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Old
01-15-2014, 08:57 AM
  #201
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I don't know that he will be like Rafalski, but that is who he will have to be like to succeed IMO.
Right..that's what I was thinking.

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01-15-2014, 09:02 AM
  #202
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I don't know that he will be like Rafalski, but that is who he will have to be like to succeed IMO.



That's at the NCAA level though. If he is 170-180 in the NHL (HF has him listed at 161, I've seen other sites say 175), he is going to get abused by the wingers that are 225+ pounds and over six foot. He'll be manhandled in front of the net, destroyed in the corners, and shoved off the puck easily in his own zone. He's going to have to put on some pounds, or be an incredibly strong defensive player to compensate.

His offense may be fine, but his size will be his biggest detriment. That's why I think you put him in the AHL next year to let him show that he can play with some seriously heavy hitters (literally and figuratively). Maybe I am wrong about this though...are NCAA players comparable in size to NHL players? I'm sure there are a bunch that are 6'4", 235lbs, but is he facing guys that big on a regular basis?
He won't be 175 when he makes it to the NHL. He needs some seasoning in the AHL before coming up like you said. Hopefully during this off season and next year he can put on about 15 pounds of muscle/weight and compete with more develop players in the AHL. I didn't say anything about him playing in the NHL next year, just want him to develop properly before he gets here. All smallish defenseman will have problems with big forwards and their forecheck, that's where his positioning, reach, and Hockey IQ need to come in handy. He isn't as small as Kimmo or Gus, but he does need the weight. I actually am not worried, once he gets a professional helping in that regard, he should improve his size.

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01-15-2014, 09:04 AM
  #203
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How tall is he?

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01-15-2014, 09:10 AM
  #204
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5'11" and 170 lbs on Eliteprospects. I could see him being about 5'11"/6' 180 to 185 by the time he gets into the NHL, which isn't too bad. Timonen is 5'10" at 194 lbs. He can gain weight and a bit more conditioning as he goes along.

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01-15-2014, 09:12 AM
  #205
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How tall is he?
taller than some Habs, 5'11"

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01-15-2014, 09:19 AM
  #206
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Lets get a pairing of Morin & Ghost...It'll be hella funny

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01-15-2014, 09:19 AM
  #207
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Enstrom is 5'10" 181. Boyle is 5'11" 190. Rafalski is 5'10" 192. Karlsson is 5'11" 174 (I could see Ghost having better defensive skills than Karlsson).

He just needs to add about 15 to 20 lbs worth of muscle in the next couple of seasons and he should be good to go at the NHL level.

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01-15-2014, 09:19 AM
  #208
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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
5'11" and 170 lbs on Eliteprospects. I could see him being about 5'11"/6' 180 to 185 by the time he gets into the NHL, which isn't too bad. Timonen is 5'10" at 194 lbs. He can gain weight and a bit more conditioning as he goes along.
If he can reach 190 I would be a lot more comfortable. Being 180 and sub six foot is going to be a challenge so he would have to really play at very high level to compensate IMO.

Just out of curiosity, if anyone can find it (I can't find it real quick and I don't have the time ATM to look it up), roughly how many defensemen in the NHL are sub six foot and sub 190?

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01-15-2014, 09:20 AM
  #209
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Karlsson is that small? But the guy is elite offensively. If Ghost is gonna hang at that size, dude better score 50-60 pts

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01-15-2014, 09:22 AM
  #210
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
If he can reach 190 I would be a lot more comfortable. Being 180 and sub six foot is going to be a challenge so he would have to really play at very high level to compensate IMO.

Just out of curiosity, if anyone can find it (I can't find it real quick and I don't have the time ATM to look it up), roughly how many defensemen in the NHL are sub six foot and sub 190?
You can throw Krug up there at 5'9" 181. Spurgeon is 5'9" 168 (Elite prospects).

NHL has Karlsson at 6' 180.

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01-15-2014, 09:25 AM
  #211
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i'd like to have girardi but he's going to be asking for way more than he's worth. typical homer though.

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01-15-2014, 09:26 AM
  #212
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Originally Posted by Hiesenberg View Post
Karlsson is that small? But the guy is elite offensively. If Ghost is gonna hang at that size, dude better score 50-60 pts
Yeah, that's my feeling on him. If he is going to be an NHL regular, he's going to have to be playing at a higher level than if he wasn't so undersized.

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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
You can throw Krug up there at 5'9" 181. Spurgeon is 5'9" 168 (Elite prospects).

NHL has Karlsson at 6' 180.
So not too many, though according to Wikipedia Spurgeon is 185 not 168 so he may not be that far off from the 190 mark. Either way, I think Ghost will need to play at least a year in the AHL before he even sniffs the NHL (unless he is like absolutely dominating or something). Should be interesting, but my expectations for Ghost are not very high at the moment. He has an uphill battle in front of him because of his size. Undersized guys have and can make an impact, but they are behind the eightball from the get-go. I'm sure he has a ton of skill, but I'll be skeptical of him because of his size until he proves me wrong.

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01-15-2014, 09:27 AM
  #213
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
If he can reach 190 I would be a lot more comfortable. Being 180 and sub six foot is going to be a challenge so he would have to really play at very high level to compensate IMO.

Just out of curiosity, if anyone can find it (I can't find it real quick and I don't have the time ATM to look it up), roughly how many defensemen in the NHL are sub six foot and sub 190?
Sami Vatanen - ANA
Torey Krug - BOS
Kris Russell - CAL
John Michael Liles - CAR
Ryan Murphy - CAR
Alex Goglioski - DAL
Andrew Ference - EDM
Brian Campbell - FLR
Jared Spurgeon - MIN
Ryan Ellis - NASH
Chris Connor - PITT
Connor Carrick - WASH
Tobias Enstrom - WINN

I might have missed some, but basically not a lot

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01-15-2014, 09:44 AM
  #214
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Originally Posted by Hiesenberg View Post
Sami Vatanen - ANA
Torey Krug - BOS
Kris Russell - CAL
John Michael Liles - CAR
Ryan Murphy - CAR
Alex Goglioski - DAL
Andrew Ference - EDM
Brian Campbell - FLR
Jared Spurgeon - MIN
Ryan Ellis - NASH
Chris Connor - PITT
Connor Carrick - WASH
Tobias Enstrom - WINN

I might have missed some, but basically not a lot
That's a little more guys, but any of those guys have very good offensive abilities, hopefully Ghost can reach those. Didn't realize Campbell was that small. I always thought he was a bigger dude.

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01-15-2014, 09:45 AM
  #215
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Campbell I think is 6'.

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01-15-2014, 09:45 AM
  #216
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There are a few big guys he plays against in the NCAA... he practices vs Eli Lichtenwald all the time and he is 6'6 and 240 pounds.

But not as many who are also good hockey players compared to the pros.

The biggest forwards on most teams seem to be 6'2 to 6'3 and 200-220 pounds... but there are not many of them.

Biggest 3 forwards on teams Ghost plays regularly:

Bowling Green: Adam Berkle, 6'3 and 200, Matthew Pohlkamp, 6'1 and 195, Camden Wojtala, 6'2 and 190.
Brown: Garnet Hathaway, 6'2 and 215, Zack Pryzbek, 6'4 and 210, Joe Prescott, 6'2 and 195.
Colgate: Tim Harrison, 6'3 and 200, Kyle Baun, 6'2 and 205, Michael Borkowski, 6'0 and 180.
Connecticut: Cody Sharib, 6'2 and 220, Brant Harris, 6'1 and 205, Trevor Gerling, 6'0 and 205.
Cornell: Josh McCarron, 6'2 and 230, Christian Hilbrich, 6'6 and 220, Brian Ferlin, 6'2 and 205.
Darmouth: Brandon McNally, 6'2 and 220, Brad Schierhorn, 6'3 and 205, Jesse Beamish, 6'2 and 205.
Harvard: Brian Hart, 6'3 and 215, David Valek, 6'2 and 210, Jimmy Vesey 6'1 and 200.
Lake Superior: Matt Johnson, 6'2 and 205, Alex Globke, 6'2 ad 205, Colin Campbell, 6'1 and 200.
Penn State: Zach Saar, 6'4 and 220, Casey Bailey, 6'3 and 200, Curtis Loik 6'1 and 205.
Princeton: Jack Berger, 6'3 and 220, Ryan Siiro, 6'2 and 220, Eric Carlson, 6'3 and 215.
Quinnipiac: Bryce Van Brabant, 6'3 and 210, Jordan Samuels-Thomas, 6'4 and 190, Tim Clifton, 6'1 and 185.
RPI: Michael Zalewski, 6'2 and 210, Milos Bubela, 6'2 and 190, Mark McGowan, 6'1 and 210.
St. Cloud: Cory Thorson, 6'2 and 205, Nic Dowd, 6'2 and 200, Jonny Brodzinski, 6'1 and 200.
St. Lawrence: Woodruff Hudson, 6'3 and 215, Gunnar Hughes, 6'1 and 205, Chris Martin, 6'1 and 200.
Yale: John Hayden, 6'3 and 210, Frankie DiChiara, 6'2 and 220, Kenny Agostino, 6'1 and 205.

And as you can imagine only about half of these guys are good hockey players to boot... and like 10~ who have a shot at the NHL.

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01-15-2014, 09:47 AM
  #217
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i'd like to have girardi but he's going to be asking for way more than he's worth. typical homer though.
Well some think if you get Girardi, Coburn might become expendable. Remember the Flyers were in it till the end with Scuderi last year too. They want to get a replacement for Coburn it seems for them to be comfortable trading him away.

Girardi might end up getting anywhere between 5-6 million for 6-7 years. If it's in the 5 million range for 6 years, I wouldn't mind that deal at all.


What I would try to do is grab Girardi, and then try to sell Coburn to the Oilers for 2015's first rounder.

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01-15-2014, 09:55 AM
  #218
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The current roster is a perfect example of an overpaid slow Veteran defense that is getting exposed on a regular basis.
They are supposed to play a solid game based on positioning but are not getting the job done any better than the average less experienced AHL callup/fringe NHL defenseman... but cost more money and take away a spot form a younger guy who may have a future with the club.

If one of Morin/Hagg/Ghost reports to camp in great shape and earns a spot on the roster next season I don't see why we don't keep him there and let him learn the game while playing alongside a Veteran pro. Size or age are secondary and this franchise is at least a couple of years away from contending anyway.


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01-15-2014, 10:02 AM
  #219
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Originally Posted by Appleyard View Post
There are a few big guys he plays against in the NCAA... he practices vs Eli Lichtenwald all the time and he is 6'6 and 240 pounds.

But not as many who are also good hockey players compared to the pros.

The biggest forwards on most teams seem to be 6'2 to 6'3 and 200-220 pounds... but there are not many of them.

Biggest 3 forwards on teams Ghost plays regularly:

Bowling Green: Adam Berkle, 6'3 and 200, Matthew Pohlkamp, 6'1 and 195, Camden Wojtala, 6'2 and 190.
Brown: Garnet Hathaway, 6'2 and 215, Zack Pryzbek, 6'4 and 210, Joe Prescott, 6'2 and 195.
Colgate: Tim Harrison, 6'3 and 200, Kyle Baun, 6'2 and 205, Michael Borkowski, 6'0 and 180.
Connecticut: Cody Sharib, 6'2 and 220, Brant Harris, 6'1 and 205, Trevor Gerling, 6'0 and 205.
Cornell: Josh McCarron, 6'2 and 230, Christian Hilbrich, 6'6 and 220, Brian Ferlin, 6'2 and 205.
Darmouth: Brandon McNally, 6'2 and 220, Brad Schierhorn, 6'3 and 205, Jesse Beamish, 6'2 and 205.
Harvard: Brian Hart, 6'3 and 215, David Valek, 6'2 and 210, Jimmy Vesey 6'1 and 200.
Lake Superior: Matt Johnson, 6'2 and 205, Alex Globke, 6'2 ad 205, Colin Campbell, 6'1 and 200.
Penn State: Zach Saar, 6'4 and 220, Casey Bailey, 6'3 and 200, Curtis Loik 6'1 and 205.
Princeton: Jack Berger, 6'3 and 220, Ryan Siiro, 6'2 and 220, Eric Carlson, 6'3 and 215.
Quinnipiac: Bryce Van Brabant, 6'3 and 210, Jordan Samuels-Thomas, 6'4 and 190, Tim Clifton, 6'1 and 185.
RPI: Michael Zalewski, 6'2 and 210, Milos Bubela, 6'2 and 190, Mark McGowan, 6'1 and 210.
St. Cloud: Cory Thorson, 6'2 and 205, Nic Dowd, 6'2 and 200, Jonny Brodzinski, 6'1 and 200.
St. Lawrence: Woodruff Hudson, 6'3 and 215, Gunnar Hughes, 6'1 and 205, Chris Martin, 6'1 and 200.
Yale: John Hayden, 6'3 and 210, Frankie DiChiara, 6'2 and 220, Kenny Agostino, 6'1 and 205.

And as you can imagine only about half of these guys are good hockey players to boot... and like 10~ who have a shot at the NHL.
Yeah, that's what I was expecting. Because of his size, it is really hard to gauge his abilities at the NCAA level. Being 30-40 pounds lighter and an inch or two shorter in the NCAA is a lot different than being 30-40 (or more) pounds lighter and an inch or two (or more) shorter in the NHL.

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01-15-2014, 10:07 AM
  #220
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Also if the Flyers are making a stong push for the playoffs, one player I would love on Couts wing is Ray Whitney out of Dallas. If they continue to struggle they might look to send some players off. Whitney might be 142 years old, but man he can play the game.

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01-15-2014, 10:08 AM
  #221
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Also if the Flyers are making a stong push for the playoffs, one player I would love on Couts wing is Ray Whitney out of Dallas. If they continue to struggle they might look to send some players off. Whitney might be 142 years old, but man he can play the game.
I'd be all over that, but I'm sure ten other teams would be too. I imagine you're looking at a relatively high price.

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01-15-2014, 10:09 AM
  #222
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Yeah, that's what I was expecting. Because of his size, it is really hard to gauge his abilities at the NCAA level. Being 30-40 pounds lighter and an inch or two shorter in the NCAA is a lot different than being 30-40 (or more) pounds lighter and an inch or two (or more) shorter in the NHL.
Yeh, Colgates 3rd biggest forward is pretty much my size! 1 inch taller and a few pounds lighter... that is ridiculous considering in most sports I have played I am considered average to undersized.

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01-15-2014, 10:10 AM
  #223
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I'd be all over that, but I'm sure ten other teams would be too. I imagine you're looking at a relatively high price.
One hope would be his asking price isn't all that high because he hasn't been playing out of this world for a guy who is his age. His price tag is pretty steep too. No 1st rounder or top prospects for him, but wouldn't mind something like a 2nd rounder+Tye Mcginn deal. Something along those lines.

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01-15-2014, 10:23 AM
  #224
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Whitney has lost basically all of his scoring touch. His numbers may not look that bad in Dallas, but that's also because Dallas is one of very best offensive teams in the league. At this point, he's not enough of an upgrade on what they currently put on that third line (Read, Downie, Raffl) to justify trading much for two months of him.

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01-15-2014, 10:28 AM
  #225
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One hope would be his asking price isn't all that high because he hasn't been playing out of this world for a guy who is his age. His price tag is pretty steep too. No 1st rounder or top prospects for him, but wouldn't mind something like a 2nd rounder+Tye Mcginn deal. Something along those lines.
If enough teams are in on him, the price might be a first. Overpayment at the deadline is the norm. I wouldn't give up a first for him, but the 2nd+McGinn might be doable. Hell if Downie isn't in the plans for next season might as well think about offering a 2nd+Downie or Downie+McGinn or something. Throw Whitney on the third line, maybe give him some PP time. Go after Vanek or something in the offseason. Who knows.

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