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Between DD, Eller, and Briere, who would you keep?

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:05 PM
  #101
Winter Eclipse
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Someone called him a 1st line 70 point center?
Isn't he? I've heard that:

(1) the first 19 games of the season don't count as they're an "anomaly"
- removing those 19 games makes him a 70 point player

(2) we're weak on the wings; Galchenyuk, Eller, and Briere can compensate for that
- if we're moving 3 centers to the wing, including our 3rd overall draft pick, I would hope it would be for a #1 center, no?

So is he not implicitly a #1 70 point center?

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:09 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by HabsRockBruinsChoke View Post
These centers obviously get paid like a top 2 center (Eller will demand) and wants to be a top 2 center but can't be the best top 2 since Pleks and Chuck will fill those roles.

If you could keep one and send two away, who would you keep?

I would keep DD. Yeah he's been slow in the beginning but he produces reasonably for his salary without being on the PP and is quick like a true hab.

Eller needs to go, I feel like I'm the only person here that always thought he sucked and his size (that he doesn't physically use) is slowing him down from being an agile top 2 center. He stated that he wants to be a top 2 so if we keep him he will demand a top 2 salary but not produce like one. His point/goal production doesn't increase by year and you can blame his wingers but he got plenty of opportunity this year and should have no excuses on how he barely has any points in the most recent games.

Eller sucks, he is the last of the 3 on my list, at least Briere is a post-season player like Price, Eller just sucks all the way.

Between Briere and DD, I'd keep DD after Briere complained about how he wants out, but still they are similar in a lot of aspects.



Sorry if this thread loosely translated into an "Eller sucks" thread but I really can't stand how overrated the guy is. His size dont mean jack s*** and we are not gona pay him a DD contract $3.5mil for 5 years or so when we know who our top 2 are going to be. Yeah Galchenyuk may produce around the similar pace as him but hes not even playing at his natural position and hes not even 20.





Plus I just wanted to state that no one agreed when I stated earlier in the season that "Eller is producing like crazy right now, lets trade him for as much value as we can get" and look at you now, all teary and complaining about how this team isn't good enough and not being resource efficient.


Anyways, who would you keep?
Holy crap Batman, this guy must be the most ignorant separatist ever! Eller overrated? Considering what he is playing with and the short-leash he's had to deal with since his debut with the Habs, he is being underrated by many if anything. He's one of our best forward PKer and still has tons of time to refine his game. We've already seen how he can dominate a game, but he, just like Galchenyuk, are constantly being shuffled in the lineup and not given time to develop into a solid role with static linemates. All this happening, while DD is given our best producing forwards to surround him even when he was on a 40 games slump dating back from last season. This thread is a joke, I hope a mod closes this. These kinds of fans ruin the image of our fanbase as a whole, I bet he's one of those posters on the trade forums making nonsensical trade proposals and making us look like ******** fans taht know nothing about hockey.

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:13 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
Not quite sure how Eller got the label of being overrated. I don't think many have ever predicted or claimed him to be a 1st line center or even a projected 1st line center. The consensus seems to be that he's got 2nd line centre upside as a two way guy, probably excelling a bit more in the defensive side of things than offensive. I don't think that's out of line with the popular opinion around here, and I don't think it's out of touch with the reality of him as a player. So exactly how is he overrated?
That's a very conservative opinion now.

PLEKANEC 2.0!!!!
TRADE PLEKY, WE HAVE ELLER!!!
60+ POINT PLAYER!!!
I KNOW HE'S 24 BUT GIVE HIM TIME, HE'S NOT SHOWN HIS TRUE POTENTIAL YET!!

That doesn't exist? All stuff I read about him(and more than once) so yes, he is overrated. I also heard some weird as **** about DD too so I think habs fans are just wacko in general.

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:15 PM
  #104
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Only choices should be Eller or Eller or Eller and the only answer should be Eller

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:16 PM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winter Eclipse View Post
Isn't he? I've heard that:

(1) the first 19 games of the season don't count as they're an "anomaly"
- removing those 19 games makes him a 70 point player

(2) we're weak on the wings; Galchenyuk, Eller, and Briere can compensate for that
- if we're moving 3 centers to the wing, including our 3rd overall draft pick, I would hope it would be for a #1 center, no?

So is he not implicitly a #1 70 point center?
W.E. Are we really going to go into a debate about something like this? With all due respect, you're just taking random opinions thrown out and bunching them together then assuming something based on it. I get what you're saying but why you want to have discussion is beyond me. Seems like we'd be discussing something entirely ridiculous as 99.9999% of people don't think DD is a 70 point center.

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:22 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
That's a very conservative opinion now.

PLEKANEC 2.0!!!!
TRADE PLEKY, WE HAVE ELLER!!!
60+ POINT PLAYER!!!
I KNOW HE'S 24 BUT GIVE HIM TIME, HE'S NOT SHOWN HIS TRUE POTENTIAL YET!!

That doesn't exist? All stuff I read about him(and more than once) so yes, he is overrated. I also heard some weird as **** about DD too so I think habs fans are just wacko in general.
I could pretty much copy/paste your last reply to winter-eclipse here. Quoting outlier opinions doesn't get either of you anywhere.

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01-18-2014, 05:29 PM
  #107
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Eller is way more versatile, younger, currently costs less and has more upside in his overall game.. I don't even know why this would ever be a debate lol.. He could be the perfect third line centre behind Galch and Pleks.. And yes Eller has been overrated at times but doesn't mean his game isn't of more value than DD/Briere


Briere is at tail end of his career I don't really like to criticize him but it's painfully obvious you don't keep him over Eller given the age and the way he's played


DD works when you give him the two best wingers on the team, most of the PP and offensive zone starts.. Give DD the same defensive zone starts and wingers as Eller and you'll see next to no results and a score tilted the other way. He has been playing decent hockey lately though so it's not fair to bash him it's just not fair to compare offensive numbers.

If you consider Chuckie to be the future of this team down the middle than obviously Eller has more value to this team if you build him as one of the better third line centres in the game that can move up when you need it.

I don't see Pleks going anywhere.

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:29 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
That's a very conservative opinion now.

PLEKANEC 2.0!!!!
TRADE PLEKY, WE HAVE ELLER!!!
60+ POINT PLAYER!!!
I KNOW HE'S 24 BUT GIVE HIM TIME, HE'S NOT SHOWN HIS TRUE POTENTIAL YET!!

That doesn't exist? All stuff I read about him(and more than once) so yes, he is overrated. I also heard some weird as **** about DD too so I think habs fans are just wacko in general.
The thing is, there is as more reaction to said posts than anything else - everytime someone says something stupid and hyperbolic about Eller's performances, another person runs with it to scream about how overrated Eller is and how he's a career third liner at best. There's as many people here who compare Eller to Jan Bulis as there are those who claim he's going to explode to a PPG player, so you are being a bit disingenius.

As of right now, Eller looks more like Bolland than he does Sundin or Forsberg or any other ridiculous comparison, but considering half this board is jealous of the Leafs for having Bolland, you should understand where some of the overrating comes from.

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:30 PM
  #109
Winter Eclipse
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
W.E. Are we really going to go into a debate about something like this? With all due respect, you're just taking random opinions thrown out and bunching them together then assuming something based on it. I get what you're saying but why you want to have discussion is beyond me. Seems like we'd be discussing something entirely ridiculous as 99.9999% of people don't think DD is a 70 point center.
No, the impression I get is that "99.9999% of people don't think DD is a 70 point center" when confronted with the implicit conclusions of their earlier arguments, but yeah, the argument goes round and round and goes nowhere.

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Old
01-18-2014, 05:50 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
I could pretty much copy/paste your last reply to winter-eclipse here. Quoting outlier opinions doesn't get either of you anywhere.
I won't drag this on but if you can't see the difference, dunno what to say.

I don't agree with the OP whatsoever but I'm surprised the thread even made it this far. Any thread not praising king Eller usually gets locked before page 1 is done. People usually go bat**** crazy if someone says one negative thing about the guy.

From what I read on this board(and often), he's overrated. Doesn't mean I don't like him. If you want to compare it with any DD discussion, be my guest, I consider it irrelevant but if you chose to the love/hate ratio wouldn't really support your argument. The bias level would be mind boggling as well.

There's very little else I have to say about it. I like the guy a lot. I like his personality and I like his game. I want him to be a hab for a long time. I just have a different opinion than other people but to be fair, I'm not bashing the guy in PGTs or creating Lars Eller threads when he has a bad game. I think he's not as good as people think. People can't expect everyone to think the exact same can they? If everyone said the exact same thing, what's the point of even discussing to begin with?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
The thing is, there is as more reaction to said posts than anything else - everytime someone says something stupid and hyperbolic about Eller's performances, another person runs with it to scream about how overrated Eller is and how he's a career third liner at best. There's as many people here who compare Eller to Jan Bulis as there are those who claim he's going to explode to a PPG player, so you are being a bit disingenius.

As of right now, Eller looks more like Bolland than he does Sundin or Forsberg or any other ridiculous comparison, but considering half this board is jealous of the Leafs for having Bolland, you should understand where some of the overrating comes from.
I'm okay with Bolland type upside but I don't see them as similar players really. Still, to avoid going in circles about nothing that's good with me. I heard Mikko Koivu a lot though and I wonder what people are smoking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winter Eclipse View Post
No, the impression I get is that "99.9999% of people don't think DD is a 70 point center" when confronted with the implicit conclusions of their earlier arguments, but yeah, the argument goes round and round and goes nowhere.
You still implied it all on your own.

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Old
01-18-2014, 07:15 PM
  #111
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Eller can't even demand over 3.5m for the way he is playing. He is playing like a 3rd line center at best. If he elevates his play then he can demand more but it isn't looking good for him right now. Obviously i would take Eller over DD and Briere. Also Eller will be looking for a 2-3 year deal no way he asks for 5 years at like 3.5-4m...more like 2 or 3 yrs at 3m.

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Old
01-18-2014, 07:18 PM
  #112
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Who would select Brière first.

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01-18-2014, 07:29 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Hawkguy View Post
We can tank again and hopefully by the time we're ready to compete, Pacioretty and PK peace out.

Desharnais isn't one of the best players on the team. But when whe have wingers named Gionta, Bourque, Moen, and Prust playing minutes in the Top-9... Desharnais isn't a problem.

I guess having another player like Galchenyuk would be pretty awesome, but I'm not a pro-tanker. I don't want to watch a team purposely lose.
What does tanking have to do with this? Dealing DD would IMPROVE the team now. This is not a tank move dude.

Again, our play drops right around the time that MT starts giving him those minutes with Gallagher. Not coincidence. Eller gets relegated to 3rd line scrub with alternating linemates but DD gets all the PP opps. And then... our PP dries up to.

We cant use DD in any other way than exploitive center. And using him this way hasn't helped the team overall.

We're better off without him.

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01-18-2014, 07:30 PM
  #114
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We're stuck with Brière until the end of his contrat. Desharnais is much more useful to us than what we could get for him. (doubt he has much value on the market)

And as for Eller, it seems he won't get much better than this. He's a decent third liner capable of playing on as a top-6 from time to time. Unless we get a good return, I don't see the point of trading him either. And he's a skilled player, so you never know, he might still develop his offensive game at some point.

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01-18-2014, 07:33 PM
  #115
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Lars eller AINEC and never will be. Why is this even a question? SMH

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01-18-2014, 07:34 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
What does tanking have to do with this? Dealing DD would IMPROVE the team now. This is not a tank move dude.

Again, our play drops right around the time that MT starts giving him those minutes with Gallagher. Not coincidence. Eller gets relegated to 3rd line scrub with alternating linemates but DD gets all the PP opps. And then... our PP dries up to.

We cant use DD in any other way than exploitive center. And using him this way hasn't helped the team overall.

We're better off without him.


I don't even...


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01-18-2014, 07:34 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
What does tanking have to do with this? Dealing DD would IMPROVE the team now. This is not a tank move dude.
Dealing DD would kill what's left of our offense, as both Plekanec and Pacioretty wold be stuck playing with 2 third liners.

Think what you want about him, but Desharnais is a legit top-6 player...and our third best forward. (as sad as it sounds)

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Originally Posted by theboss View Post
Lars eller AINEC and never will be. Why is this even a question? SMH
AINEC? Eller is a decent player. Great size and speed, good skills, but low hockey sense and questionnable work ethic. I get that Desharnais has his limitations too, but Eller will never be the offensive player that Desharnais is, and I'm not sold that he's much better defensively either.


Last edited by LeMAD: 01-18-2014 at 07:45 PM.
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Old
01-18-2014, 07:52 PM
  #118
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I don't even...

The same old 'addition by subtraction' crap. Doesn't even make sense.

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Old
01-18-2014, 08:13 PM
  #119
Lafleurs Guy
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I don't even...

Yeah, great response. From a mod no less.

The really funny part is that nobody would give us jack **** for him. We can't give him away.

But yeah, you're right... we'll tank if we lose him.
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Originally Posted by LeMAD View Post
Dealing DD would kill what's left of our offense, as both Plekanec and Pacioretty wold be stuck playing with 2 third liners.
Yeah right...

Our offense was doing very well until we decided to re-jig the lineup to get him going. Now he's putting up his assists while the rest of the team has sunk to 28th! in 5 on 5 and our PP has sucked.

Its exactly what I thought would happen with Briere, only it's been DD. Exploitive player who can't do anything but suck up sheltered minutes from better players who should be getting them. And we can't use him for anything else because he'll get annihilated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeMAD View Post
Think what you want about him, but Desharnais is a legit top-6 player...and our third best forward. (as sad as it sounds)
Our third best forward eh? ********.

Go post some trade threads anywhere else and see what you could get for him. Then post what you could get for Gallagher, Plecs, Galchenyuk, Eller, Max.... you will get vastly different responses.

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01-18-2014, 08:41 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
The same old 'addition by subtraction' crap. Doesn't even make sense.
Exactly. It makes no sense.

I could see an argument for Leblanc over Bourque. But Desharnais is in our Top-6 forwards.

Plekanec is #1. No doubt.
Pacioretty is #2. Has a shot that can score at any moment.
Gallagher is #3. His effort level is top notch and he can produce.
Eller is #4. He's strong on the puck, great defensively and has some solid offensive instincts.
Desharnais is #5. He's got vision like no other player in the forward group.
Galchenyuk is #6. He's creative, strong on the puck, and fun to watch.
Gionta is #7. Good checking line forward - overplayed though.

Those 7 guys (especially with Galchenyuk out) should be staples on the forward core right now.

Briere gives no effort.
Bourque gives no effort most nights.
Bournival's game was killed by the demotion while he was playing well.
Prust is like Moen of last year aka mediocre.
Moen is solid this year, but still a 4th liner.
Parros is terrible.
White is a 4th liner/spare forward.

How are we a better team with Desharnais out of the lineup, for nothing?

Pacioretty - Eller - Gallagher
Bourque - Plekanec - Gionta
Bournival - Briere - Leblanc
Moen - White - Prust

Yup.. seems like a team who is going to do a lot better.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Yeah, great response. From a mod no less.

The really funny part is that nobody would give us jack **** for him. We can't give him away.

But yeah, you're right... we'll tank if we lose him.
Not a mod.

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Old
01-18-2014, 08:49 PM
  #121
SouthernHab
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The last two stupid threads started by the OP were locked very quickly by the mods.

This one should have faced the same fate since this is nothing but a **** stirring thread with no point other than getting Habs fans to bash either Eller or DD.

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