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Wed., Jan. 22, 2014| Hurricanes 3 at Flyers 2

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Old
01-22-2014, 07:58 PM
  #76
bennysflyers16
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Kind of glad they didn't pull out the win. Maybe be the wake up call,they need.

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01-22-2014, 07:59 PM
  #77
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Luke Schenn stinks.

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01-22-2014, 08:00 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
Duncan Keith is about to win his 2nd Norris. He was picked in the 2nd round so your right that tanking isn't the way to go. Building a blue line is.
Comparing a D to a forward is tricky and weird ground. He's also definitely not a 100 P player and not a generational player depending on who you ask so my point still stands.

Anyways, yeah, nobody needs to tank to be successful. Good management making good moves and developing players well leads to success. Doesn't really matter how it's done as it can be done in many ways.

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01-22-2014, 08:03 PM
  #79
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Luke Schenn stinks.
You don't say?

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01-22-2014, 08:04 PM
  #80
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Hey Flyers the Olympic break has not started yet.

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01-22-2014, 08:05 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
There's nobody on Chicago that's a 100 point or generational player really. There's a couple of relatively high echelon point producers on there, but they're a great team because they're well-rounded and well-built from good management. Guys like Taylor Hall, RNH, Eberle, and potentially Yakupov aren't much worse if any worse then Patrick Kane and Toews. Problem with Edmonton is that's all they have and their management is probably the worst I've ever seen for a franchise. Like, ever. Even with other teams Colorado has managed to make the playoffs in the recent past and they're on the upswing after drafting guys like Mackinnon and Landeskog that aren't any better then the top guys in Edmonton. Yet they're not nearly as bad of a team or franchise.
I would argue Kane is a guy who could put up 100 points in this league but that's beside the point.

They have drafted well even without top picks Keith, Saad, Bickell, Hjalmarsson, Crawford & Kruger were all either drafted in the second or later by the Hawks.

Sharp, Leddy, Handzus, & Oduya were all brought in by trade. Hossa & Rosival were brought in as free agents.

Bowman inherited a lot of talent when he started from Tallon but he kept it afloat over the years & hasn't run it into the ground up to this point.

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01-22-2014, 08:07 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
There's nobody on Chicago that's a 100 point or generational player really. There's a couple of relatively high echelon point producers on there, but they're a great team because they're well-rounded and well-built from good management. Guys like Taylor Hall, RNH, Eberle, and potentially Yakupov aren't much worse if any worse then Patrick Kane and Toews. Problem with Edmonton is that's all they have and their management is probably the worst I've ever seen for a franchise. Like, ever. Even with other teams Colorado has managed to make the playoffs in the recent past and they're on the upswing after drafting guys like Mackinnon and Landeskog that aren't any better then the top guys in Edmonton. Yet they're not nearly as bad of a team or franchise.
There is only one generational player in the NHL, IMO. But, Chicago had high picks for nearly 5 years
2004- #3 overall
2005- #7 overall
2006- #3 overall
2007- #1 overall
2008- #11 overall

I am not suggesting put all the chips on McDavid, I am suggesting we attempt a rebuild though.

People also forget just how good Mackinnon is. He was a #1 overall pick in one of the strongest drafts in recent memory. That being said, I don't like Mediocrity. The Phillies, Sixers and Eagles have had their long stretches of mediocrity in the last decade or so and I do not want to see the Flyers do the same.

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01-22-2014, 08:09 PM
  #83
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I am realistic. That move executed that well would beat any goalie most times.

Keep pretending you are being realistic by blaming the goalie when the team was dominated territorially and in shots.
You're being unrealistic by doing whatever you can to try to shift the blame off Mason, the fact is he was bad and as much responsible for the loss as anyone else.

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01-22-2014, 08:11 PM
  #84
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You're being unrealistic by doing whatever you can to try to shift the blame off Mason, the fact is he was bad and as much responsible for the loss as anyone else.
Mason was bad as was most of the team. He had the chance to steal,the team a point when they needed him and he didn't.

3 GAA and .904 isn't good enough.

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01-22-2014, 08:13 PM
  #85
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You're being unrealistic by doing whatever you can to try to shift the blame off Mason, the fact is he was bad and as much responsible for the loss as anyone else.
But god forbid any of us call out our best player for, ya know, not being our best player

It's the Bryz saga all over again. Giroux isn't the main problem, but he is absolutely a problem and certainly something worth being concerned about.

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01-22-2014, 08:14 PM
  #86
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The rebound on the third goal was terrible(control was bad all night) and the d-zone coverage was just as bad though. Raffl wasn't sure what he was doing. G and Coburn(IIRC were the two that were actually covering people.

Overall, everyone is to blame, don't know why we sit here and bicker about who is more at fault. They played pathetically.

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01-22-2014, 08:14 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Tpinheiro4 View Post
2004- #3 overall
2005- #7 overall
2006- #3 overall
2007- #1 overall
2008- #11 overall
It would do more justice if you listed the players they drafted there because three out of five of them were busts.

2004- Cam Barker
2005- Jack Skille
2006- Jonathan Toews
2007- Patrick Kane
2008- Kyle Beach

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01-22-2014, 08:15 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by orangecrush8 View Post
But god forbid any of us call out our best player for, ya know, not being our best player

It's the Bryz saga all over again. Giroux isn't the main problem, but he is absolutely a problem and certainly something worth being concerned about.
He was in on both goals tonight, not bad considering how bad everyone was.

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01-22-2014, 08:17 PM
  #89
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I don't know why Giroux is being called out. He played better than any player tonight, and was in on both goals for. He played pretty well defensively and actually was playing physical. He wasn't the problem tonight.

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01-22-2014, 08:19 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
It would do more justice if you listed the players they drafted there because three out of five of them were busts.

2004- Cam Barker
2005- Jack Skille
2006- Jonathan Toews
2007- Patrick Kane
2008- Kyle Beach
Quite a few years ago played in a golf tourney with Barker. We all got quite hammered and all,day we kept asking him who were those two guys drafted before you, are they any good ??

He was a good sport and then took us to Earls after and thats where he introduced me to,Richie !!

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01-22-2014, 08:21 PM
  #91
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Bobby Ryan.

We can't spell intense

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01-22-2014, 08:27 PM
  #92
Garbage Goal
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
It would do more justice if you listed the players they drafted there because three out of five of them were busts.

2004- Cam Barker
2005- Jack Skille
2006- Jonathan Toews
2007- Patrick Kane
2008- Kyle Beach
Yeah, like I said before, there's numerous ways to go about being successful and every single one requires good management, but Chicago didn't really tank for their success. They did a lot of quality drafting and kept a terrific core together while always maintaining a quality complementary presence.

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01-22-2014, 08:28 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
I don't know why Giroux is being called out. He played better than any player tonight, and was in on both goals for. He played pretty well defensively and actually was playing physical. He wasn't the problem tonight.
Doesn't matter, apparently if the Flyers lose it's his fault for not getting a hat trick and a shutout.

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01-22-2014, 08:35 PM
  #94
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Pens up 5-1 with 5 left and have Sid Geno and Letang out to start a PP

Arrogant ****s

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01-22-2014, 08:35 PM
  #95
LegionOfDoom91
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
Yeah, like I said before, there's numerous ways to go about being successful and every single one requires good management, but Chicago didn't really tank for their success. They did a lot of quality drafting and kept a terrific core together while always maintaining a quality complementary presence.
Yup, the NHL isn't like the NBA where you need to tank to acquire top players. Good drafting & good management can get you to the top of the league. The Flyers have good scouts but the management part still remains to be unseen up to this point.

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01-22-2014, 08:38 PM
  #96
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TSN actually just cut the wings hawks game to go to tennis cause they don't want to leave a 5-1 Pens game. Pathetic with 2 mins left

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01-22-2014, 08:39 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by orangecrush8 View Post
But god forbid any of us call out our best player for, ya know, not being our best player

It's the Bryz saga all over again. Giroux isn't the main problem, but he is absolutely a problem and certainly something worth being concerned about.
You're wrong. I mostly made this account to troll mainboards but im too lazy to do that, but im gonna serious post for a minute

Giroux regularly plays on a line with Michael Raffl, a player who has 14 career points in the NHL. I know we like Raffl, but if you honestly think he's a first line or even a second line player you need to see a doctor immediately. Giroux is a star player on a poorly constructed team that will never win anything, and it sucks so bad to see him take the blame because he's honestly that good.

There was a crappy mainboards poll a few days ago where it was agreed that Tavares was "way better" than Giroux and that goes to show how far his stock has fallen because of this crappy team, because it is very close- Tavares is playing with Okposo and Vanek and is suddenly a mega star, while Giroux is very frequently on the ice with Voracek + a scrub + two scrubby D-men who can't play hockey.

You don't pay a star playmaker that kind of money and then choose to award millions of dollars to Steve Mason. You don't pay a star playmaker that kind of money and then give up a 30 goal winger for Luke Schenn, a sub NHL defenseman. but its okay, because if philly fans think Giroux is a problem then management can't be far behind, and he'll get traded to a team that isn't built by a braindead idiot and he'll win his cup. Basically he could be right up there in discussions with Tavares right now and building an HOF career, but instead he'll probably spend it trying to carry a bunch of bad players to early playoff exits. woooooooo. this team is bad but Giroux is literally the last person I'd blame.

edit: i guess raffl has 15 career points now counting tonight . nvm post invalid, get him a better centerman cuz G can't utilize this offensive powerhouse properly

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01-22-2014, 08:40 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by orangecrush8 View Post
But god forbid any of us call out our best player for, ya know, not being our best player

It's the Bryz saga all over again. Giroux isn't the main problem, but he is absolutely a problem and certainly something worth being concerned about.
Not being our best player? Oh really? Then who would you say is better? Giroux is the last thing you should be worrying about. The only person you could argue is playing better lately is Simmonds.

The only problem with Giroux is he isn't being given the right linemates to maximize his effectiveness, and that's a fact. When your franchise player, who is an all-star playmaker, doesn't have anyone to set up, there's a big problem.

Raffl is obviously not a legitimate 1st line LW, although sadly he's probably the best option for 1st LW on the team. And Voracek, although very talented, doesn't shoot enough to make up for the lack of an option on the LW. Every game we see the same thing, Giroux makes a nice pass to set someone up and they don't capitalize on it. Then whenever he's in a good position to score he needs to recover from receiving a bad pass before shooting.

Look at what he has to work with on the LW all season:
-Hartnell who was easily the worst player on the team for the first two months and the second he was taken off the 1st line Giroux and Voracek started producing.
-Raffl who played well considering his skill set and expectations but it's obvious he would be better as the 3rd line LW with Couturier and Read. He's just not skilled enough to keep up with Giroux and Voracek.
-Downie who is currently one of the most useless players on the team but keeps getting bursts of time on the 1st line during games because Berube is an idiot when it comes to lineups.
-Lecavelier who has said himself he is incapable of playing LW and has been horrible every time he's placed there.

I guarentee you, if Giroux had a LW who could really shoot the puck, he'd easily be over a PPG. Even without it, hes leading the team in scoring and he's playing very well.

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01-22-2014, 08:43 PM
  #99
jeff leonard
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Originally Posted by Striiker View Post
Not being our best player? Oh really? Then who would you say is better? Giroux is the last thing you should be worrying about. The only person you could argue is playing better lately is Simmonds.

The only problem with Giroux is he isn't being given the right linemates to maximize his effectiveness, and that's a fact. When your franchise player, who is an all-star playmaker, doesn't have anyone to set up, there's a big problem.

Raffl is obviously not a legitimate 1st line LW, although sadly he's probably the best option for 1st LW on the team. And Voracek, although very talented, doesn't shoot enough to make up for the lack of an option on the LW. Every game we see the same thing, Giroux makes a nice pass to set someone up and they don't capitalize on it. Then whenever he's in a good position to score he needs to recover from receiving a bad pass before shooting.

Look at what he has to work with on the LW all season:
-Hartnell who was easily the worst player on the team for the first two months and the second he was taken off the 1st line Giroux and Voracek started producing.
-Raffl who played well considering his skill set and expectations but it's obvious he would be better as the 3rd line LW with Couturier and Read. He's just not skilled enough to keep up with Giroux and Voracek.
-Downie who is currently one of the most useless players on the team but keeps getting bursts of time on the 1st line during games because Berube is an idiot when it comes to lineups.
-Lecavelier who has said himself he is incapable of playing LW and has been horrible every time he's placed there.

I guarentee you, if Giroux had a LW who could really shoot the puck, he'd easily be over a PPG. Even without it, hes leading the team in scoring and he's playing very well.
can you edit your post? we both posted at the same time saying the exact thing but i think mine is more sanctimonious and sassy. sorry

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01-22-2014, 08:46 PM
  #100
Garbage Goal
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Yup, the NHL isn't like the NBA where you need to tank to acquire top players. Good drafting & good management can get you to the top of the league. The Flyers have good scouts but the management part still remains to be unseen up to this point.
Pretty much. Big part of why I'm tired of Holmgren. Guys has had his chances and can't really put it all together at once it seems.

We do have good player development (outside of stupid picks like Klotz or whatever his name was) so it's definitely not that. In the past Homer has traded a lot of top picks so there aren't as many names to list as there should be, but in the recent past Richards, Carter, Giroux, and Couturier have all been drafted by the Flyers in the first round. That's essentially the forward core of both this edition of the team and the Richards/Carter edition of the team. They probably make the best rookie free agent signings league-wide with guys like Read and Bobrovsky as well and great drafted players that were later traded off and excelled elsewhere (Sharp, Seidenberg, and Downie off the top of my head though I can't think of anyone too recent). The problem has always been not filling out the team well and it's usually in the same areas in goaltending and sometimes D.

Even in the SCF year they made the playoffs as an 8th seed and lost in the SCF due to never acquiring any form of legitimate goalie options.

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