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Wed., Jan. 22, 2014| Hurricanes 3 at Flyers 2

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Old
01-22-2014, 08:47 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Bennysflyers16 View Post
Pens up 5-1 with 5 left and have Sid Geno and Letang out to start a PP

Arrogant ****s
Gone are the days of Orr and Esposito telling their teammates to take it easy on teams they were already dominating.

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01-22-2014, 08:49 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
Yeah, like I said before, there's numerous ways to go about being successful and every single one requires good management, but Chicago didn't really tank for their success. They did a lot of quality drafting and kept a terrific core together while always maintaining a quality complementary presence.
I don't know having two of the top 10 players in the world would be quite helpful too. Of course it takes consistent quality drafting but, without either Kane or Toews I doubt Chicago wins even 1 cup.

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01-22-2014, 08:50 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Gone are the days of Orr and Esposito telling their teammates to take it easy on teams they were already dominating.
Habs started a scuffle and Fleury and Budaj tried to,scrap, but nothing that justified putting that unit out They had Malkin, Sid and Engelland, such a chicken **** organization.

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01-22-2014, 08:51 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by jeff leonard View Post
You're wrong. I mostly made this account to troll mainboards but im too lazy to do that, but im gonna serious post for a minute

Giroux regularly plays on a line with Michael Raffl, a player who has 14 career points in the NHL. I know we like Raffl, but if you honestly think he's a first line or even a second line player you need to see a doctor immediately. Giroux is a star player on a poorly constructed team that will never win anything, and it sucks so bad to see him take the blame because he's honestly that good.

There was a crappy mainboards poll a few days ago where it was agreed that Tavares was "way better" than Giroux and that goes to show how far his stock has fallen because of this crappy team, because it is very close- Tavares is playing with Okposo and Vanek and is suddenly a mega star, while Giroux is very frequently on the ice with Voracek + a scrub + two scrubby D-men who can't play hockey.

You don't pay a star playmaker that kind of money and then choose to award millions of dollars to Steve Mason. You don't pay a star playmaker that kind of money and then give up a 30 goal winger for Luke Schenn, a sub NHL defenseman. but its okay, because if philly fans think Giroux is a problem then management can't be far behind, and he'll get traded to a team that isn't built by a braindead idiot and he'll win his cup. Basically he could be right up there in discussions with Tavares right now and building an HOF career, but instead he'll probably spend it trying to carry a bunch of bad players to early playoff exits. woooooooo. this team is bad but Giroux is literally the last person I'd blame.

edit: i guess raffl has 15 career points now counting tonight . nvm post invalid, get him a better centerman cuz G can't utilize this offensive powerhouse properly
You should honestly post more. That was a smart, honest, and correct post in every way.

Giroux is pretty much the only player on this team that's reliable to score points. Even when he started off the year with the goal drought he was still putting up plenty of assists and was among the team leaders in points. The guy isn't a problem at all.

Especially tonight. He had a goal and an assist IIRC so I have no idea how he could have been the problem tonight.

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01-22-2014, 08:54 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by jeff leonard View Post
can you edit your post? we both posted at the same time saying the exact thing but i think mine is more sanctimonious and sassy. sorry
If anything I'll edit it to make it even more sassy.

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Old
01-22-2014, 08:56 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by Tpinheiro4 View Post
I don't know having two of the top 10 players in the world would be quite helpful too. Of course it takes consistent quality drafting but, without either Kane or Toews I doubt Chicago wins even 1 cup.
They're definitely top ten at their position, but top ten players overall is probably not true. Kane is usually a PPG to 90 P winger who doesn't really do anything besides score (meaning he can't PK, take face-offs, play a special defensive game, etc.) and Toews is a lot more well-rounded but has less scoring capability. If you're saying a top 10 player overall then you're comparing them to players at every position.

Anyhow, the Flyers had Richards/Carter once. At their times here Richards was an annual Selke candidate and a PPG player and Carter was a two-way presence who had a 46 G season and was one of the best goal scorers in the league (in his 46 G season he was only second to Ovechkin IIRC). They also had Pronger eventually and Giroux.

Even now they still have Giroux who is easily an elite point producer about on par with Kane. Even Edmonton has guys like Hall, RNH, Yakupov, and Eberle who can put up a **** ton of points.

Almost every team has great players. Buffalo has Miller, Edmonton has those aforementioned players, we have Giroux, etc.

Like I said before, Chicago's success has a lot more to do with great management making great moves and great drafting then getting high picks. Toews and Kane definitely are a hug part of their success, but it's blatantly untrue to say they're the way they are solely because they drafted Toews and Kane with high picks.

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01-22-2014, 08:59 PM
  #107
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the way they run this team there is no way they get closer to the cup untill 2017-18 when they clean up the Defense and every Dman we have right now is gone, but i wouldn't happen because next FA they will just throw money at a player that we don't need

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01-22-2014, 09:00 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Tpinheiro4 View Post
I don't know having two of the top 10 players in the world would be quite helpful too. Of course it takes consistent quality drafting but, without either Kane or Toews I doubt Chicago wins even 1 cup.
Our top player who is also arguably a top 10 player himself was drafted in the second half of the first round.

We were two wins away from a cup with a core of players drafted outside of the top ten, traded in, or signed as FA's.

It can be done without tanking & isn't something that should be easily explored unless there's zero options but to.

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01-22-2014, 09:04 PM
  #109
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I'll say it right now:

The team is not built to do anything exceptionally well.

Put Read on the first line, put Raffle on the third, do whatever is humanly possible to trade Vinny. Sell off Hartnell for some buku up and comers.

Coburn and Grossmann should be the only defensemen to return next year. You rebuild over the next year. Bring in a highly touted back up. Building a competent team cannot be so goddamned difficult.

And the worst part is the fact that the roster turnover that has occurred in the organization since the SCF has made the team worse, not better. Dare I say we are entering Rueben Amaro territory with Homer?

Edit - 1 other thing. I want one Barry Ashbee-esque player. He takes no ****, he's tough as nails, and he'll crack the skull of any mother****er in the locker room who is not giving 110% on every shift of every night. Is that too much to ask?

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01-22-2014, 09:07 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by mypunkrock View Post
I'll say it right now:

The team is not built to do anything exceptionally well.

Put Read on the first line, put Raffle on the third, do whatever is humanly possible to trade Vinny. Sell off Hartnell for some buku up and comers.

Coburn and Grossmann should be the only defensemen to return next year. You rebuild over the next year. Bring in a highly touted back up. Building a competent team cannot be so goddamned difficult.

And the worst part is the fact that the roster turnover that has occurred in the organization since the SCF has made the team worse, not better. Dare I say we are entering Rueben Amaro territory with Homer?
Whoa whoa let's pump our breaks there! Homer at least has some strengths to go along with his downfalls. I can't tell you what Amaro has as a strength.

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01-22-2014, 09:10 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Whoa whoa let's pump our breaks there! Homer at least has some strengths to go along with his downfalls. I can't tell you what Amaro has as a strength.
His last name is easy to spell.

That's about it.

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01-22-2014, 09:11 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Whoa whoa let's pump our breaks there! Homer at least has some strengths to go along with his downfalls. I can't tell you what Amaro has as a strength.
Homer was recycling old Philly players before Amaro knew it was cool

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01-22-2014, 09:12 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by mypunkrock View Post
I'll say it right now:

The team is not built to do anything exceptionally well.

Put Read on the first line, put Raffle on the third, do whatever is humanly possible to trade Vinny. Sell off Hartnell for some buku up and comers.

Coburn and Grossmann should be the only defensemen to return next year. You rebuild over the next year. Bring in a highly touted back up. Building a competent team cannot be so goddamned difficult.

And the worst part is the fact that the roster turnover that has occurred in the organization since the SCF has made the team worse, not better. Dare I say we are entering Rueben Amaro territory with Homer?

Edit - 1 other thing. I want one Barry Ashbee-esque player. He takes no ****, he's tough as nails, and he'll crack the skull of any mother****er in the locker room who is not giving 110% on every shift of every night. Is that too much to ask?
That's actually a pretty apt comparison. Except the Flyers didn't actually win the championship they just got the opportunity to and fell short because of goaltending. Homer is a little better but only because he keeps up the illusion of competitiveness with some good qualities. They've both taken a championship finals team, revamped it almost completely to the point where it's not really recognizable, and are much worse now after all is said and done.

For the record though, if Lecavalier gets traded off somehow (which he probably won't unless it gets dire) then Streit is probably coming back next season too. Signed long-term and I doubt Homer is going to want to trade both of his big free agent contracts so soon.

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Old
01-22-2014, 09:17 PM
  #114
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Anyone see G response to the guy that asked him if the Flyers are a slow team ? He looked mad as it is true and got a little snippy

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01-22-2014, 09:27 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Flyerfan4life View Post
sure glad i didnt rush home to watch that..

why do i suspect tomorows game will be more of the same beer league level effort.
Don't insult beer leagues they put in way more effort than that. A lot of them take it pretty seriously (some too seriously)

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01-22-2014, 09:29 PM
  #116
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Look I'm not going to hide the fact that obviously this team would be better off if Giroux had a pure goal scorer along side him. But the fact of the matter is that the offence was putrid tonight. We all could count on one hand how many true scoring chances they had through 2 periods. Outside of a lucky bounce, they put up 0 goals through 2 and were extremely ineffective in the offensive zone. Having A pure shooter with Giroux out there wouldn't have changed a single thing. There weren't any situations where I thought "damn, if only we had (insert sniper here)". Giroux, like the whole team, provided very little on offence for the entire game. Having a Stamkos or a Ryan wouldn't haven't changed that, at least from the Giroux standpoint.

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01-22-2014, 09:29 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Bennysflyers16 View Post
Anyone see G response to the guy that asked him if the Flyers are a slow team ? He looked mad as it is true and got a little snippy
I don't really blame Giroux for getting mad even if it's unfair for the reporter.

He got tons of flak for basically nothing just at the start of the season despite being one of the best players at forward we've ever had (in terms of point production at least) and people were actually doubting his captaincy just like Richards just because the team started off awful and he had a goal drought. Then he gets scrubbed from the Olympics, his team lost an important game tonight, and he's still probably the first one to get blamed as soon as the ship starts sinking just because he's the Captain and biggest name. I'd be pissed all the time too if I were him.

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01-22-2014, 09:31 PM
  #118
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When 70% of the team is terrible at making and receiving passes on any given night it will also make them look slower than they actually are.

I would love to see them move the puck consistently. From night to night or even shift to shift they'll go from awesome to absolutely laughable. It's one thing for passes to get broken up, they're blowing clear stuff.

And considering that Streit and Timonen are both quite capable, it seems like they're rarely involved in the offense. At times I get reminded of Edmonton and watching their 3 forwards do the work of 5 guys. Unlike Edmonton, we have guys who can actually participate. Mez too, but he wasn't involved tonight either...or included, I should say. It mystifies me that the forwards seemingly forget they have two more guys behind them for stretches. Tonight was one of the games where they did that a lot.


Last edited by Beef Invictus: 01-22-2014 at 09:36 PM.
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Old
01-22-2014, 09:33 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by orangecrush8 View Post
Look I'm not going to hide the fact that obviously this team would be better off if Giroux had a pure goal scorer along side him. But the fact of the matter is that the offence was putrid tonight. We all could count on one hand how many true scoring chances they had through 2 periods. Outside of a lucky bounce, they put up 0 goals through 2 and were extremely ineffective in the offensive zone. Having A pure shooter with Giroux out there wouldn't have changed a single thing. There weren't any situations where I thought "damn, if only we had (insert sniper here)". Giroux, like the whole team, provided very little on offence for the entire game. Having a Stamkos or a Ryan wouldn't haven't changed that, at least from the Giroux standpoint.
1 G, 1 A and neither of those points were fluky.

I'm curious, what is your expectation for enough offensive output? 3 points? Two goals?

There's a reason a forward roster contains 12 players and not just 1. This is why I don't get mad at Giroux if he gets pissed off after a game because there are people who will blame him regardless of circumstances or what he's doing literally just because he's the Captain and biggest name on the team.

EDIT: And having Stamkos instead of Raffl wouldn't have meant a chance at more production this game or over the course of the season? My God.

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01-22-2014, 09:37 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
1 G, 1 A and neither of those points were fluky.

I'm curious, what is your expectation for enough offensive output? 3 points? Two goals?

There's a reason a forward roster contains 12 players and not just 1. This is why I don't get mad at Giroux if he gets pissed off after a game because there are people who will blame him regardless of circumstances or what he's doing literally just because he's the Captain and biggest name on the team.

EDIT: And having Stamkos instead of Raffl wouldn't have meant a chance at more production this game or over the course of the season? My God.
I was about to post a nearly identical response... glad I don't have to type it out.

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01-22-2014, 09:56 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
1 G, 1 A and neither of those points were fluky.

I'm curious, what is your expectation for enough offensive output? 3 points? Two goals?

There's a reason a forward roster contains 12 players and not just 1. This is why I don't get mad at Giroux if he gets pissed off after a game because there are people who will blame him regardless of circumstances or what he's doing literally just because he's the Captain and biggest name on the team.

EDIT: And having Stamkos instead of Raffl wouldn't have meant a chance at more production this game or over the course of the season? My God.
How about a consistent effort? You know even if they had lost but the chances and effort was there, this game wouldn't have left such a bitter taste in my mouth. This team sleep walked through 55 minutes of this game. A deflection goal off the goalie and a secondary assist on the power play doesn't justify a ****** effort for the rest of the game, specifically 5 on 5.

And yes, tonight with that display, even having Stamkos play alongside Giroux wouldn't have changed a single thing from a Giroux standpoint.

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01-22-2014, 10:05 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by orangecrush8 View Post
How about a consistent effort? You know even if they had lost but the chances and effort was there, this game wouldn't have left such a bitter taste in my mouth. This team sleep walked through 55 minutes of this game. A deflection goal off the goalie and a secondary assist on the power play doesn't justify a ****** effort for the rest of the game, specifically 5 on 5.

And yes, tonight with that display, even having Stamkos play alongside Giroux wouldn't have changed a single thing from a Giroux standpoint.
Again...Giroux had a goal and an assist both of which were well earned. Girouxs also a far better passer and playmaker then goal scorer so he actually does rely on having competent line mates and not the Raffl's and Hartnell's of the world.

So is a goal and an assist not enough production or is he responsible for the play of the 17 other skaters in the game (not counting the goalie)? It literally has to be one or the other as far as this game goes.

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01-22-2014, 10:19 PM
  #123
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I'm noticing the forwards are looking extremely lazy especially in defensive coverage's in our own zone. Nobody on D seems to have any hockey IQ besides Kimmo.

Mason's play has been poor, but I have trouble putting blame on him because of the atrocious defense he has to work with.

Pretty pathetic effort as well. Although this is just a mediocre team, so what should we expect...

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01-22-2014, 10:34 PM
  #124
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if somehow we could Give the Rangers Vinny and get Callahan would be Great i'd rather have Callahan signed at 5.8m/6years with a NMC than having Vinny signed at 4.5m/5years

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01-22-2014, 10:58 PM
  #125
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I like Vinny, he just hasn't been utilized offensively since returning from injury. Downie, neither.

Move Raffl off the top line and mix things up a little.

B. Schenn - Giroux - Voracek
Hartnell - Lecavalier - Simmonds
Raffl - Couturier - Read
Rosehill/VV - Hall - Downie

Vinny vs. B. Schenn on faceoffs is a wash, and no better way than to get Vinny moving offensively than to put him with our two hottest wingers. Raffl-Couturier-Read is solid two-way and has some quality speed and work down low. I really would like to see Meszaros traded too while his value doesn't suck, and have Gustafsson inserted in his place. This team doesn't have many players who are quality skaters. Voracek, Read and Raffl are the only forwards who I would say have breakaway speed. Giroux isn't bad at all but not anything special in the speed department.

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