13 AM
  #212
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Yes, but no other player on this team is more willing to literally pass away from prime scoring opportunities than our Kaptain. He is the most frustrating to watch, for sure.
You made this statement while this team suits up Kyle Brodziak and Keith Ballard on a nightly basis. Not sure about this one.

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01-06-2014, 02:19 PM
  #213
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#mnwild captain Mikko Koivu underwent ankle surgery, will miss at least a month, team announces.
****.

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01-06-2014, 02:37 PM
  #214
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****.
****. AAARGH.


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01-06-2014, 03:00 PM
  #215
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Damn, he'll miss the olympics

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01-06-2014, 03:00 PM
  #216
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You made this statement while this team suits up Kyle Brodziak and Keith Ballard on a nightly basis. Not sure about this one.
Apples and oranges. Neither Brodziak and Ballard have the skill that Koivu has. It's much harder, for me anyways, to get all worked up over a #3/#4 center and #6 defenseman not producing than our #1 center and team captain passing up on prime scoring opportunities.

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01-06-2014, 03:09 PM
  #217
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Besides, some pejorative comments on Koivu have been bare easy, this is not one man game

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01-06-2014, 05:05 PM
  #218
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IMO it doesn't really matter where Koivu ranks compared to other centers in the NHL. What matters is that he's essential to this team and we've seen before just how much better they are with him, and what happens when he goes down. I think there's more reason for optimism this year with more talented depth filling in than in years past, but I think we're all still pretty nervous.

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01-06-2014, 06:36 PM
  #219
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Wuss. Taking the easy way out with just a broken ankle.

Why can't we have a captain who cares, who competes?

I would have liked to see him score out there instead of just setting people up.

Broken ankle...hrrrumph!

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01-06-2014, 06:47 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by Surly Furious View Post
Wuss. Taking the easy way out with just a broken ankle.

Why can't we have a captain who cares, who competes?

I would have liked to see him score out there instead of just setting people up.

Broken ankle...hrrrumph!
Agreed. True leaders would wear skates on their hands and play the puck with their tongue.

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01-06-2014, 07:55 PM
  #221
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Agreed. True leaders would wear skates on their hands and play the puck with their tongue.
Amen. Greg Zanon played on a broken foot, why can't Koivu? Zanon better captain than Koivu, confirmed with link.

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01-06-2014, 08:56 PM
  #222
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Originally Posted by Surly Furious View Post
Wuss. Taking the easy way out with just a broken ankle.

Why can't we have a captain who cares, who competes?

I would have liked to see him score out there instead of just setting people up.

Broken ankle...hrrrumph!
Props to Koivu for playing... surgery implies that it was a pretty bad fracture I think.


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03-14-2014, 03:32 PM
  #223
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Koivu is at the very least a top 20 centermen.

Where do people get the third line C?

This year averaged out to 65 games he would be sitting 21st.

Last year 19th in points.

Two years was .8 ppg missed time. If he had played 75 games at that pace #21 at 82 games at that pace thats good for 14th.

21st in 71 games played.

11th

Add in a faceoffs again in the top 20 the last two years. Percentage wise.
Last year he was top 5 in total wins.
This year in the 22, missed games hurt.

Tied for 12th in PP assists

In the top 5 in TOI.

Of other top centermen only Kesler and Getzlaf average more PK time.

Has a total of 18 PIM. Far less than
Malkin at 52
Backstrom at 46
Those two are not taking the same PIM as
Backes' 87

Cross those up and he is a top 15 Centermen IMO.

People will like who they like but stats do not lie. There is no comprehensive list that will show him out of the top 20. Sure ther are better goal scorers, PKers, more exiting players, one hit wonders this year. Not across the board.

We have two trains of thought here. Koivu is a top 20 Center. Or he is past him prime and will never regrain his top 20 scoring status.

A: we keep him as he is better than people make him out to be

B: No one wants to spend 6.5 mil on a washed up player.

so

C: He will be in a wild uniform for some time.

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03-14-2014, 03:35 PM
  #224
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People get anxious because he doesn't score a lot of goals, which can be a legitimate critique because he does pass up some prime chances to shoot, but it's far, far, far from a tradeable offense.

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03-14-2014, 04:06 PM
  #225
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Finally get TWO centers worth a damn who's abilities are actually deserving of playing in the top 6 and some now want to rake Koivu through the coals for whatever the hell reason.

Makes sense. Those are the same people who will be complaining that they don't have another center that can fill the void if such a move was ever made as well. Love this fan base. Don't ever change.

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