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Trade Thread Part XI: New year...no trades.

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Old
01-07-2014, 01:01 AM
  #401
Kwayry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
These are the facts:

Del Zotto has a cap-hit of $2.55 million. Gardiner 875K.

Both are RFAs this summer. It will be Gardiner's second contract, so he won't be able to command as much as Del Zotto.

Del Zotto is controllable for two more seasons, Gardiner four.

Given all that, Del Zotto would have to be playing a lot better than Gardiner to be worth more, let alone a first as well (again, lolz).

But he isn't. Gardiner is the best possession defenseman on the Leafs and he's not getting babies with offensive zone starts like Del Zotto.
More facts.
DZ is making more money than Gardiner because he has produced more.
DZ has 108 points in 283 NHL games.
Gardiner has 46 points in 129 games.
Where was Gardiner last season when the Leafs needed Dmen? That's right the AHL.
That's the reason for the difference in salary. One has proven production and one has potential and they are the same age.

Even this season, supposedly Gardiner's best and DZ's worst.
Gardiner is producing at 0.285 clip, and DZ is at .265 PPG and that includes games where DZ was playing on his offside.
Gardiner is barely outproducing DZ.

How responsible is each with the puck?
Gardiner: 38 giveaways in 42 games for a 0.90 giveaways/game.
DZ: 20 giveaways in 33 games for 0.61 giveaways/game

So all in all when you stop making babies with Gardiner's skating, you will realize that DZ is the better hockey player. I know this is not a popular opinion around here, but facts are facts.

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01-07-2014, 02:23 AM
  #402
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I don't disagree but that still doesn't alter the fact that I would bet cold, hard cash that Gardiner's VALUE is higher today. Not his quality, which sounds like it should be the same thing, but how much GM's covet him and would be willing to pay to acquire him. It's that simple. DZ is perceived to have some sort of red flags right now, in a situation where people feel he really needs to be moved. Gardiner is perceived to still be on a good development track, trending up and to be available, as a piece to improve his team (Reilly makes him expendable), but by no means a player who needs to be moved.

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01-07-2014, 02:59 AM
  #403
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so Nash for Gaborik+Johansen? Because Gabby's a UFA, so by HF standards he has no trade value.

On a more serious note, as regarding the PHX rumors: I'd love to get a guy like Rob Klinkhammer back in that trade. He's physical, a good skater, rarely takes a penalty, will do a lot of things right and has the best name in the NHL. Perfect 3rd liner, could see him doing well between Hagelin and Callahan. I doubt PHX bites, but anyway...

Klink, Rundblad, 2nd for Girardi+ a little?

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01-07-2014, 04:14 AM
  #404
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Originally Posted by Joey Bones View Post
I don't know if this was mentioned at all but as per Eklund, the Rangers are trying to bring back Marion Gaborik!!

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?p...3&blogger_id=1

Any thoughts? I would say yes if the price was small. He's consistently injured.
I liked Gabby, and he can be a consistent goal scorer and shooting thereat, but right now he's only consistently injured. Can't really justify taking back that salary for what we'd be getting.

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Old
01-07-2014, 04:15 AM
  #405
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Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
The Coyotes are believed to be interested in New York Rangers defenseman Dan Girardi, though word around the League suggests the Rangers aren't willing to deal him at this point in the season, despite interest from multiple teams.

Maloney is also eyeing Florida forwards Scottie Upshall and Tomas Kopecky, both of whom the Panthers are willing to move, for the right price.


http://www.thefourthperiod.com/news/phx140105.html

from Yotes id like: any one of these younger players in a deal: Samuelsson, Lessio, Brown, Murphy, Gromley, Szwarz for Girardi....
The upside with PHX for sure is that they have an excellent "depth chart" at RD.

If G was willing to negotiate with PHX before a trade is made, moving him becomes a lot easier if you get someone like Muprhy coming back. Stone is a decent RD too. Rundblad got so much offensive potential, but on the other hand, if we continue to struggle as much defensively as we have lately, I am less high on him because you gotta be able to support him defensively real well. At least while he is still growing into the NHL game.

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01-07-2014, 04:17 AM
  #406
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Murphy and a high pick would be a great return for Girardi, although, the more I think about, the more I'd like to re-sign him to a 5x5 contract, which I think he would take.

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01-07-2014, 04:47 AM
  #407
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11. As the Michael Del Zotto saga crawls towards its conclusion, wonder if San Jose is a "stealth" team in all of this. Last year, the Sharks scouted him pretty closely as the two teams talked trade (Ryane Clowe was eventually dealt to Manhattan). Couldn't hurt for a young defenceman to learn under Larry Robinson.

12. The Rangers also have a big decision to make on Dan Girardi, who is an unrestricted free agent. Multiple sources believe Anaheim, with legit Stanley Cup aspirations, is interested and he'd be a very nice fit there. Same with Boston, now that Dennis Seidenberg is out. The Bruins want to take a look at internal options, but have a great shot in the weaker East.
http://www.cbc.ca/sports-content/hoc...s-to-fill.html

Both SJ and Anaheim were scouting the game last night. SJ could use some forward depth too.

Anaheim has been a frequent visitor to the Garden. Now we know why. If they have been scouting the Rangers for a while and they have,the Rangers must have made it known Girardi is available.

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01-07-2014, 05:09 AM
  #408
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If both San Jose and Anaheim both want him, the Rangers could easily play the two against each other.

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01-07-2014, 05:19 AM
  #409
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thinking about trying to get Girardi out of our division/conference if we're trading him, I came up with a question. Was there ever a conditional pick added in a trade based on a condition a la "if you trade him back to our division within the next 1.5 years, you'll have to add a 2nd rounder" or something like that? I can't remember. Is this even allowed?

It would be an interesting option in a trade. You'd obviously have to set a "maximum time frame" the clause kicks in, but I could see GMs (and their lawyers) come up with such an idea.

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01-07-2014, 05:23 AM
  #410
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
If both San Jose and Anaheim both want him, the Rangers could easily play the two against each other.
That's the plan. Would absolutely love to get Nieto or Etem back from either, a Dman (Theodore), and a pick.

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01-07-2014, 06:46 AM
  #411
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The Wings have also been scouting the Rangers on a frequent basis. Mark Howe scouts the east for the Wings. Another Wings scout Glenn Merkosky has been at the Garden in recent weeks. The Wings have no righties. Girardi or Stralman.

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01-07-2014, 07:08 AM
  #412
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I can almost imagine how our defense will look like if we are trading DZ, Girardi and Stralman for picks and A prospects. If people are complaining about current defense, what are they going to say after the trade?

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01-07-2014, 07:09 AM
  #413
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Defenders are at a huge premium heading towards the deadline. Fans on this forum like to pretend that their team isn't in need of a defensive upgrade, or that they're okay standing pat. Just wait until Girardi gets dangled and the bidding war starts. You think Anaheim and San Jose, both cup contenders, are going to let each other get Girardi at a bargain bin price? Hell no.

Detroit is up and down this year, but they want to win now. That core is old. Very old. Their window is closing rapidly.


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01-07-2014, 07:10 AM
  #414
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Sad thing is we're a 5 game win streak away from being buyers at the deadline.

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01-07-2014, 07:16 AM
  #415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw2004 View Post
I can almost imagine how our defense will look like if we are trading DZ, Girardi and Stralman for picks and A prospects. If people are complaining about current defense, what are they going to say after the trade?
I'm going to say "oh well, they're re-tooling, had to expect this". Because if we dealt them off, it'd be clear that Sather is okay with losing the season.

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01-07-2014, 07:16 AM
  #416
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Originally Posted by bmw2004 View Post
I can almost imagine how our defense will look like if we are trading DZ, Girardi and Stralman for picks and A prospects. If people are complaining about current defense, what are they going to say after the trade?
Probably that the defense looks worse, but the idea is that soon people will see a better product on the ice as these players develop into NHLers.

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01-07-2014, 07:18 AM
  #417
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If Phoenix wants Girardi, I do him for Samuelsson + Rundblad. Think that's a fair deal.

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01-07-2014, 07:24 AM
  #418
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The Rangers want to trade DZ for another top 4 D. Girardi could bring back another D in the deal. Allen could step in. He didn't look out of place.

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01-07-2014, 07:32 AM
  #419
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Probably that the defense looks worse, but the idea is that soon people will see a better product on the ice as these players develop into NHLers.
We should always think about the worse that can happen. What if some of them will not develope in to NHLers? Then what? I personally consider Girardi as a very good defensement and wouldn't want him to leave the organization. I hope Sather sent Callahan for some really nice package.

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01-07-2014, 07:36 AM
  #420
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Dave Baseggio is the Ducks Director of Professional Scouting. He has been at many games at the Garden recently.

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01-07-2014, 07:37 AM
  #421
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We should always think about the worse that can happen. What if some of them will not develope in to NHLers? Then what? I personally consider Girardi as a very good defensement and wouldn't want him to leave the organization. I hope Sather sent Callahan for some really nice package.
Why is it that we always must assume the worst about prospects, but not about existing players? Why are we not assuming the worst with Girardi? The best players that have come through this team have been kids that were added with our own draft picks, or added as prospects from other teams before they stepped into the NHL. We've had far more success there than we have in investing millions of dollars in aging players.

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01-07-2014, 07:41 AM
  #422
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Why is it that we always must assume the worst about prospects, but not about existing players? Why are we not assuming the worst with Girardi? The best players that have come through this team have been kids that were added with our own draft picks, or added as prospects from other teams before they stepped into the NHL. We've had far more success there than we have in investing millions of dollars in aging players.
Because we are lucky Rangers organization!!!

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01-07-2014, 07:48 AM
  #423
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The Rangers have the 8th best PP. 20.7%. 7th best PK. 85%. Top ten in both special teams. The team is a game above .500. 21-20-3 in 44 games. 2nd worst goals for at even strength. 66. Buffalo is 30th at 47. Arniel has turned the PP around. The top 5 teams in goals for at even strength are Chicago,Anaheim,St.Louis,SJ and Pittsburgh. Top 5 teams in standings. Anaheim. Chicago. St.Louis. Pittsburgh. SJ.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/teamstats.htm...wName=goalsFor


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01-07-2014, 07:51 AM
  #424
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Originally Posted by bmw2004 View Post
We should always think about the worse that can happen. What if some of them will not develope in to NHLers? Then what? I personally consider Girardi as a very good defensement and wouldn't want him to leave the organization. I hope Sather sent Callahan for some really nice package.
You can't run a team standing by the devil you know is better than the one you don't mantra. They need to keep trying new things until they find a successful path to staying competitive and then stick with that until it stops working too.

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01-07-2014, 07:52 AM
  #425
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DZ for Gardiner makes sense--trading a struggling left D for an equally young right D who has his own issues. Then if you move Girardi it's more towards the trade deadline when demand should be at its peak and you have Gardiner a right D replacement already in place--keeping in mind that he's not at Girardi's level.

Just looking at the two eastern division favorites--Boston and Pittsburgh. Hard to imagine Girardi in a Pens uniform but Boston had lost Seidenberg and he's not going to be back this year. That's a big loss for them. Pittsburgh has been decimated all season long by injuries to their defense. Girardi almost never gets injured. It's not just about adding a player who will help you get over the top either--it also means the other team doesn't get him. It can mean winning a round in the playoffs or not and Girardi had almost an hour's worth of TOI in one playoff game a couple years ago against Washington. He's a guy who doesn't get hurt--with plenty of playoff experience and who can play huge amounts of minutes if called upon.

Expand it out to the teams out west--Anaheim wants Girardi--and Los Angeles, San Jose, Chicago, St. Louis, Vancouver won't want Anaheim to have Girardi. Girardi was a Torts guy--plays a Torts style game. There are plenty of good teams he can go to. Trade him too early without offering him around--not likely you're going to make the best deal.

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