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[EDM/LAK] Oilers acquire Ben Scrivens for 3rd round pick

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01-15-2014, 04:58 PM
  #226
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Originally Posted by oiLowe View Post
This has nothing to do with MacT. It has to do with the overwhelming evidence that Dubnyk is not now nor ever will be a serviceable NHL goaltender.
3 years of being a serviceable NHL goaltender surely suggests that you might be wrong?

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01-15-2014, 05:04 PM
  #227
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Originally Posted by djdub View Post
That's not an exaggeration at all.

I didn't know this team was 1 Ben Scrivens away from playing GOOD DEFENCE.

MacT has you all drinking the kool-aid. These moves do nothing for us, Scrivens will be left out to dry just as much as Dubnyk and Bryz are and he won't succeed just as the two former haven't.

Yeah Dubnyk has let in more than a few bad goals this year, but under Kreuger he was playing like a Legit starter. Now he's the worst in the league? How does that happen? You guys think it has absolutely nothing to do with our team, this years short comings are all on Dubnyk?

Let me ask you this, how many more games do you think we would have won if we had Scrivens starting over Dubnyk at the start of the season?
A dozen, maybe? Dubnyk has let in some incredibly weak goals, especially early in the season, in those close games when we still had a chance at the playoffs.

I'm not justifying our defense, but Dubnyk has been that bad.

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01-15-2014, 05:04 PM
  #228
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Originally Posted by djdub View Post

Keep believing that this team stinks because of goal tending.
It's part of the issue, no doubt about it. Scrivens and Bryzgalov is a significant upgrade over Dubnyk and Labarbera, problem is it was far too late before either of these moves were made. Defense is still this team's biggest issue though.

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01-15-2014, 05:06 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IV XIV XCI View Post
For those who defend Dubnyk:

He has some good traits and he has some serious flaws. The team and the defence in front of him in Edmonton did not do much to help cover the flaws. He was left exposed often and because of that his flaws were amplified.

I do believe that on a better defensive team, like Nashville, he will prove to be a steady option for them. Similar in the way Conklin seemed like a serviceable goalie when he went from Edmonton to Detroit. The job gets easier for goalies when their D prevent more grade-A scoring chances.

All that said, Dubnyk on his own is still a goalie with too many fundamental holes in his game to be a guy to carry a team. He slides out of position, he doesnt battle hard enough to see through screens, cant handle rebounds or anticipate fast enough on odd man rushes. He gets exposed on both the blocker and catcher side on a regular basis. He had a long leash (giraffe!) here for the better part of a decade. He had no pressure on him (Happy-boozing at 39! and Lolbarbera!) and couldn't help us win. In many games he helped us lose.

This day had to come eventually and he was unlikely going to factor in any BOLD moves so moving him now gives us more time to see what Scrivens is made of before his contract is to be negotiated.

Any Bold moves will come when other teams are more desperate - trade deadline, draft, before free agency etc.

Good G.M.'ing
Don't forget how often he was beat 5-hole. I've never seen such a big goalie make himself so small in the net. CuJo looked a lot bigger, for crying out loud.

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01-15-2014, 05:13 PM
  #230
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Shuffle those deck chairs..

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01-15-2014, 05:15 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by syz View Post
Shuffle those deck chairs..
Isn't that the same premise for any trade?

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01-15-2014, 05:16 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by syz View Post
Shuffle those deck chairs..
sometimes it helps to get different people in the room

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01-15-2014, 05:20 PM
  #233
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Originally Posted by bozwell View Post
sometimes it helps to get different people in the room
I think the Edmonton Oilers have done a great job of proving that wrong over the last 8-9 years.

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01-15-2014, 05:22 PM
  #234
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People want trades and change and then ***** when it happens. What are you seriously expecting? Weren't many of us tired of the game to game soft goals?

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01-15-2014, 05:23 PM
  #235
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Interesting observation between two goalies:

Goalie A:
Rookie NA Pro Season at 23 (AHL) - 47GP-2.48 GAA/.924 Pct.
Sophomore Pro Season at 24 (AHL) - 36GP-2.24/.926 Pct. (+ 5GP at NHL 1.95/.902 Pct)
Third Year Pro at 25 (NHL) - 20GP-2.49/.915 (+ 4GP in AHL 1.73/.949)
4th year Pro at 26 (NHL) - 22GP-3.25/.889
5th year at 27 relegated to third stringer gets traded for a 2nd round pick
Totals up to pre-trade year (aged 23-26):
AHL - 87GP-2.35/.926
NHL - 48GP-2.83/.897


Goalie B (Scrivens):
Rookie NA Pro Season at 24 (AHL) - 33GP-2.33 GAA/.924 Pct. (+13GP ECHL 2.23/.938)
Sophomore Pro Season at 25 (AHL) - 39GP-2.04/.926 Pct. (+ 12GP at NHL 3.13/.902 Pct)
Third Year Pro at 26 (NHL) - 20GP-2.69/.915 (+ 22GP in AHL 2.22/.917)
4th year at 27 hot rookie start by third stringer makes him expendable and traded for a 3rd round pick.
Totals up to pre-trade year (aged 24-26):
AHL - 94GP-2.18/.923
NHL - 32GP-2.86/.910

Note: goalie A put up 1.70GAA/.933 save percentage in 38 games in his 27 year old season post trade as he hadn't played before the trade. Scrivens is currently in his 27 year old season with 19GP-1.97/.931 albeit with the original team.

Hint: Darryl Sutter was involved in both trade scenarios.


Last edited by bone: 01-15-2014 at 06:08 PM. Reason: Corrected mistake in Scrivens 3rd year AHL numbers.
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01-15-2014, 05:25 PM
  #236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bone View Post
Interesting observation between two goalies:

Goalie A:
Rookie NA Pro Season at 23 (AHL) - 47GP-2.48 GAA/.924 Pct.
Sophomore Pro Season at 24 (AHL) - 36GP-2.24/.926 Pct. (+ 5GP at NHL 1.95/.902 Pct)
Third Year Pro at 25 (NHL) - 20GP-2.49/.915 (+ 4GP in AHL 1.73/.949)
4th year Pro at 26 (NHL) - 22GP-3.25/.889
5th year at 27 relegated to third stringer gets traded
Totals up to pre-trade year (aged 23-26):
AHL - 87GP-2.35/.926
NHL - 48GP-2.83/.897


Goalie B (Scrivens):
Rookie NA Pro Season at 24 (AHL) - 33GP-2.33 GAA/.924 Pct. (+13GP ECHL 2.23/.938)
Sophomore Pro Season at 25 (AHL) - 39GP-2.04/.926 Pct. (+ 12GP at NHL 3.13/.902 Pct)
Third Year Pro at 26 (NHL) - 20GP-2.49/.915 (+ 4GP in AHL 1.73/.949)
Totals up to pre-trade year (aged 24-26):
AHL - 94GP-2.18/.923
NHL - 32GP-2.86/.910

Note: goalie A put up 1.70GAA/.933 save percentage in 38 games in his 27 year old season post trade as he hadn't played before the trade. Scrivens is currently in his 27 year old season with 19GP-1.97/.931 albeit with the original team.
If Goalie A is Thomas you need to explain what Thomas did to change up his style when he came here to Europe

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01-15-2014, 05:26 PM
  #237
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I don't think Scrivens is starter material, but then again neither is Dubnyk. At least with Scrivens there is a chance that he might gel with the team. New scenery.

The real measure of these deals will be how well Hendricks plays for us.


Last edited by Mr Positive: 01-15-2014 at 05:26 PM. Reason: spelling
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01-15-2014, 05:27 PM
  #238
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I like that we added Scrivens. I don't expect him to play nearly as well behind the Oilers as he did the Kings, but he will be an upgrade on Dubnyk.

What do you guys think our net looks like next year? Unless Scrivens comes in and plays lights out better than Bryz I would like to see both of them stay, a decent 1A 1B combo. I don't think either goalie deserves legit starter money.

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Old
01-15-2014, 05:28 PM
  #239
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Originally Posted by syz View Post
Shuffle those deck chairs..
There may be some merit to that statement, that said, Hendricks I believe has more hits in his last full season than any Oiler forward has had in like the last 6 seasons.

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01-15-2014, 05:32 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by djdub View Post
MacT has you all drinking the kool-aid. These moves do nothing for us, Scrivens will be left out to dry just as much as Dubnyk and Bryz are and he won't succeed just as the two former haven't.

Yeah Dubnyk has let in more than a few bad goals this year, but under Kreuger he was playing like a Legit starter. Now he's the worst in the league? How does that happen? You guys think it has absolutely nothing to do with our team, this years short comings are all on Dubnyk?
Agreed that Dubnyk was not solely at fault for the Oilers current position.
Agreed the Bryzgalov is playing at a similar level to Dubnyk.

How about taking a look at the trade this way?

Dubnyk is a UFA. Oilers have decided that he's not going to be back here going forward. They want to try another goaltender.

Enter Scrivens, also a UFA. If Scrivens performs well, they re-sign him.

If Scrivens performs poorly, they don't resign him, they lose a 3rd round pick for the opportunity to try him out. But otherwise, they would be in a similar position with Dubnyk being a UFA.

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01-15-2014, 05:33 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by bozwell View Post
If Goalie A is Thomas you need to explain what Thomas did to change up his style when he came here to Europe
Not Thomas. Thomas was a weird cat that sucked in NA to start, goes overseas came back and made a career once in his thirties. Goalie A started off pretty decent, just didn't get the chance until traded.

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01-15-2014, 05:35 PM
  #242
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Originally Posted by bozwell View Post
If Goalie A is Thomas you need to explain what Thomas did to change up his style when he came here to Europe
Not Thomas.

Kiprusoff.


EDIT: BTW the 2nd rounder turned out to be Marc-Edouard Vlasic.

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01-15-2014, 05:39 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by t0mf00lery View Post
Not Thomas.

Kiprusoff.
You got it. Doubt it happens, but if it turns into a Kiprusoff like career, nice trade!

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01-15-2014, 05:42 PM
  #244
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Originally Posted by bone View Post
Not Thomas. Thomas was a weird cat that sucked in NA to start, goes overseas came back and made a career once in his thirties. Goalie A started off pretty decent, just didn't get the chance until traded.
Kiprusoff?

Beaten to it while trying to see what the Flames traded the Sharks.

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01-15-2014, 05:48 PM
  #245
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
People want trades and change and then ***** when it happens. What are you seriously expecting? Weren't many of us tired of the game to game soft goals?
Agreed. After sort-of watching last night's game, I thought "how much longer can this go on before they do something? Any kind of move." I was pleasantly surprised to see these trades, even if they do seem somewhat lateral.

Hopefully Hendricks improves the bottom 6. And hopefully Scrivens plays well enough to earn a contract with us.

Dubnyk might find his mojo and turn into a decent starter but I wouldn't bet on it. And the team has had plenty of time to evaluate him. I don't think it's any surprise that they were not going to bring him back next season. Frustrating to put that much time into developing a player to trade him for so little but Dubnyk pretty much forced the Oilers to trade him with his play this season.

As for the 3rd rounder, doesn't bother me at all. I don't overvalue that the way others do.

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01-15-2014, 06:02 PM
  #246
Tw0Shoes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bone View Post
Interesting observation between two goalies:

Goalie A:
Rookie NA Pro Season at 23 (AHL) - 47GP-2.48 GAA/.924 Pct.
Sophomore Pro Season at 24 (AHL) - 36GP-2.24/.926 Pct. (+ 5GP at NHL 1.95/.902 Pct)
Third Year Pro at 25 (NHL) - 20GP-2.49/.915 (+ 4GP in AHL 1.73/.949)
4th year Pro at 26 (NHL) - 22GP-3.25/.889
5th year at 27 relegated to third stringer gets traded for a 2nd round pick
Totals up to pre-trade year (aged 23-26):
AHL - 87GP-2.35/.926
NHL - 48GP-2.83/.897


Goalie B (Scrivens):
Rookie NA Pro Season at 24 (AHL) - 33GP-2.33 GAA/.924 Pct. (+13GP ECHL 2.23/.938)
Sophomore Pro Season at 25 (AHL) - 39GP-2.04/.926 Pct. (+ 12GP at NHL 3.13/.902 Pct)
Third Year Pro at 26 (NHL) - 20GP-2.49/.915 (+ 4GP in AHL 1.73/.949)
4th year at 27 hot rookie start by third stringer makes him expendable and traded for a 3rd round pick.
Totals up to pre-trade year (aged 24-26):
AHL - 94GP-2.18/.923
NHL - 32GP-2.86/.910

Note: goalie A put up 1.70GAA/.933 save percentage in 38 games in his 27 year old season post trade as he hadn't played before the trade. Scrivens is currently in his 27 year old season with 19GP-1.97/.931 albeit with the original team.

Hint: Darryl Sutter was involved in both trade scenarios.
You definitely copied Kipper's 3rd year pro stats into Scriven's stat line. He played 22 ahl games that year, not 4.

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01-15-2014, 06:04 PM
  #247
bone
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Originally Posted by Tw0Shoes View Post
You definitely copied Kipper's 3rd year pro stats into Scriven's stat line. He played 22 ahl games that year, not 4.
Sorry, tried copying to make them to look the same, and missed that change. The totals should still be right as they were calculated separately in a spreadsheet and I'll update the original.

Weird how their first three years (2 in AHL and 1 in NHL) have the exact same save percentage.


Last edited by bone: 01-15-2014 at 06:10 PM.
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01-15-2014, 06:15 PM
  #248
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I guess we'll have to see with this guy
At least he's played under Eakins before and he's never been under .900 at any level
For now it is a big meh in regards to both trades

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01-15-2014, 06:18 PM
  #249
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Originally Posted by bone View Post
Sorry, tried copying to make them to look the same, and missed that change. The totals should still be right as they were calculated separately in a spreadsheet and I'll update the original.

Weird how their first three years (2 in AHL and 1 in NHL) have the exact same save percentage.
Ridiculously similar. I just couldn't believe that their 3rd year pro was EXACTLY the same though hahaha. Thanks for posting it

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01-15-2014, 06:19 PM
  #250
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Biggest winner in all these trades? Dubnyk.

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